No more war, no more hate.

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  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 10,024
    edited April 2018
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    Then we have that Psychopath Truman dropping two Atomic Bombs on Japan Murdering Thousands of innocent people... As with the title of Thread...if we can just elect Good Hearted people so we can have no more war then that would be great...
    I know many will disagree, but those bombs saved both American and Japanese lives.
    Japan was such a weird culture who worship their emperor as a god, and they were not only prepared to die, but was a very high honor to do so. This is a culture that would rather die than surrender. Just look at the thousands of Okinawan civilians, women and children, that chose suicide over American defeat. They were actually training even children to fight to the death in preparation for an invasion. Countless more would have been killed with an invasion. 
    Did you interview every Japanese Person did you?...so the answer is lets just Murder as many innocent people as we can?...seriously that has the hall marks of Psychopathy...
    Do I need to interview every single Japanese person to understand their history and culture? It is very well documented that they were training children, 5 and 6 year olds even, to fight off American soldiers. It is well documented they encouraged suicide in the face of defeat. It is very well documented they viewed their emperor as a god, and was a honor to die for him. As a result this was a nation that would have fought until no one was left to fight back, they would not accept surrender except in the face of something like a nuclear bomb.
    I never said murder as many innocent people as we can. I just said more would have died if we didn't drop the bombs. There is a lot of evidence to back that statement up.
    My point is no one should of been murdered...the fact is those Atomic Bombs murdered innocent people...
    SO how would you end the war then? Just ask nicely for Japan to surrender? 
    It was going to end either with an invasion that killed millions, or a bomb that killed 200,000 

    So by what you just said you justify killing 200,000 innocent people???

    Well if my choices are to let millions die during the combat, or end the war quickly and only kill 200,00, I'd chose the bomb.
    You'd rather let millions die istead? And for what then? 

    Do you relise what you are saying?...200,000 innocent people being murdered...

    Yes, and that is less than 10 million people, including millions of innocent women and children dying in combat. 
    As already mentioned, they were training small children to fight. Millions would have died. I am convinced this was the only way to end that war with the least amount of violence, as horrible as it was.
    You still didn't answer my question, how would you prefer to end that war?

    I don't believe in War...so your question is irrelevant to me...

    You don't have to believe in war, but our enemies did.
    SO your solution would be to let Japan invade and rule us and do nothing then?

    I don't believe in War...

    Also I'm talking about the murdering of Thousands of innocent People...what are you talking about?

    We were attacked by Japan that started a war (well, got us into an existing war).
    You refuse to answer the question how would you bring WWII to an end with fewer casualties. The reality is dropping the bomb was the least deadly method, on both sides, to end the war.
    If you're answer is to just claim you don't believe in war at all, then does that mean you would chose to not defend this country in an attack from Japan?
    If we did not end the war Japan would be an entirely different country today, and the attack on Pearl Harbor probably would not have been the only attack we suffered if we chose to not respond. I don't see how anyone can say they don't believe in way when countries get attacked. You don't believe in a nation protecting itself from invasion of more violent people?
    You've criticized dropping the bomb but have not provided a single comment on what should have been done instead, other than "I don't believe in war" as if somehow not believe in it will prevent it.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • i_lov_it
    i_lov_it Perth, Western Australia Posts: 4,007
    edited April 2018
    mcgruff10 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    Then we have that Psychopath Truman dropping two Atomic Bombs on Japan Murdering Thousands of innocent people... As with the title of Thread...if we can just elect Good Hearted people so we can have no more war then that would be great...
    I know many will disagree, but those bombs saved both American and Japanese lives.
    Japan was such a weird culture who worship their emperor as a god, and they were not only prepared to die, but was a very high honor to do so. This is a culture that would rather die than surrender. Just look at the thousands of Okinawan civilians, women and children, that chose suicide over American defeat. They were actually training even children to fight to the death in preparation for an invasion. Countless more would have been killed with an invasion. 
    Did you interview every Japanese Person did you?...so the answer is lets just Murder as many innocent people as we can?...seriously that has the hall marks of Psychopathy...
    Do I need to interview every single Japanese person to understand their history and culture? It is very well documented that they were training children, 5 and 6 year olds even, to fight off American soldiers. It is well documented they encouraged suicide in the face of defeat. It is very well documented they viewed their emperor as a god, and was a honor to die for him. As a result this was a nation that would have fought until no one was left to fight back, they would not accept surrender except in the face of something like a nuclear bomb.
    I never said murder as many innocent people as we can. I just said more would have died if we didn't drop the bombs. There is a lot of evidence to back that statement up.
    My point is no one should of been murdered...the fact is those Atomic Bombs murdered innocent people...
    SO how would you end the war then? Just ask nicely for Japan to surrender? 
    It was going to end either with an invasion that killed millions, or a bomb that killed 200,000 

    So by what you just said you justify killing 200,000 innocent people???

