Obamacare sucks

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  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    keeponrockin wrote:
    It blows my mind that in the United States of America, the 'greatest country in the world', people are okay with others just dieing because they don't have insurance.

    Furthermore, if you're a doctor, and you don't treat a guy in an emergency becaue he is illegal, you're a doctor for the wrong reasons.
    +1
  • keeponrockin
    keeponrockin Posts: 7,446
    Maybe it's cause I'm from Canada...

    But here, if you get sick, you're treated. If you're here illegally, I'm sure it's sorted out later. Either way, I won't lose any sleep that my tax dollars went to treat someone who needed it, even though they didn't have the 'right' to it.
    Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
  • comebackgirl
    comebackgirl Posts: 9,885
    redrock wrote:
    keeponrockin wrote:
    It blows my mind that in the United States of America, the 'greatest country in the world', people are okay with others just dieing because they don't have insurance.

    Furthermore, if you're a doctor, and you don't treat a guy in an emergency becaue he is illegal, you're a doctor for the wrong reasons.
    +1
    +2

    I cant' understand how someone's right to a fat bank account outweighs someone's right to live. Actually I hope I never understand that. If that ever happens I'll know my life has been too easy and I need more to worry about.
    tumblr_mg4nc33pIX1s1mie8o1_400.gif

    "I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,780
    keeponrockin wrote:
    Maybe it's cause I'm from Canada...

    But here, if you get sick, you're treated. If you're here illegally, I'm sure it's sorted out later. Either way, I won't lose any sleep that my tax dollars went to treat someone who needed it, even though they didn't have the 'right' to it.

    Totally agree ..
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    keeponrockin wrote:
    Do I think it's justice to provide everyone in the country health care?

    Unequivically yes. Every time. No exceptions.
    you mean socialized healthcare?
  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    comebackgirl wrote:
    redrock wrote:
    keeponrockin wrote:
    It blows my mind that in the United States of America, the 'greatest country in the world', people are okay with others just dieing because they don't have insurance.

    Furthermore, if you're a doctor, and you don't treat a guy in an emergency becaue he is illegal, you're a doctor for the wrong reasons.
    +1
    +2

    I cant' understand how someone's right to a fat bank account outweighs someone's right to live. Actually I hope I never understand that. If that ever happens I'll know my life has been too easy and I need more to worry about.

    Even those with insurance, thinking they are OK find out they are not, find out they have some condition/need care that exceeds their 'allowance', etc. I see it with relatives. Husband working 2 jobs (and not 'menial' jobs - sort of well paid), wife not because of major health issues, insurance no longer pays, cannot afford meds/follow up/surgery that would give her a better quality of life (and longer life...). Home already remortgaged, no more savings.....

    Those basically saying 'to each their own - sort yourself out, I've done so and why should I pay for you' - well... I hope nothing drastic ever happens to them. Wonder what they would be thinking then?

    Live and let die...

    Obamacare is far from perfect, but it's better than what is in place.
  • comebackgirl
    comebackgirl Posts: 9,885
    redrock wrote:
    comebackgirl wrote:
    redrock wrote:
    +2

    I cant' understand how someone's right to a fat bank account outweighs someone's right to live. Actually I hope I never understand that. If that ever happens I'll know my life has been too easy and I need more to worry about.

    Even those with insurance, thinking they are OK find out they are not, find out they have some condition/need care that exceeds their 'allowance', etc. I see it with relatives. Husband working 2 jobs (and not 'menial' jobs - sort of well paid), wife not because of major health issues, insurance no longer pays, cannot afford meds/follow up/surgery that would give her a better quality of life (and longer life...). Home already remortgaged, no more savings.....

    Those basically saying 'to each their own - sort yourself out, I've done so and why should I pay for you' - well... I hope nothing drastic ever happens to them. Wonder what they would be thinking then?

    Live and let die...

