Police abuse

tbergs said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

26 year veteran didn’t or couldn’t tell the difference between her taser and firearm?

https://www.prisonlegalnews.org/media/publications/taser_intl_certification_plan_full.pdf

from the link, weight 18 ozs versus 33.3 for a 9mm with a 3-15 round mag (don’t call it a clip). Optional yellow color, why? Oh, MN had an instance of law enforcement mistakenly shooting someone with their firearm and not a taser in the past.

Why do you keep implying there is some sort of conspiracy to this? You make it sound like the cop wanted to kill someone and pretended she didnt know she had her firearm out instead of a taser. Did you watch the video? She fucked up for sure. It was a mistake. Cops aren't perfect and she'll face the consequences for that mistake as well. 

mace1229 said:

oftenreading said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

tbergs said:

static111 said:

This is a terrible association. If these are the comparisons that people want to argue, then it's no different when police use the shootings of other cops as the reason for deadly force in any non-compliance situations. I'm not condoning this as much a I'm not condoning the "he should have just complied" crowd. Neither are an excuse for this situation.

Sorry not even the same thing.  less than 100 police get killed in the line of duty versus them killing 1000 plus people a year.  And we know that a certain segment of the murdered by cop population takes more of this on per capita.   The police that do get killed in the line of duty by weapons are often times responding to actual violent acts that they signed up for, whereas the people that have been getting killed by police have largely been for some minor offense and “not complying”.   I’m sure you’ve seen the video of the army lieutenant that was going around recently.   People have more to fear from cops than cops have from people, statistically speaking.

Where are you getting that? Using your numbers of 100 cops being killed they are at a much higher risk of being killed than the 350 million citizens who get killed at a rate of 1000 per year.
Not defending what happened yesterday, but civilians are not in more danger of being killed by police than of police risk. It’s not even close.
And I hate the argument “that’s what they signed up for.” That doesn’t make violence against police okay.

There is a big gulf between recognizing that there are occupational hazards in policing vs saying "violence against police is okay". It's almost as foolish to deny that police have to face the occupational hazard of dealing with violent situations as it would be to deny that those in the armed forces do, or that roofers have to deal with the occupational hazards of working at heights. Reasonable efforts should go in to reducing those risks but they will always exist, and strategies to mitigate those risks should not involve placing those being stopped or arrested at greater risk. 

I agree with all that. I was just responding to the comment that citizens are in more danger from cops than cops are on the job. No matter how someone skews the data, that isn’t true. Then adds and when they do get killed, they signed up for it anyway. It just came across as callous towards police deaths to me.

tbergs said:

dankind said:

I’ve never not resisted arrest or just flat out ran away from cops in my teens and 20s. 

Wonder why I’m still alive?

It's because you're white. Is that what you wanted to hear? I'm sure that's the only reason too.

dankind said:

tbergs said:

dankind said:

I’ve never not resisted arrest or just flat out ran away from cops in my teens and 20s. 

Wonder why I’m still alive?

It's because you're white. Is that what you wanted to hear? I'm sure that's the only reason too.

Not what I wanted to hear. It's the last thing I ever want to hear. But it is what it is.

Also, white house party breakups=no guns drawn, no arrests made; Black house party breakups=guns drawn and as many Black bodies as they could fit into their cruisers for a ride downtown.

I'm guessing that's still standard operating procedure where I grew up, but I could be wrong. I don't go back to that place. They arm educators there so that they can have their turn to say "all of a sudden, I was afraid" and get away with murder. Only a matter of time.

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

oftenreading said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

tbergs said:

static111 said:

This is a terrible association. If these are the comparisons that people want to argue, then it's no different when police use the shootings of other cops as the reason for deadly force in any non-compliance situations. I'm not condoning this as much a I'm not condoning the "he should have just complied" crowd. Neither are an excuse for this situation.

Sorry not even the same thing.  less than 100 police get killed in the line of duty versus them killing 1000 plus people a year.  And we know that a certain segment of the murdered by cop population takes more of this on per capita.   The police that do get killed in the line of duty by weapons are often times responding to actual violent acts that they signed up for, whereas the people that have been getting killed by police have largely been for some minor offense and “not complying”.   I’m sure you’ve seen the video of the army lieutenant that was going around recently.   People have more to fear from cops than cops have from people, statistically speaking.