    Well if my choices are to let millions die during the combat, or end the war quickly and only kill 200,00, I'd chose the bomb.
    You'd rather let millions die istead? And for what then? 

    Do you relise what you are saying?...200,000 innocent people being murdered...

    Yes, and that is less than 10 million people, including millions of innocent women and children dying in combat. 
    As already mentioned, they were training small children to fight. Millions would have died. I am convinced this was the only way to end that war with the least amount of violence, as horrible as it was.
    You still didn't answer my question, how would you prefer to end that war?

    I don't believe in War...so your question is irrelevant to me...

    lso it's ok to rip the united states for dropping an atomic bomb but to not have any other solution?  wars happen bud, it's a fact of life.  

    Of course Wars happen...but do we as the general population have a decision in that?

    Post edited by i_lov_it on
  • i_lov_it
    i_lov_it Perth, Western Australia Posts: 4,007
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    Then we have that Psychopath Truman dropping two Atomic Bombs on Japan Murdering Thousands of innocent people... As with the title of Thread...if we can just elect Good Hearted people so we can have no more war then that would be great...
    I know many will disagree, but those bombs saved both American and Japanese lives.
    Japan was such a weird culture who worship their emperor as a god, and they were not only prepared to die, but was a very high honor to do so. This is a culture that would rather die than surrender. Just look at the thousands of Okinawan civilians, women and children, that chose suicide over American defeat. They were actually training even children to fight to the death in preparation for an invasion. Countless more would have been killed with an invasion. 
    Did you interview every Japanese Person did you?...so the answer is lets just Murder as many innocent people as we can?...seriously that has the hall marks of Psychopathy...
    Do I need to interview every single Japanese person to understand their history and culture? It is very well documented that they were training children, 5 and 6 year olds even, to fight off American soldiers. It is well documented they encouraged suicide in the face of defeat. It is very well documented they viewed their emperor as a god, and was a honor to die for him. As a result this was a nation that would have fought until no one was left to fight back, they would not accept surrender except in the face of something like a nuclear bomb.
    I never said murder as many innocent people as we can. I just said more would have died if we didn't drop the bombs. There is a lot of evidence to back that statement up.
    My point is no one should of been murdered...the fact is those Atomic Bombs murdered innocent people...
    SO how would you end the war then? Just ask nicely for Japan to surrender? 
    It was going to end either with an invasion that killed millions, or a bomb that killed 200,000 

    So by what you just said you justify killing 200,000 innocent people???

    Well if my choices are to let millions die during the combat, or end the war quickly and only kill 200,00, I'd chose the bomb.
    You'd rather let millions die istead? And for what then? 

    Do you relise what you are saying?...200,000 innocent people being murdered...

    Yes, and that is less than 10 million people, including millions of innocent women and children dying in combat. 
    As already mentioned, they were training small children to fight. Millions would have died. I am convinced this was the only way to end that war with the least amount of violence, as horrible as it was.
    You still didn't answer my question, how would you prefer to end that war?

    I don't believe in War...so your question is irrelevant to me...

    You don't have to believe in war, but our enemies did.
    SO your solution would be to let Japan invade and rule us and do nothing then?

    I don't believe in War...

    Also I'm talking about the murdering of Thousands of innocent People...what are you talking about?

    We were attacked by Japan that started a war (well, got us into an existing war).
    You refuse to answer the question how would you bring WWII to an end with fewer casualties. The reality is dropping the bomb was the least deadly method, on both sides, to end the war.
    If you're answer is to just claim you don't believe in war at all, then does that mean you would chose to not defend this country in an attack from Japan?
    If we did not end the war Japan would be an entirely different country today, and the attack on Pearl Harbor probably would not have been the only attack we suffered if we chose to not respond. I don't see how anyone can say they don't believe in way when countries get attacked. You don't believe in a nation protecting itself from invasion of more violent people?
    You've criticized dropping the bomb but have not provided a single comment on what should have been done instead, other than "I don't believe in war" as if somehow not believe in it will prevent it.

