Should welfare recipiants have to do community service?

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  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    Jeanwah wrote:
    pandora wrote:

    My point is it is better for the soul and spirit to be busy...this how we learn.

    That work is enjoyment not a punishment.

    This something the physically and mentally challenged have learned,
    to be contributing to society builds character, gives life purpose.
    It makes a person feel good to complete a challenge.

    An idle mind and body is no favor we are doing for those on welfare.

    There is proof that happiness comes from helping others, as well as helping a greater cause.
    For anyone to shoot down volunteerism for the sake of free govt handouts is nuts!
    How easy it is to forget that our very nature is to nurture and take care of each other. Not to mention, that through volunteerism, job opportunities arise, you meet new friends, and you learn empathy.
    :thumbup: someone who agrees community service is a positive thing! :D
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    pandora wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:
    pandora wrote:

    My point is it is better for the soul and spirit to be busy...this how we learn.

    That work is enjoyment not a punishment.

    This something the physically and mentally challenged have learned,
    to be contributing to society builds character, gives life purpose.
    It makes a person feel good to complete a challenge.

    An idle mind and body is no favor we are doing for those on welfare.

    There is proof that happiness comes from helping others, as well as helping a greater cause.
    For anyone to shoot down volunteerism for the sake of free govt handouts is nuts!
    How easy it is to forget that our very nature is to nurture and take care of each other. Not to mention, that through volunteerism, job opportunities arise, you meet new friends, and you learn empathy.
    :thumbup: someone who agrees community service is a positive thing! :D

    :D I just can't imagine it ever to be a 'bad' thing. For anyone.
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    HeidiJam wrote:
    inmytree wrote:
    Who do you think keeps track of current volunteers? Or do they all just show up and do whatever they want? It could be as simple as a badge/id/sign in sheet at the place of community service commitment

    huh...what are you talking about...?

    you proposed something, act as if it's all simple, then type some gibberish...

    how much do you think this program will actually cost...?
    Like I said before how would it work any differently than current volunteer programs. It seems pretty simple to me. I don't see where the confusion is, what are you have a hard time understanding?[/quote]

    if you add 1000's of people to the mix of "community service" those running those agencies will be overwhelmed and unable to manage...I guess that's hard for some to understand...I love how you think this is so simple...

    do you feel those corporations that receive corporate welfare should be included in your proposal or just the lazy bums...?
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    cincybearcat wrote:
    inmytree wrote:
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Like title says, should people receiving welfare benefits be required to do community service? Think about it, no one is spending 40+ hours a week looking for jobs/work. What about requiring them to do 20-30 hours of community service a week given out by the local city. It would be a good way to give an incentive to find work. It could also save some tax payer money. Maybe some of those poor innercity areas would not look so bad if all the people on welfare were required to clean the areas up, maintain the playgrounds. What do you think?

    if you included corporations who get public dollars via tax breaks and subsidies, then I'm all for it...

    it really sounds like you're wanting a public works program, which is very FDR of you...

    I wonder how those who are disabled, both physically and mentally, fit into your proposed public works program...

    Pretty sure most of the disabled people would find it pretty offensive that you seem to think they can't do anything. ;)


    I hope you and yours are well my friend... :D
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    Jeanwah wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Exactly why is the question asked (the title of the thread) so ridiculous to some of you here?
    I agree; I'm :shock:ed that people would jump to the defense rather than actually provide a bit of help towards their communities.

    while the question may seem simple, there are many layers...

    anyway, I say fine, let's force all who receive welfare to go pick up garbage...

    and if they don't toss them in the streets...those lazy bums...
  • FiveB247x
    FiveB247x Posts: 2,330
    Cincy here's exactly why this is such a screwed up country. The same people who vow for tighter regulation of these programs aren't really out to put people back to work - it boils down to nothing but scapegoating them cause "they're sucking up my tax dollars by sitting on their asses and collecting checks". If we instituted your below idea, people on benefits in need of assistance and put them to work for the government, many call this "socialism" and that is a terrible thing to many. That's the reality of politics and society in the US, we're not here to fix things, just hand out blame cause it's all got to be someone else's fault.
    cincybearcat wrote:
    You do realize you could train some of them to operate a daycare or an after school program, etc?
    CONservative governMENt

    Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
  • whygohome
    whygohome Posts: 2,305
    To answer the OP's question. YES. But more importantly, these programs NEED TO BE REGULATED. Unemployment fraud, welfare fraud, medicaid fraud, medicare fraud, all cost the nation hundreds of billions of dollars a year.

    http://www.stopmedicarefraud.gov/index.html
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/ ... 4390.shtml
    http://www.hhs.gov/asl/testify/2009/05/t20090506d.html
    http://www.dss.cahwnet.gov/fraud/pg270.htm

    enough is enough
  • whygohome
    whygohome Posts: 2,305
    And then I just found this:

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110217/us_ ... care_fraud


    U.S. charges 111 in largest Medicare fraud crackdown
    Thu Feb 17, 3:52 pm ET

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) – The U.S. government on Thursday charged 111 doctors, nurses and other defendants with Medicare crime schemes that exceeded $225 million in false billings, the largest health care fraud crackdown so far.

