Crowd was awesome for the first few innings. The Sanchez chants were the loudest I have ever heard at that park and everyone in the place was fired up. No idea where you were that it wasn't loud or rowdy but it was an awesome atmosphere until they started shitting the bed.
saturday was awful. just plain awful. the crowd was lame too.
nothing will ever compare to 2008. nothing
Maybe where you were. Crowd seemed fired up to me. Maybe it was because I was fired up. It was '08 loud. Well, until Uribe's homer. And I fully take credit for the Sanchez chants. Yes, that's right, me.
I was in 204. In an elimination game people should be up off their asses every time there's 2 strikes on a hitter. In 08 it was like a party every time the phils got an out...didn't matter what inning it was.
I'm still extremely bitter. About pretty much everything that happened on saturday night. Especially the performance of the $125 million man
saturday was awful. just plain awful. the crowd was lame too.
nothing will ever compare to 2008. nothing
Maybe where you were. Crowd seemed fired up to me. Maybe it was because I was fired up. It was '08 loud. Well, until Uribe's homer. And I fully take credit for the Sanchez chants. Yes, that's right, me.
I was in 204. In an elimination game people should be up off their asses every time there's 2 strikes on a hitter. In 08 it was like a party every time the phils got an out...didn't matter what inning it was.
I'm still extremely bitter. About pretty much everything that happened on saturday night. Especially the performance of the $125 million man
Today, I started to feel a little better. Just a little. Like I said earlier to the Howard slurper - my problem with him was leaving the bat on his shoulder for the last pitch of the game. That's unacceptable. Also that was unacceptable was not sending Jimmy on Ryan's double, Francisco not manufacturing a run, not putting up more runs in that 1st inning, Shane getting doubled up, and the whole team in general not taking advantage of a San Fran manager playing scared and getting into their pen in the 3rd. A LOT went wrong. This series was all about mistakes and whether the Giants were capable of taking advantage of them. And of course they did. And that's what they deserve credit for - and nothing to take away from their squad, but we lost this series more than they won it. Hence the mistakes.
All I know is all professional athletes are selfish rich pricks. And because of that - Rollins = contract year. Think it's going to be a good one.
And, yes, I was calling this the '02 Tampa NFC Champ game. And boom. Just way too much overconfidence both locally and nationally. Too much expectancy and not enough wanting.
The Sanchez chants rivaled the CC chants. All I know is I was almost out of gas by the 5th inning. My head hurt like if I was at a PJ show screaming every word. Full rush of blood to the head every time. Thought I was going to pass out.
Today, I started to feel a little better. Just a little. Like I said earlier to the Howard slurper - my problem with him was leaving the bat on his shoulder for the last pitch of the game. That's unacceptable. Also that was unacceptable was not sending Jimmy on Ryan's double, Francisco not manufacturing a run, not putting up more runs in that 1st inning, Shane getting doubled up, and the whole team in general not taking advantage of a San Fran manager playing scared and getting into their pen in the 3rd. A LOT went wrong. This series was all about mistakes and whether the Giants were capable of taking advantage of them. And of course they did. And that's what they deserve credit for - and nothing to take away from their squad, but we lost this series more than they won it. Hence the mistakes.
All I know is all professional athletes are selfish rich pricks. And because of that - Rollins = contract year. Think it's going to be a good one.
And, yes, I was calling this the '02 Tampa NFC Champ game. And boom. Just way too much overconfidence both locally and nationally. Too much expectancy and not enough wanting.
SF played and managed better. the phils didn't hit or catch the ball...other than that they were great.
I agreed that fans were too overconfident about this team.
I won't feel better until spring training starts. I didn't even care about watching the eagles game yesterday. I watched it, but I wasn't fully vested in caring about what happened.
Oh, and to the schlep Mets & Boston fans who act like the rest of the country wants to see SF/Tex, you have no idea what you're talking about. Yeah, I don't care about this stuff, but I feel like being an idiot and telling them they're wrong. A buddy of mine was in a suite with exec's from Fox. Guy said they were praying for NY/Philly, and if not that, then Philly/Tex. From a business standpoint, they're a little pissed at this matchup. The people of SF or DFW shouldn't care either the way, but for all the other deliberate haters just check out http://www.sportsmediawatch.net/ after the series. I'll bet my left AND right testicle that these ratings are lower.