    I just don't believe in War and killing other Human Beings...just remember why are these People killing other People from the other side of the World?...think about it...you've never met them...you don't know them...they've never done wrong by you...but yet because of a few Psychopathic 'leaders' say so you go kill them...

    Of course I've criticised the US for dropping Bombs on Japan because you are murdering thousands of innocent people...what's not to criticise?

  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    edited April 2018
    I dont support the use of atomic weapons on japan...  I dont believe they were neccessary to end the war...not a fan of nuking cities full of innocent civilians... but im.not here to debate that...

    With that being said... I think its interesting everybody always focuses on the "evil war mongering" America... but never want to talk about Japan attacking the US by surprise for NO REASON like a bunch of fucking cowards... in these conversations about how evil America is it's interesting things like that never come up... Hiroshima and Nagasaki were totally fucked up... but so was Pearl Harbor... which ultimately lead to those atomic weapons being used

    Also,  I love how people who live in other "western" countries pass judgement on America and Americans for these actions... while your governments, militaries, and tax dollars are right there beside use every single time... finger pointing hypocrites
    Post edited by my2hands on
  • mcgruff10
    mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,179
    i_lov_it said:
    mcgruff10 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    mace1229 said:
    i_lov_it said:
    Then we have that Psychopath Truman dropping two Atomic Bombs on Japan Murdering Thousands of innocent people... As with the title of Thread...if we can just elect Good Hearted people so we can have no more war then that would be great...
    I know many will disagree, but those bombs saved both American and Japanese lives.
    Japan was such a weird culture who worship their emperor as a god, and they were not only prepared to die, but was a very high honor to do so. This is a culture that would rather die than surrender. Just look at the thousands of Okinawan civilians, women and children, that chose suicide over American defeat. They were actually training even children to fight to the death in preparation for an invasion. Countless more would have been killed with an invasion. 
    Did you interview every Japanese Person did you?...so the answer is lets just Murder as many innocent people as we can?...seriously that has the hall marks of Psychopathy...
    Do I need to interview every single Japanese person to understand their history and culture? It is very well documented that they were training children, 5 and 6 year olds even, to fight off American soldiers. It is well documented they encouraged suicide in the face of defeat. It is very well documented they viewed their emperor as a god, and was a honor to die for him. As a result this was a nation that would have fought until no one was left to fight back, they would not accept surrender except in the face of something like a nuclear bomb.
    I never said murder as many innocent people as we can. I just said more would have died if we didn't drop the bombs. There is a lot of evidence to back that statement up.
    My point is no one should of been murdered...the fact is those Atomic Bombs murdered innocent people...
    SO how would you end the war then? Just ask nicely for Japan to surrender? 
    It was going to end either with an invasion that killed millions, or a bomb that killed 200,000 

    So by what you just said you justify killing 200,000 innocent people???

    Well if my choices are to let millions die during the combat, or end the war quickly and only kill 200,00, I'd chose the bomb.
    You'd rather let millions die istead? And for what then? 

    Do you relise what you are saying?...200,000 innocent people being murdered...

    Yes, and that is less than 10 million people, including millions of innocent women and children dying in combat. 
    As already mentioned, they were training small children to fight. Millions would have died. I am convinced this was the only way to end that war with the least amount of violence, as horrible as it was.
    You still didn't answer my question, how would you prefer to end that war?

    I don't believe in War...so your question is irrelevant to me...

    lso it's ok to rip the united states for dropping an atomic bomb but to not have any other solution?  wars happen bud, it's a fact of life.  

    Of course Wars happen...but do we as the general population have a decision in that?

    I don't think the people of Poland and China had a choice in that decision during the 1930's.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • i_lov_it
    i_lov_it Perth, Western Australia Posts: 4,007
    my2hands said:
    I dont support the use of atomic weapons on japan...  I dont believe they were neccessary to end the war...not a fan of nuking cities full of innocent civilians... but im.not here to debate that...