    Obamacare is far from perfect, but it's better than what is in place.
    That's just it...it's not that a lot of people aren't working or aren't trying or don't have coverage...it's that it just isn't enough...or for people who can't get coverage because of pre-existing conditions...I guess they're just out of luck.

    Some of the "haves" aren't willing to acknowledge that they "have" because they've been fortunate enough to have different supports, different access and fewer or different barriers. Those things don't make one person more worthy than another...they just make them more fortunate. People can't thrive if their basic human needs aren't met. It all goes back to the hierarchy of needs. Maslow knew what he was talking about.

    I agree it's not perfect, but we do have to start somewhere.
    tumblr_mg4nc33pIX1s1mie8o1_400.gif

    "I need your strength for me to be strong...I need your love to feel loved"
  • whygohome
    whygohome Posts: 2,305
    comebackgirl wrote:
    redrock wrote:
    keeponrockin wrote:
    It blows my mind that in the United States of America, the 'greatest country in the world', people are okay with others just dieing because they don't have insurance.

    Furthermore, if you're a doctor, and you don't treat a guy in an emergency becaue he is illegal, you're a doctor for the wrong reasons.
    +1
    +2

    I cant' understand how someone's right to a fat bank account outweighs someone's right to live. Actually I hope I never understand that. If that ever happens I'll know my life has been too easy and I need more to worry about.

    + 1,000,000

    Obviously there are some who think a hedge fund manager or Alex Rodriquez deserves better healthcare than us serfs.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    I must have missed the folk who are ok with letting people die?
    Where are they?

    Again it comes down to money only because people can not afford the insurance plans,
    so they are given a penalty tax from the government and expected to pay for the hospital bills
    of illegal immigrants and others who can not pay their bills, this in the form of
    higher taxes, rising medical costs.

    It is a double injustice, no insurance and less money to pay for basic needs.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    So some here feel the very rich should pay for the medical costs of others?
    They can afford it yes but would that be justice?

    And perhaps many already are with huge donations to hospitals and research.
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,780
    If it means me paying a few more dollars in taxes each yr would get coverage for more who don't have it i'm down for this ..
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • markin ball
    markin ball Posts: 1,076
    Shades of red...

    Romney and most all of us are fine with not letting people die in the streets if they don't have insurance and with taxpayers, charities, etc. (aka - "others" or the "haves") picking up the tab in those cases...aka socialized medicine.

    But some of us think that maybe the system would work better if that line of thinking were continued and medical treatment could be procured before death's doorstep.
    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win ."

    "With our thoughts we make the world"
  • g under p
    g under p Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,237
    josevolution wrote:
    If it means me paying a few more dollars in taxes each yr would get coverage for more who don't have it i'm down for this ..

    I'm with you especially when health insurance companies have denied me coveraged even after they said they would cover me. This after I'm paying high premiums OUT of my hard earned pockets something better needs to be done. Some companies people now work for have to wait a year just to get some coverage while working fulltime....I think that's madness.

    Peace
    *We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti

    *MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
    .....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti

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  • Cosmo
    Cosmo Posts: 12,225
    pandora wrote:
    I ask you...
    Do you think it is justice, this situation I speak of? Why must it fall to me, if I can not afford
    insurance myself, that I also pay someone else's bills and a penalty tax to boot.
    It comes down to money because I can not afford it, just like the one's I am expected to cover.
    ...
    I will answer your question... even though you completely dodged answering mine... which, I admit, I was 100% sure you would avoid answering.
    Your question: "Do you think it is justice, this situation I speak of?"
    My answer: I don't see it having anything to do with 'Justice'. If you can't afford to pay... and you fall ill and require life threatening medical help... I have no problem helping to pay for your costs. Also, you are paying for health care insurance right now, right? Therefore, you CAN afford health care insurance.
    I CAN afford to pay and I DO pay for my Health Care Insurance. I also place the life of a human being over additional taxes that I may incurr. It is all part of my decision to life within the parameters of a society... where I am one amoungst many... and not out here... on my own.
    That is where we differ... to you, "It comes down to money because I can not afford it, just like the one's I am expected to cover"... to me, I'm glad the guy (American or not American) is alive, not dead.
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
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  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    1. We already pay enough to cover everyone. We just don't want to cover them, regardless of cost.