    Attorney General Eric Holder and Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius announced the charges in the latest of a series of cases brought by the Obama administration as health care fraud has emerged as an important political issue.

    About 45 million elderly and disabled Americans are enrolled in taxpayer-funded Medicare plans, which have come under fire from critics who say the government pays too much to the companies running them and that they are subject to fraud.

    Medicare reform represented a key part of the sweeping year-old health care law championed by Democratic President Barack Obama, but opposed by many Republicans in Congress.

    The latest charges covered defendants in nine cities. In addition to arrests, law enforcement agents also executed 16 search warrants.

    The defendants were charged various crimes, including conspiracy to defraud the Medicare program, false claims, kickbacks and money laundering, administration officials said.

    They said the alleged schemes involved various medical treatments, tests and services, such as home health care, physical and occupational therapy and medical equipment.

    "Although today marks a critical step forward in combating and deterring illegal activity, our work is far from over," Holder said. Fraud has accounted for as much as an estimated $60 billion a year in the Medicare program.

    A top FBI official, Shawn Henry, said 2,600 health care fraud cases were under investigation and that organized crime groups have been increasingly linked to the alleged schemes.

    Sebelius said $4 billion was recovered last year, and the government's Medicare Fraud Strike Force was recently expanded to nine cities, with the addition of Dallas and Chicago.

    (Reporting by James Vicini; Editing by Cynthia Osterman)
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Like title says, should people receiving welfare benefits be required to do community service? Think about it, no one is spending 40+ hours a week looking for jobs/work. What about requiring them to do 20-30 hours of community service a week given out by the local city. It would be a good way to give an incentive to find work. It could also save some tax payer money. Maybe some of those poor innercity areas would not look so bad if all the people on welfare were required to clean the areas up, maintain the playgrounds. What do you think?


    why doesnt the city employ someone to maintain the playgrounds and clean the streets? why should it fall to welfare recipients?


    years ago street cleaning and playground maintainence were actual jobs.. but since due to 'budget constraints' these basic jobs have been curtailed or even eliminated. and now the city looks towards a cheap alternative. one they dont necessarily have to pay for.
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  • JOEJOEJOE
    JOEJOEJOE Posts: 10,829
    catefrances wrote:
    HeidiJam wrote:
    Like title says, should people receiving welfare benefits be required to do community service? Think about it, no one is spending 40+ hours a week looking for jobs/work. What about requiring them to do 20-30 hours of community service a week given out by the local city. It would be a good way to give an incentive to find work. It could also save some tax payer money. Maybe some of those poor innercity areas would not look so bad if all the people on welfare were required to clean the areas up, maintain the playgrounds. What do you think?


    why doesnt the city employ someone to maintain the playgrounds and clean the streets? why should it fall to welfare recipients?


    years ago street cleaning and playground maintainence were actual jobs.. but since due to 'budget constraints' these basic jobs have been curtailed or even eliminated. and now the city looks towards a cheap alternative. one they dont necessarily have to pay for.

    1. many countries are in a recession, so there are less tax dollars to fund city services

    2. many cities are in bankruptcy, so they can't hire new people

    3. many cities shower their employees with above-market-value compensation, benefits & pensions, as a result, cities can't afford to hire additional employees

    4. Politics!

    The system is broke, and it was made that way by everyone....rich and poor!

    Fix the game so the players can't play!
  • gabers
    gabers Posts: 2,787
    I remember my American Government teacher making the case for this in high school like 20 years ago. It makes sense to me after a pre-determined length of time has passed and they still haven't found employment. They may bitch about it but I bet it will make them feel just a slight bit better about their situation if they know they are at least "working for" the money.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    gabers wrote:
    I remember my American Government teacher making the case for this in high school like 20 years ago. It makes sense to me after a pre-determined length of time has passed and they still haven't found employment. They may bitch about it but I bet it will make them feel just a slight bit better about their situation if they know they are at least "working for" the money.


    yeah im sure id feel really great about my 'situation' having to pick up trash other arseholes have dropped cause they have no sense of pride in their community.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • _
    _ Posts: 6,657
    A. Many people on welfare already work harder than the rest of us.

    B. If we think they should do it because it's so good for the soul, then we should make everyone do it.
  • haffajappa
    haffajappa British Columbia Posts: 5,955
    HeidiJam wrote:
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    how do you propose these poor and "minorities" pay for a college education when the cost of college is skyrocketing and they barely have neough money to pay rent and buy food and keep the lights on??? think about what you are saying, because if it was that easy everyone would do it. in 5 years they come out, maybe can't find a career immediately, yet they have that massive loan payement to start paying on 6 months after graduation.

    by the way, hey republicans, it has been a few months since you got your mandate, where the fuck are the jobs??
    Haven't you heard anybody can go to college
    i hadn't heard that.....
    live pearl jam is best pearl jam
  • haffajappa
    haffajappa British Columbia Posts: 5,955
    pandora wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:
    pandora wrote:

    My point is it is better for the soul and spirit to be busy...this how we learn.