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The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,444
Today, I started to feel a little better. Just a little. Like I said earlier to the Howard slurper - my problem with him was leaving the bat on his shoulder for the last pitch of the game. That's unacceptable. Also that was unacceptable was not sending Jimmy on Ryan's double, Francisco not manufacturing a run, not putting up more runs in that 1st inning, Shane getting doubled up, and the whole team in general not taking advantage of a San Fran manager playing scared and getting into their pen in the 3rd. A LOT went wrong. This series was all about mistakes and whether the Giants were capable of taking advantage of them. And of course they did. And that's what they deserve credit for - and nothing to take away from their squad, but we lost this series more than they won it. Hence the mistakes.
All I know is all professional athletes are selfish rich pricks. And because of that - Rollins = contract year. Think it's going to be a good one.
And, yes, I was calling this the '02 Tampa NFC Champ game. And boom. Just way too much overconfidence both locally and nationally. Too much expectancy and not enough wanting.
SF played and managed better. the phils didn't hit or catch the ball...other than that they were great.
I agreed that fans were too overconfident about this team.
I won't feel better until spring training starts. I didn't even care about watching the eagles game yesterday. I watched it, but I wasn't fully vested in caring about what happened.
Just a horrendous weekend
honestly they had every right to be super confident going in. if the phils played like they were capable of, we'd be getting fired up for the series right now. best record in baseball, odds on favorites to win the whole thing, and all the rest--that kind of stuff should breed confidence. only thing i was concerned about is our inane ability to go into a slump at the drop of a hat and it happened. that's baseball. point is this is post 2008. in '08 i shed my inferiority complex and really don't intend on getting it back.
Today, I started to feel a little better. Just a little. Like I said earlier to the Howard slurper - my problem with him was leaving the bat on his shoulder for the last pitch of the game. That's unacceptable. Also that was unacceptable was not sending Jimmy on Ryan's double, Francisco not manufacturing a run, not putting up more runs in that 1st inning, Shane getting doubled up, and the whole team in general not taking advantage of a San Fran manager playing scared and getting into their pen in the 3rd. A LOT went wrong. This series was all about mistakes and whether the Giants were capable of taking advantage of them. And of course they did. And that's what they deserve credit for - and nothing to take away from their squad, but we lost this series more than they won it. Hence the mistakes.
All I know is all professional athletes are selfish rich pricks. And because of that - Rollins = contract year. Think it's going to be a good one.
And, yes, I was calling this the '02 Tampa NFC Champ game. And boom. Just way too much overconfidence both locally and nationally. Too much expectancy and not enough wanting.
SF played and managed better. the phils didn't hit or catch the ball...other than that they were great.
I agreed that fans were too overconfident about this team.
I won't feel better until spring training starts. I didn't even care about watching the eagles game yesterday. I watched it, but I wasn't fully vested in caring about what happened.
Just a horrendous weekend
honestly they had every right to be super confident going in. if the phils played like they were capable of, we'd be getting fired up for the series right now. best record in baseball, odds on favorites to win the whole thing, and all the rest--that kind of stuff should breed confidence. only thing i was concerned about is our inane ability to go into a slump at the drop of a hat and it happened. that's baseball. point is this is post 2008. in '08 i shed my inferiority complex and really don't intend on getting it back.
Who said anything about an inferiority complex? That has nothing to do with anything.
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The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,444
SF played and managed better. the phils didn't hit or catch the ball...other than that they were great.
I agreed that fans were too overconfident about this team.
I won't feel better until spring training starts. I didn't even care about watching the eagles game yesterday. I watched it, but I wasn't fully vested in caring about what happened.
Just a horrendous weekend
honestly they had every right to be super confident going in. if the phils played like they were capable of, we'd be getting fired up for the series right now. best record in baseball, odds on favorites to win the whole thing, and all the rest--that kind of stuff should breed confidence. only thing i was concerned about is our inane ability to go into a slump at the drop of a hat and it happened. that's baseball. point is this is post 2008. in '08 i shed my inferiority complex and really don't intend on getting it back.
