Police abuse

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Comments

  • dignin said:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/12/nypd-body-worn-camera-pilot-chokehold-death

    NYPD urged to step up body-worn camera pilot after chokehold death
    Amid accusations of excessive force and increasing civilian video of police activity, New York officers may wear cameras while on duty

    The most cited study of the effects of body-worn cameras on policing is Cambridge University’s examination of the police department in Rialto, California. After cameras were introduced in February 2012, officers’ use of force dropped 59%, and complaints against officers plummeted by 88%.

    This would be a good thing for so many reasons.

    Just as patrol cars are equipped with cameras, so should officers.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    Remember people, you have the RIGHT to video tape any police officers as long as you're not in their way doing their job. They CANT take your phones or cameras away. NYC even sent out a memo to it's officers explaining this to them. Looks like NYC is actually handling this the right way.
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    Up until recently in Illinois they had it as illegal. I have heard that it changed but I need to verify.
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098

    dignin said:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/12/nypd-body-worn-camera-pilot-chokehold-death

    NYPD urged to step up body-worn camera pilot after chokehold death
    Amid accusations of excessive force and increasing civilian video of police activity, New York officers may wear cameras while on duty

    The most cited study of the effects of body-worn cameras on policing is Cambridge University’s examination of the police department in Rialto, California. After cameras were introduced in February 2012, officers’ use of force dropped 59%, and complaints against officers plummeted by 88%.

    This would be a good thing for so many reasons.

    Just as patrol cars are equipped with cameras, so should officers.

    Absolutely. However from what I'm reading the police in St. Louis confiscated phones.
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    unsung said:

    Bringing this back up, ignore that it is fox, stossel is a libertarian.
  • dignindignin Posts: 4,465
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/in-ferguson-washington-post-reporter-wesley-lowery-gives-account-of-his-arrest/2014/08/13/0fe25c0e-2359-11e4-86ca-6f03cbd15c1a_story.html


    In Ferguson, Washington Post reporter Wesley Lowery gives account of his arrest



    FERGUSON, Mo. — For the past week in Ferguson, reporters have been using the McDonald’s a few blocks from the scene of Michael Brown’s shooting as a staging area. Demonstrations have blown up each night nearby. But inside there’s WiFi and outlets, so it’s common for reporters to gather there.

    That was the case Wednesday. My phone was just about to die, so as I charged it, I used the time to respond to people on Twitter and do a little bit of a Q&A since I wasn’t out there covering the protests.

    As I sat there, many armed officers came in — some who were dressed as normal officers, others who were dressed with more gear.

    Initially, both Ryan Reilly of the Huffington Post and I were asked for identification. I was wearing my lanyard, but Ryan asked why he had to show his ID. They didn’t press the point, but one added that if we called 911, no one would answer.

    Then they walked away. Moments later, the police reemerged, telling us that we had to leave. I pulled my phone out and began recording video.

    An officer with a large weapon came up to me and said, “Stop recording.”

    I said, “Officer, do I not have the right to record you?”

    He backed off but told me to hurry up. So I gathered my notebook and pens with one hand while recording him with the other hand.

    As I exited, I saw Ryan to my left, having a similar argument with two officers. I recorded him, too, and that angered the officer. As I made my way toward the door, the officers gave me conflicting information.

    One instructed me to exit to my left. As I turned left, another officer emerged, blocking my path.

    “Go another way,” he said.

    As I turned, my backpack, which was slung over one shoulder, began to slip. I said, “Officers, let me just gather my bag.” As I did, one of them said, “Okay, let’s take him.”


    Police used tear gas and smoke bombs to repel crowds who threw Molotov cocktails during another violent night in the wake of the shooting of the unarmed 18-year-old Michael Brown. (AP)
    Multiple officers grabbed me. I tried to turn my back to them to assist them in arresting me. I dropped the things from my hands.

    “My hands are behind my back,” I said. “I’m not resisting. I’m not resisting.” At which point one officer said: “You’re resisting. Stop resisting.”

