OCCUPY WALL STREET - Spreading

ajedigecko wrote:

for those of you that hate the 1%....you have wanted this battle, for sometime now and it is here.

yet...you type around on the computer.

what's your point?

Jason P wrote:

The conditions in Egypt are so different from the United States, it's not even a fair comparison. If it gets to the point where sewage is running down the streets and we have to wait in line for our daily bread ration, I'll take you up on the call to arms.

Here is my BIG suggestion: OWS needs to find a common bridge with the Tea Party. Think about it ...

whoa nelly ... i have never called for any violence nor use of arms ... violence is not the answer ... revolutions are not synonymous with violence ...

as far as OWS and the Tea Party ... there are common interests there ... but ultimately, people have to agree on what the picture is before changing it ... that's the first thing ...

polaris_x wrote:

ajedigecko wrote:

for those of you that hate the 1%....you have wanted this battle, for sometime now and it is here.

yet...you type around on the computer.

what's your point?

my point.....?

you will fly around and cross borders to see a pearl jam show, charge large amounts on pearl jam merchandise, i have read others who say they are going to quit their jobs to follow pearl jam concerts.

you have the opportunity to create or be apart of history....yet, you type around on the computer.

that is my point....hope it was simple.

FiveB247x wrote:

What a hypocrite. You know who these "bad parents" are or who's family they people come from... the Baby Boomer generation. That's right, the generation who were handed everything in a post-WW2 era where their own parents actually created suburbia and then they decided to create things like privatization, corporate culture, consumerism and greed all things to be admired in our society. I don't agree nor like the OWS group, but the more further we get away from the baby boomers, the more we recognize how selfish and self-interested they are and they are the ones causing far more problems in our nation than any group protesting in parks. The baby boomers have created the national debt and security issues we face in our nation, everyone else is just stuck with the results.

usamamasan1 wrote:

A great article by Marybeth Hicks.

WOOT

I was born in 1951 and this does not sound like an apt description of me or any peers I associate with. I wouldn't be so quick to generalize or condemn.

You don't know whats in his heart, and you don't know what else he does with his time, or do you really think that all Mr Polaris does is sit around typing?

Maybe start another thread that goes into who we all are?[/quote]

great point....now apply the same logic to the 1% that you do not know.

I think it would also be useful to point out that the boomer generation created or greatly expanded some things I assume most of us here, regardless of age, appreciate like the civil rights movement, the feminist movement, handicap rights, gay rights, solar power, computers not to mention music that would open the door and influence bands like Pearl Jam. I don't see the usefulness of bashing a generation of people my age any more than it is useful to use terms like ‘slackers’, ‘whiners’ or ‘doomers’.

But assuming what you say is true, what do you believe has been created by subsequent generations? I don't mean that facetiously. I really would like to believe generations younger that mine are creating something better. And even better yet, maybe we can all work for something better regardless of our generation.

FiveB247x wrote:

May not be you or any of your peers, but as a whole it is your generation.

brianlux wrote:

FiveB247x wrote:

What a hypocrite. You know who these "bad parents" are or who's family they people come from... the Baby Boomer generation. That's right, the generation who were handed everything in a post-WW2 era where their own parents actually created suburbia and then they decided to create things like privatization, corporate culture, consumerism and greed all things to be admired in our society. I don't agree nor like the OWS group, but the more further we get away from the baby boomers, the more we recognize how selfish and self-interested they are and they are the ones causing far more problems in our nation than any group protesting in parks. The baby boomers have created the national debt and security issues we face in our nation, everyone else is just stuck with the results.

I was born in 1951 and this does not sound like an apt description of me or any peers I associate with. I wouldn't be so quick to generalize or condemn.

Monster Rain wrote:

Was it a "plant" who slashed a police officer today, too? Were the DC protesters who knocked an old lady down concrete steps just one big group of "plants?" Why is it that when protesters turn violent, people quickly point out conspiracy theories that the violent people are plants sent in to discredit the group but nobody ever suggests that an aggressive cop in a video is a sympathizer of the protesters trying to get them sympathy and nobody ever suggests that what preceded the incident in the video but was conveniently not recorded may shed some light on what really happened such as the "victim" initiating the physicality (such as the video OWS supporters said showed the NYPD attacking them when the full video showed the "victims" raming a steel barricade into the police without any provocation)?

polaris_x wrote:

Idris wrote:

I saw a video of a female protester getting abused/roughed up by some NYPD officers, and all the other OWS protesters around did was scream "shame" "shame" "shame"...

I say shame on the protesters who stood by watching that happen, not trying to stop it. Shame indeed.

it's a PR war now ... attacking the police officer only fuels the opposition ... i wouldn't be surprised if the violence today was started by a plant ... obviously, i could be wrong as i've been to enough of these things to know there are loose cannons everywhere ... but who knows ... obviously any violence swings the PR war to the establishment ... so, not sure how OWS can win if there is any violence ...

I rarely posted in any of these occupy threads, I don't support OWS outright, I also don't want to see any NYPD or any officer hurt in that city or my city or anywhere, why would I want to see officers hurt? If I need help, I'm surely dialing 911.

