Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez
Comments
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She was right about the Amazon thing IMHO. I know it hurts now, but not nearly as much as it would have down the road a ways, when none of her constituents could afford rent and none of their children had a hope in hell of staying in the neighborhood because of housing prices.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
I haven't read up much on AOC hate - but I have a feeling you can draw a straight line from "not liking AOC" to other shitty views.
It's just like the voices you hear about Greta Thunberg (atleast in Sweden).
"Oh, you think that a young girl like Greta should shut up about climate and 'focus on school instead'?... oh, and you also just happen to hate anyone not white and can't understand why politicians want to you drive your car less. How swell"
Just a feeling.Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
dignin said:HughFreakingDillon said:PJ_Soul said:Okay... but I have to say it: What if someone truly thinks that someone they're talking with is buying into a false narrative? This obviously is going to be true at least some of the time. If you treat that idea as though it's dismissive or lazy or whatever, isn't that equally dismissive to that person, who just might be right? I realize that anyone, whether they are actually buying in or not, is going to be offended by the suggestion... But that doesn't mean it might not still be true, and it's kind of a point impossible not to make at times. Sometimes something is hugely explained by the fact that people are buying into a false narrative. It shouldn't be taboo to suggest it, whether they happen to be right or wrong. Anyone accused of it can obviously deny it (not that they'll know if it's true or not) and feel annoyed that they've been accused of it, but I don't think it's a crazy or lazy suggestion to be making even if it's not true.
And for the record, it was you who engaged me. As usual you can't get simple facts straight.
can't let it go? pj soul commented on it, so i responded.
problem?
By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
tempo_n_groove said:dignin said:tempo_n_groove said:oftenreading said:tempo_n_groove said:oftenreading said:tempo_n_groove said:dignin said:tempo_n_groove said:oftenreading said:tempo_n_groove said:Halifax2TheMax said:AOC who? I forget about her and then this thread gets bumped so I check in and it’s much ado about a Twitter spat. Welcome to junior high. But the question is, is she representing her constituents and will she face a primary and get re-elected?
She won't accomplish anything but beat her chest come election time.
Most of her constituents say she blew it with the Amazon thing.
Poll numbers are bad.
google search
https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.amny.com/amp/news/politics/aoc-approval-rating-1.29633086
So Sienna poll and Quinnac poll... All these polls. I guess we can pick the ones we like to construct our arguments, lol.
In April 52% supports her. I guess that is a majority? Half? I was actually shocked it was that high.
I was more curious to see the polling from her district where you say they thought she blew the Amazon deal (which as proven before she didn't). Can you do that Google search for me too?
2nd, I know she had nothing to do with losing amazon but her constituents are upset about it... Look above.
Read the article Hoss.Post edited by dignin on0 -
'Why do you hate Hilary?' 'I just do! She's a liar''Why do you hate Cortez?' I just do! She's arrogant'0
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Halifax2TheMax said:I’d rather have AOC in Congress less than a full term, inexperienced, young, brash, pompous, polarizing, etc. than Lindsey fucking Graham, who after decades on the hill and as a former Air Force lawyer, publicly encourages criminals to ignore senate subpoenas. Imagine what that POS is doing in private? But Oooooo, AOC clapped back at Joe Biden, ooooooooo.
We love eating our own.0 -
PJ_Soul said:She was right about the Amazon thing IMHO. I know it hurts now, but not nearly as much as it would have down the road a ways, when none of her constituents could afford rent and none of their children had a hope in hell of staying in the neighborhood because of housing prices.Be Excellent To Each OtherParty On, Dudes!0
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benjs said:Halifax2TheMax said:HughFreakingDillon said:Halifax2TheMax said:I’d rather have AOC in Congress less than a full term, inexperienced, young, brash, pompous, polarizing, etc. than Lindsey fucking Graham, who after decades on the hill and as a former Air Force lawyer, publicly encourages criminals to ignore senate subpoenas. Imagine what that POS is doing in private? But Oooooo, AOC clapped back at Joe Biden, ooooooooo.
We love eating our own.
And yes, i'd agree I'd much prefer her over many of the high profile republicans, including LG.
This is a matter of opinion at this point so take it with a grain of salt, but suppose that you were to superimpose the population of America onto this lovely diagram of the political spectrum. Now, picture where in the political spectrum AOC's positions will yield her votes and respect. How wide of a range is that? What percentage of the population is within that subset of the spectrum?
Next, pretend that AOC were to take a principled yet pragmatic stance where she showed openness to compromise recognizing that the direction is right, even if the progress is insufficient for the end goal. How wide of a range is her spectrum now? What would you imagine the impact to the extreme left wing cohort would be in that situation?
My theory is that a willingness to compromise will expose AOC to a further-centered cohort of population voters currently inaccessible to her, as well a further-centered cohort of political voters currently inaccessible to her, with negligible lack of support from what I suspect to be a smaller cohort than we think (which is likely since extremes are typically the loudest, not the largest).