    That was when I was most afraid — more afraid than of the tear gas and rubber bullets.

    As they took me into custody, the officers slammed me into a soda machine, at one point setting off the Coke dispenser. They put plastic cuffs on me, then they led me out the door.

    I could see Ryan still talking to an officer. I said: “Ryan, tweet that they’re arresting me, tweet that they’re arresting me.”

    He didn’t have an opportunity, because he was arrested as well.

    The officers led us outside to a police van. Inside, there was a large man sitting on the floor between the two benches. He began screaming: “I can’t breathe! Call a paramedic! Call a paramedic!”

    Ryan and I asked the officers if they intended to help the man. They said he was fine. The screaming went on for the 10 to 15 minutes we stood outside the van.

    “I’m going to die!” he screamed. “I’m going to die! I can’t breathe! I’m going to die!”

    Eventually a police car arrived. A woman — with a collar identifying her as a member of the clergy — sat in the back. Ryan and I crammed in next to her, and we took the three-minute ride to the Ferguson Police Department. The woman sang hymns throughout the ride.

    During this time, we asked the officers for badge numbers. We asked to speak to a supervising officer. We asked why we were being detained. We were told: trespassing in a McDonald’s.

    “I hope you’re happy with yourself,” one officer told me. And I responded: “This story’s going to get out there. It’s going to be on the front page of The Washington Post tomorrow.”

    And he said, “Yeah, well, you’re going to be in my jail cell tonight.”

    Once at the station, we were processed, our pockets emptied. No mug shots. They removed our restraints and put us in a holding cell. Ryan was able to get ahold of his dad. I called my mom, but I couldn’t get through. I couldn’t remember any phone numbers.

    We were in there for what felt like 10 or 15 minutes. Then the processing officer came in.

    “Who’s media?” he asked.

    We said we were. And the officer said we were both free to go. We asked to speak to a commanding officer. We asked to see an arrest report. No report, the officer told us, and no, they wouldn’t provide any names.

    I asked if there would ever be a report. He came back with a case number and said a report would be available in a week or two.

    “The chief thought he was doing you two a favor,” he said.

    The Ferguson Police Department did not immediately respond to a request for comment on Lowery’s detention.

    The following is a statement on the incident from Washington Post Executive Editor Martin D. Baron:

    Wesley has briefed us on what occurred, and there was absolutely no justification for his
    arrest.

    He was illegally instructed to stop taking video of officers. Then he followed officers’ instructions to leave a McDonald’s — and after contradictory instructions on how to exit, he was slammed against a soda machine and then handcuffed. That behavior was wholly unwarranted and an assault on the freedom of the press to cover the news. The physical risk to Wesley himself is obvious and outrageous.

    After being placed in a holding cell, he was released with no charges and no explanation. He was denied information about the names and badge numbers of those who arrested him.

    We are relieved that Wesley is going to be OK. We are appalled by the conduct of police officers involved.
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 16,273
    unsung said:

    unsung said:

    Bringing this back up, ignore that it is fox, stossel is a libertarian.
    I agree with Stossel but i have to ask where is your other Libertarians that you allways speak of where is Rand speaking out against this he sure as hell jumped on the farmers side out west when the big bad gov wanted those cows to be moved just asking ....
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    Don't know, don't care, that's not the point of this thread. We can discuss it in another if you will make it.
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    Unfortunate events like this are what make positive change. It is tragic that someone died, it is tragic that is what it takes to get people motivated.
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098

    Remember people, you have the RIGHT to video tape .



    The kids call it recording now. LOL. Just busting your chops.
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 16,273
    unsung said:

    Don't know, don't care, that's not the point of this thread. We can discuss it in another if you will make it.

    ok very convenient only bring up what you wanna discuss ok got it ...
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    It's off topic. That's why we have threads and multiple forums and not just one big and long message.
  • dignindignin Posts: 4,465
    http://boingboing.net/2014/08/14/video-of-ferguson-police-gassi.html

    Video of Ferguson police gassing news crew and dismantling their equipment
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    dignin said:

    http://boingboing.net/2014/08/14/video-of-ferguson-police-gassi.html

    Video of Ferguson police gassing news crew and dismantling their equipment


    Sick.

