grandpa (dad's dad a WWII army vet who fought on pacific islands) & our dad (a navy veitnam vet up to his eyeballs in all sorts of bullshit) raised us three boys like you are describing: surrounded by farms, countryside & timber & outdoors living. it is a natural part of rural life, yes. we even had a outhouse in case the well went dry or were outback messin around & you'd just step in the outhouse all good & muddy vs' trackin mud & shit & trigs into the house
i'm the oldest & i was given a bb gun when i was in 1st grade & it was no toy. as in no shooting each other, no eyeballs being blown out, it was serious business or it'd be on. by 3rd grade i was given a 20 gauge single shot shotgun. it takes years to teach & to learn how to handle a gun safely. practice practice practice. & you good people out there do not for one second believe that grandpa & dad had me stompin around the woods & fields w/ a loaded shotgun when im in 3rd grade. that would be naive of someone to think that is how we rolled.
as we know already 87% - 90% of the folks on here are against guns in any way shape or form. well they most probably grew up & had a family that did not own guns or needed guns or what have you.
i like southern country folks. pretty real & they'll survive
guns weren't a big fucking deal to get erect over & make a mess in your jeans. they were around, lots of them & it was like having a pepsi 8 pack of bottles sitting in a snow drift outside the door next to the woodpile. it was just that simple
I grew up in the country, in backcountry hills the likes of which Florida and Iowa can't compare to. I am OK with guns as far as the country narrative goes, but the country narrative doesn't include badass handguns and tactically appointed rifles. Those are the purview of the gun-obsessed, and are part of an entirely different equation. Nobody is trying to over-regulate tube loading 22's, bolt action thirty oughts, or pump action shotguns.
I wanted to ask you Gambs.Do you carry when in the deep back woods on a 3 day adventure in Appalachia Banjo country?? I've seen some sketchy individuals come rolling out of those woods.
Very human indeed, but to remove flight from the "fight or flight" response ignores both biological imperative and common sense.
Ditto this....I'm not anti-gun: defend your castle.
Grandpa was a vet, Great-Uncle was a vet, Great-Grandparents fled Nazi Germany. We can turn this into a pissing contest and talk about how I've been raised with everything from slingshots to shotguns, and shot everything in between. From BB to paintball, Derringers & Saturday Night Specials. 22s, 35s, 9mm, 357 Magnums, AK-47s, Kalashnikovs, Tommy Guns and weeeeee! I've shot 'em all. I'm the first to admit, guns are fun as hell.
I'm not anti-regulation either. Shoot first, ask questions later does not make sense. Stand your ground is a disgrace to modern civilized society. To conceal/carry on a daily basis is completely unnecessary for the majority of the population. As with everything, there needs to be a balance. Right now, American society's relationship with guns is totally out of balance. It's creating more problems than it's solving.
grandpa (dad's dad a WWII army vet who fought on pacific islands) & our dad (a navy veitnam vet up to his eyeballs in all sorts of bullshit) raised us three boys like you are describing: surrounded by farms, countryside & timber & outdoors living. it is a natural part of rural life, yes. we even had a outhouse in case the well went dry or were outback messin around & you'd just step in the outhouse all good & muddy vs' trackin mud & shit & trigs into the house
i'm the oldest & i was given a bb gun when i was in 1st grade & it was no toy. as in no shooting each other, no eyeballs being blown out, it was serious business or it'd be on. by 3rd grade i was given a 20 gauge single shot shotgun. it takes years to teach & to learn how to handle a gun safely. practice practice practice. & you good people out there do not for one second believe that grandpa & dad had me stompin around the woods & fields w/ a loaded shotgun when im in 3rd grade. that would be naive of someone to think that is how we rolled.
as we know already 87% - 90% of the folks on here are against guns in any way shape or form. well they most probably grew up & had a family that did not own guns or needed guns or what have you.
i like southern country folks. pretty real & they'll survive
guns weren't a big fucking deal to get erect over & make a mess in your jeans. they were around, lots of them & it was like having a pepsi 8 pack of bottles sitting in a snow drift outside the door next to the woodpile. it was just that simple
I grew up in the country, in backcountry hills the likes of which Florida and Iowa can't compare to. I am OK with guns as far as the country narrative goes, but the country narrative doesn't include badass handguns and tactically appointed rifles. Those are the purview of the gun-obsessed, and are part of an entirely different equation. Nobody is trying to over-regulate tube loading 22's, bolt action thirty oughts, or pump action shotguns.
I wanted to ask you Gambs.Do you carry when in the deep back woods on a 3 day adventure in Appalachia Banjo country?? I've seen some sketchy individuals come rolling out of those woods.
it's kind of scary that someone would want to control my gun owneship rights...but then again we have (whats loosely called) a first lady who wants to control the food your children eat at school %-( it's always ticked me off that a person can be given the athority to control different wants or needs of another.
