Our changing planet: What will we do?

24

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  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,759
    edited September 2017
    China also just built the biggest solar power farm on the face of the planet and is building solar power faster than any other nation by far. They increased their solar power infrastructure by 25% this year alone.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    And batteries



  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    Wind farms also have their problems, with impacts on birds. Maybe there are other impacts that I'm not aware of, also. Like I said, nothing comes for free, though some modalities have fewer costs than others. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    oftenreading said:
    Wind farms also have their problems, with impacts on birds. Maybe there are other impacts that I'm not aware of, also. Like I said, nothing comes for free, though some modalities have fewer costs than others. 
    Wind farms and nuclear power stations are responsible each for between 0.3 and 0.4 fatalities per gigawatt-hour (GWh) of electricity while fossil-fuelled power stations are responsible for about 5.2 fatalities per GWh

  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,759
    edited September 2017
    oftenreading said:
    Wind farms also have their problems, with impacts on birds. Maybe there are other impacts that I'm not aware of, also. Like I said, nothing comes for free, though some modalities have fewer costs than others. 
    The biggest impact of wind farms that I've heard of related to humans (sure they can kill birds and bats, but I doubt nearly as many as pollution does!). Those who live near them have complained about what's been dubbed "wind turbine syndrome". Some are skeptical about this, but.... Anyway, the solution to this is to not build wind farms next to homes. As for the aesthetics of the turbines... I actually think wind farms are cool looking. Obviously other disagree with me. And yeah, an unblemished vista is nicer, but hell, I'll take a wind farm on the horizon over a coal power plant or the complete death of our planet any day, right? http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-science/wind-turbines-health.htm

    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    oftenreading said:
    Nothing comes for free. All power generation comes with an environmental cost. Some more than others, of course; sometimes far more. But hydroelectric power generation ends up with disruptions to the river ecosystems. No free rides here. 
    True!
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    oftenreading said:
    * Unless you ride your bike :) 
    True again,  although technically not even bicycles are free from some environmental impact- mining, production energy, etc.
    but still next to walking, lowest on the energy consumption for travel.
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    PJ_Soul said:
    China also just built the biggest solar power farm on the face of the planet and is building solar power faster than any other nation by far. They increased their solar power infrastructure by 25% this year alone.
    Even this comes with a price.  Giant solar panel fields alter the environment over which they are installed causing much imbalance to that  ecosystem.

    I think the best solution is to use less energy, consume less, and for humans to reproduce in fewer numbers.

    This post has been brought to you by the words "less" and "fewer".  :smile:
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    I'll take a few birds smacking into a turbine over blowing the tops off of mountains
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    my2hands said:
    I'll take a few birds smacking into a turbine over blowing the tops off of mountains
    I would agree if the number of birds lost was small but the Audubon Society (  http://www.audubon.org/news/will-wind-turbines-ever-be-safe-birds , among other sources) say that as many as 328,000 birds are killed each year in North America by wind turbines.  There are some efforts to reduce those numbers but that really is a lot. 

    Removing mountain tops is certainly a big problem too.  Here's an excellent book on that subject:





    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • PJfanwillneverleave1
    PJfanwillneverleave1 Posts: 12,885
    brianlux said:
    Houston.
    Irma, Jose, Katia and more like them to follow.
    Fires raging across the western U.S.
    Second hottest year on record.
    Global temperatures on the rise.

    Obviously all this is telling us something, but what they're telling us is nothing new.  Scientists have seen this coming for decades.  What have the largest, most wealthy countries done about it?  Not much.

    So what do we do now?  Throw up our hands, gnash our teeth, jump off a cliff?  Or be sensible and start acting?

    What will we do now?
    I think neither of those options will do anything.  Life is too short at a certain age to worry about what the planet is doing.
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    my2hands said:
    I'll take a few birds smacking into a turbine over blowing the tops off of mountains

    Hundreds of thousands of birds, and it's another ecosystem issue. What is the impact of a marked reduction in a variety of bird species, including impacts on their prey species (mostly insects) and species that prey upon them? I'm not going to pretend I know, but there will be one. Now, maybe it's a better impact than mining and burning coal, but that doesn't mean it's insignificant.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    brianlux said:
    my2hands said:
    I'll take a few birds smacking into a turbine over blowing the tops off of mountains
    I would agree if the number of birds lost was small but the Audubon Society (  http://www.audubon.org/news/will-wind-turbines-ever-be-safe-birds , among other sources) say that as many as 328,000 birds are killed each year in North America by wind turbines.  There are some efforts to reduce those numbers but that really is a lot. 

    Removing mountain tops is certainly a big problem too.  Here's an excellent book on that subject:






    counterpoint: Cats kill up to 3.7B birds annually

    wind turbines kill 0.0088% the number of birds that cats do
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:
    brianlux said:
    Houston.
    Irma, Jose, Katia and more like them to follow.
    Fires raging across the western U.S.
    Second hottest year on record.
    Global temperatures on the rise.

