Middle East ......

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  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,401
    They’re not supposed to know. This is a deliberate tactic to cover up and prevent the mass atrocities against non-combatant Palestinians from being broadcast in real time. Bibi and his apartheid state have unleashed the Zionist holocaust. Just wait.

    The world is watching.
    but most of the world is blindly pro israel in this situation, so it doesn't matter if the world is watching or not. israel is basically a rogue state at this point. it has already hit targets in other countries as well, with backing from the us.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • static111static111 Posts: 4,900
    news flash. trump will never be president again. wake up.
    He will if people like Lerxst vote for him to continue the unwavering support of wholesale slaughter of Gazans.
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,163
    static111 said:
    He will if people like Lerxst vote for him to continue the unwavering support of wholesale slaughter of Gazans.

    Part of me thinks there is no way Trump will get elected as president again and part of me is concerned that it might happen, but as hard as it is to fathom, he is, after all, leading the GOP pack at this early stage.  I hope gimme is right-  I'd really really really like to be confident that he is right
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni











  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,373
    nobody here is saying what hamas did is NOT terrorism. stop putting words in everyone's mouths. what you are doing is blaming all palestinians for hamas' actions, and justifying israel's overwhelming response targeting civilians. this is the same thing the US did with afghanistan and then pivoting to iraq. 19 people carried out 9/11 and because of that we killed nearly 1 million iraqis. did you support that too?

    AND most of those 19 were Saudi....
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  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,401
    edited October 2023
    mickeyrat said:

    AND most of those 19 were Saudi....
    yep, i forgot to add that part. we did nothing to the saudis after 9/11 even though we knew they were saudi nationals. 

    by lerxs' rationale and what he has said about the israel/hamas conflict, we should have flattened saudi arabia based on the actions of 19 people.
    Post edited by gimmesometruth27 on
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,401
    brianlux said:

    Part of me thinks there is no way Trump will get elected as president again and part of me is concerned that it might happen, but as hard as it is to fathom, he is, after all, leading the GOP pack at this early stage.  I hope gimme is right-  I'd really really really like to be confident that he is right
    trump cannot win the popular vote, so he has to win the electoral vote in a small number of states. he will not have the popular turnout to swing those elections because he has not gained voters. he has lost millions of supporters. his hardcore supporters are old people that are dying off. the gop is not raising younger generations of voters, the younger voters are more liberal, so they would never vote gop. the gop is a dying party. they gave their party to trump, and he has driven it into the ground, like every single facet of all of his businesses. unless there is huge electoral interference, trump will never be president again. he cannot win it legitimately.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,163
    trump cannot win the popular vote, so he has to win the electoral vote in a small number of states. he will not have the popular turnout to swing those elections because he has not gained voters. he has lost millions of supporters. his hardcore supporters are old people that are dying off. the gop is not raising younger generations of voters, the younger voters are more liberal, so they would never vote gop. the gop is a dying party. they gave their party to trump, and he has driven it into the ground, like every single facet of all of his businesses. unless there is huge electoral interference, trump will never be president again. he cannot win it legitimately.

    All sounds good to me, thanks.  I guess I have to stop reading things that get me paranoid else-wise!
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni











  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,373
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,357
    brianlux said:

    All sounds good to me, thanks.  I guess I have to stop reading things that get me paranoid else-wise!
    That younger voter argument was first made with Obama in 2008. Voters 20 years old then will be 36 for this election. That’s a huge swath of the electorate, yet trump is polling as good as anyone else. He can’t win it legitimately? I wish the pollsters agreed




    Don’t like national polls? Hers a bunch of swing state polls with Biden ahead in one




    20 house Dems now support cease fire, Keep supporting Hamas, like somehow that will end the horrible killing of civilians. No, supporting Hamas will split the Dems and get trump elected. Why isn’t the world demanding hamas to immediate surrender? 

    If the world community wanted peace and to spare lives, everyone would demand the immediate surrender of Hamas. They started this war.


  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,881
    That younger voter argument was first made with Obama in 2008. Voters 20 years old then will be 36 for this election. That’s a huge swath of the electorate, yet trump is polling as good as anyone else. He can’t win it legitimately? I wish the pollsters agreed




    Don’t like national polls? Hers a bunch of swing state polls with Biden ahead in one




    20 house Dems now support cease fire, Keep supporting Hamas, like somehow that will end the horrible killing of civilians. No, supporting Hamas will split the Dems and get trump elected. Why isn’t the world demanding hamas to immediate surrender? 