Where are you getting that? Using your numbers of 100 cops being killed they are at a much higher risk of being killed than the 350 million citizens who get killed at a rate of 1000 per year.
Not defending what happened yesterday, but civilians are not in more danger of being killed by police than of police risk. It’s not even close.
And I hate the argument “that’s what they signed up for.” That doesn’t make violence against police okay.

There is a big gulf between recognizing that there are occupational hazards in policing vs saying "violence against police is okay". It's almost as foolish to deny that police have to face the occupational hazard of dealing with violent situations as it would be to deny that those in the armed forces do, or that roofers have to deal with the occupational hazards of working at heights. Reasonable efforts should go in to reducing those risks but they will always exist, and strategies to mitigate those risks should not involve placing those being stopped or arrested at greater risk. 

I agree with all that. I was just responding to the comment that citizens are in more danger from cops than cops are on the job. No matter how someone skews the data, that isn’t true. Then adds and when they do get killed, they signed up for it anyway. It just came across as callous towards police deaths to me.

Callous, like saying he should have complied, or don’t build a rap sheet at 20 etc.  amazing the knots people will tie themselves in to justify an officer killing someone while putting the blame on the victim.  What about officer behaviors? maybe that’s what needs to change?  The fact remains that there are far more dangerous occupations than policing that cause more worker fatalities.  The amount of policemen getting killed and targeted for being policemen is negligible.  On the other hand the amount of young black men being killed by police for being young black men is an epidemic.     I’m sorry but the answer shouldn’t be in a free country that people need to comply.  And another thing who sees about the kids rap sheet.  Why don’t we hear about all the times this cop has been reprimanded etc And every detail of their past?

CM189191 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

tbergs said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

26 year veteran didn’t or couldn’t tell the difference between her taser and firearm?

https://www.prisonlegalnews.org/media/publications/taser_intl_certification_plan_full.pdf

from the link, weight 18 ozs versus 33.3 for a 9mm with a 3-15 round mag (don’t call it a clip). Optional yellow color, why? Oh, MN had an instance of law enforcement mistakenly shooting someone with their firearm and not a taser in the past.

Why do you keep implying there is some sort of conspiracy to this? You make it sound like the cop wanted to kill someone and pretended she didnt know she had her firearm out instead of a taser. Did you watch the video? She fucked up for sure. It was a mistake. Cops aren't perfect and she'll face the consequences for that mistake as well. 

Liberals better get their act together. This is defund the police all over again. 

This is clearly not anything like the Floyd murder. The victim had two outstanding warrants, physically resisted arrest and lunged into his car. The cops had every right  to suspect the victim had a gun in the car. One of the outstanding warrants involved illegal carry. In the heat of battle, the cop made a terrible mistake. But the dangerous conditions were created by the victim. Where is the black community to admit breaking the law and resisting arrest is not acceptable conduct?

Liberals want trump elected in 2024? Ignoring the victim’s contributions to his own death and ignoring the danger he put the cops in with  his blatant disregard for authority will certainly help republicans sweep congress in 22 and Trump to win in 24.

This is clearly not anything like the Floyd murder.
Yes, it is

The victim had two outstanding warrants, physically resisted arrest and lunged into his car.
This is not a license for police to summarily execute a citizen.

The cops had every right  to suspect the victim had a gun in the car.
1) no they didn't
2) cops think everyone has a gun

One of the outstanding warrants involved illegal carry.
No, the outstanding warrant was for failure to appear in court.  Neither of these are violent crimes.

In the heat of battle, the cop made a terrible mistake.
The cop was negligent and reckless

But the dangerous conditions were created by the victim.
No they weren't.  Cops started the interaction.  Where unable to control the situation.  And escalated unnecessarily.  

Where is the black community to admit breaking the law and resisting arrest is not acceptable conduct?
Police aren't supposed to murder guilty people, either. 

Merkin Baller said:

Has there been actual confirmation about what the warrants were for?


Jack Posobiec is the only blue checkmark I've seen reporting that the warrants were related to firearms, and I don't find him very trustworthy. 

Ledbetterman10 said:

Merkin Baller said:

Has there been actual confirmation about what the warrants were for?


Jack Posobiec is the only blue checkmark I've seen reporting that the warrants were related to firearms, and I don't find him very trustworthy. 

Here's a screenshot from the public records. Looks like he had a charge for possessing a firearm without a permit, didn't show for court on 04/02/21 (which I guess would've been via Zoom since it mentions 'remote technology'), and a warrant as issued that day....