Who said anything about an inferiority complex? That has nothing to do with anything.
maybe that's the wrong word. all i'm trying to say is birds fans in '02 and phils fans this year should have been super confident heading into the playoffs. hindsight is 20-20 but both teams choked. both would have and should have won had they played to their capabilities.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; WF Center 10/21/13; WF Center 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; WF Center 4/28/16; WF Center 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
I have to say, a small part of me is happy to see Cliff Lee make it farther in the playoffs than the Phillies, after that stupid trade. Sorry if that makes me a bad fan.
Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; WF Center 10/21/13; WF Center 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; WF Center 4/28/16; WF Center 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
I have to say, a small part of me is happy to see Cliff Lee make it farther in the playoffs than the Phillies, after that stupid trade. Sorry if that makes me a bad fan.
as good as oswalt is ...stupid trade in that you could have kept him
i post on the board of a band that doesn't exsist anymore .......i need my head examined.......
I keep seeing the phils attached to jeff francouer. If this team signs that turd I will blow up CBP (as long as I know amaro is in the building).
'why don't they put OBP on the scoreboard if it's so important.' dumbest dude in MLB...and he swings at everything. god, he's almost as bad as howard's contract.
I keep seeing the phils attached to jeff francouer. If this team signs that turd I will blow up CBP (as long as I know amaro is in the building).
'why don't they put OBP on the scoreboard if it's so important.' dumbest dude in MLB...and he swings at everything. god, he's almost as bad as howard's contract.
as dumb as putting a threat, whether real or imagined, in writing on the internet. and don't worry some team is going to give Jayson Werth a contract worse than Howard's - if anyone signs him for more than 4 years at 16+ million they are crazy. very nice player but not worth the numbers and years being throw around at this time.
I keep seeing the phils attached to jeff francouer. If this team signs that turd I will blow up CBP (as long as I know amaro is in the building).
'why don't they put OBP on the scoreboard if it's so important.' dumbest dude in MLB...and he swings at everything. god, he's almost as bad as howard's contract.
as dumb as putting a threat, whether real or imagined, in writing on the internet. and don't worry some team is going to give Jayson Werth a contract worse than Howard's - if anyone signs him for more than 4 years at 16+ million they are crazy. very nice player but not worth the numbers and years being throw around at this time.
I agree that werth is gonna get overpaid. I would have much rather seen the phils overpay werth and/or hamels than howard though. Like I've said a million times before...howard does one thing well. If he's not doing that (like the last 3 playoff series), he is worthless.
I will lose my mind if they sign Francoeur. Just looking at the list of guys out there, the people I'd go after are - Cuddyer, Andruw Jones, Mag Ordonez, Nady, Podsednik, and that's about it. It may be worth getting a bargain deal on Melk Cabrera too. Dude played well in a small ballpark and came up with a lot of walk off/clutch hits with the Yanks since he wasn't no where near relied upon there like they hoped he would in ATL. I like Cuddyer because he can play a bunch of positions and I think he would rake in this park. Just wonder about injuries, and how much he would ask for.
I will lose my mind if they sign Francoeur. Just looking at the list of guys out there, the people I'd go after are - Cuddyer, Andruw Jones, Mag Ordonez, Nady, Podsednik, and that's about it. It may be worth getting a bargain deal on Melk Cabrera too. Dude played well in a small ballpark and came up with a lot of walk off/clutch hits with the Yanks since he wasn't no where near relied upon there like they hoped he would in ATL. I like Cuddyer because he can play a bunch of positions and I think he would rake in this park. Just wonder about injuries, and how much he would ask for.
there really aren't many appealing guys out there. the three names I've seen the phils linked to the most in the last week are francouer, cody ross, and matt diaz. so it looks like it's gonna be the pu pu platter in the OF this year.
the ibanez and howard contracts just kill them financially.