Godfather.
The 3 word of the 2nd Amendment is 'Regulated'. What do you think was meant by that?
The entire reason we have food at school is for national defense. It was instituted because our children were malnourished and underfed. This makes it difficult to maintain and create an effective army. Today you have top military brass coming out and saying they can't find enough good recruits because children are lazy, fat, and out of shape. Makes sense that our school children should have a healthy diet in that context.
Also, the wife of the President is the First Lady. To suggest otherwise is childish and insulting.
childish and insulting to who ? some would say we have not had a president since Bush left office but I'm sure that's not your opinion and I would not want to offend you with my opinion...you know that communism kind of sounds like it borders in meaning to what your are so passionate about in this thread,anyway have a fine day. )
Godfather.
Insulting to you. It makes you look childish.
We've had one president since GWB was 'elected'. That's not an opinion, that's a fact. He was even re-elected! I've come to terms with the Supreme Court's mistake re: Bush, you should acknowledge Obama's 2 successful elections. Both of which were determined by a populous of the electoral college and popular vote. Handily I might add.
And no, I'm not advocating Communism. In fact, I consider myself to have a Libertarian streak more than anything else. However, government does have a place in our society. For example, I prefer Keynesian economics to the repeatedly dis-proven 'trickle-down' economics. Government is but one tool among many in our society's toolbox. You have to pick the right tool for the job. You don't use a saw to hammer in a nail.
If you're going to throw around words like 'opinion' and 'communism', you should probably know what they mean before you use them....
You talk about why you should own a gun, get to carry it with you everyday, because it makes you feel safer. But when you're faced with numbers and facts that prove otherwise, all of a sudden it's a matter of 'opinion' or 'differing views'. Bullshit. The fact of the matter is: more guns create more gun deaths. That is not a matter opinion, it's a fact.
I'm sorry for your anger but the fact that people kill each other everyday is no fault of a responsible gun owner...no bullshit really...it's true. and if your going throw around your opinion maybe you should the reason I would disagree.
Godfather.
I'm not angry.
The fact that people kill each other everyday with guns is the fault of people who own guns.
"and if your going throw around your opinion maybe you should the reason I would disagree." This isn't even a sentence, much less a cohesive thought.
I'm at work and trying to hurry......Burnzie is that you ?
Godfather.
No, it's not...
then please tell me how your facts matter more than and my rights (2nd am.) ? all those gun death you keep whinning about are probably less than drug related deaths or cancer deaths or even car accident deaths but still you and others like you keep whinning about guns and gun related deaths....sorry but my "give a shit" cup has already reached it full level.
Godfather.
As a Canadian, I have no idea of what your 2nd Amendment actually means. It speaks of a well-regulated militia yet every time the gun debate comes up on the Train I hear people arguing against any form of regulation whatsoever. Honestly, is that part of the 2nd Amendment a misprint or am I actually missing something here?
You aren't missing a thing....it's really frustrating for a lot of us
that's messed up...interesting though that the dog owner ran in to get his gun as well. Life in murikkka
it's like the gun nuts believe that the gun is their only solution. As the dog owner said in this article why couldn't the shooter have just not walked by their house? He had already expressed some concern about the dog barking. So instead of separating the dogs, maybe a non lethal kick or something, he takes the whole neighborhoods safety risk down several levels by shooting it? Just absolutely stupid.
Does this have something to do with a person's right to stand his or her ground? On the whole, standing your ground seems like a very American concept to me. Why back down when you can pull out a gun and escalate the situation instead?
I Prefer when they call it the Castle Doctrine.Ones right to protect family,pets and home That simple.I don't get what is so American about that concept? Its human want to protect those you love.
I'm sorry, but as a Canadian I find that "stand your ground" stands out as being an incredibly American concept. The idea that you don't need to back down as long as you are armed is very foreign to me as a Canadian. Of course stand your ground doesn't make a lot of sense in a jurisdiction where carrying fire arms (open or concealed) is illegal or where obtaining a permit to do so is nearly impossible. Let's be honest, how often do you hear Brits, Aussies, or Canadians talking about their need to carry a firearm in public to keep themselves or their loved ones safe? Guns simply don't resonate with many of us the way they do for you Americans.
I'm just an American. Not part of "you Americans". Many different people in that lumping, blue.
Curious if "stand your ground" is about self-protection and all it encompasses, or about how one goes about it?
My or my husband's life on the line, I'd use whatever I could to preserve either and both - even if not armed in the traditional (ie, gun) sense.
We don't own one but we have a rather large knife, a mini-sword and various heavy objects. Not sure how using any of those to keep ourselves safe could be criticized. Or, any other (ad hoc) weapon, fingernails, teeth, knees, feet, carkeys, pepper spray, voice...and firearm.
