Viruses / Vaccines 2

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  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 43,222
    23scidoo said:
    What was it??

    a condition of employment.
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  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    mickeyrat said:

    a condition of employment.
    In my part of the world call it blacmail..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • benjsbenjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,306
    edited May 2023
    23scidoo said:
    In my part of the world call it blacmail..
    You have ignored countless people on here who have explained to you, with evidence, how and why reduced symptoms led to reduced spread. You may consider reducing the spread of a pandemic by imposing a minuscule risk of any complication (not a lethal one) on employed citizens to be illegitimate - I consider that attitude selfish as fuck. Must be cultural differences between 'your part of the world' and mine.

    Other risks we willingly accept: 
    Building codes in Ontario accept calculations yielding a 1 in 2 million odds of failure (a terrible imposition from the government - we should all abandon our homes instead)
    The odds of tripping and dying in the shower are something like 1 in 700,000 (who can accept this? BAN ALL SHOWERS) 
    Exposure to drunk drivers on the road or violent carriers of firearms on the streets (whatever the odds are, expect them to be way worse if you're not Caucasian)
    Being stampeded to death at a Pearl Jam concert: 9 died at Roskilde. As of September 2021 (according to ChatGPT) PJ had played over 1,200 shows. Assuming 30,000 seats per venue, that's 70,000,000 attendees, or more than 1 in 10 million odds of death. Should Pearl Jam have stopped touring when they saw a fatality occur? For that matter, should all music events be banned?
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  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,000
    edited May 2023
    23scidoo said:
    My character is me..my behavior is you..
    😂 so i suppose that applies to every other perdon every time you’ve whined about people being “big meanies” to you then, wouldn’t it. 
    Post edited by HughFreakingDillon on
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,000
    23scidoo said:
    In my part of the world call it blacmail..
    Your part of the world has trouble with definitions then. 
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • Merkin BallerMerkin Baller Posts: 12,231
    Nail on the head, @benjs

    selfish as fuck. 
  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 727
    neither was the vaccine. did someone hold you down and administer it? why is that so hard to understand?
    So at the age of 45ish, somebody is forced to change his job and/or restart his career. Good fuckin luck with that. 

  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 727
    mrussel1 said:
    Why?  The polio vaccine was tested literally on children, quickly, and rolled out to all school children in the US in the matter of a year.  And now it's mandatory.  Why is there not an equivalency?  
    Night and day. Polio vaccine was effective and Covid shots were ineffective, but great as a feelgood factor among some. 
  • AW124797AW124797 Posts: 727
    benjs said:
    You have ignored countless people on here who have explained to you, with evidence, how and why reduced symptoms led to reduced spread. You may consider reducing the spread of a pandemic by imposing a minuscule risk of any complication (not a lethal one) on employed citizens to be illegitimate - I consider that attitude selfish as fuck. Must be cultural differences between 'your part of the world' and mine.

    Other risks we willingly accept: 
    Building codes in Ontario accept calculations yielding a 1 in 2 million odds of failure (a terrible imposition from the government - we should all abandon our homes instead)
    The odds of tripping and dying in the shower are something like 1 in 700,000 (who can accept this? BAN ALL SHOWERS) 
    Exposure to drunk drivers on the road or violent carriers of firearms on the streets (whatever the odds are, expect them to be way worse if you're not Caucasian)
    Being stampeded to death at a Pearl Jam concert: 9 died at Roskilde. As of September 2021 (according to ChatGPT) PJ had played over 1,200 shows. Assuming 30,000 seats per venue, that's 70,000,000 attendees, or more than 1 in 10 million odds of death. Should Pearl Jam have stopped touring when they saw a fatality occur? For that matter, should all music events be banned?
    What about swimming pools and air travel? 
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 40,828
    AW124797 said:
    What about swimming pools and air travel? 
    The government should stop lying about them and ban them. No good for nobody.
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  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    Your part of the world has trouble with definitions then. 
    So Huge, how you call it??..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    benjs said:
    You have ignored countless people on here who have explained to you, with evidence, how and why reduced symptoms led to reduced spread. You may consider reducing the spread of a pandemic by imposing a minuscule risk of any complication (not a lethal one) on employed citizens to be illegitimate - I consider that attitude selfish as fuck. Must be cultural differences between 'your part of the world' and mine.

    Other risks we willingly accept: 
    Building codes in Ontario accept calculations yielding a 1 in 2 million odds of failure (a terrible imposition from the government - we should all abandon our homes instead)
    The odds of tripping and dying in the shower are something like 1 in 700,000 (who can accept this? BAN ALL SHOWERS) 
    Exposure to drunk drivers on the road or violent carriers of firearms on the streets (whatever the odds are, expect them to be way worse if you're not Caucasian)
    Being stampeded to death at a Pearl Jam concert: 9 died at Roskilde. As of September 2021 (according to ChatGPT) PJ had played over 1,200 shows. Assuming 30,000 seats per venue, that's 70,000,000 attendees, or more than 1 in 10 million odds of death. Should Pearl Jam have stopped touring when they saw a fatality occur? For that matter, should all music events be banned?
    Again for thousand time..did they told us that the vaccine is 100% safe and effective??..it was true ??..no..end of storie, anything else is air..is that the PJ example serious??..
    ofcourse we have cultural differences..thank God for that..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    AW124797 said:
    What about swimming pools and air travel? 
    Walking on big highways has also some risk..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    neither was the vaccine. did someone hold you down and administer it? why is that so hard to understand?
    ''neither was the vaccine''??..you must be kidding or short memory..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    Nuremberg Code, point number 10..