also, I just read that amaro threw in a full no trade clause when he signed ibanez. I want Ibanez's agent negotiating my next contract. He probably could have worn #20 if he really wanted
I will lose my mind if they sign Francoeur. Just looking at the list of guys out there, the people I'd go after are - Cuddyer, Andruw Jones, Mag Ordonez, Nady, Podsednik, and that's about it. It may be worth getting a bargain deal on Melk Cabrera too. Dude played well in a small ballpark and came up with a lot of walk off/clutch hits with the Yanks since he wasn't no where near relied upon there like they hoped he would in ATL. I like Cuddyer because he can play a bunch of positions and I think he would rake in this park. Just wonder about injuries, and how much he would ask for.
there really aren't many appealing guys out there. the three names I've seen the phils linked to the most in the last week are francouer, cody ross, and matt diaz. so it looks like it's gonna be the pu pu platter in the OF this year.
the ibanez and howard contracts just kill them financially.
Yeah, I don't mind Ross, but Diaz would be nice too - like how he takes the ball the other way. I think too many people make a big deal about someone "protecting" Howard. As long as you can get a platoon of guys to produce 25-ish homers from RF then you're fine. Plus, I don't think ANYONE can do worse than Werth did this past year with guys in scoring position.
I will lose my mind if they sign Francoeur. Just looking at the list of guys out there, the people I'd go after are - Cuddyer, Andruw Jones, Mag Ordonez, Nady, Podsednik, and that's about it. It may be worth getting a bargain deal on Melk Cabrera too. Dude played well in a small ballpark and came up with a lot of walk off/clutch hits with the Yanks since he wasn't no where near relied upon there like they hoped he would in ATL. I like Cuddyer because he can play a bunch of positions and I think he would rake in this park. Just wonder about injuries, and how much he would ask for.
there really aren't many appealing guys out there. the three names I've seen the phils linked to the most in the last week are francouer, cody ross, and matt diaz. so it looks like it's gonna be the pu pu platter in the OF this year.
the ibanez and howard contracts just kill them financially.
Yeah, I don't mind Ross, but Diaz would be nice too - like how he takes the ball the other way. I think too many people make a big deal about someone "protecting" Howard. As long as you can get a platoon of guys to produce 25-ish homers from RF then you're fine. Plus, I don't think ANYONE can do worse than Werth did this past year with guys in scoring position.
Werth was probably their best offensive player this year. And he's well rounded as a player, so it will hurt not having him in RF.
I do agree that as long as you platoon the right guys, they will be fine. That's the same argument I used when talking about first base, which is the easiest position in baseball to replace.
I'm gonna be bitter every offseason until 2018 because of what that contract does to their ability to make moves and sign more productive players. so fucking annoying
Best offensive player? That's not saying much for this year. Plus, I'm giving that nod to Chooch.
Dude, the guy hit 100 something with RISP. The dude padded his stats with what will help him get a contract. Teams can't deny avg., homers, and ribbies when signing a guy - even if they're flawed stats. He one of only a few players to stay healthy all year though. Also, I really wouldn't be surprised if they worked something out to bring him back, but I'm not holding my breath.
I think Ibanez and Rollins have bounce back years.
Best offensive player? That's not saying much for this year. Plus, I'm giving that nod to Chooch.
Dude, the guy hit 100 something with RISP. The dude padded his stats with what will help him get a contract. Teams can't deny avg., homers, and ribbies when signing a guy - even if they're flawed stats. He one of only a few players to stay healthy all year though. Also, I really wouldn't be surprised if they worked something out to bring him back, but I'm not holding my breath.
I think Ibanez and Rollins have bounce back years.
There have been studies on fangraphs.com that show that BA w/RISP is a fluke stat...there's no correlation to a players BA w/RISP from year to year.
Chooch was good this year, but he hits 8th. If I had to guess, I'd say werth's OPS was higher.
Rollins can't be any worse. I think ibanez can and will be worse.
Should be an interesting offseason. I think the chances of werth coming back are less than 5%. Who knows though...amaro has proven he loves overpaying for free agents (and even worse, guys that will be free agents in 2 years. he should be fired for that contract alone)
Best offensive player? That's not saying much for this year. Plus, I'm giving that nod to Chooch.