    With that being said... I think its interesting everybody always focuses on the "evil war mongering" America... but never want to talk about Japan attacking the US by surprise for NO REASON like a bunch of fucking cowards... in these conversations about how evil America is it's interesting things like that never come up... Hiroshima and Nagasaki were totally fucked up... but so was Pearl Harbor... which ultimately lead to those atomic weapons being used

    Also,  I love how people who live in other "western" countries pass judgement on America and Americans for these actions... while your governments, militaries, and tax dollars are right there beside use every single time... finger pointing hypocrites
    In summary...War is Fucked up...
  • mcgruff10
    mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,179
    my2hands said:
    I dont support the use of atomic weapons on japan...  I dont believe they were neccessary to end the war...not a fan of nuking cities full of innocent civilians... but im.not here to debate that...

    With that being said... I think its interesting everybody always focuses on the "evil war mongering" America... but never want to talk about Japan attacking the US by surprise for NO REASON like a bunch of fucking cowards... in these conversations about how evil America is it's interesting things like that never come up... Hiroshima and Nagasaki were totally fucked up... but so was Pearl Harbor... which ultimately lead to those atomic weapons being used

    Also,  I love how people who live in other "western" countries pass judgement on America and Americans for these actions... while your governments, militaries, and tax dollars are right there beside use every single time... finger pointing hypocrites
    Haven't you realized by now that it is a common theme on these threads to bash everything american?

    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 10,024
    my2hands said:
    I dont support the use of atomic weapons on japan...  I dont believe they were neccessary to end the war...not a fan of nuking cities full of innocent civilians... but im.not here to debate that...

    With that being said... I think its interesting everybody always focuses on the "evil war mongering" America... but never want to talk about Japan attacking the US by surprise for NO REASON like a bunch of fucking cowards... in these conversations about how evil America is it's interesting things like that never come up... Hiroshima and Nagasaki were totally fucked up... but so was Pearl Harbor... which ultimately lead to those atomic weapons being used

    Also,  I love how people who live in other "western" countries pass judgement on America and Americans for these actions... while your governments, militaries, and tax dollars are right there beside use every single time... finger pointing hypocrites
    I agree with your middle part. It rarely is talked about. Japan was a violent country during WWII, and likely would be very different from today if that war had a different outcome. As part of the unconditional surrender they had to dissolve their military. They worshiped their emperor and had they won the war on the Pacific I have little doubt that they would have been on a war-hungry power trip that would have drastically changed history far more than any actions the US have made since that time.

    I've already mentioned my views on the bombs, but I have wondered why those 2 cities? Could the same statement have been made on military zones or less populated areas? I'm sure a tremendous amount of thought and consideration went into ot, I would just like to know what it was. Its's not like today, it took days or weeks to deliver the bomb, and it was a dangerous job just doing that. The ship that delivered the bomb was sunk on the trip back, one of the worst naval disasters of that war. If a different target was chosen that didn't have the same impact and they still refused to surrender, how long would it take to assemble and deliver another bomb? 
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,760
    i_lov_it said:
    There should be no War...as with the OP...No More War...
    :plus_one:
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,760
    What I don't understand about arguing for why war is Ok is this, Wouldn't it make more sense to take that energy and time and apply it to finding a means for peace? 
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • mcgruff10
    mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,179
    edited April 2018
    mace1229 said:
    my2hands said:
    I dont support the use of atomic weapons on japan...  I dont believe they were neccessary to end the war...not a fan of nuking cities full of innocent civilians... but im.not here to debate that...

    With that being said... I think its interesting everybody always focuses on the "evil war mongering" America... but never want to talk about Japan attacking the US by surprise for NO REASON like a bunch of fucking cowards... in these conversations about how evil America is it's interesting things like that never come up... Hiroshima and Nagasaki were totally fucked up... but so was Pearl Harbor... which ultimately lead to those atomic weapons being used

    Also,  I love how people who live in other "western" countries pass judgement on America and Americans for these actions... while your governments, militaries, and tax dollars are right there beside use every single time... finger pointing hypocrites
    I agree with your middle part. It rarely is talked about. Japan was a violent country during WWII, and likely would be very different from today if that war had a different outcome. As part of the unconditional surrender they had to dissolve their military. They worshiped their emperor and had they won the war on the Pacific I have little doubt that they would have been on a war-hungry power trip that would have drastically changed history far more than any actions the US have made since that time.

