I'm uncomfortable with letting anyone use whatever bathroom they so choose.
Then you should have no problems then, as no trans person chose to be trans. The only people choose to use a "different" restroom are the fictional predators used to get people to back these laws.
Until some man sees a therapist, gets on female hormones, takes testosterone blockers, starts electrolysis, gets facial feminization surgery, gets breast implants, changes their name, changes their government identification, has their high school diploma and college degrees reissued under a new name, and rebuilds an entirely new life where are they are more hated, judged, criticized, assaulted, and ostracized than ever before, with higher rates of suicide, depression, and murder than they would have experienced before all of this... all so they can get their kicks and finally pee in a stall next to other women? That's an active fantasy life.
Beautifully put.
By preventing a trans person to not use the bathroom of their identified gender, that doesn't make you comfortable, that makes you someone who discriminates.
I'm uncomfortable with whom will abuse the freedom of using any bathroom they choose. not transgendered people. If there was not the possibility of perverse people using this as method to for fill their perversion the I'd see this whole thing in another light.
Everyone keeps skipping the part about perverse people would do this shit with or without this law. Again, post one example of a transgender friendly restroom leading to an instance of sexual assault or something along those lines. And not the Gender Neutral bathroom issues that have been posted. I'm talking about a mens or womens room that are open to trans people who identify such. You will not be able to link one example if you try, because it has completely been a non-issue.
"If I should ever die, God forbid, let this be my epitaph: The only proof he needed for the existence of God was music." KV Jr.
As to why they waited so long, perhaps they knew this was on the horizon? From a news story this afternoon:
"North Carolina Governor Pat McCrory says he will respect and bide by the 4th Circuit Court of Appeals’ ruling on a case involving a transgender student from Virginia, a ruling that could invalidate his state’s new anti-LGBT bill.
Earlier on Tuesday, the 4th Circuit found that requiring students to use bathrooms in accordance with their “biological gender” or gender neutral bathrooms violates Title IX of the Education Act of 1972, which prohibits discrimination based on sex.
That ruling could have dramatic implications for North Carolina and it’s anti-LGBT bill, HB 2, because North Carolina is under the purview of the 4th Circuit. HB 2 bans transgender individuals from using bathrooms in accordance with their gender identity.
Responding to news of the court’s ruling, McCrory said he will meet with attorneys and uphold his oath of office and “abide” by the 4th Circuit’s decision."
I know that this is almost beside the point, because the conversation hinges on morality, and issues other than bathroom usage. But, the public bathroom layout could use an overhaul anyway. How about, for public restrooms, use full walls with motion detectors (light outside the "stall") to let you know that a stall is occupied to give some sense of safety. Sinks could be shared and no one is exposed. I know that this likely wouldn't work easily for small businesses but, the expense for governments and large establishments shouldn't be significant compared to the current issues.
Dear Tenclub members, here's a friendly reminder, don't take Pearl Jam for granted, when you do, shit happens
Who exactly was "taking Pearl Jam for granted"? The Tenclub members, the vast majority of whom did not vote for this law or these politicians?
I think the band is taking its fans for granted more so than those fans are taking the band for granted.
If you purchased a nonrefundable airline ticket that you can't use ever, to fly there for a Pearl Jam show and nothing else, you took something for granted.
PEARL JAM in 2024! Dark Matter and MORE ! THANK YOU!! Peace Love & Pearl Jam forever!!
Dear Tenclub members, here's a friendly reminder, don't take Pearl Jam for granted, when you do, shit happens
Who exactly was "taking Pearl Jam for granted"? The Tenclub members, the vast majority of whom did not vote for this law or these politicians?
I think the band is taking its fans for granted more so than those fans are taking the band for granted.
If you purchased a nonrefundable airline ticket that you can't use ever, to fly there for a Pearl Jam show and nothing else, you took something for granted.
Not really. Not at all actually. You entered into an agreement.
Taking PJ for granted would be electing to not see PJ because you think you can see them some other time.
Feel sorry for those who would have travelled a long, long way to the show. Maybe an alternative would be to do a sit in/occupy the arena until the police/authorities forced the band out. Imagine the press coverage of that!
Dear Tenclub members, here's a friendly reminder, don't take Pearl Jam for granted, when you do, shit happens
Who exactly was "taking Pearl Jam for granted"? The Tenclub members, the vast majority of whom did not vote for this law or these politicians?
I think the band is taking its fans for granted more so than those fans are taking the band for granted.
If you purchased a nonrefundable airline ticket that you can't use ever, to fly there for a Pearl Jam show and nothing else, you took something for granted.