    If the world community wanted peace and to spare lives, everyone would demand the immediate surrender of Hamas. They started this war.


    Hamas doesn’t care if the world burns down to the ground! 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • static111static111 Posts: 4,900
    That younger voter argument was first made with Obama in 2008. Voters 20 years old then will be 36 for this election. That’s a huge swath of the electorate, yet trump is polling as good as anyone else. He can’t win it legitimately? I wish the pollsters agreed




    Don’t like national polls? Hers a bunch of swing state polls with Biden ahead in one




    20 house Dems now support cease fire, Keep supporting Hamas, like somehow that will end the horrible killing of civilians. No, supporting Hamas will split the Dems and get trump elected. Why isn’t the world demanding hamas to immediate surrender? 

    If the world community wanted peace and to spare lives, everyone would demand the immediate surrender of Hamas. They started this war.


    Do you think all of the Palestinians being industrially murdered wholesale makes anyone safer?  Is there no moral cost for those lives lost bombing a refugee camp by a sovereign government, or are Israels hands clean for everything?
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,881
    static111 said:
    Do you think all of the Palestinians being industrially murdered wholesale makes anyone safer?  Is there no moral cost for those lives lost bombing a refugee camp by a sovereign government, or are Israels hands clean for everything?
    I believe hate just creates more hate a vicious cycle with no end in sight! I believe theirs an Israeli young man who just lost a family or friends that has total hate for all Palestinian citizens as I believe there’s a young Palestinian man who has just lost a family or friends that now just wants all Israeli citizens dead! It will not end 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • JeBurkhardtJeBurkhardt Posts: 5,182
    I believe hate just creates more hate a vicious cycle with no end in sight! I believe theirs an Israeli young man who just lost a family or friends that has total hate for all Palestinian citizens as I believe there’s a young Palestinian man who has just lost a family or friends that now just wants all Israeli citizens dead! It will not end 
    The illustration of a snake eating itself is appropriate for this. Every act of violence is motivated by a past event, which was motivated by a past event, which was motivated by a past event... So many innocent lives have been lost on both sides, it is sickening.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    trump cannot win the popular vote, so he has to win the electoral vote in a small number of states. he will not have the popular turnout to swing those elections because he has not gained voters. he has lost millions of supporters. his hardcore supporters are old people that are dying off. the gop is not raising younger generations of voters, the younger voters are more liberal, so they would never vote gop. the gop is a dying party. they gave their party to trump, and he has driven it into the ground, like every single facet of all of his businesses. unless there is huge electoral interference, trump will never be president again. he cannot win it legitimately.
    Don't most polls show a tight race, and many giving Trump a slight lead? 
  • static111static111 Posts: 4,900
    That younger voter argument was first made with Obama in 2008. Voters 20 years old then will be 36 for this election. That’s a huge swath of the electorate, yet trump is polling as good as anyone else. He can’t win it legitimately? I wish the pollsters agreed




    Don’t like national polls? Hers a bunch of swing state polls with Biden ahead in one




    20 house Dems now support cease fire, Keep supporting Hamas, like somehow that will end the horrible killing of civilians. No, supporting Hamas will split the Dems and get trump elected. Why isn’t the world demanding hamas to immediate surrender? 

    If the world community wanted peace and to spare lives, everyone would demand the immediate surrender of Hamas. They started this war.


    Funny have 20 dems come out in support of Hamas? has anyone come out in support of Hamas or is this another delusion?
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,697
    static111 said:
    Funny have 20 dems come out in support of Hamas? has anyone come out in support of Hamas or is this another delusion?
    I don't know about politicians. But when BLM posts this image the day after Hamas uses paragliders to drop in and murder hundreds of civilians and kidnap hundreds more, I'd say that is showing support for Hamas.

  • Isn’t it sweet of Egypt finally opened its border to a few select Palestinian’s the other day??  It sure is amusing how the Muslim world really don’t seem to want to help out the Palestinians much…Has any Arab country offered asylum to any of them?  I gotta be missing something.  
    Perhaps slow Joe and the dummies can learn a thing or 2 about securing a border like Egypt does.  You got a million Palestinians fleeing bombs and bloodshed getting pushed to the Egypt border, yet no crazy breeches by the crazy desperate people to their wall from what I saw. 
    Pretty impressive 
  • mace1229 said:
    I don't know about politicians. But when BLM posts this image the day after Hamas uses paragliders to drop in and murder hundreds of civilians and kidnap hundreds more, I'd say that is showing support for Hamas.

