Should white people be able to appropriate black hairstyles (afro, braids, dreadlocks)

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Comments

  • Annafalk
    Annafalk Sweden Posts: 4,004
    Hatred and envying coming from either side, it won't lead to anything positive. They are going after the most open minded people also turning them possibly towards negative thinking they didn't have before.
  • riotgrl
    riotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,895
    I thought this article presented a good counter argument to many of the points made in this thread.  It really boils down to inequality in the power structure.  Until the power structure is more equalized then it will be appropriating another's culture.  No one is saying that people are 'bad' or 'racist' for admiring black culture but when, as a white person, we say that it is silly for someone of color to be upset we perpetuate the system of inequality.  I've followed you guys on these boards for a long time and know that there are a lot of good people who are not racist and would never intend for their cultural admiration to be deemed inappropriate but shouldn't we listen to the voices of people of color in regards to this issue rather than another white person?  Doesn't mean you might not continue to wear the hairstyle but being open to having a dialogue with a person of color about why they might be bothered can only improve race relations.

    https://everydayfeminism.com/2015/07/white-people-black-hairstyles/


    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,975
    Yes
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Meltdown99
    Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    Yes
    Buying crafts made by First Nations people helps support them ... they are not offended by making money and a making living.  You know since the europeans conquerers tried to wipe them out and are still treated poorly, they need to make a living somehow.  So please support First Nations people's crafts...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    Meltdown99 said:
    Buying crafts made by First Nations people helps support them ... they are not offended by making money and a making living.  You know since the europeans conquerers tried to wipe them out and are still treated poorly, they need to make a living somehow.  So please support First Nations people's crafts...
    Sure. I don't think anyone is arguing against buying the work of First Nations artists and artisans and paying a fair price. That's quite a different story than taking cultural elements and adopting them without consideration for their meaning and the larger implications. Even worse is buying rip-off "First Nations" work produced cheaply by non-aboriginal people, like the fake Cowichan sweaters. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Meltdown99
    Meltdown99 None Of Your Business... Posts: 10,739
    Yes
    Yes, if you see a dreamcatcher made in China, then it is a cheap knock-off for sure...


    Give Peas A Chance…
  • riotgrl
    riotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,895
    edited August 2018
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!
    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    riotgrl said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!
    The one thing that unites us in AMT - problems with the quote feature. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,975
    Yes
    oftenreading said:
    riotgrl said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!
    The one thing that unites us in AMT - problems with the quote feature. 
    Very true
    hippiemom = goodness
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,975
    Yes
    oftenreading said:
    riotgrl said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!
    The one thing that unites us in AMT - problems with the quote feature. 


    I mean...very true.

    hippiemom = goodness
  • Go Beavers
    Go Beavers Posts: 9,689
    cincybearcat said:
    oftenreading said:
    riotgrl said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!



  • riotgrl
    riotgrl LOUISVILLE Posts: 1,895
    oftenreading said:
    riotgrl said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!
    The one thing that unites us in AMT - problems with the quote feature. 
    And I just realized that apparently I don't know the difference between their, there, and they're!
    Are we getting something out of this all-encompassing trip?

    Seems my preconceptions are what should have been burned...

    I AM MINE
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,813
    Yes
    riotgrl said:
    oftenreading said:
    riotgrl said:
    cincybearcat said:
    Kinda interesting article....but it seems to say if you are white you cannot wear your hair in cornrows because police kill blacks, companies didn't make products for black for a long time, magazine sell "white beauty", etc.

    While all of that is true, I still don't see how a white person's choice in hairstyle plays into that at all.  It's pointing out all the real reasons the black community is upset and then using them as an excuse to be upset over hair.  That's what it seems like to me.  

    But thank you for posting, was good to read.





    Valid point.  Maybe they feel that cultural appropriation is where they're power lies therefore that is something they can control.  Would be a great conversation to have.

    Sorry I was having problems with quote feature!
    The one thing that unites us in AMT - problems with the quote feature. 
    And I just realized that apparently I don't know the difference between their, there, and they're!
    Just use "thar", it covers all bases.  :lol:
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Thoughts_Arrive
    Thoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    Yes
    Go Beavers said:
    Thoughts_Arrive said:
    I don't know why this has got me so worked up to the point I feel like I am going to have a panic attack and to the point I could not focus in class today.
    One of these girls walked into my class today (and that guy whose head she bit off yesterday). Gosh she looks like she has a chip on her shoulder.
    She kept looking over at me. Must have been my Mitchell & Ness beanie I had on. How dare I appropriate a beanie worn predominantly by African Americans. How racist and hypocritical of me.
    The tutor asked the class if anyone can give an example of cultural globalisation and I answered that people around the world adopt fashions from other cultures hoping it would lead to the dreadlocks debate again but it didn't.