    2. What if all it would cost you for us to provide health care to everyone was the price of a 10C membership? Are your posting privileges and good seats worth more than the lives and health of your fellow (wo)man? Or would you still pay your annual 10C dues and say to let people die because you can't afford it?
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    Maybe we need to ask: How much more would you be willing to pay to provide health care to everyone? What is this worth to you? And is care for non-citizens worth less than care for citizens? What does this say about (y)our values?
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,780
    _ wrote:
    1. We already pay enough to cover everyone. We just don't want to cover them, regardless of cost.

    2. What if all it would cost you for us to provide health care to everyone was the price of a 10C membership? Are your posting privileges and good seats worth more than the lives and health of your fellow (wo)man? Or would you still pay your annual 10C dues and say to let people die because you can't afford it?

    Well now that is a different story don't mess with my 10C seats :lol::lol: J/K you allready know where i stand on this :)
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    josevolution wrote:
    _ wrote:
    1. We already pay enough to cover everyone. We just don't want to cover them, regardless of cost.

    2. What if all it would cost you for us to provide health care to everyone was the price of a 10C membership? Are your posting privileges and good seats worth more than the lives and health of your fellow (wo)man? Or would you still pay your annual 10C dues and say to let people die because you can't afford it?

    Well now that is a different story don't mess with my 10C seats :lol::lol: J/K you allready know where i stand on this :)

    Maybe it will depend on how low one's 10C # is. ;)
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    Cosmo wrote:
    pandora wrote:
    I ask you...
    Do you think it is justice, this situation I speak of? Why must it fall to me, if I can not afford
    insurance myself, that I also pay someone else's bills and a penalty tax to boot.
    It comes down to money because I can not afford it, just like the one's I am expected to cover.
    ...
    I will answer your question... even though you completely dodged answering mine... which, I admit, I was 100% sure you would avoid answering.
    Your question: "Do you think it is justice, this situation I speak of?"
    My answer: I don't see it having anything to do with 'Justice'. If you can't afford to pay... and you fall ill and require life threatening medical help... I have no problem helping to pay for your costs. Also, you are paying for health care insurance right now, right? Therefore, you CAN afford health care insurance.
    I CAN afford to pay and I DO pay for my Health Care Insurance. I also place the life of a human being over additional taxes that I may incurr. It is all part of my decision to life within the parameters of a society... where I am one amoungst many... and not out here... on my own.
    That is where we differ... to you, "It comes down to money because I can not afford it, just like the one's I am expected to cover"... to me, I'm glad the guy (American or not American) is alive, not dead.
    I hear those saying a few more taxes ok... you see you can afford that,
    to you it is not a problem financially. You have insurance either a plan you can afford
    or one provided through your employer.
    I pay for a health plan now but may have to discontinue in the future...

    but it's not about me or you
    it's about those who already have no insurance, who can not afford the plans
    and have to pay a penalty tax and have higher taxes to pay to cover people
    who are here illegally and those on aid. They barely have enough to cover basic needs.

    They can not have insurance and will be doubly taxed. This is not fair to them,
    nor a good plan to help people have affordable medical care.
    You guys here are for it cause you can pay both taxes and for insurance
    what about those who can not?
  • Red Mosquito75
    Red Mosquito75 Moline IL Posts: 1,038
    How is obamacare going to affect me, a middle class father with a family? We all have healthcare through employer. The insurance is good and we pay a decent rate for a family of five. That is my main question? If an individual doesn't have insurance but must get it now because of obamacare where does he get it from, and insurance company or the gov't?
    This is Not For You

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