    The domestic terrorist group BLM was the pride and joy of Progressives and social justice warriors during the George Floyd riots of 2020.  Loads of y’all supported this sham of an organization, and probably still do.  Here is a little tip, fentanyl is bad yo!!!
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,357
    edited November 2023
    The illustration of a snake eating itself is appropriate for this. Every act of violence is motivated by a past event, which was motivated by a past event, which was motivated by a past event... So many innocent lives have been lost on both sides, it is sickening.

    However one side and only one side repeatedly refuses to recognize the other sides right to exist peacefully as a sovereign nation. That step is needed for peace.

    I’d say the battle of Mosul is a better comparable to the current mess, especially to the claim the Palestinian people are not (edit, Hamas).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mosul_(2016%E2%80%932017)

    The US withdrew from Iraq in 2011, but the problem got worse and the ISIL needed to be dealt with years later.
    Post edited by Lerxst1992 on
  • static111static111 Posts: 4,900
    edited November 2023

    However one side and only one side repeatedly refuses to recognize the other sides right to exist peacefully as a sovereign nation. That step is needed for peace.

    I’d say the battle of Mosul is a better comparable to the current mess, especially to the claim the Palestinian people are not (edit, Hamas).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mosul_(2016%E2%80%932017)

    The US withdrew from Iraq in 2011, but the problem got worse and the ISIL needed to be dealt with years later.
    And does Israel unconditionally recognize the right of the existence of a sovereign Palestinian state with borders that can't be annexed at will by settlers?
    Post edited by static111 on
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,357
    edited November 2023
    static111 said:
    Funny have 20 dems come out in support of Hamas? has anyone come out in support of Hamas or is this another delusion?


    Cmon, it is well known Hamas will use ANY pause to restock its weapons, often using humanitarian aid to improve its ability to murder civilians.

    to refer to my comment as “another delusion” is borderline outside the rules here. 

    Give me some credit. I’m probably the only liberal here supporting Israel’s right to defend itself, and in the face of a very strong pro Palestine slant on this forum, this topic has remained open since the horrific start to this war Oct seven



    Edit, the guardian,


    “Pressure is building in Congress, where 18 House Democrats – all progressive lawmakers of color – joined a resolution calling for the White House to support “an immediate de-escalation and ceasefire in Israel and occupied Palestine”.
    Post edited by Lerxst1992 on
  • cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,851
    The illustration of a snake eating itself is appropriate for this. Every act of violence is motivated by a past event, which was motivated by a past event, which was motivated by a past event... So many innocent lives have been lost on both sides, it is sickening.
    I agree.  Their reasons for war are far beyond our comprehension.  They want land based on bloodshed from events when Jesus was born and before.  These are people who pledge their lives to a God that they believe in.  They truly believe their reward will come even if they die.  Israel will not stop until every tunnel is gone, flattened.  Which will, as everyone already posted, just create more death.  Between the 400 years of slavery to the holocaust, as they stated, Israel isn’t going to stop.   
  • static111static111 Posts: 4,900


    Cmon, it is well known Hamas will use ANY pause to restock its weapons, often using humanitarian aid to improve its ability to murder civilians.

    to refer to my comment as “another delusion” is borderline outside the rules here. 

    Give me some credit. I’m probably the only liberal here supporting Israel’s right to defend itself, and in the face of a very strong pro Palestine slant on this forum, this topic has remained open since the horrific start to this war Oct seven



    Edit, the guardian,


    “Pressure is building in Congress, where 18 House Democrats – all progressive lawmakers of color – joined a resolution calling for the White House to support “an immediate de-escalation and ceasefire in Israel and occupied Palestine”.
    Show me where they said they support Hamas and I will take back that the comment was a delusion.  Sure Israel has the right to defend itself and I don't think anyone disputes that, but for many the current actions of the IDF and Israeli government are crossing a line with collective punishment. Kind of like what the us Government did in Iraq and Afghanistan which was wrong then.  Supporting a cease fire and humanitarian aid in the face of the slaughter of civilians en mass in pursuit of some kind of blood debt does not equate supporting Hamas, that's hyperbole in the finest if you aren't with us you're against us vein.