  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098

    unsung said:

    Don't know, don't care, that's not the point of this thread. We can discuss it in another if you will make it.

    ok very convenient only bring up what you wanna discuss ok got it ...
    Since you asked nicely, I looked.

    http://rare.us/story/justin-amash-weighs-in-on-ferguson-chaos/
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 16,273
    unsung said:

    unsung said:

    Don't know, don't care, that's not the point of this thread. We can discuss it in another if you will make it.

    ok very convenient only bring up what you wanna discuss ok got it ...
    Since you asked nicely, I looked.

    http://rare.us/story/justin-amash-weighs-in-on-ferguson-chaos/
    I thank you for looking I've learned a ton from you and others here i don't allways agree with you but on issues like this i absolutely do ...
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Yah.

    Unsung is kooky (in a good way), but I have to concede that this situation begs consideration for what he consistently says.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • IdrisIdris Posts: 2,316
    edited August 2014
    badbrains said:

    Remember people, you have the RIGHT to video tape any police officers as long as you're not in their way doing their job. They CANT take your phones or cameras away.

    But we should keep in mind, that just because we have the 'right', does not mean that we will be allowed that 'right'. Sometimes we just need to take it (that 'right') and suffer the potential immediate consequences. (which I did not do in my story below)

    I was sorta pulled over by a police officer the other week, things got heated.

    It got to a point where I simply told the officer, "at this point sir, I'd like to start recording this with my cell phone", he told me, "touch it and I'll take you to jail".

    I really did not have time to spend the night in jail, so I did not pick up my cell phone.

    It may of been my 'right', but that 'right' woulda got me locked up, sure at a later point I'd come out on top in court or whatever, but in that moment I chose not to 'fight' in that way.

    However, after getn out of my car, I verbally let the Officer have it, I cited law, history and a bunch of other good stuff.

    Anyway, by the end, he shook my hand and let me go. I don't think he's comes across many people who question his actions like I did that afternoon.

    I think I also embarrassed him in front of a female officer who was also present, and who took 'my side'.
    -
    I ordered a dash cam for my car when I got home.
    Post edited by Idris on
  • hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of foreverPosts: 17,204
    Wow. Messed up, but good for you, Idris.

    Sad anyone has to get to the point of dash-camming, but understandable. Kudos for keeping a level head.

    (and I'm dying to know what you sort of got pulled over for, but figure you'll share if desired :) )
  • IdrisIdris Posts: 2,316
    hedonist said:

    Wow. Messed up, but good for you, Idris.

    Sad anyone has to get to the point of dash-camming, but understandable. Kudos for keeping a level head.

    (and I'm dying to know what you sort of got pulled over for, but figure you'll share if desired :) )

    I'll share when I get back from some errands.
  • The Kelly Thomas incident is a crushing one.

    Hearing him call for his dad as those fat pricks were beating him down was as disturbing as a scene might be.

    The worst thing about it was when calmer heads arrived... they didn't stop things- they piled on. Emotionally removed from the incident... they did nothing to stop what was clearly an incident that had spiralled out of control.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • IdrisIdris Posts: 2,316
    hedonist said:

    Wow. Messed up, but good for you, Idris.

    Sad anyone has to get to the point of dash-camming, but understandable. Kudos for keeping a level head.

    (and I'm dying to know what you sort of got pulled over for, but figure you'll share if desired :) )

    So I just left my works parking lot (1pm, sunny Florida afternoon), got onto the road, the road bends, I came around the bend and maybe 750? feet ahead is a pedestrian crosswalk, I saw some peds about to step onto the crossing, I slowed my car and came to a very decent smooth stop.