Dude, the guy hit 100 something with RISP. The dude padded his stats with what will help him get a contract. Teams can't deny avg., homers, and ribbies when signing a guy - even if they're flawed stats. He one of only a few players to stay healthy all year though. Also, I really wouldn't be surprised if they worked something out to bring him back, but I'm not holding my breath.
I think Ibanez and Rollins have bounce back years.
There have been studies on fangraphs.com that show that BA w/RISP is a fluke stat...there's no correlation to a players BA w/RISP from year to year.
Chooch was good this year, but he hits 8th. If I had to guess, I'd say werth's OPS was higher.
Rollins can't be any worse. I think ibanez can and will be worse.
Should be an interesting offseason. I think the chances of werth coming back are less than 5%. Who knows though...amaro has proven he loves overpaying for free agents (and even worse, guys that will be free agents in 2 years. he should be fired for that contract alone)
Dude, I'm a proponent of stats, but don't nerd it up even further. An ENTIRE season of hitting below the mendoza line with RISP is damn well indicative of something. Do me a favor and look up Werth's numbers from June on. I bet they're uuuuuugly. If it wasn't for his blazing start, his numbers are absolutely hollow. If anything, I'll go out on a limb and say the biggest benefactor of this lineup over the last three years is Werth. If he's depended upon to be the 3 hole or 4 hole hitter in a lineup will be disappointed.
Hitting 8th in an NL lineup is the most difficult place to hit - you're given nothing but junk to hit. Chooch's on-base was .400 I think and hit around .300. And all I can ever remember of anything this year, is him coming through in the clutch.
Comments
I was in 204. In an elimination game people should be up off their asses every time there's 2 strikes on a hitter. In 08 it was like a party every time the phils got an out...didn't matter what inning it was.
I'm still extremely bitter. About pretty much everything that happened on saturday night. Especially the performance of the $125 million man
Not even close. The 'Eva' Chants in '08 were 2,000 times louder
scoring 2 in the first was the b mitch return and staley run up the middle for 6...
the following 6 innings--bats go to sleep just like the birds offense did...
uribe's homer = joe jurviscious running untouched all through our defense.
howard striking out looking: f@cking ronde barber.
then: dead silence.
doesn't hurt as much b/c of '08....but kinda creepy how alike the two games were.
right now at cowboys stadium all you hear is: "let's go rangers." idiot fans exist everywhere. not just here.
Today, I started to feel a little better. Just a little. Like I said earlier to the Howard slurper - my problem with him was leaving the bat on his shoulder for the last pitch of the game. That's unacceptable. Also that was unacceptable was not sending Jimmy on Ryan's double, Francisco not manufacturing a run, not putting up more runs in that 1st inning, Shane getting doubled up, and the whole team in general not taking advantage of a San Fran manager playing scared and getting into their pen in the 3rd. A LOT went wrong. This series was all about mistakes and whether the Giants were capable of taking advantage of them. And of course they did. And that's what they deserve credit for - and nothing to take away from their squad, but we lost this series more than they won it. Hence the mistakes.
All I know is all professional athletes are selfish rich pricks. And because of that - Rollins = contract year. Think it's going to be a good one.
And, yes, I was calling this the '02 Tampa NFC Champ game. And boom. Just way too much overconfidence both locally and nationally. Too much expectancy and not enough wanting.
SF played and managed better. the phils didn't hit or catch the ball...other than that they were great.
I agreed that fans were too overconfident about this team.
I won't feel better until spring training starts. I didn't even care about watching the eagles game yesterday. I watched it, but I wasn't fully vested in caring about what happened.
Just a horrendous weekend
honestly they had every right to be super confident going in. if the phils played like they were capable of, we'd be getting fired up for the series right now. best record in baseball, odds on favorites to win the whole thing, and all the rest--that kind of stuff should breed confidence. only thing i was concerned about is our inane ability to go into a slump at the drop of a hat and it happened. that's baseball. point is this is post 2008. in '08 i shed my inferiority complex and really don't intend on getting it back.