Not like we're wearing chaps and looking for a high-noon showdown!
I'm just an American. Not part of "you Americans". Many different people in that lumping, blue.
Curious if "stand your ground" is about self-protection and all it encompasses, or about how one goes about it?
My or my husband's life on the line, I'd use whatever I could to preserve either and both - even if not armed in the traditional (ie, gun) sense.
We don't own one but we have a rather large knife, a mini-sword and various heavy objects. Not sure how using any of those to keep ourselves safe could be criticized. Or, any other (ad hoc) weapon, fingernails, teeth, knees, feet, carkeys, pepper spray, voice...and firearm.
Not like we're wearing chaps and looking for a high-noon showdown!
Hedo I think you and your Hubby are missing out on a new opportunity in self protection.You already have the sword and the moxy,now go ahead and both of you throw on some chaps(village people style please!) And stroll around with the heavy objects and the sword yelling at people,while bearing your teeth like Hannibal Lector.I can guarantee no one will mess with you and I'm pretty sure in SoCal you probably won't get a second look.Shit,no gun needed.lol
it's kind of scary that someone would want to control my gun owneship rights...but then again we have (whats loosely called) a first lady who wants to control the food your children eat at school %-( it's always ticked me off that a person can be given the athority to control different wants or needs of another.
Godfather.
The 3 word of the 2nd Amendment is 'Regulated'. What do you think was meant by that?
The entire reason we have food at school is for national defense. It was instituted because our children were malnourished and underfed. This makes it difficult to maintain and create an effective army. Today you have top military brass coming out and saying they can't find enough good recruits because children are lazy, fat, and out of shape. Makes sense that our school children should have a healthy diet in that context.
Also, the wife of the President is the First Lady. To suggest otherwise is childish and insulting.
childish and insulting to who ? some would say we have not had a president since Bush left office but I'm sure that's not your opinion and I would not want to offend you with my opinion...you know that communism kind of sounds like it borders in meaning to what your are so passionate about in this thread,anyway have a fine day. )
Godfather.
Insulting to you. It makes you look childish.
We've had one president since GWB was 'elected'. That's not an opinion, that's a fact. He was even re-elected! I've come to terms with the Supreme Court's mistake re: Bush, you should acknowledge Obama's 2 successful elections. Both of which were determined by a populous of the electoral college and popular vote. Handily I might add.
And no, I'm not advocating Communism. In fact, I consider myself to have a Libertarian streak more than anything else. However, government does have a place in our society. For example, I prefer Keynesian economics to the repeatedly dis-proven 'trickle-down' economics. Government is but one tool among many in our society's toolbox. You have to pick the right tool for the job. You don't use a saw to hammer in a nail.
If you're going to throw around words like 'opinion' and 'communism', you should probably know what they mean before you use them....
You talk about why you should own a gun, get to carry it with you everyday, because it makes you feel safer. But when you're faced with numbers and facts that prove otherwise, all of a sudden it's a matter of 'opinion' or 'differing views'. Bullshit. The fact of the matter is: more guns create more gun deaths. That is not a matter opinion, it's a fact.
I'm sorry for your anger but the fact that people kill each other everyday is no fault of a responsible gun owner...no bullshit really...it's true. and if your going throw around your opinion maybe you should the reason I would disagree.
Godfather.
I'm not angry.
The fact that people kill each other everyday with guns is the fault of people who own guns.
"and if your going throw around your opinion maybe you should the reason I would disagree." This isn't even a sentence, much less a cohesive thought.
I'm at work and trying to hurry......Burnzie is that you ?
Godfather.
No, it's not...
then please tell me how your facts matter more than and my rights (2nd am.) ? all those gun death you keep whinning about are probably less than drug related deaths or cancer deaths or even car accident deaths but still you and others like you keep whinning about guns and gun related deaths....sorry but my "give a shit" cup has already reached it full level.
Godfather.
As a Canadian, I have no idea of what your 2nd Amendment actually means. It speaks of a well-regulated militia yet every time the gun debate comes up on the Train I hear people arguing against any form of regulation whatsoever. Honestly, is that part of the 2nd Amendment a misprint or am I actually missing something here?
You aren't missing a thing....it's really frustrating for a lot of us
that's messed up...interesting though that the dog owner ran in to get his gun as well. Life in murikkka
it's like the gun nuts believe that the gun is their only solution. As the dog owner said in this article why couldn't the shooter have just not walked by their house? He had already expressed some concern about the dog barking. So instead of separating the dogs, maybe a non lethal kick or something, he takes the whole neighborhoods safety risk down several levels by shooting it? Just absolutely stupid.
Does this have something to do with a person's right to stand his or her ground? On the whole, standing your ground seems like a very American concept to me. Why back down when you can pull out a gun and escalate the situation instead?
