The Concept of God

RYME said:

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brianlux said:

If you're like those of us who see religion and God as a form of mythology (which is not a bad thing), but wonder what lies beyond life and worry about not seeing loved ones after death, this is my way of looking at it:  First, times spent with loved ones remain as memories.  Memories are thoughts and thoughts emanate out from our brains as low frequency waves similar to radio waves.  Those waves do not die.   That is science.  This I cannot prove, but I wonder, when thinking about loved ones, if our thoughts about them emanating out into the universe, eventually to mingle with the thoughts of our loved ones?  I think very possible so.  And if the loved one you miss is a parent (as I miss my mother) it's their DNA that made you what you are and in that way they live in you. 

Another thing that is true in terms of science is that the atoms and molecules that make up the body also do not die.  All the water, air, carbon and minerals of every one who has lived  still exists and many of those atoms exist in our own bodies- including those of the saints and those of the most evil.  That's a weird thought but not so unsettling if you consider that our minds and bodies have the power to use those atoms and molecules for whatever purpose we choose, be it good or bad.  We can utilize Hitler's atoms and molecules toward altruistic purposes or incorporate Jack the Ripper's into working to cure a disease.

Or you can read Ecclesiastes chapter 12 and feel much better about your lost loved ones.  The first 5 verses pertain to the aging process getting old.  Verses 6 and 7 have to do with your soul (silver cord)(when these clay pots break) returning to God who gave it.
When a person dies the flesh body goes back to the dirt or clay whatever you want to say it's made out of back to the Earth. Flesh bodies are temporary. But your spirit body returns to the Father that gave it.  And a much nicer place.  So your loved ones who have died/passed on, are not out here in a hole in the cold ground.
They are with the Father in another dimension  that we cannot see at this time. So when you when you die or kick the bucket, pass on you will be there too with the Lord and all the people who you've lost over the years will be there too &; happy to greet you.
God has an overall plan that he is ultimately in control of but individuals on an individual basis have free will that's correct. For instance he does not like it when one takes their own life, but if you choose to end your life somehow He's  not going to stop you if you choose to jump off a building you're going to go splat.  I've already discussed what He says we are supposed to do with murderors and rapists.  
He Himself isn't going to float down her on a magic carpet every time someone is about to commit a terrible act and hit them in the face with a big stick.  That's what we are supposed to have laws and law enforcement for.
And as we know accidents happen tree branch can fall on you from the tree on your head and down you go. I totally agree that it's a kind of a sad and wrong answer when people say it was God's plan that somebody died tragically.
Flesh bodies are pretty fragile that's why we have to take care of them.
Ecclesiastes as a great book in the Bible.
Ecclesiastes is basically God's instructions on how to be happy in the flesh.
Prayer is a very humbling thing. You have to be patient when asking for things and give things time.  It's also wize is too thank Him for whatever blessings you have, before you go asking for things.  He does indeed answer prayers.  Sometimes not right away.  Sometimes a decade will go by before you realize that He did in fact answer your prayer it just took time for you to see it..  
Sometimes he won't give you something that you want because He knows that in the long run it would be bad for you.
If my kid begs me for a rattlesnake, I'm not going to get it for him, because if you mess with a rattlesnake long enough it will bite you.
But if you ask Him to lead guide direct and touch you, He will.

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Another concept I cant grasp is baptism.  I used to be a little uncomfortable during the awkward silence when someone asked me (especially some family) if I was going to  or why didn't I get my kids baptized. Now not so much.
 You could only imagine the answer I gave.
So again, to the believers of god why must we baptize? Live and let live.

oftenreading said:

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brianlux said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Another concept I cant grasp is baptism.  I used to be a little uncomfortable during the awkward silence when someone asked me (especially some family) if I was going to  or why didn't I get my kids baptized. Now not so much.
 You could only imagine the answer I gave.
So again, to the believers of god why must we baptize? Live and let live.

It's a concept I never fully understood.  I know it's supposed to symbolize purification or initiation into the church.  And it's generally done two ways:

Sprinkling water on a babies head.  Are babies impure?  I don't think so.  Certainly they're not making a decision to join the church.

Or:

Immersion in water.  That's just kind of scary to me.  Have someone hold my nose and dunk me backwards and face up under water.  Sounds a bit too much like... no, I won't even say it.  A very strange custom.  No thanks. (Been there, done that, never again.)

  Hmmmmmmm.  Mine was pretty stinky at times. Could have used more than a sprinkling of water.

HughFreakingDillon said:

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Attaway77 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

". this is an honest question: how can he have a plan if he has no control over the situation?

That's a great question and I don't know, none of us ever will till we meet our own death. If God/Jesus is there to greet us or we simply fall asleep and call it done with nothing there, we will never know till our time comes. I believe in it and when my life ends, if I'm wrong will it even matter? But what if it will? It's been great being part of this discussion with you all, it really has. I love it when humans can interact questioning everything in a somewhat civilized conversation "that's becoming rare these days like an old neighborhood being torn down for the next to come around". This is just something none of us will ever know the answer to. I officially bow out, time to get back to living while I still have the chance..... This has been good......

I know none of us know, but I'm asking the opinion of a believer. Do you think god can have both control and give us free will? Do you think god has a plan, or just "god created everything, he lets everything do as it will, and he controls heaven" type of thing?

that is one thing that needed to be said as you did: as long as you aren't hurting anyone with your beliefs, it doesn't matter if you are wrong, as you won't know. Unless of course there is a god and he turns his back on those who didn't believe in this life and they are left in purgatory for all eternity. Then that might kinda suck. 

HughFreakingDillon said:

for sure, Brian, but most today aren't fundamentalists. 

unprovable checks out for me. Although my spellcheck is Canadian.

HughFreakingDillon said:

I only know Austin 3:16 - Stone Cold just whipped your ass! 

In all seriousness, if there is one thing about my brother's religion that makes some sense to me, is that you don't get baptized against your will. it happens as an adult when you can make an informed decision about it. But I still find it odd what baptism illustrates: god doesn't recognize you as a pure soul until you are baptized, so if a baby dies prior to getting baptized, their soul remains in purgatory forever. that's kinda fucked up, no? damning the soul of a dead baby for all eternity?

PJ_Soul said:

My sister and I aren't baptized (why would we be, right?), but my sister married a guy who was a non-practicing Catholic, and then divorced him. Then the guy tried to marry another Catholic, and the church wouldn't let him get married again because he was divorced, lol, but from a non-Catholic marriage. So the only way around it was to get the Catholic Church to ceremonially annul the first marriage, but without the participation of my sister. And the only way the Church would annul it for him was to confirm that he had married an unbaptized woman... apparently, his marriage to my sister was considered illegitimate by the Church because she was never baptized, as well as because they didn't marry under the Church. So he simply asked me if she'd been baptized and I said no.... and that was supposedly enough proof as far as the Catholic Church is concerned - no proof necessary - and it annulled a marriage that never even happened with the Church in the first place (presumably, they would have refused to marry them if they'd asked, unless my sister got baptized). A Justice of the Peace married them. I am not sure where in the fuck the Catholic Church gets off doing that to be honest. My sister never agreed to any form of annulment ... somehow she didn't matter at all to the Catholic Church because she wasn't baptized, but at the same time she mattered enough for the Church to "rule" the marriage she was in as illegitimate. Why in the hell does the Church have to "annul" a marriage that they also supposedly don't acknowledge since it was never sanctioned by them in the first place? So incredibly stupid. It really makes no sense. Plus, the whole thing is obviously so lax - you can apparently tell them whatever you want and they just go ahead without proving anything, which simply proves that even the Church knows its full of shit.