How do you know AOC hasn't listened? Maybe she has and she's being told the same things she and many of her constiuents have been told their whole lives, wait your turn, slow down, take a number. Well, maybe she's tired of waiting for that change that never comes? The day we're posting about AOC and her FU to the establishment, it was 84 degress in the Artic Circle and CO2 levels reached 455 ppm for the first time in 3 million years. Wait your turn, you sassy malassie! Why do you think she was "preaching" to those old dem stalwarts? The Green New Deal is not an actionable plan but a call to arms, to begin the debate, and whether you agree or not, actionable and debateable policy goals. The point is to do "something," and "something" never happens. Not one repub voted for Obamacare and 9 years later, after attempt after attempt to repeal, gut it, burn it to the ground, they still haven't come up with a plan to replace it. The definition of "do nothing." Meanwhile, Team Trump Treason is promoting fossil fuels and damning wind turbines. And the dems sit on their hands. And nothing changes.
The "lovely diagram of political spectrum," is flawed. The opposite of "conservatism" is "liberalism," not "socialism." Further, social change should sit on both sides of "status quo," right? Both liberals and conservatives want social change over the status quo, whether its abortion, school choice, welfare, healthcare, tax policy, etc. And why is the left "radical" and the right is "reactionary?" One connotes a departure from established norms while the other connotes protecting established norms, to me anyway. Like access to success, there's a built in bias. Now, superimpose AOC's tact, beliefs, etc over the diagram. What do you get? The same the other side would get with their right version of AOC, pick up more of the center, at the expense of your base or lose more lefties/righties to gain more centrists. That said, AOC is not running nationwide. She's appealing to her base and even if its uppity, sassy, disrespectful, too much, too soon, overeager, tactless, her policies would benefit more people in the center, even if they're further left than the centrists, than the alternative. And don't confuse her votes with her rhetoric. Chances are, she'll vote party over principle when it means the most more often than not and she ultimately has to answer to her constiuents, not Faux News or a nationwide electorate. Time will tell.Post edited by Halifax2TheMax on09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©0 -
Smellyman said:'Why do you hate Hilary?' 'I just do! She's a liar''Why do you hate Cortez?' I just do! She's arrogant'
"Women taking up space and having opinions - it makes me uncomfortable!""Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
PJ_Soul said:I wonder if anyone in the history of the world who really was buying into a false narrative actually knew it at the time?? I doubt it. I'm not saying this about you specifically HFD. Just a general question.Post edited by cincybearcat onhippiemom = goodness0
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Halifax2TheMax said:benjs said:Halifax2TheMax said:HughFreakingDillon said:Halifax2TheMax said:
We love eating our own.
And yes, i'd agree I'd much prefer her over many of the high profile republicans, including LG.
This is a matter of opinion at this point so take it with a grain of salt, but suppose that you were to superimpose the population of America onto this lovely diagram of the political spectrum. Now, picture where in the political spectrum AOC's positions will yield her votes and respect. How wide of a range is that? What percentage of the population is within that subset of the spectrum?
Next, pretend that AOC were to take a principled yet pragmatic stance where she showed openness to compromise recognizing that the direction is right, even if the progress is insufficient for the end goal. How wide of a range is her spectrum now? What would you imagine the impact to the extreme left wing cohort would be in that situation?
My theory is that a willingness to compromise will expose AOC to a further-centered cohort of population voters currently inaccessible to her, as well a further-centered cohort of political voters currently inaccessible to her, with negligible lack of support from what I suspect to be a smaller cohort than we think (which is likely since extremes are typically the loudest, not the largest).
How do you know AOC hasn't listened? Maybe she has and she's being told the same things she and many of her constiuents have been told their whole lives, wait your turn, slow down, take a number. Well, maybe she's tired of waiting for that change that never comes? The day we're posting about AOC and her FU to the establishment, it was 84 degress in the Artic Circle and CO2 levels reached 455 ppm for the first time in 3 million years. Wait your turn, you sassy malassie! Why do you think she was "preaching" to those old dem stalwarts? The Green New Deal is not an actionable plan but a call to arms, to begin the debate, and whether you agree or not, actionable and debateable policy goals. The point is to do "something," and "something" never happens. Not one repub voted for Obamacare and 9 years later, after attempt after attempt to repeal, gut it, burn it to the ground, they still haven't come up with a plan to replace it. The definition of "do nothing." Meanwhile, Team Trump Treason is promoting fossil fuels and damning wind turbines. And the dems sit on their hands. And nothing changes.