    Obviously all this is telling us something, but what they're telling us is nothing new.  Scientists have seen this coming for decades.  What have the largest, most wealthy countries done about it?  Not much.

    So what do we do now?  Throw up our hands, gnash our teeth, jump off a cliff?  Or be sensible and start acting?

    What will we do now?
    I think neither of those options will do anything.  Life is too short at a certain age to worry about what the planet is doing.
    Jesus, Joseph and Mary, how old do I have to be for that to happen?  :lol:
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    CM189191 said:
    brianlux said:
    my2hands said:
    I'll take a few birds smacking into a turbine over blowing the tops off of mountains
    I would agree if the number of birds lost was small but the Audubon Society (  http://www.audubon.org/news/will-wind-turbines-ever-be-safe-birds , among other sources) say that as many as 328,000 birds are killed each year in North America by wind turbines.  There are some efforts to reduce those numbers but that really is a lot. 

    Removing mountain tops is certainly a big problem too.  Here's an excellent book on that subject:






    counterpoint: Cats kill up to 3.7B birds annually

    wind turbines kill 0.0088% the number of birds that cats do




    I have read various statistics along those lines.  But there are ways of reducing the number of birds that cats kill including having indoor cats or putting a bell on the collars of outdoor cats. 
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:
    brianlux said:
    Houston.
    Irma, Jose, Katia and more like them to follow.
    Fires raging across the western U.S.
    Second hottest year on record.
    Global temperatures on the rise.

    Obviously all this is telling us something, but what they're telling us is nothing new.  Scientists have seen this coming for decades.  What have the largest, most wealthy countries done about it?  Not much.

    So what do we do now?  Throw up our hands, gnash our teeth, jump off a cliff?  Or be sensible and start acting?

    What will we do now?
    I think neither of those options will do anything.  Life is too short at a certain age to worry about what the planet is doing.
    Fun fact: Baffin Island, Canada is home to Mount Thor, the world's tallest vertical cliff. In fact, it's steeper than vertical, with a 105-degree overhang.

    That close to you by any chance?  
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    CM189191 said:
    PJfanwillneverleave1 said:
    brianlux said:
    Houston.
    Irma, Jose, Katia and more like them to follow.
    Fires raging across the western U.S.
    Second hottest year on record.
    Global temperatures on the rise.

    Obviously all this is telling us something, but what they're telling us is nothing new.  Scientists have seen this coming for decades.  What have the largest, most wealthy countries done about it?  Not much.

    So what do we do now?  Throw up our hands, gnash our teeth, jump off a cliff?  Or be sensible and start acting?

    What will we do now?
    I think neither of those options will do anything.  Life is too short at a certain age to worry about what the planet is doing.
    Fun fact: Baffin Island, Canada is home to Mount Thor, the world's tallest vertical cliff. In fact, it's steeper than vertical, with a 105-degree overhang.

    That close to you by any chance?  

    Baffin Island isn't close to anyone.

    But good thought :smiley:
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    This is how much Mt. Thor  isn't close to anyone:

    To say that Auyuittuq is off the beaten path is more than a small understatement. It is incredibly remote. From Pangnirtung one must take a 30km boat ride (or if the fjord is frozen one must use a snowmobile) to the park entrance at the head of the Akshayuk Pass (which was once known as the Pangnirtung Pass). The route cuts across the Cumberland Peninsula and is the main travel route year round, though most especially in winter.

    The park entrance is located here at the head of the valley and here is located the one and only Ranger Station in the entire park. The Weasel And Owl rivers flow through the valley, and one has to ford the river as well as several runoff streams as you make your way along the valley floor.

    The trail is marked by ‘Inukshuks’ which are man shaped cairns that are placed at distant but regular intervals so one doesn’t lose their way… though that is kind of hard to do. As the route only follows the valley to its terminus.

    Thor is located about 20km from the park entrance and is a 4 hour hike past Windy Lake. Its closest neighbour is Mt. Breidablik which lies just to the south. There is a hut located near the base of the peak on the valley floor which can sleep 2-4 people.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,669
    Speaking of not close to anything, in his marvelous book, Hunting the Hunters; At War With the Whalers, which tells of a few Sea Shepherd campaigns he was on that set out to stop illegal Japanese whaling, Laurens de Groot says:

    "Pedro, quartermaster on the bridge, quotes an explorer whose name has slipped his mind. It captures our situation in a nutshell: 'Below 50 degrees south, there is no law.  Below 60 degrees south, there is no hope.  Below 70 degrees south, there is no God."

    Later on in the book, de Groot reports, "Our position is 77° 53' S and 178°  03' W.  I'm unlikely to ever make it further south in my lifetime."

    de Groot and company sailed to a Godless, remote part of the world to do amazing work toward reducing to the needless and illegal slaughter of these intelligent, incredible creatures.  Their efforts saved several hundred whales.  Pretty awesome! 



    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,599
    I'm really curious as to why we haven't harvested the oceans power yet?  I have seen the tidal turbines that sit on top of the water but nothing about under water?

    There is a constant ocean current that we could put to good use to push turbines.  

    This has always baffled me.

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