    During the course of the experiment the scientist in charge must be prepared to terminate the experiment at any stage, if he has probable cause to believe, in the exercise of the good faith, superior skill and careful judgment required of him that a continuation of the experiment is likely to result in injury, disability, or death to the experimental subject.
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    Some crazy scientists from the north..

    https://www.mdpi.com/1467-3045/44/3/73
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    😂 so i suppose that applies to every other perdon every time you’ve whined about people being “big meanies” to you then, wouldn’t it. 
    this goes to those who consider themselves smart and someone else not even if they haven't even seen him..οr because just have different opinion..but i have grow up in the country who born democracy and principles like this..

    I might disagree with your opinion -Voltaire 600x400  rQuotesPorn
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    edited May 2023
    23scidoo said:
    I care but..
    https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/11/vaccinated-spread-the-coronavirus/620650/
    ςWhat happens here Huge, no comments??..
    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.10.20.21265137v1
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,548
    AW124797 said:
    Night and day. Polio vaccine was effective and Covid shots were ineffective, but great as a feelgood factor among some. 
    Ok great.  So if the covid shots were more effective, you would have agreed with all of the efforts by the US gov't these last few years, correct?
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,548
    23scidoo said:
    I care but..
    https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/11/vaccinated-spread-the-coronavirus/620650/
    I feel like you didn't actually read what you posted.  This article 100% supports what everyone here has been saying.  Maybe you should read it with a different lens if you think it's anti-vaccine.  
  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 11,172
    AW124797 said:
    What about swimming pools and air travel? 
    In both situations there should be more guns and less doors.
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,398
    23scidoo said:
    ςWhat happens here Huge, no comments??..
    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.10.20.21265137v1
    Whoopsies:

    However, despite its magnitude, the outbreak was restricted in its onward impact in MA and the US, likely due to high vaccination rates and a robust public health response.

  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    mrussel1 said:
    I feel like you didn't actually read what you posted.  This article 100% supports what everyone here has been saying.  Maybe you should read it with a different lens if you think it's anti-vaccine.  
    If you find one antivaccine post from me i'll buy you a cheeseburger from McDonald's..after 3 years you still don't get my point..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,548
    23scidoo said:
    If you find one antivaccine post from me i'll buy you a cheeseburger from McDonald's..after 3 years you still don't get my point..
    Then summarize it.  I certainly don't know what it is at this point. 
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    mrussel1 said:
    Then summarize it.  I certainly don't know what it is at this point. 
    I'll do it for last time..
    first lie..the virus came from the market..they knew it it was man made..please don't te;ll otherwise..
    second lie..vaccines are 100% safe and effective..bullshit..
    people lost their jobs and scientists lost their reputations because they expressed a different opinion..others were called crazy and others conspiracy theorists..
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • 23scidoo23scidoo Thessaloniki,Greece Posts: 19,686
    Athens 2006. Dusseldorf 2007. Berlin 2009. Venice 2010. Amsterdam 1 2012. Amsterdam 1+2 2014. Buenos Aires 2015.
    Prague Krakow Berlin 2018. Berlin 2022
    EV, Taormina 1+2 2017.

    I wish i was the souvenir you kept your house key on..
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,548
    23scidoo said:
    I'll do it for last time..
    first lie..the virus came from the market..they knew it it was man made..please don't te;ll otherwise..
    second lie..vaccines are 100% safe and effective..bullshit..
    people lost their jobs and scientists lost their reputations because they expressed a different opinion..others were called crazy and others conspiracy theorists..
    So let's pull this apart one thing at a time:

    RE:  "man made" vs "naturally occurring "

    1. When you say "they knew it was man made", who precisely is "they" and when precisely did "they know"?
    2. Let's say your statement is true (whoever "they" may be), what do you think your gov't or the US gov't should have done differently as a public health response, with that knowledge?  Would they have not had mask mandates?  Would the virus have killed fewer people.  Tell me how the public response would have changed.  


  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,548
    RE: Safe and effective

    1. What is the actual safety rate of the vaccine?  What would it have needed to be for you to get the vaccine?

    2. What is the final efficacy rate of the virus against the original strain (for which it was developed)?  What would that number have needed to be for you to support the vaccine distribution?
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,672
    mrussel1 said:
    So let's pull this apart one thing at a time:

    RE:  "man made" vs "naturally occurring "

    1. When you say "they knew it was man made", who precisely is "they" and when precisely did "they know"?
    2. Let's say your statement is true (whoever "they" may be), what do you think your gov't or the US gov't should have done differently as a public health response, with that knowledge?  Would they have not had mask mandates?  Would the virus have killed fewer people.  Tell me how the public response would have changed.  


    My views are probably in between you 2, but I'll answer.

    I'm not convinced they (the government and those working for them) knew it was from a lab early on. But they sure weren't open to the idea for a very long time. Many would call you racist for even suggesting it. Turns out, 2 years later seems like the likely cause. So they could have, and should have been more open to it than just shoving the wet market idea down on us.

    They did announce the vaccine as something like 95% effective and say you will not even get it. Within a few months that changed to it just reduces the symptoms. A lot of people seem to forget that initial promise to us. I don't know what they should have done differently, they had limited data in a short time. I'm just acknowledging their stance on how effective it was did change quite a lot.
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