But this much I just got to say, it does not matter if it is a person with a badge, a gang, a bunch of punks..whatever, Does not matter who they are, if someone is using that kind of force, such brutal force to take on a woman or a man. It is only right to get involved. Not just sing, yea? How easily one kick turns to two, and a kick in leg turns to one in the head, so to my mind anyway...Yes, I say get involved, more protesters than cops. They have no right to treat someone like that.

It could easily of been your own family member who suffers the tip of a billy club or being thrown to the ground, it could even one day be one of us, it has in some cases, and I can assure you that rubber bullets and pepper spray do no differentiate between the violent and the non violent protester.

You think the movement in India against the British was always non violent? or the struggle against apartheid South Africa was just township singing in IsiZulu? and if you or anyone else thinks that the battle for America is not like these other countries, well America, when you look at it, regardless of it's immense good, and high capacity for greatness, it's bloody hands can not be ignored, America supports dictators around the word, they have military bases, hundreds of them, secret prisons, they speak of the rule of law, but when the favor is not on their side, they turn away from that same law.

Who wants violence? Not me, I'm sure not you. But it's not just random violence trying to stop an abuse or an injustice, it is simply the right thing to do, and if they kill me trying, then fine. They will only be killing a man.

But maybe soon, and I hope not, but probability does seem high of someone being seriously injured. Maybe critically, I don't no. Let's hope not, But do you really want to be the person who stood by chanting "shame" or taking photos or just even standing watching while a cop or a group of punks or whatever beats a woman, a man, a child or any other living thing?

and btw, a barricade in this case is the provocation, the riot gear? the tear gas? what do you call that? That is the provocation.

Barricades and riot gear are not provocation. Barricades were set up to prevent protesters from interfering with other people's ability to travel through those areas and to ensure that businesses in the area were able to operate without their customers being prevented from getting there and to generally ensure safety for everyone. There is no excuse for trying to push that barricade into officers who are standing there and aren't touching you in any way. There was no provocation by those officers.

Riot gear is worn to protect the officers being sent into those situations because they just might encounter some violent people (and some have, such as the officer who was slashed yesterday). What happens when people start throwing things at the police or pushing barricades into them and they have no protective gear? There have to be at least some police in riot gear in the area because if something bad does happen and there's nobody prepared to control it then it puts other people in danger. Would you really suggest that the police wait for a riot to break out before considering ways to control it?

Idris wrote:

I rarely posted in any of these occupy threads, I don't support OWS outright, I also don't want to see any NYPD or any officer hurt in that city or my city or anywhere, why would I want to see officers hurt? If I need help, I'm surely dialing 911.

But this much I just got to say, it does not matter if it is a person with a badge, a gang, a bunch of punks..whatever, Does not matter who they are, if someone is using that kind of force, such brutal force to take on a woman or a man. It is only right to get involved. Not just sing, yea? How easily one kick turns to two, and a kick in leg turns to one in the head, so to my mind anyway...Yes, I say get involved, more protesters than cops. They have no right to treat someone like that.

It could easily of been your own family member who suffers the tip of a billy club or being thrown to the ground, it could even one day be one of us, it has in some cases, and I can assure you that rubber bullets and pepper spray do no differentiate between the violent and the non violent protester.

You think the movement in India against the British was always non violent? or the struggle against apartheid South Africa was just township singing in IsiZulu? and if you or anyone else thinks that the battle for America is not like these other countries, well America, when you look at it, regardless of it's immense good, and high capacity for greatness, it's bloody hands can not be ignored, America supports dictators around the word, they have military bases, hundreds of them, secret prisons, they speak of the rule of law, but when the favor is not on their side, they turn away from that same law.

Who wants violence? Not me, I'm sure not you. But it's not just random violence trying to stop an abuse or an injustice, it is simply the right thing to do, and if they kill me trying, then fine. They will only be killing a man.

But maybe soon, and I hope not, but probability does seem high of someone being seriously injured. Maybe critically, I don't no. Let's hope not, But do you really want to be the person who stood by chanting "shame" or taking photos or just even standing watching while a cop or a group of punks or whatever beats a woman, a man, a child or any other living thing?

and btw, a barricade in this case is the provocation, the riot gear? the tear gas? what do you call that? That is the provocation.

Jason P wrote:

I think the key is coming up with a list of ten demands that both sides can agree with. And also, an agreed course of action would need to be established that spells out the actions that will be taken if the demands are not met.

i think they have to go back and step and agree just what the heck the problem is ... sure, they both can point to gov't but that's about where the similarity ends ... i don't think anyone in the tea party attributes any of the problems to the role of corporations ...

Jason P wrote:

The list of demands would need to focus directly on the amount of power that congress has. I'll list a few and see if there is any common ground:

* Term Limits
* Severe restrictions on campaign financing
* NCAA type penalties for lobby interaction. Set rules and enforce penalties
* Balance budget amendment (I know this has become a party battleground, but come on man :geek: )

Again, the list of demands needs to have a broad focus on how much power congress has, and not necessarily the issues they are debating. I know there are smart people out there that are capable of doing this.

i agree with the goals of your demands ... however, history will show that those goals will fall by the way of regulation in that loopholes will always be made available to these groups ... it is these loopholes that highlight the need for OWS ...

we need honest and transparent gov't back ... the problem is how can you trust the gov't to fix itself when they are the problem? ...