Donald Trump

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  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    mrussel1 said:
    That's literally the most insane interpretation of what I said, that you could possibly muster.  You said I probably don't know any black people, which I replied that im in a diversified industry.  Your counter implication could be... you don't believe that successful black people are real black people.   Is that what you meant? 

    You're off the deep end dude.  
    You are making shit up now..... 

    Where did i say you probably dont know any black people?

    And i inferred that i think successful black people arent real black people? 

    Lol, dude just stop. 

    By the way, you're assuming i think people that work in the banking industry are succesful? Maybe, maybe not, we may have a different idea of what is successful.

    I am going to walk away now, because these are unproductive, never end, and just spiral for pages with people arguing over nothing and semantics. Thess types of conversations on the internet do not work, and people get way too uptight about trivial shit that doesnt matter. 
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,884
    my2hands said:
    mrussel1 said:
    That's literally the most insane interpretation of what I said, that you could possibly muster.  You said I probably don't know any black people, which I replied that im in a diversified industry.  Your counter implication could be... you don't believe that successful black people are real black people.   Is that what you meant? 

    You're off the deep end dude.  
    You are making shit up now..... 

    Where did i say you probably dont know any black people?

    And i inferred that i think successful black people arent real black people? 

    Lol, dude just stop. 

    By the way, you're assuming i think people that work in the banking industry are succesful? Maybe, maybe not, we may have a different idea of what is successful.

    I am going to walk away now, because these are unproductive, never end, and just spiral for pages with people arguing over nothing and semantics. Thess types of conversations on the internet do not work, and people get way too uptight about trivial shit that doesnt matter. 
    You just spent a paragraph inferring and assuming.  You really have no idea how hypocritical your posts are.  
  • Kat
    Kat Posts: 4,967
    OnWis97 said:
    Kat said:
    I'm wondering today if he has the early stages of Alzheimer's because he kept saying oranges instead of origins, said his father was born in Germany when it was really his grandfather. He seems ill and it's not a joke or right to make fun of him for that. He just needs to leave the White House. I worry about his successor though. I guess there's no need to worry though because kicking and screaming would be the only way the criminal would leave office. I hope this nightmare ends soon.

    I was thinking that.  I also would not be surprised if a stroke happens soon.
    He has Alzheimer's in his family tree so that's a real possibility...and a stroke? We know he eats badly so that's a real possibility too.


    Falling down,...not staying down
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,831
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,884
    my2hands said:
    Oh. My. God.

    You guys will argue and parse what color blue the fucking sky is

    Let me be clear. Black voter turnout dropped because Obama, or a person of color, was not on the ticket. That is the OBVIOUS MAIN DRIVER of that phenomenon. Period. Full stop. The drop in turnout would have happened no matter what two white people would have been on the ticket. 

    And guess what, it doesnt matter what you or i think,  they didnt show up at the polls and it cost dems the election, and that is a fact. 

    Do you guys even know any black people? Lol
    See your last sentence. 
  • benjs
    benjs Toronto, ON Posts: 9,382
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
    Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    I don't see anyone saying that. Just that there were many factors at play...not just Obama black, Hillary terrible.
  • Meltdown99
    Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    Kat said:
    OnWis97 said:
    Kat said:
    I'm wondering today if he has the early stages of Alzheimer's because he kept saying oranges instead of origins, said his father was born in Germany when it was really his grandfather. He seems ill and it's not a joke or right to make fun of him for that. He just needs to leave the White House. I worry about his successor though. I guess there's no need to worry though because kicking and screaming would be the only way the criminal would leave office. I hope this nightmare ends soon.

    I was thinking that.  I also would not be surprised if a stroke happens soon.
    He has Alzheimer's in his family tree so that's a real possibility...and a stroke? We know he eats badly so that's a real possibility too.



    Kat said:
    I'm wondering today if he has the early stages of Alzheimer's because he kept saying oranges instead of origins, said his father was born in Germany when it was really his grandfather. He seems ill and it's not a joke or right to make fun of him for that. He just needs to leave the White House. I worry about his successor though. I guess there's no need to worry though because kicking and screaming would be the only way the criminal would leave office. I hope this nightmare ends soon.

    I have an Aunt and Grandma that both had Alzheimer's, From my experience with them, it is quite possible he is in the early stages of the disease, he also may have dementia setting in...I would say he is suffering from more than senior moments.
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,694

    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    I don't think that. My only issue with the whole debate was what I thought was the original premise: that they were racist for not voting because there wasn't a black candidate to vote for.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,831
    edited April 2019
    benjs said:
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    My fault for overstating it. I realize no one said that exactly.
    But its is the only factor of substantial significance.  Whatever other factors involved were there in 2004 and in 2016. The only difference between those years and 2008/2012 was who was on the ticket.
    The fact that black votes spiked in exactly 2008 and dropped in exactly 2016 can only be explained by 1 thing. 
    It isn't just A factor, it is THE factor. 
    No other reason can explain a spike in exactly 2008 and a drop in 2016, all other factors, however significant or not, have been in play.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,884
    mace1229 said:
    benjs said:
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    My fault for overstating it. I realize no one said that exactly.
    But its is the only factor of substantial significance.  Whatever other factors involved were there in 2004 and in 2016. The only difference between those years and 2008/2012 was who was on the ticket.
    The fact that black votes spiked in exactly 2008 and dropped in exactly 2016 can only be explained by 1 thing. 
    It isn't just A factor, it is THE factor. 
    No other reason can explain a spike in exactly 2008 and a drop in 2016, all other factors, however significant or not, have been in play.
    If your statement were true,  you would not have seen the similar increase election over election in since 1996. In fact,  2016 is an outlier, not a return to normalcy, from its previous trendline.  This is why I don't challenge the data,  but whether the is the only factor.  I agree that your conclusion is likely somewhat true,  but not the only reason.  There needs to be more data points, i.e. elections, before you can say that 16 is a return to the mean rather than an outlier.