The "lovely diagram of political spectrum," is flawed. The opposite of "conservatism" is "liberalism," not "socialism." Further, social change should sit on both sides of "status quo," right? Both liberals and conservatives want social change over the status quo, whether its abortion, school choice, welfare, healthcare, tax policy, etc. And why is the left "radical" and the right is "reactionary?" One connotes a departure from established norms while the other connotes protecting established norms, to me anyway. Like access to success, there's a built in bias. Now, superimpose AOC's tact, beliefs, etc over the diagram. What do you get? The same the other side would get with their right version of AOC, pick up more of the center, at the expense of your base or lose more lefties/righties to gain more centrists. That said, AOC is not running nationwide. She's appealing to her base and even if its uppity, sassy, disrespectful, too much, too soon, overeager, tactless, her policies would benefit more people in the center, even if they're further left than the centrists, than the alternative. And don't confuse her votes with her rhetoric. Chances are, she'll vote party over principle when it means the most more often than not and she ultimately has to answer to her constiuents, not Faux News or a nationwide electorate. Time will tell.
Regarding "where you come from" - you're right, it was pretty binary of me to say "not" to that. I should've said that your success is not caused by where you come from, but influenced greatly by where you come from. What I meant was that AOC being a young minority congresswoman is not likely to be a thing that makes her remembered - it will be her ability to see her ideas executed.
On listening - if the Green New Deal isn't an actionable plan but a call to arms, at first I was thinking "well then, why doesn't she just discuss it in Congress without forcing a vote on the matter", but maybe that braveness of forcing people to take a side is warranted at this point. I still fear the repercussions to her own ability to politically succeed, as well as the influence on the DNC voting base, but if it turns out the movement is produced through this action (regardless of where AOC is at the time) then all of these points are moot because she'll have lost the battle but won the war. As usual, I really do hope you're right. We have very similar visions of what the country could look like, I think, you just have faith that I don't in the ability to get there.
Finally, on the political spectrum diagram - I agree, the labelling in hindsight is way out to lunch. If you just focus on the idea of a spectrum though without the labels, I feel that what I wrote holds true. On the national opinion - the sad thing is, although AOC is a New York Congresswoman, she is also getting national attention because weaponizing your political opponents seems to be all the rage these days - regardless of what level of government. On the topic of who will receive the benefits of AOC's policy, if it's a move to reduce emissions, everyone collectively will receive the benefits over a long enough time period, however people have historically voted in alignment with who they feel will do best for them, and make their decision (or even their decision to learn more about a politician's positions) based on instinct and intuition over proper scientific inquiry. I would love to find out that I've been naively faithless and that she's kicking ass and we were ready this whole time for radical and necessary change, and eager to do it at the rapid pace that AOC proposes.
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Spiritual_Chaos said:Smellyman said:'Why do you hate Hilary?' 'I just do! She's a liar''Why do you hate Cortez?' I just do! She's arrogant'
"Women taking up space and having opinions - it makes me uncomfortable!"By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
HughFreakingDillon said:Spiritual_Chaos said:Smellyman said:'Why do you hate Hilary?' 'I just do! She's a liar''Why do you hate Cortez?' I just do! She's arrogant'
"Women taking up space and having opinions - it makes me uncomfortable!"
"The lady doth protest too much, me thinks."0 -
mrussel1 said:HughFreakingDillon said:Spiritual_Chaos said:Smellyman said:'Why do you hate Hilary?' 'I just do! She's a liar''Why do you hate Cortez?' I just do! She's arrogant'
"Women taking up space and having opinions - it makes me uncomfortable!"
"The lady doth protest too much, me thinks."By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
dignin said:tempo_n_groove said:dignin said:tempo_n_groove said:oftenreading said:tempo_n_groove said:oftenreading said:tempo_n_groove said:dignin said:tempo_n_groove said:oftenreading said:tempo_n_groove said:Halifax2TheMax said:AOC who? I forget about her and then this thread gets bumped so I check in and it’s much ado about a Twitter spat. Welcome to junior high. But the question is, is she representing her constituents and will she face a primary and get re-elected?
She won't accomplish anything but beat her chest come election time.
Most of her constituents say she blew it with the Amazon thing.
Poll numbers are bad.
google search
https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.amny.com/amp/news/politics/aoc-approval-rating-1.29633086
So Sienna poll and Quinnac poll... All these polls. I guess we can pick the ones we like to construct our arguments, lol.
In April 52% supports her. I guess that is a majority? Half? I was actually shocked it was that high.
I was more curious to see the polling from her district where you say they thought she blew the Amazon deal (which as proven before she didn't). Can you do that Google search for me too?
2nd, I know she had nothing to do with losing amazon but her constituents are upset about it... Look above.
Read the article Hoss.
My bad Hoss.0 -
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I liked her tweet.0 -
Spiritual_Chaos said:Smellyman said:'Why do you hate Hilary?' 'I just do! She's a liar''Why do you hate Cortez?' I just do! She's arrogant'
"Women taking up space and having opinions - it makes me uncomfortable!""I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/080 -
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