I Prefer when they call it the Castle Doctrine.Ones right to protect family,pets and home That simple.I don't get what is so American about that concept? Its human want to protect those you love.
I'm sorry, but as a Canadian I find that "stand your ground" stands out as being an incredibly American concept. The idea that you don't need to back down as long as you are armed is very foreign to me as a Canadian. Of course stand your ground doesn't make a lot of sense in a jurisdiction where carrying fire arms (open or concealed) is illegal or where obtaining a permit to do so is nearly impossible. Let's be honest, how often do you hear Brits, Aussies, or Canadians talking about their need to carry a firearm in public to keep themselves or their loved ones safe? Guns simply don't resonate with many of us the way they do for you Americans.
Armed or not,standing up to those who want to inflict ill will or harm against you or yours is just human nature.No borders needed.
Don't take my comment the wrong way; I'm not suggesting that all Americans comprise a single hive mind or that all Americans are gun-toting, would-be heroes. I'm simply suggesting that this is a very American topic. While some Americans may disagree with America's gun culture, it is definitely something that is what I would consider unique to the United States. Gun rights are featured prominently in your constitution and seem to be of paramount importance to a large portion of your society. As i said before, you don't really hear many Canadians talking about their right to bear arms. It simply isn't a prominent element in our society (whether we agree or disagree with the concept). Whether you are for or against an unrestricted access to firearms, this is a topic that is far more relevant to you as an American than it is to people in many other parts of the world.
As for "stand your ground", I always think of Tom Petty when I hear this phrase because it goes hand in hand with "I won't back down". I don't think you will find many (if any) jurisdictions where self defence or acting in defence of a loved one is a crime. Having said that, in Canada we would never have the right to confront a person on the street or provoke somebody leading to a potentially dangerous situation. Our courts apply a standard of "reasonable and necessary" force which effectively means that the amount of force one may apply in defence of one's self is directly proportional to the threat they face. Put it this way; somebody like Zimmerman wouldn't have a leg to stand on in a Canadian court because in Canada he wouldn't have the right to follow and confront someone.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
Don't take my comment the wrong way; I'm not suggesting that all Americans comprise a single hive mind or that all Americans are gun-toting, would-be heroes. I'm simply suggesting that this is a very American topic. While some Americans may disagree with America's gun culture, it is definitely something that is what I would consider unique to the United States. Gun rights are featured prominently in your constitution and seem to be of paramount importance to a large portion of your society. As i said before, you don't really hear many Canadians talking about their right to bear arms. It simply isn't a prominent element in our society (whether we agree or disagree with the concept). Whether you are for or against an unrestricted access to firearms, this is a topic that is far more relevant to you as an American than it is to people in many other parts of the world.
As for "stand your ground", I always think of Tom Petty when I hear this phrase because it goes hand in hand with "I won't back down". I don't think you will find many (if any) jurisdictions where self defence or acting in defence of a loved one is a crime. Having said that, in Canada we would never have the right to confront a person on the street or provoke somebody leading to a potentially dangerous situation. Our courts apply a standard of "reasonable and necessary" force which effectively means that the amount of force one may apply in defence of one's self is directly proportional to the threat they face. Put it this way; somebody like Zimmerman wouldn't have a leg to stand on in a Canadian court because in Canada he wouldn't have the right to follow and confront someone.
Our constitution has an amendment, one. So not like it made this a prominent topic.
When reading sensationalist US news and coming to this board can see a non US person thinking we walk around thinking about guns. All the time. Well my guess is 20% have that hard on for guns. They are paranoid about crime and the government. The rest go about their daily lives not thinking about guns. Course reading sensationalist news and these boards can understand how this may seem different.
And Zimmerman should be behind bars. Our justice system is flawed at times.
grandpa (dad's dad a WWII army vet who fought on pacific islands) & our dad (a navy veitnam vet up to his eyeballs in all sorts of bullshit) raised us three boys like you are describing: surrounded by farms, countryside & timber & outdoors living. it is a natural part of rural life, yes. we even had a outhouse in case the well went dry or were outback messin around & you'd just step in the outhouse all good & muddy vs' trackin mud & shit & trigs into the house
i'm the oldest & i was given a bb gun when i was in 1st grade & it was no toy. as in no shooting each other, no eyeballs being blown out, it was serious business or it'd be on. by 3rd grade i was given a 20 gauge single shot shotgun. it takes years to teach & to learn how to handle a gun safely. practice practice practice. & you good people out there do not for one second believe that grandpa & dad had me stompin around the woods & fields w/ a loaded shotgun when im in 3rd grade. that would be naive of someone to think that is how we rolled.
as we know already 87% - 90% of the folks on here are against guns in any way shape or form. well they most probably grew up & had a family that did not own guns or needed guns or what have you.
i like southern country folks. pretty real & they'll survive
guns weren't a big fucking deal to get erect over & make a mess in your jeans. they were around, lots of them & it was like having a pepsi 8 pack of bottles sitting in a snow drift outside the door next to the woodpile. it was just that simple
I grew up in the country, in backcountry hills the likes of which Florida and Iowa can't compare to. I am OK with guns as far as the country narrative goes, but the country narrative doesn't include badass handguns and tactically appointed rifles. Those are the purview of the gun-obsessed, and are part of an entirely different equation. Nobody is trying to over-regulate tube loading 22's, bolt action thirty oughts, or pump action shotguns.