    Then a cop walks to about 15 feet from my car (my windows were down more than half way) and he starts (quite loudly/aggressively) telling me what the speed limit is (35MPH) which I already knew as I drive that road just about daily, and knew officers had been watching the crosswalk for a few weeks.

    So he like a robot repeats to me over an over "its 35! its 35!" "slow down" (I was already driving under the limit, I think I had some PJ on the radio, it WAS a relaxing day until that point)

    After about 40 seconds of him repeating this, I said in a calm and very cool manner. "Thank you officer, I am aware of the speed limit and was not over it"

    Now he seems to get really annoyed, "what!" (he yells) and continues "slowwww down!", (at this point I'm thinking what world am I living in lmao)

    The pedestrians are about 70% down the crosswalk (its a wide two streets),

    Now after the 10,15th, maybe 20th time he tells me that I was speeding and should slow down, I told him, "officer, the next time you accuse someone of doing something, make sure your facts are in order, thank you"

    That set him off, he ran up to my window "THAT'S IT!. License and registration!!!"

    I asked what the reason was he was asking/demanding this from me, and he said "WHEN I TELL YOU SOMETHING, YOU LISTEN UP AND JUST DO IT!"

    That's when I told him that I wanted to start recording, "at this point sir, I'd like to start recording this with my cell phone"..."touch it and I'll take you to jail" he yells,

    "License! Now!" (he yells again)

    I opened up my glove box, and started to get my DL out and I hear him chuckle, (I think he was very pleased with himself?)

    So I show him my license (kept it in my hand) and he said "give it to me!", I said something about "illegal stops" and he said "give it to me or I'm taking you to jail, and he reaches for my door handle" (that was the point in which it could go anyway, I chose a more calm? approach)

    I said "alright officer", and handed it to him". He tells me to exit my vehicle, which I do, and he goes checks my DL.

    At this point the female officer and myself start talking and I expressed my dismay at what was going on, (I forgot to mention that before I got out of my car, I asked the officer 3 times for a supervisor and he replied "what do you think he (supervisor) is going to do for you?") (I'm like "supervise?")

    So after he checks my DL, he comes back right up to me, "I can right you a ticket for speeding", "I know when people speed, I'm trained in the use of Radars",

    "Thank you officer, what speed was I going?" (He was manning the crosswalk, I could see he did not have a radar with him)

    He said "I can tell the by the way a car leans", at this point I gave him a quick lesson in physics, gravity, and some other things that came to mind at the time...It took him quite back, his voice got suddenly less aggressive and he probably wondered who he pulled over,

    Now at this point he realizes that he can't write me a speeding ticket, he looks over at my car, and then said "ah! your tints!, I can tell they are illegal!" Then he runs like a horse to his car and comes back with a small black box.

    He opens it, looks at me and says "I'm going to test your window tints with this machine?(he did not say machine, can't recall what word he used, 'device', maybe)", "Go ahead officer" (I said)

    He hooks it on my window and, it registered something like 9% darker than what's legal, he says quite joyfully, "ha!, illegal, that's a 160 dollar ticket per window" (I literally did one of these 8-|

    Then I (naturally) question his usage of said device, and he gives me a run down about his extensive knowledge of using it, and he opened the black box again and takes out two small tinted lenses with a certain % tint on them, he tells me that this is how he knows his readings are accurate, so I said "excellent officer, do you mind testing those lenses right now..?"

    (Now the playing field changes completely)

    At that point, he took a step back from me, looked at me kinda shocked, slowly put the lenses and device back in the box, turned around and walked back to his car to put the box back into his vehicle,

    Then he walks back up to me and says (very gently, very very gently) "so I'm not going to write/issue you any tickets/citations" reaches out his hand to shake mine, I pause, look at him, and shake his hand.