I'm fairly certain that anyone who bought a plane ticket to come to the show that Pearl Jam was selling tickets to a mere 36 hours ago was operating under a very reasonable assumption that the band would play the show. That hardly seems like "taking Pearl Jam for granted". That's more like basic human interaction.
As a Raleigh native, with incredible seats to the show, I applaud the statement made to NC. Right on guys.
1992-8-18 Lollapalooza, Raleigh NC
2012-11-24 Jacksonville FL, Eddie solo tour
2012-11-25 Jacksonville FL, Eddie solo tour
2013-10-27 Baltimore MD
2013-10-29 Charlottesville VA
2013-10-30 Charlotte NC
2013=making up for lost time
I have read SO many comments since yesterday and I see so many upset over this, rightfully so. QUESTION: How many of you actually feel so slighted with this that you will not renew your 10c membership, ask for ticket refunds to upcoming shows, etc? I would be in tears if I had tickets to this show and made travel plans. I'm not sure how I would handle it.
I have read SO many comments since yesterday and I see so many upset over this, rightfully so. QUESTION: How many of you actually feel so slighted with this that you will not renew your 10c membership, ask for ticket refunds to upcoming shows, etc? I would be in tears if I had tickets to this show and made travel plans. I'm not sure how I would handle it.
I live in Chapel Hill and had GA tickets for the Raleigh show. I support the band's politics on this issue but feel like the choice to cancel the show was tacky and gutless. I won't be quitting the Ten Club because I love this band's music and will try to see them again if they ever come through this area. What I won't ever do again is plan a trip around one of the band's shows. There are terrible politicians everywhere and this band is telling me that any one of those politicians has the power to kill off a Pearl Jam show at the last minute.
I have read SO many comments since yesterday and I see so many upset over this, rightfully so. QUESTION: How many of you actually feel so slighted with this that you will not renew your 10c membership, ask for ticket refunds to upcoming shows, etc? I would be in tears if I had tickets to this show and made travel plans. I'm not sure how I would handle it.
I requested a refund for Columbia and have not heard anything back. I asked because I no longer was going to travel for just one show, and because I felt disrespected by the band's delay in decision making.
It is just a music concert....people are getting refunds. Events risk getting cancelled, buyer beware.
I've had 3.5 shows get cancelled on me in 10 years. One which I made nonrefundable travel accommodations for.
You just got to shrug your shoulders and maybe have a quick vent. Then, find something else to do and move on.
See, I have read that it is just a concert and not a big deal, but if that was true why did it matter if PJ canceled or not? Obviously it was a big deal because it made the news and PJ felt it would be a big deal if they canceled it.
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KV4053
Mike's side, crushed up against the stage Posts: 1,455
25 years and a couple of hiccups along the way. Not a bad track record if you ask me. I'll continue doing business with this organization.
On the other hand, I fired Comcast, Dish Network, Verizon, T-Mobile, Panera Bread, etc.
I know I was born and I know that I'll die. The in between is mine.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,721
I know that this is almost beside the point, because the conversation hinges on morality, and issues other than bathroom usage. But, the public bathroom layout could use an overhaul anyway. How about, for public restrooms, use full walls with motion detectors (light outside the "stall") to let you know that a stall is occupied to give some sense of safety. Sinks could be shared and no one is exposed. I know that this likely wouldn't work easily for small businesses but, the expense for governments and large establishments shouldn't be significant compared to the current issues.
My wife suggested something similar to this last night. Good idea, PardonMe.
As for small businesses, like many others, my wife's store has one bathroom so of course, all genders use it. Even the store cat's letter box is there. There one bit of segregation however, the co-owner's dog uses the yard behind the store.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
It is just a music concert....people are getting refunds. Events risk getting cancelled, buyer beware.
I've had 3.5 shows get cancelled on me in 10 years. One which I made nonrefundable travel accommodations for.
You just got to shrug your shoulders and maybe have a quick vent. Then, find something else to do and move on.
See, I have read that it is just a concert and not a big deal, but if that was true why did it matter if PJ canceled or not? Obviously it was a big deal because it made the news and PJ felt it would be a big deal if they canceled it.
Because Pearl Jam thought the message being spread and the economic impact was bigger than the event itself...which is just a concert.
It is just a music concert....people are getting refunds. Events risk getting cancelled, buyer beware.
I've had 3.5 shows get cancelled on me in 10 years. One which I made nonrefundable travel accommodations for.
You just got to shrug your shoulders and maybe have a quick vent. Then, find something else to do and move on.
See, I have read that it is just a concert and not a big deal, but if that was true why did it matter if PJ canceled or not? Obviously it was a big deal because it made the news and PJ felt it would be a big deal if they canceled it.