I wanted to ask you Gambs.Do you carry when in the deep back woods on a 3 day adventure in Appalachia Banjo country?? I've seen some sketchy individuals come rolling out of those woods.
I do carry bear spray and a knife, contrary to what many would believe, bear spray is VERY MUCH more effective against bears than even large caliber firearms...there has yet to be a fatal attack on a person who properly used bear spray, but gun carriers often shoot the bear, get mauled and then they bleed out together in a sad, poetic death. As far as hillbillies, they don't scare me one bit. For one, I outbeard 90% of them, and two, I have experienced backwoods folk to be among the kindest and most giving segment of Americans...given you treat them with respect and not poke fun at their appearance or way of life. Honestly though, in more than a dozen true wilderness rambles I have not come across any real backwoods folk out there, they all live closer to town nowadays where they have access to cigarettes and booze. The 'shiners and pot farmers aren't in the prime wilderness areas, I mostly find liberal tree huggers like myself out there.
I'm just an American. Not part of "you Americans". Many different people in that lumping, blue.
Curious if "stand your ground" is about self-protection and all it encompasses, or about how one goes about it?
My or my husband's life on the line, I'd use whatever I could to preserve either and both - even if not armed in the traditional (ie, gun) sense.
We don't own one but we have a rather large knife, a mini-sword and various heavy objects. Not sure how using any of those to keep ourselves safe could be criticized. Or, any other (ad hoc) weapon, fingernails, teeth, knees, feet, carkeys, pepper spray, voice...and firearm.
Not like we're wearing chaps and looking for a high-noon showdown!
Hedo I think you and your Hubby are missing out on a new opportunity in self protection.You already have the sword and the moxy,now go ahead and both of you throw on some chaps(village people style please!) And stroll around with the heavy objects and the sword yelling at people,while bearing your teeth like Hannibal Lector.I can guarantee no one will mess with you and I'm pretty sure in SoCal you probably won't get a second look.Shit,no gun needed.lol
Ha! You're correct - we'd probably blend in looking and acting like that.
blue, thanks for clarifying. I guess its prominence is due to our history, and unfortunately the fanatics and the irresponsible take the spotlight vs those who take having or carrying a weapon very seriously.
I'd rather be able to walk away rather than provoke or exacerbate a situation. Most folks would too, I believe.
grandpa (dad's dad a WWII army vet who fought on pacific islands) & our dad (a navy veitnam vet up to his eyeballs in all sorts of bullshit) raised us three boys like you are describing: surrounded by farms, countryside & timber & outdoors living. it is a natural part of rural life, yes. we even had a outhouse in case the well went dry or were outback messin around & you'd just step in the outhouse all good & muddy vs' trackin mud & shit & trigs into the house
i'm the oldest & i was given a bb gun when i was in 1st grade & it was no toy. as in no shooting each other, no eyeballs being blown out, it was serious business or it'd be on. by 3rd grade i was given a 20 gauge single shot shotgun. it takes years to teach & to learn how to handle a gun safely. practice practice practice. & you good people out there do not for one second believe that grandpa & dad had me stompin around the woods & fields w/ a loaded shotgun when im in 3rd grade. that would be naive of someone to think that is how we rolled.
as we know already 87% - 90% of the folks on here are against guns in any way shape or form. well they most probably grew up & had a family that did not own guns or needed guns or what have you.
i like southern country folks. pretty real & they'll survive
guns weren't a big fucking deal to get erect over & make a mess in your jeans. they were around, lots of them & it was like having a pepsi 8 pack of bottles sitting in a snow drift outside the door next to the woodpile. it was just that simple
I grew up in the country, in backcountry hills the likes of which Florida and Iowa can't compare to. I am OK with guns as far as the country narrative goes, but the country narrative doesn't include badass handguns and tactically appointed rifles. Those are the purview of the gun-obsessed, and are part of an entirely different equation. Nobody is trying to over-regulate tube loading 22's, bolt action thirty oughts, or pump action shotguns.
I wanted to ask you Gambs.Do you carry when in the deep back woods on a 3 day adventure in Appalachia Banjo country?? I've seen some sketchy individuals come rolling out of those woods.