    I appreciate your knowledge of the history of the region and the perspective you bring to the discussion.  Calling people that believe in protecting the lives of Palestinian children supporters of Hamas, however, is fiction.  

    The idea that the unarmed citizens of Palestine can just rise up against a well funded and well armed terrorist group is also outside the realm of reality.  
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,357
    static111 said:
    Show me where they said they support Hamas and I will take back that the comment was a delusion.  Sure Israel has the right to defend itself and I don't think anyone disputes that, but for many the current actions of the IDF and Israeli government are crossing a line with collective punishment. Kind of like what the us Government did in Iraq and Afghanistan which was wrong then.  Supporting a cease fire and humanitarian aid in the face of the slaughter of civilians en mass in pursuit of some kind of blood debt does not equate supporting Hamas, that's hyperbole in the finest if you aren't with us you're against us vein.

    I appreciate your knowledge of the history of the region and the perspective you bring to the discussion.  Calling people that believe in protecting the lives of Palestinian children supporters of Hamas, however, is fiction.  

    The idea that the unarmed citizens of Palestine can just rise up against a well funded and well armed terrorist group is also outside the realm of reality.  

    A pause gives Hamas a chance to rearm itself to attack unarmed civilians, which is the only reason this war currently exists. Supporting a pause is supporting Hamas’ ability to wage war. Supporting a pause will lead to more fatalities. Those that support peace should instead be insisting Hamas surrender. If hamas can’t keep their people safe in the wake of their aggressions, that is evidence they are a failed leadership. They need to surrender to save lives.

    The battle of Mosul was very similar to this conflict, that was a bad idea? We should have let ISIL thrive there?
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,373
    in the meantime US funded weapons killing Palestinian civilians shot by IDF is perfectly ok.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,373
    by this logic, the wholesale slaughter of the ENTIRE Gaza population is permissible in the pursuit of completely wiping out Hamas.

    gotcha.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • static111static111 Posts: 4,900

    A pause gives Hamas a chance to rearm itself to attack unarmed civilians, which is the only reason this war currently exists. Supporting a pause is supporting Hamas’ ability to wage war. Supporting a pause will lead to more fatalities. Those that support peace should instead be insisting Hamas surrender. If hamas can’t keep their people safe in the wake of their aggressions, that is evidence they are a failed leadership. They need to surrender to save lives.

    The battle of Mosul was very similar to this conflict, that was a bad idea? We should have let ISIL thrive there?
    Hamas likely doesn't even see the people of Palestine as their charge.  It's unrealistic to expect the unarmed Palestinians to oust them.  It is also unrealistic to expect a terror organization to just surrender especially when they are ok dying and burning the whole place to the ground. None of this justifies the killing of innocent civilians in the thousands by one of the most advanced militaries in the world, with the full backing of the US Government.

    I support peace and also support the surrender of Hamas. Unfortunately I don't think Hamas is ever going to give up.
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,401
    That younger voter argument was first made with Obama in 2008. Voters 20 years old then will be 36 for this election. That’s a huge swath of the electorate, yet trump is polling as good as anyone else. He can’t win it legitimately? I wish the pollsters agreed




    Don’t like national polls? Hers a bunch of swing state polls with Biden ahead in one




    20 house Dems now support cease fire, Keep supporting Hamas, like somehow that will end the horrible killing of civilians. No, supporting Hamas will split the Dems and get trump elected. Why isn’t the world demanding hamas to immediate surrender? 

    If the world community wanted peace and to spare lives, everyone would demand the immediate surrender of Hamas. They started this war.


    hamas started this war as a result of palestinian subjugation.

    actually this is not the war. this is another flare up of the ongoing conflict that has been going on for decades.

    also, let us take very seriously polls that are a year out from the election....

    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,401
    mace1229 said:
    Don't most polls show a tight race, and many giving Trump a slight lead? 
    again polls 52 weeks from the election. trump could be in jail in a year.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 23,401
    why are more and more settlements being built?

    this is the root of the issue as far as i am concerned. the settlement expansion is illegal, and israel keeps doing it. the government has at one time subsidized the settlers to move there. seems to me, if i am that concerned about the safety of my people, i would not pay people to fucking move onto land that is not theirs.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
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