  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,369
    edited April 2019
    Fucked up quote feature, see below.
    Post edited by Halifax2TheMax on
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,831
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    benjs said:
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    My fault for overstating it. I realize no one said that exactly.
    But its is the only factor of substantial significance.  Whatever other factors involved were there in 2004 and in 2016. The only difference between those years and 2008/2012 was who was on the ticket.
    The fact that black votes spiked in exactly 2008 and dropped in exactly 2016 can only be explained by 1 thing. 
    It isn't just A factor, it is THE factor. 
    No other reason can explain a spike in exactly 2008 and a drop in 2016, all other factors, however significant or not, have been in play.
    If your statement were true,  you would not have seen the similar increase election over election in since 1996. In fact,  2016 is an outlier, not a return to normalcy, from its previous trendline.  This is why I don't challenge the data,  but whether the is the only factor.  I agree that your conclusion is likely somewhat true,  but not the only reason.  There needs to be more data points, i.e. elections, before you can say that 16 is a return to the mean rather than an outlier.



    My opinion is this is not relevant. Basically was a trend for 2000 and 2004, not really long enough. You are looking at just 2 voting years and trying to establish a trend, but by doing that you are ignoring just as many other data points. 2004 was where it was in 1992. 2016 was exactly where it was in 2004, there is plenty of reason to believe the data in 2000 and 2004 is the norm, not the record number in 2012.
    Also consider that something like 96% of black voters voted for Obama (I'm pretty sure the biggest margin in history) and you still don't think who was on the ticket was THE factor to account for the spike?
  • RoleModelsinBlood31
    RoleModelsinBlood31 Austin TX Posts: 6,242
    So how is everyone’s day going?  I have poison ivy or oak or something all
    over my left arm from trail rides on my onewheel.  It sucks, but I’m dealing with it.  Alright, talk to y’all soon, have a good one.
    I'm like an opening band for your mom.
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,369
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mace1229 said:
    benjs said:
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    My fault for overstating it. I realize no one said that exactly.
    But its is the only factor of substantial significance.  Whatever other factors involved were there in 2004 and in 2016. The only difference between those years and 2008/2012 was who was on the ticket.
    The fact that black votes spiked in exactly 2008 and dropped in exactly 2016 can only be explained by 1 thing. 
    It isn't just A factor, it is THE factor. 
    No other reason can explain a spike in exactly 2008 and a drop in 2016, all other factors, however significant or not, have been in play.
    Two "factors" were in play in 2016 that were not in play in 2008 and 2012, repub governor and residency requirements to obtain ID and vote and putin on the ritz's massive disinformation social media attack. putin split the Bernie Bros from the dems and then whiddled deep inside the dem demographics and split them further, including the black vote (the campaign started in 2013, on social media to gain trust and legitimacy and was weaponized running up to the election in 2016) not jsut in Wisconsin but everywhere. Why would Paul Manafort share polling data with putin on the ritz? And why would a repub governor make it more difficult to prove your residency in order for you to get a state issued photo ID?
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,831
    edited April 2019

    Look back all the way to 1972 and 2000/2004 looks like the normal. Yes, if you only consider 1996 and beyond then 2012 looks like it lines up with the natural trend. But it spikes up and down every few years.  The reality is in 2008 black voters turned out in larger numbers than any race since 1972, maybe even longer, this chart only goes back to 1972. Then suddenly drops off to the levels where the average has been for the last 30 years in 2016. That is too big of a coincidence for me to buy that it was just a trend.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,884
    mace1229 said:

    Look back all the way to 1972 and 2000/2004 looks like the normal. Yes, if you only consider 1996 and beyond then 2012 looks like it lines up with the natural trend. But it spikes up and down every few years.  The reality is in 2008 black voters turned out in larger numbers than any race since 1972, maybe even longer, this chart only goes back to 1972. Then suddenly drops off to the levels where the average has been for the last 30 years in 2016. That is too big of a coincidence for me to buy that it was just a trend.
    This is only 18 to 29 year old people. 
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,840
    benjs said:
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    Ummm you think any other factor mattered more than having a black guy to vote for? Really?
    hippiemom = goodness
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,884
    cincybearcat said:
    benjs said:
    mace1229 said:
    Wait, so people truly believe the big spike in black votes, then the sudden drop off has nothing to do with the fact a black person was on the ticket? It was all just a coincidence? All the voter suppression just disappeared for those 8 years and suddenly came back without any explanation? That is hilarious if anyone believes that.
    mace, not one person has said that. All that a hell of a lot of us are trying to say here is that this is A factor, not THE factor. I'm shocked this is so hard to concede.
    Ummm you think any other factor mattered more than having a black guy to vote for? Really?
    "More" is different than "Only".
  • Vitalogensia
    Vitalogensia Posts: 2,203

    With everything going on in the past few pages, I think this is a good time for everyone to take a step back and ask themselves, “Am I being best?”

    No matter how you feel about the world, or the thoughts and behaviors of others, in the end the only thing you can control is if you be best or not. Even if you are currently being best, you should still strive to be bester than the best you may have been. If the opposite is more accurate for you, please allow me to remind you that it is never too late to be best.

    Don’t just simply be, don't settle to be better: be best!


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