    I've already mentioned my views on the bombs, but I have wondered why those 2 cities? Could the same statement have been made on military zones or less populated areas? I'm sure a tremendous amount of thought and consideration went into ot, I would just like to know what it was. Its's not like today, it took days or weeks to deliver the bomb, and it was a dangerous job just doing that. The ship that delivered the bomb was sunk on the trip back, one of the worst naval disasters of that war. If a different target was chosen that didn't have the same impact and they still refused to surrender, how long would it take to assemble and deliver another bomb? 
    From What I have read the next bomb would have been delivered around august 19th. So ten days after Nagasaki. 
    Post edited by mcgruff10 on
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 10,024
    edited April 2018
    brianlux said:
    What I don't understand about arguing for why war is Ok is this, Wouldn't it make more sense to take that energy and time and apply it to finding a means for peace? 
    How do you find peace when your country is being invaded and your people killed? 
    Should the countries Hitler invaded just asked for peace while their people were being sent to death camps? Japan murdered millions of Chinese at the same time, should China just ask for peace?
    Sometimes all the energy and resources in the world won't be enough for peace.
    I just think not believing in war is like telling your kid to never stuck up for himself or join a fight.
    When my kid is a few years older I want him to know to never seek out a fight, but 100% I will support him if a fight results in him defending himself. Sometimes you have no choice but to join a fight when you;re not the one who starts it. Running away is not always an option.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • i_lov_it
    i_lov_it Perth, Western Australia Posts: 4,007
    mace1229 said:
    brianlux said:
    What I don't understand about arguing for why war is Ok is this, Wouldn't it make more sense to take that energy and time and apply it to finding a means for peace? 
    How do you find peace when your country is being invaded and your people killed? 
    Should the countries Hitler invaded just asked for peace while their people were being sent to death camps? Japan murdered millions of Chinese at the same time, should China just ask for peace?
    Sometimes all the energy and resources in the world won't be enough for peace.
    I just think not believing in war is like telling your kid to never stuck up for himself or join a fight.
    When my kid is a few years older I want him to know to never seek out a fight, but 100% I will support him if a fight results in him defending himself. Sometimes you have no choice but to join a fight when you;re not the one who starts it. Running away is not always an option.
    What fight???...that some Psychopath has decided for you?

  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    edited April 2018
    Nice little article about some Australian war crimes...

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/11/the-fog-of-war-and-the-modern-soldier-violent-elitism-and-a-culture-of-secrecy
    Post edited by my2hands on
  • i_lov_it
    i_lov_it Perth, Western Australia Posts: 4,007
    my2hands said:
    Nice little article about some Australian war crimes...

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/11/the-fog-of-war-and-the-modern-soldier-violent-elitism-and-a-culture-of-secrecy

    Absolutely disgusting...
  • mcgruff10
    mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,179
    my2hands said:
    Nice little article about some Australian war crimes...

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/11/the-fog-of-war-and-the-modern-soldier-violent-elitism-and-a-culture-of-secrecy
    No way! I thought American troops were the only soldiers who committed atrocities?
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • i_lov_it
    i_lov_it Perth, Western Australia Posts: 4,007
    edited April 2018
    I wonder how these Wars would of turned out if the People in Power who created them were the only ones fighting them?
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    How bout some good old fashioned war crimes committed by my friendly Canadian neighbors to the north?

    https://thediplomat.com/2014/11/speaking-truth-to-power-canadian-war-crimes-in-korea/
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    edited April 2018
    mcgruff10 said:
    my2hands said:
    I dont support the use of atomic weapons on japan...  I dont believe they were neccessary to end the war...not a fan of nuking cities full of innocent civilians... but im.not here to debate that...

    With that being said... I think its interesting everybody always focuses on the "evil war mongering" America... but never want to talk about Japan attacking the US by surprise for NO REASON like a bunch of fucking cowards... in these conversations about how evil America is it's interesting things like that never come up... Hiroshima and Nagasaki were totally fucked up... but so was Pearl Harbor... which ultimately lead to those atomic weapons being used

    Also,  I love how people who live in other "western" countries pass judgement on America and Americans for these actions... while your governments, militaries, and tax dollars are right there beside use every single time... finger pointing hypocrites
    Haven't you realized by now that it is a common theme on these threads to bash everything american?

    I accept the faults of my country... lord knows there are plenty... but it's time to put a mirror in front of our other western friends on the moving train, because their shit stinks too
    Post edited by my2hands on
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    Do I even need to post the amazing track record of Europe the last 100 years? And America gets looked down on? Give me a fucking break

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