    That work is enjoyment not a punishment.

    This something the physically and mentally challenged have learned,
    to be contributing to society builds character, gives life purpose.
    It makes a person feel good to complete a challenge.

    An idle mind and body is no favor we are doing for those on welfare.

    There is proof that happiness comes from helping others, as well as helping a greater cause.
    For anyone to shoot down volunteerism for the sake of free govt handouts is nuts!
    How easy it is to forget that our very nature is to nurture and take care of each other. Not to mention, that through volunteerism, job opportunities arise, you meet new friends, and you learn empathy.
    :thumbup: someone who agrees community service is a positive thing! :D
    I never said that it wasn't....... or at least never meant to :?
    live pearl jam is best pearl jam
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    haffajappa wrote:

    This is very true.
    The problem is those who are abusing the system often feel an unnecessary entitlement... As if everyone owes it to them to pay them while they sit and choose not to work. In that sense, I'm not sure if those that are just lazy would get much out of it...
    And to that extent I actually kind of understand what Heidijam is saying...

    Maybe not a universal rule but its a good idea I think, although hard to administer. As gimme and others have said, the welfare system includes many people who actually need it as well as those who abuse it.


    Oh no you didn't say you were against the idea


    I replied


    Those who feel an entitlement or are lazy may not get anything out of it
    but the community will and in time most likely the welfare recipient won't be able to keep from taking away positives, it is a positive builder. They may just want to find employment or may find some in their journey.

    Those who have a genuine need may get a lot out of it because it is an opportunity for personal growth and understanding of others.

    I find it odd that it is looked on as a punishment by so many here...try it you might like it.


    I think it would be worth a try at a program like that and their are many opportunities besides picking up trash to those who seem to think that is the only community service available.
  • pjhawks
    pjhawks Posts: 12,956
    _ wrote:
    A. Many people on welfare already work harder than the rest of us.

    B. If we think they should do it because it's so good for the soul, then we should make everyone do it.

    not sure where you live but i'd love to find the place where 'welfare' recipients are working harder than the rest of us. frankly that's just insulting to someone who works 40-60 hours a week, every week. and don't use the excuse that many of them are single mothers or whatever. can't afford children then put a damn condom on.
  • Jeanwah
    Jeanwah Posts: 6,363
    pjhawks wrote:
    _ wrote:
    A. Many people on welfare already work harder than the rest of us.

    B. If we think they should do it because it's so good for the soul, then we should make everyone do it.

    not sure where you live but i'd love to find the place where 'welfare' recipients are working harder than the rest of us. frankly that's just insulting to someone who works 40-60 hours a week, every week. and don't use the excuse that many of them are single mothers or whatever. can't afford children then put a damn condom on.

    She may mean that they work hard to survive more than the rest. That still doesn't mean that helping out in the community is a bad idea. Opportunity and goodness arises from helping others.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    pjhawks wrote:
    _ wrote:
    A. Many people on welfare already work harder than the rest of us.

    B. If we think they should do it because it's so good for the soul, then we should make everyone do it.

    not sure where you live but i'd love to find the place where 'welfare' recipients are working harder than the rest of us. frankly that's just insulting to someone who works 40-60 hours a week, every week. and don't use the excuse that many of them are single mothers or whatever. can't afford children then put a damn condom on.
    I agree pjhawks on both counts.

    My son who is 27, works beside his father in our printing company for
    as much as 60 hours a week.
    His taxes, being single and childless is outrageously high ... $400 per week!

    He is responsible and has chosen and been careful not to become a father yet,
    although he could afford to.
    But all in good time, there is no rush.

    Where as, there are people who choose to bring kids into the world
    that they know they can not support...but they think that is ok because they know
    the govt/ hardworking tax payer will pay.

    This very frustrating to the hard working taxpayer who is living responsibly.

    And " -"....
    I think it is a nice idea to ask everyone to experience a
    little volunteerism in their life... don't you? We can all use more sense of community.

    If an able body welfare recipient is sitting idle
    only good can come from a program that gives him something to do,
    challenges, builds self esteem and gets him out in the community in a positive way.
  • Blockhead
    Blockhead Posts: 1,538
    So let me make sure I am getting this straight... Its NOT Ok to FORCE people who receive welfare benefits to contribute to society in a way of community service, but it IS ok to FORCE people to use their own hard earned money to pay into a system that only contributes to people who can't take care of their own basic needs of their life and their family (and continue to have kids with no punishment)??? Is that what I am hearing?
    A progam like this is would have only a positive outcome. It would be a great way to clean some of these innercity areas, (and we all know that when you take care of something and work hard at that, you tend to continually take care of that.) It would also be a great way to unite the community, help make those areas kid friendly. It would also be a great way to lean a trade, the program could eventually evolve into a partner program with local companies and my turn simple community service into a job.

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