Because Pearl Jam thought the message being spread and the economic impact was bigger than the event itself...which is just a concert.
Why would the economic impact mean anything if it wasn't a big deal? There were 15,000 people ready to go to that show. It was a big deal.
I requested a refund for Columbia and have not heard anything back.
As someone who tried to get a refund because I personally wanted to boycott NC even if the band didn't, I am pretty certain they will not be giving you one, based on the communications I had last week.
It is just a music concert....people are getting refunds. Events risk getting cancelled, buyer beware.
I've had 3.5 shows get cancelled on me in 10 years. One which I made nonrefundable travel accommodations for.
You just got to shrug your shoulders and maybe have a quick vent. Then, find something else to do and move on.
See, I have read that it is just a concert and not a big deal, but if that was true why did it matter if PJ canceled or not? Obviously it was a big deal because it made the news and PJ felt it would be a big deal if they canceled it.
Because Pearl Jam thought the message being spread and the economic impact was bigger than the event itself...which is just a concert.
Why would the economic impact mean anything if it wasn't a big deal? There were 15,000 people ready to go to that show. It was a big deal.
The economic impact is a big deal; the event was not a big deal.
It is just a music concert....people are getting refunds. Events risk getting cancelled, buyer beware.
I've had 3.5 shows get cancelled on me in 10 years. One which I made nonrefundable travel accommodations for.
You just got to shrug your shoulders and maybe have a quick vent. Then, find something else to do and move on.
See, I have read that it is just a concert and not a big deal, but if that was true why did it matter if PJ canceled or not? Obviously it was a big deal because it made the news and PJ felt it would be a big deal if they canceled it.
Because Pearl Jam thought the message being spread and the economic impact was bigger than the event itself...which is just a concert.
Why would the economic impact mean anything if it wasn't a big deal? There were 15,000 people ready to go to that show. It was a big deal.
The economic impact is a big deal; the event was not a big deal.
Because 15,000 people wanted to show (with some traveling long distances) for the helluva it. I get what you are saying though but I think it is a big deal to get 15,000 people to show up.
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hedonist
standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
I know that this is almost beside the point, because the conversation hinges on morality, and issues other than bathroom usage. But, the public bathroom layout could use an overhaul anyway. How about, for public restrooms, use full walls with motion detectors (light outside the "stall") to let you know that a stall is occupied to give some sense of safety. Sinks could be shared and no one is exposed. I know that this likely wouldn't work easily for small businesses but, the expense for governments and large establishments shouldn't be significant compared to the current issues.
My wife suggested something similar to this last night. Good idea, PardonMe.
As for small businesses, like many others, my wife's store has one bathroom so of course, all genders use it. Even the store cat's letter box is there. There one bit of segregation however, the co-owner's dog uses the yard behind the store.
Whoa whoa, your cat has a letter box? Address please! I can send her mucho treats.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,721
I know that this is almost beside the point, because the conversation hinges on morality, and issues other than bathroom usage. But, the public bathroom layout could use an overhaul anyway. How about, for public restrooms, use full walls with motion detectors (light outside the "stall") to let you know that a stall is occupied to give some sense of safety. Sinks could be shared and no one is exposed. I know that this likely wouldn't work easily for small businesses but, the expense for governments and large establishments shouldn't be significant compared to the current issues.
My wife suggested something similar to this last night. Good idea, PardonMe.
As for small businesses, like many others, my wife's store has one bathroom so of course, all genders use it. Even the store cat's letter box is there. There one bit of segregation however, the co-owner's dog uses the yard behind the store.
Whoa whoa, your cat has a letter box? Address please! I can send her mucho treats.
Oh but my has it ever been a long day! (Got water at home again at least though!)
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
25 years and a couple of hiccups along the way. Not a bad track record if you ask me. I'll continue doing business with this organization.
On the other hand, I fired Comcast, Dish Network, Verizon, T-Mobile, Panera Bread, etc.
This made me laugh, love it. Right on! Even though i am typically loyal! Verizon 12 years, Directv 4 years, Honda 15 years(but did also have a Chevy as a secondary vehicle for a few years), Fender guitars about 15 years, I guess I add my wife to this loyalty list as well.
I have fired multiple restaurants, normally to give them a chance again after a few years and regret giving them another chance. Pretty sure I've also fired Myrtle Beach(not my type of vacation). This makes me wanna start a discussion about places/business everyone have fired or been loyal too over the years.