I do carry bear spray and a knife, contrary to what many would believe, bear spray is VERY MUCH more effective against bears than even large caliber firearms...there has yet to be a fatal attack on a person who properly used bear spray, but gun carriers often shoot the bear, get mauled and then they bleed out together in a sad, poetic death. As far as hillbillies, they don't scare me one bit. For one, I outbeard 90% of them, and two, I have experienced backwoods folk to be among the kindest and most giving segment of Americans...given you treat them with respect and not poke fun at their appearance or way of life. Honestly though, in more than a dozen true wilderness rambles I have not come across any real backwoods folk out there, they all live closer to town nowadays where they have access to cigarettes and booze. The 'shiners and pot farmers aren't in the prime wilderness areas, I mostly find liberal tree huggers like myself out there.
I love your use of the term "outbeard". So excellent!
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
guns are dangerous. gun nuts freak me out a bit. im no gun nut but i know a few really well & they're on another level.
something we talked about many years ago & i been thinking about it lately is this... these thugs, these idiots doing drive by shooting & whatnot aren't even good shots, yes i know it doesn't matter as they just keep firing until they hit someone, a mowing down scene or they miss altogether & take off or their drunk bullets hit innocent citizens who aren't even doing thug life.
these shitheads i'm surprised can even load their guns. where do they go to target practice? who taught them about gun safety? NOBODY! these folks are fucking dumb as shit
............................ part II
14 thugs can rob me, my house, steal my car & burn my shit down & i'd never shoot a single one of them. i am very sure i know when my life would be in danger & when life is just a kick in the balls & you may punch a fucker in the face
hedonist, i have a couple boxes & photo albums fulla pictures. if i ever get duplicates or scan & email (or whatever it's called) i'll send you some pictures of my young skinny ass decked out in iowa country boy attire. plz don't hold your breath as it'll take me awhile but i think it can happen if you want
I'm just an American. Not part of "you Americans". Many different people in that lumping, blue.
Curious if "stand your ground" is about self-protection and all it encompasses, or about how one goes about it?
My or my husband's life on the line, I'd use whatever I could to preserve either and both - even if not armed in the traditional (ie, gun) sense.
We don't own one but we have a rather large knife, a mini-sword and various heavy objects. Not sure how using any of those to keep ourselves safe could be criticized. Or, any other (ad hoc) weapon, fingernails, teeth, knees, feet, carkeys, pepper spray, voice...and firearm.
Not like we're wearing chaps and looking for a high-noon showdown!
Hedo I think you and your Hubby are missing out on a new opportunity in self protection.You already have the sword and the moxy,now go ahead and both of you throw on some chaps(village people style please!) And stroll around with the heavy objects and the sword yelling at people,while bearing your teeth like Hannibal Lector.I can guarantee no one will mess with you and I'm pretty sure in SoCal you probably won't get a second look.Shit,no gun needed.lol
Ha! You're correct - we'd probably blend in looking and acting like that.
blue, thanks for clarifying. I guess its prominence is due to our history, and unfortunately the fanatics and the irresponsible take the spotlight vs those who take having or carrying a weapon very seriously.
I'd rather be able to walk away rather than provoke or exacerbate a situation. Most folks would too, I believe.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
Very human indeed, but to remove flight from the "fight or flight" response ignores both biological imperative and common sense.
Ditto this....I'm not anti-gun: defend your castle.
Grandpa was a vet, Great-Uncle was a vet, Great-Grandparents fled Nazi Germany. We can turn this into a pissing contest and talk about how I've been raised with everything from slingshots to shotguns, and shot everything in between. From BB to paintball, Derringers & Saturday Night Specials. 22s, 35s, 9mm, 357 Magnums, AK-47s, Kalashnikovs, Tommy Guns and weeeeee! I've shot 'em all. I'm the first to admit, guns are fun as hell.
I'm not anti-regulation either. Shoot first, ask questions later does not make sense. Stand your ground is a disgrace to modern civilized society. To conceal/carry on a daily basis is completely unnecessary for the majority of the population. As with everything, there needs to be a balance. Right now, American society's relationship with guns is totally out of balance. It's creating more problems than it's solving.
Don't take my comment the wrong way; I'm not suggesting that all Americans comprise a single hive mind or that all Americans are gun-toting, would-be heroes. I'm simply suggesting that this is a very American topic. While some Americans may disagree with America's gun culture, it is definitely something that is what I would consider unique to the United States. Gun rights are featured prominently in your constitution and seem to be of paramount importance to a large portion of your society. As i said before, you don't really hear many Canadians talking about their right to bear arms. It simply isn't a prominent element in our society (whether we agree or disagree with the concept). Whether you are for or against an unrestricted access to firearms, this is a topic that is far more relevant to you as an American than it is to people in many other parts of the world.