Who said anything about an inferiority complex? That has nothing to do with anything.
maybe that's the wrong word. all i'm trying to say is birds fans in '02 and phils fans this year should have been super confident heading into the playoffs. hindsight is 20-20 but both teams choked. both would have and should have won had they played to their capabilities.
eh whatever. its a moooo point now
http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2010/1 ... lose-call/
Wow. That's crazy. Large hunk of metal hurdling through the air - well, that's how my dad looks at it and why hasn't flown since being in the Army.
JC Romero - option declined. He's outta here! Later GNC Man.
Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; WF Center 4/28/16; WF Center 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18;
Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
I have to say, a small part of me is happy to see Cliff Lee make it farther in the playoffs than the Phillies, after that stupid trade. Sorry if that makes me a bad fan.
Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; WF Center 4/28/16; WF Center 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18;
Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24
Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
as good as oswalt is ...stupid trade in that you could have kept him
'why don't they put OBP on the scoreboard if it's so important.' dumbest dude in MLB...and he swings at everything. god, he's almost as bad as howard's contract.
as dumb as putting a threat, whether real or imagined, in writing on the internet. and don't worry some team is going to give Jayson Werth a contract worse than Howard's - if anyone signs him for more than 4 years at 16+ million they are crazy. very nice player but not worth the numbers and years being throw around at this time.
I agree that werth is gonna get overpaid. I would have much rather seen the phils overpay werth and/or hamels than howard though. Like I've said a million times before...howard does one thing well. If he's not doing that (like the last 3 playoff series), he is worthless.
luckily the phils only have him for 7 more years
there really aren't many appealing guys out there. the three names I've seen the phils linked to the most in the last week are francouer, cody ross, and matt diaz. so it looks like it's gonna be the pu pu platter in the OF this year.
the ibanez and howard contracts just kill them financially.
Yeah, I don't mind Ross, but Diaz would be nice too - like how he takes the ball the other way. I think too many people make a big deal about someone "protecting" Howard. As long as you can get a platoon of guys to produce 25-ish homers from RF then you're fine. Plus, I don't think ANYONE can do worse than Werth did this past year with guys in scoring position.
Werth was probably their best offensive player this year. And he's well rounded as a player, so it will hurt not having him in RF.
I do agree that as long as you platoon the right guys, they will be fine. That's the same argument I used when talking about first base, which is the easiest position in baseball to replace.
I'm gonna be bitter every offseason until 2018 because of what that contract does to their ability to make moves and sign more productive players. so fucking annoying
Dude, the guy hit 100 something with RISP. The dude padded his stats with what will help him get a contract. Teams can't deny avg., homers, and ribbies when signing a guy - even if they're flawed stats. He one of only a few players to stay healthy all year though. Also, I really wouldn't be surprised if they worked something out to bring him back, but I'm not holding my breath.
I think Ibanez and Rollins have bounce back years.
There have been studies on fangraphs.com that show that BA w/RISP is a fluke stat...there's no correlation to a players BA w/RISP from year to year.
Chooch was good this year, but he hits 8th. If I had to guess, I'd say werth's OPS was higher.
Rollins can't be any worse. I think ibanez can and will be worse.
Should be an interesting offseason. I think the chances of werth coming back are less than 5%. Who knows though...amaro has proven he loves overpaying for free agents (and even worse, guys that will be free agents in 2 years. he should be fired for that contract alone)
Dude, I'm a proponent of stats, but don't nerd it up even further. An ENTIRE season of hitting below the mendoza line with RISP is damn well indicative of something. Do me a favor and look up Werth's numbers from June on. I bet they're uuuuuugly. If it wasn't for his blazing start, his numbers are absolutely hollow. If anything, I'll go out on a limb and say the biggest benefactor of this lineup over the last three years is Werth. If he's depended upon to be the 3 hole or 4 hole hitter in a lineup will be disappointed.
Hitting 8th in an NL lineup is the most difficult place to hit - you're given nothing but junk to hit. Chooch's on-base was .400 I think and hit around .300. And all I can ever remember of anything this year, is him coming through in the clutch.