    I get back in my car, and drive off. (female office looking at me with a huge smile on her face just shaking her head)
    -

    I'm confident, the next time he 'pulls' someone over, or yells at someone, it will be for the 'right' reasons. ah, but who knows. Some friends of mine were angry at me that I did not report him, my reasoning for not doing so was that at the end, he recognized what the 'truth' was, and will be perhaps more careful,more human, in the future, reporting him, I felt would just harden his heart, I spoke to him at the human level, and think I reached his heart, I dunno, maybe I shoulda reported him. I dunno.
    -

    So yeah, I now drive with a dash cam, records automatically once I start my engine and stays on for 5mins after ignition is turned off,
    Garmin Dash Cam 10

    image

    Quite a few different types of dashcams on the market, blackvue, MioVu, Cobra. I recommend every driver using one.

    image

    (Sorry Unsung for stepping into your thread, I don't mean to derail it)
  • badbrainsbadbrains Posts: 10,255
    Idris said:

    hedonist said:

    Wow. Messed up, but good for you, Idris.

    Sad anyone has to get to the point of dash-camming, but understandable. Kudos for keeping a level head.

    (and I'm dying to know what you sort of got pulled over for, but figure you'll share if desired :) )

    So I just left my works parking lot (1pm, sunny Florida afternoon), got onto the road, the road bends, I came around the bend and maybe 750? feet ahead is a pedestrian crosswalk, I saw some peds about to step onto the crossing, I slowed my car and came to a very decent smooth stop.

    Then a cop walks to about 15 feet from my car (my windows were down more than half way) and he starts (quite loudly/aggressively) telling me what the speed limit is (35MPH) which I already knew as I drive that road just about daily, and knew officers had been watching the crosswalk for a few weeks.

    So he like a robot repeats to me over an over "its 35! its 35!" "slow down" (I was already driving under the limit, I think I had some PJ on the radio, it WAS a relaxing day until that point)

    After about 40 seconds of him repeating this, I said in a calm and very cool manner. "Thank you officer, I am aware of the speed limit and was not over it"

    Now he seems to get really annoyed, "what!" (he yells) and continues "slowwww down!", (at this point I'm thinking what world am I living in lmao)

    The pedestrians are about 70% down the crosswalk (its a wide two streets),

    Now after the 10,15th, maybe 20th time he tells me that I was speeding and should slow down, I told him, "officer, the next time you accuse someone of doing something, make sure your facts are in order, thank you"

    That set him off, he ran up to my window "THAT'S IT!. License and registration!!!"

    I asked what the reason was he was asking/demanding this from me, and he said "WHEN I TELL YOU SOMETHING, YOU LISTEN UP AND JUST DO IT!"

    That's when I told him that I wanted to start recording, "at this point sir, I'd like to start recording this with my cell phone"..."touch it and I'll take you to jail" he yells,

    "License! Now!" (he yells again)

    I opened up my glove box, and started to get my DL out and I hear him chuckle, (I think he was very pleased with himself?)

    So I show him my license (kept it in my hand) and he said "give it to me!", I said something about "illegal stops" and he said "give it to me or I'm taking you to jail, and he reaches for my door handle" (that was the point in which it could go anyway, I chose a more calm? approach)

    I said "alright officer", and handed it to him". He tells me to exit my vehicle, which I do, and he goes checks my DL.

    At this point the female officer and myself start talking and I expressed my dismay at what was going on, (I forgot to mention that before I got out of my car, I asked the officer 3 times for a supervisor and he replied "what do you think he (supervisor) is going to do for you?") (I'm like "supervise?")

    So after he checks my DL, he comes back right up to me, "I can right you a ticket for speeding", "I know when people speed, I'm trained in the use of Radars",

    "Thank you officer, what speed was I going?" (He was manning the crosswalk, I could see he did not have a radar with him)

    He said "I can tell the by the way a car leans", at this point I gave him a quick lesson in physics, gravity, and some other things that came to mind at the time...It took him quite back, his voice got suddenly less aggressive and he probably wondered who he pulled over,

    Now at this point he realizes that he can't write me a speeding ticket, he looks over at my car, and then said "ah! your tints!, I can tell they are illegal!" Then he runs like a horse to his car and comes back with a small black box.