As for "stand your ground", I always think of Tom Petty when I hear this phrase because it goes hand in hand with "I won't back down". I don't think you will find many (if any) jurisdictions where self defence or acting in defence of a loved one is a crime. Having said that, in Canada we would never have the right to confront a person on the street or provoke somebody leading to a potentially dangerous situation. Our courts apply a standard of "reasonable and necessary" force which effectively means that the amount of force one may apply in defence of one's self is directly proportional to the threat they face. Put it this way; somebody like Zimmerman wouldn't have a leg to stand on in a Canadian court because in Canada he wouldn't have the right to follow and confront someone.
Zimmerman would have been convicted if the ambitious prosecutor didn't try to pull a Casey Anthony and go for the home run with Murder 1.A lesser charge of murder 2 or neg homicide woulda got a guilty conviction.Hope these over zealous DAs learn from those 2 cases.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
You have any data to back up that claim?
Yes refer to your local newspaper, national newspaper, or world news. Anyone who has been robbed or a victim of a crime who did not have a concealed weapon. If you are looking for a specific study with the specific words that are discussed here, I am not searching for that info.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
You have any data to back up that claim?
Yes refer to your local newspaper, national newspaper, or world news. Anyone who has been robbed or a victim of a crime who did not have a concealed weapon. If you are looking for a specific study with the specific words that are discussed here, I am not searching for that info.
The data that shows a correlation between gun ownership and likelihood of gun victimization is evident in those same newspaper articles. You are only proving the point.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
You have any data to back up that claim?
Yes refer to your local newspaper, national newspaper, or world news. Anyone who has been robbed or a victim of a crime who did not have a concealed weapon. If you are looking for a specific study with the specific words that are discussed here, I am not searching for that info.
The data that shows a correlation between gun ownership and likelihood of gun victimization is evident in those same newspaper articles. You are only proving the point.
Maybe I am missing something. But thats like saying swimming in water increases the likelihood of drowning, while someone else says that swimming is exercise and increases the likelihood of good health.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
You have any data to back up that claim?
Yes refer to your local newspaper, national newspaper, or world news. Anyone who has been robbed or a victim of a crime who did not have a concealed weapon. If you are looking for a specific study with the specific words that are discussed here, I am not searching for that info.
The data that shows a correlation between gun ownership and likelihood of gun victimization is evident in those same newspaper articles. You are only proving the point.
Maybe I am missing something. But thats like saying swimming in water increases the likelihood of drowning, while someone else says that swimming is exercise and increases the likelihood of good health.
I suppose the difference is that your swimming doesn't affect my safety. Your carrying a gun, however, does. And again, there is evidence to that effect that shows a very clear linear relationship between number of guns within a population and number of gun related fatalities within the population.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
You have any data to back up that claim?
Yes refer to your local newspaper, national newspaper, or world news. Anyone who has been robbed or a victim of a crime who did not have a concealed weapon. If you are looking for a specific study with the specific words that are discussed here, I am not searching for that info.
The data that shows a correlation between gun ownership and likelihood of gun victimization is evident in those same newspaper articles. You are only proving the point.
Maybe I am missing something. But thats like saying swimming in water increases the likelihood of drowning, while someone else says that swimming is exercise and increases the likelihood of good health.
You need to work on your analogies.
Swimming in water does increase the likelihood of drowning.
Paranoid or not, you should conceal carry. Better safe than sorry.
No your just putting yourself and those around you at greater risk of being injured by gun. And what a pain in the butt to have to walk around with it.
I respectfully disagree. To carry is really no different physically than carrying your wallet. As far as being in greater risk of being injured by a gun. There is factual legitimacy to that statement but you can also factually say that without concealed carry, you and those around you run a greater risk of being victimized.
You have any data to back up that claim?
Yes refer to your local newspaper, national newspaper, or world news. Anyone who has been robbed or a victim of a crime who did not have a concealed weapon. If you are looking for a specific study with the specific words that are discussed here, I am not searching for that info.
The data that shows a correlation between gun ownership and likelihood of gun victimization is evident in those same newspaper articles. You are only proving the point.
Maybe I am missing something. But thats like saying swimming in water increases the likelihood of drowning, while someone else says that swimming is exercise and increases the likelihood of good health.
I suppose the difference is that your swimming doesn't affect my safety. Your carrying a gun, however, does. And again, there is evidence to that effect that shows a very clear linear relationship between number of guns within a population and number of gun related fatalities within the population.
Ben you can twist this to meet every point of view.If you are victim of a crime at the hands of a knife wielding fuck tard and a good citizen who happens to be carrying a hand gun come comes to your aid by scaring away or confronting the attacker,you could say it has affected your safety but for the better.