    I don't understand why I as a white guy cannot wear dreadlocks if I have never been racist towards a black person in my life, WTF!
    It's like reverse racism, generalising the racism of a group of white people towards all white people.
    GRRRRR!
    What if I am a big fan of Bob Marley and want to wear dreadlocks in homage to him?


    Who said white guys can’t have dreads? What you’re hearing is people’s reaction to white guys having dreads. If you want us to all get along, then dialogue with a black person about it or read what they have written about it. 
    Did you even read my first post in this thread?

    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • Thoughts_Arrive
    Thoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    Yes
    brianlux said:
    The article linked below makes some sensible points.  This one stood out:

    Historians and anthropologists have found evidence of the 'do in ancient Egypt, Germanic tribes, Vikings, Pacific Islanders, early Christians, the Aborigines and the New Guineans as well as the Somali, the Galla, the Maasai, the Ashanti and the Fulani tribes of Africa.
    As University of Richmond professor Bert Ashe writes in "Twisted: My Dreadlock Chronicles," the better question is, "Who hasn't worn dreadlocks at one time or another?"

    and

    "...My research informed me that Indian monks wore them long before they reached the Western Hemisphere, so I'm not sure anyone has any particular claim."

    So Thoughts, next time someone claims you are culturally appropriating blacks you can honestly say to them, "So I guess you also think I'm culturally appropriating  Indian monks, Egyptians, people of Germanic tribes, Vikings, Pacific Islanders, early Christians, Aborigines and the New Guineans as well as the Somali, the Galla, the Maasai, the Ashanti and the Fulani tribes of Africa?"  That should cool their heels for a while!





    haha thanks but I wasn't involved in the lecture debate. If someone does I will but I don't plan on forming dreadlocks.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • Thoughts_Arrive
    Thoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    Yes
    Go Beavers said:
    Annafalk said:
    Why can't it be seen as a celebration to other cultures ? You celebrate something you like by having things from other cultures. It's a sign of appreciation not something that should be taken negative.
    I would only feel proud other likes it too.
    Because historically white people haven’t celebrated other cultures but instead destroyed them. Look at a lot of white people’s current attitudes toward diversity for present day feelings if you din’t like mucking around in the past. 
    And so the blaming and guilt must carry on to a new generation of white people not remotely responsible for the sins of the past?
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • Thoughts_Arrive
    Thoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    Yes
    We have to do a group assignment in this sociology unit.
    Gosh, I don't know how I'd react if the teacher paired me with her.
    I was so angry yesterday. 
    But I would like to talk to her about it one day.
    I also think she's pretty attractive haha.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,813
    Yes
    Thoughts_Arrive said:
    We have to do a group assignment in this sociology unit.
    Gosh, I don't know how I'd react if the teacher paired me with her.
    I was so angry yesterday. 
    But I would like to talk to her about it one day.
    I also think she's pretty attractive haha.
    Maybe remind her that Jimi quite happy to have his band mates do up their hair like this:


    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Thoughts_Arrive
    Thoughts_Arrive Melbourne, Australia Posts: 15,165
    Yes
    Haha will do
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • unsung
    unsung I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
    Yes
    Thoughts_Arrive said:
    Go Beavers said:
    Annafalk said:
    Why can't it be seen as a celebration to other cultures ? You celebrate something you like by having things from other cultures. It's a sign of appreciation not something that should be taken negative.
    I would only feel proud other likes it too.
    Because historically white people haven’t celebrated other cultures but instead destroyed them. Look at a lot of white people’s current attitudes toward diversity for present day feelings if you din’t like mucking around in the past. 
    And so the blaming and guilt must carry on to a new generation of white people not remotely responsible for the sins of the past?
    Yes, otherwise you are a racist.  If you defend yourself you are a racist.  If you don’t want to be minimized you are a white supremacist.  Is that how it goes halifax?

    *Those rules apply only if you are white.  Black/brown/purple/yellow pride all good.  White is bad*

    If you made something of yourself it isn’t because of sacrifice and hard work, it is because of privilege.  Same rule applies as above.

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