    He opens it, looks at me and says "I'm going to test your window tints with this machine?(he did not say machine, can't recall what word he used, 'device', maybe)", "Go ahead officer" (I said)

    He hooks it on my window and, it registered something like 9% darker than what's legal, he says quite joyfully, "ha!, illegal, that's a 160 dollar ticket per window" (I literally did one of these 8-|

    Then I (naturally) question his usage of said device, and he gives me a run down about his extensive knowledge of using it, and he opened the black box again and takes out two small tinted lenses with a certain % tint on them, he tells me that this is how he knows his readings are accurate, so I said "excellent officer, do you mind testing those lenses right now..?"

    (Now the playing field changes completely)

    At that point, he took a step back from me, looked at me kinda shocked, slowly put the lenses and device back in the box, turned around and walked back to his car to put the box back into his vehicle,

    Then he walks back up to me and says (very gently, very very gently) "so I'm not going to write/issue you any tickets/citations" reaches out his hand to shake mine, I pause, look at him, and shake his hand.

    I get back in my car, and drive off. (female office looking at me with a huge smile on her face just shaking her head)
    -

    I'm confident, the next time he 'pulls' someone over, or yells at someone, it will be for the 'right' reasons. ah, but who knows. Some friends of mine were angry at me that I did not report him, my reasoning for not doing so was that at the end, he recognized what the 'truth' was, and will be perhaps more careful,more human, in the future, reporting him, I felt would just harden his heart, I spoke to him at the human level, and think I reached his heart, I dunno, maybe I shoulda reported him. I dunno.
    -

    So yeah, I now drive with a dash cam, records automatically once I start my engine and stays on for 5mins after ignition is turned off,
    Garmin Dash Cam 10

    image

    Quite a few different types of dashcams on the market, blackvue, MioVu, Cobra. I recommend every driver using one.

    image

    (Sorry Unsung for stepping into your thread, I don't mean to derail it)
    U didn't derail shit, that was a crazy story. Good for you. I hate fucken cops who think they're untouchable.

    I was at a gas station one day and and this guy started honking his horn at the attendant (jersey, lazy asses don't pump their own gas). Attendant walked over and said sir your cars not done yet where the customer pulled out his badge and said," I don't have time for you to walk around, wait by the pump for it to finish." There was like 7 cars getting gas and this fucktard with a badge came out talking shit. Cop didn't know I owned the station and KNEW every cop in town. I walked over to him and said what's the problem? He said go away little boy, doesn't involve you. That's where I stated to laugh and grabbed my cell. Called my buddy who was a cop and he pulled right in, small town. The look on that assholes face when he saw my buddy get out of the car and fist bump me was priceless. All I did was point at the car and my buddy went over there and read him the riot act about pulling your badge for dumb shit, talking down to people, this isn't your town blah blah blah. Guy apologized to my attendant and left, never to be seen again. Cops, u either love em or hate em. :D
  • IdrisIdris Posts: 2,316
    :) that's a nice little story.
  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098

    unsung said:

    unsung said:

    Bringing this back up, ignore that it is fox, stossel is a libertarian.
    I agree with Stossel but i have to ask where is your other Libertarians that you allways speak of where is Rand speaking out against this he sure as hell jumped on the farmers side out west when the big bad gov wanted those cows to be moved just asking ....
    Another...

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/libertarians-make-their-voices-heard-on-police-in-ferguson-mo/2014/08/14/e780217c-23e6-11e4-86ca-6f03cbd15c1a_story.html

  • unsungunsung Posts: 7,098
    Idris said:

    :) that's a nice little story.

    I work with a guy who was sitting at a stoplight and the car in front of him threw it into reverse and slammed into him. The cops show up and the car in front starts screaming how they were hurt and how he rear ended them. A car behind him agreed with Car#1 and said that my co-worker rear ended them. It was all a scam that they were in on. He bought a dash cam that next day.
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