I know that this is almost beside the point, because the conversation hinges on morality, and issues other than bathroom usage. But, the public bathroom layout could use an overhaul anyway. How about, for public restrooms, use full walls with motion detectors (light outside the "stall") to let you know that a stall is occupied to give some sense of safety. Sinks could be shared and no one is exposed. I know that this likely wouldn't work easily for small businesses but, the expense for governments and large establishments shouldn't be significant compared to the current issues.
My wife suggested something similar to this last night. Good idea, PardonMe.
As for small businesses, like many others, my wife's store has one bathroom so of course, all genders use it. Even the store cat's letter box is there. There one bit of segregation however, the co-owner's dog uses the yard behind the store.
Can the dog use the litter box if he or she learns to meow? Joking, of course.
I just don't like to see divisive issues, where everyone is so dug in, that they don't even look for simple solutions. Equality is something that everyone wants and deserves. Unfortunately, it is a slow process to go from point A to point B. Education on the facts, and understanding of the real issues, seems to be the most honest, effective approach, albeit slow. I think that this is where Pearl Jam could have made the biggest difference. I don't know all of the issues that the LGBT community faces and I am not likely to completely understand anytime soon. I am in another minority known as a single father (I say this half-sincerely, not trying to compare the two) and I am too busy, trying to be good at that, to research and understand all of the inequality everywhere else. Pearl Jam had the opportunity, along with the activists in the area, to teach me and many others about the plight of this community. They could have likely activated some new activists, softened some hatred or, at worst, forced some fans of the band to reveal their intolerance and separate from the herd.
Cancelling the show may have helped, but I have to believe that educating 20,000 people, particularly in the South, on the LGBT issues would have had a longer-lasting impact.
Comments
Good Morning USA!
"Watch your micro-aggresions bro"
"North Carolina Governor Pat McCrory says he will respect and bide by the 4th Circuit Court of Appeals’ ruling on a case involving a transgender student from Virginia, a ruling that could invalidate his state’s new anti-LGBT bill.
Earlier on Tuesday, the 4th Circuit found that requiring students to use bathrooms in accordance with their “biological gender” or gender neutral bathrooms violates Title IX of the Education Act of 1972, which prohibits discrimination based on sex.
That ruling could have dramatic implications for North Carolina and it’s anti-LGBT bill, HB 2, because North Carolina is under the purview of the 4th Circuit. HB 2 bans transgender individuals from using bathrooms in accordance with their gender identity.
Responding to news of the court’s ruling, McCrory said he will meet with attorneys and uphold his oath of office and “abide” by the 4th Circuit’s decision."
Peace Love & Pearl Jam forever!!
Taking PJ for granted would be electing to not see PJ because you think you can see them some other time.
1992-8-18 Lollapalooza, Raleigh NC
2012-11-24 Jacksonville FL, Eddie solo tour
2012-11-25 Jacksonville FL, Eddie solo tour
2013-10-27 Baltimore MD
2013-10-29 Charlottesville VA
2013-10-30 Charlotte NC
2013=making up for lost time
[/img]
I've had 3.5 shows get cancelled on me in 10 years. One which I made nonrefundable travel accommodations for.
You just got to shrug your shoulders and maybe have a quick vent. Then, find something else to do and move on.
On the other hand, I fired Comcast, Dish Network, Verizon, T-Mobile, Panera Bread, etc.
As for small businesses, like many others, my wife's store has one bathroom so of course, all genders use it. Even the store cat's letter box is there. There one bit of segregation however, the co-owner's dog uses the yard behind the store.
I have fired multiple restaurants, normally to give them a chance again after a few years and regret giving them another chance. Pretty sure I've also fired Myrtle Beach(not my type of vacation). This makes me wanna start a discussion about places/business everyone have fired or been loyal too over the years.
I just don't like to see divisive issues, where everyone is so dug in, that they don't even look for simple solutions. Equality is something that everyone wants and deserves. Unfortunately, it is a slow process to go from point A to point B. Education on the facts, and understanding of the real issues, seems to be the most honest, effective approach, albeit slow. I think that this is where Pearl Jam could have made the biggest difference. I don't know all of the issues that the LGBT community faces and I am not likely to completely understand anytime soon. I am in another minority known as a single father (I say this half-sincerely, not trying to compare the two) and I am too busy, trying to be good at that, to research and understand all of the inequality everywhere else. Pearl Jam had the opportunity, along with the activists in the area, to teach me and many others about the plight of this community. They could have likely activated some new activists, softened some hatred or, at worst, forced some fans of the band to reveal their intolerance and separate from the herd.
Cancelling the show may have helped, but I have to believe that educating 20,000 people, particularly in the South, on the LGBT issues would have had a longer-lasting impact.