Comments
Grandpa was a vet, Great-Uncle was a vet, Great-Grandparents fled Nazi Germany. We can turn this into a pissing contest and talk about how I've been raised with everything from slingshots to shotguns, and shot everything in between. From BB to paintball, Derringers & Saturday Night Specials. 22s, 35s, 9mm, 357 Magnums, AK-47s, Kalashnikovs, Tommy Guns and weeeeee! I've shot 'em all. I'm the first to admit, guns are fun as hell.
But I'm also painfully aware of the damage guns can do in the wrong hands; whether it's reckless citizens, former co-workers people with a bone to pick, militias with soldier of fortune fantasies, lone wolves, angry morons or organized , fascists.
I'm not anti-regulation either. Shoot first, ask questions later does not make sense. Stand your ground is a disgrace to modern civilized society. To conceal/carry on a daily basis is completely unnecessary for the majority of the population. As with everything, there needs to be a balance. Right now, American society's relationship with guns is totally out of balance. It's creating more problems than it's solving.
How do you address this?
Curious if "stand your ground" is about self-protection and all it encompasses, or about how one goes about it?
My or my husband's life on the line, I'd use whatever I could to preserve either and both - even if not armed in the traditional (ie, gun) sense.
We don't own one but we have a rather large knife, a mini-sword and various heavy objects. Not sure how using any of those to keep ourselves safe could be criticized. Or, any other (ad hoc) weapon, fingernails, teeth, knees, feet, carkeys, pepper spray, voice...and firearm.
Not like we're wearing chaps and looking for a high-noon showdown!
I think you and your Hubby are missing out on a new opportunity in self protection.You already have the sword and the moxy,now go ahead and both of you throw on some chaps(village people style please!) And stroll around with the heavy objects and the sword yelling at people,while bearing your teeth like Hannibal Lector.I can guarantee no one will mess with you and I'm pretty sure in SoCal you probably won't get a second look.Shit,no gun needed.lol
As for "stand your ground", I always think of Tom Petty when I hear this phrase because it goes hand in hand with "I won't back down". I don't think you will find many (if any) jurisdictions where self defence or acting in defence of a loved one is a crime. Having said that, in Canada we would never have the right to confront a person on the street or provoke somebody leading to a potentially dangerous situation. Our courts apply a standard of "reasonable and necessary" force which effectively means that the amount of force one may apply in defence of one's self is directly proportional to the threat they face. Put it this way; somebody like Zimmerman wouldn't have a leg to stand on in a Canadian court because in Canada he wouldn't have the right to follow and confront someone.
When reading sensationalist US news and coming to this board can see a non US person thinking we walk around thinking about guns. All the time. Well my guess is 20% have that hard on for guns. They are paranoid about crime and the government. The rest go about their daily lives not thinking about guns. Course reading sensationalist news and these boards can understand how this may seem different.
And Zimmerman should be behind bars. Our justice system is flawed at times.
As far as hillbillies, they don't scare me one bit. For one, I outbeard 90% of them, and two, I have experienced backwoods folk to be among the kindest and most giving segment of Americans...given you treat them with respect and not poke fun at their appearance or way of life. Honestly though, in more than a dozen true wilderness rambles I have not come across any real backwoods folk out there, they all live closer to town nowadays where they have access to cigarettes and booze. The 'shiners and pot farmers aren't in the prime wilderness areas, I mostly find liberal tree huggers like myself out there.
blue, thanks for clarifying. I guess its prominence is due to our history, and unfortunately the fanatics and the irresponsible take the spotlight vs those who take having or carrying a weapon very seriously.
I'd rather be able to walk away rather than provoke or exacerbate a situation. Most folks would too, I believe.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
something we talked about many years ago & i been thinking about it lately is this... these thugs, these idiots doing drive by shooting & whatnot aren't even good shots, yes i know it doesn't matter as they just keep firing until they hit someone, a mowing down scene or they miss altogether & take off or their drunk bullets hit innocent citizens who aren't even doing thug life.
these shitheads i'm surprised can even load their guns. where do they go to target practice? who taught them about gun safety? NOBODY! these folks are fucking dumb as shit
............................
part II
14 thugs can rob me, my house, steal my car & burn my shit down & i'd never shoot a single one of them. i am very sure i know when my life would be in danger & when life is just a kick in the balls & you may punch a fucker in the face
hedonist,
i have a couple boxes & photo albums fulla pictures. if i ever get duplicates or scan & email (or whatever it's called) i'll send you some pictures of my young skinny ass decked out in iowa country boy attire. plz don't hold your breath as it'll take me awhile but i think it can happen if you want
"Hear me, my chiefs!
I am tired; my heart is
sick and sad. From where
the sun stands I will fight
no more forever."
Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
Godfather.
chadwick...
And Gambs"out bearded " nice work with that one.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Swimming in water does increase the likelihood of drowning.