History of the Downfall of PJ in Popular Culture

1356

Comments

  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    Taft wrote:
    It is hard to remember this, but during the time between Vitalogy and No Code was when Pearl Jam lost (intentionally I would argue) its reign as biggest band in the world.
    I just hope Hootie and the Flowfish didn't overthrown their reign. God I hope not. :mad:
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • dirtyT
    dirtyT Posts: 3,620
    Get_Right wrote:
    if PJ is on a down fall
    why am I being shut out of shows for the first tour in 12 years?
    Right, if they went on a downfall, how in the hell have they consistantly sold out 20,000+ seat venues and headline huge festivals, and share the stage with acts such as the Stone, Neil Young, and U2?
    Cuyahoga Falls 98, Columbus 00, Cleveland 03, Columbus 03, Toledo 04, Grand Rapids 04, Kitchener 05, Cleveland 06, Cincinnati 06, Washington DC 08, Philadelphia IV 09, Columbus 10, Cleveland 10, Chicago 13, Pittsburgh 13, Cincinnati 14, Chicago (1) 16, Chicago (2) 16
  • dirtyT
    dirtyT Posts: 3,620
    LongRd. wrote:
    You are all wrong.

    The combination of nu-metal/rap-metal and the teenpop bands and "princesses" killed much of rock music. :p
    agree with Gremmie's page one post and this. The new shit coming out like Korn, is what caused it mostly.
    Cuyahoga Falls 98, Columbus 00, Cleveland 03, Columbus 03, Toledo 04, Grand Rapids 04, Kitchener 05, Cleveland 06, Cincinnati 06, Washington DC 08, Philadelphia IV 09, Columbus 10, Cleveland 10, Chicago 13, Pittsburgh 13, Cincinnati 14, Chicago (1) 16, Chicago (2) 16
  • Solat13
    Solat13 Posts: 6,996
    I agree with your theory. Vitalogy also started the run of curious singles that were released. I love Spin the Black Circle, but obivously I'm a diehard. But it's funny that Corduroy gets by far the most radio play at least in Philly off Vitalogy and it was never a single. If Corduroy was released as the first single off Vitalogy, their mainstream success would never have tailed off.

    Since the original poster was inspired by Bill Simmons, here's what his take was on Vitalogy a few years ago.

    Q: Love your columns, but just curious as to why no love for Pearl Jam? In your column titled "No Love for Sleepy," you mentioned the Blender magazine "50 Worst Songs of All Time" list and said that you would've personally voted for Pearl Jam's "Spin the Black Circle." What's wrong with that song?
    --John D, Dayton, Ohio

    Bill Simmons: Wait a second ... Pearl Jam is my favorite band of all time. So calm down. It's not just that "Spin the Black Circle" was a dreadful song -- they released it as the first single off "Vitalogy" because they knew it was a dreadful song, and Eddie Vedder was trying to prove that, after two enormously successful albums, they had become famous enough that they could release ANYTHING -- even that horrible piece of crap -- and radio stations would play it, anyway, and their fans would crank it and make believe that they thought it was a good song. He was proving a point. I will always believe that.

    (See, this is why I never write about music -- you can have strong opinions about sports and movies, but when you bring music into it, people go bonkers when they don't agree with you. That's why I usually avoid opening that can of worms. But in this case, I'm right and nobody else can convince me otherwise. So there.)
    - Busted down the pretext
    - 8/28/98
    - 9/2/00
    - 4/28/03, 5/3/03, 7/3/03, 7/5/03, 7/6/03, 7/9/03, 7/11/03, 7/12/03, 7/14/03
    - 9/28/04, 9/29/04, 10/1/04, 10/2/04
    - 9/11/05, 9/12/05, 9/13/05, 9/30/05, 10/1/05, 10/3/05
    - 5/12/06, 5/13/06, 5/27/06, 5/28/06, 5/30/06, 6/1/06, 6/3/06, 6/23/06, 7/22/06, 7/23/06, 12/2/06, 12/9/06
    - 8/2/07, 8/5/07
    - 6/19/08, 6/20/08, 6/22/08, 6/24/08, 6/25/08, 6/27/08, 6/28/08, 6/30/08, 7/1/08
    - 8/23/09, 8/24/09, 9/21/09, 9/22/09, 10/27/09, 10/28/09, 10/30/09, 10/31/09
    - 5/15/10, 5/17/10, 5/18/10, 5/20/10, 5/21/10, 10/23/10, 10/24/10
    - 9/11/11, 9/12/11
    - 10/18/13, 10/21/13, 10/22/13, 11/30/13, 12/4/13
  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    Gremmie95 wrote:
    I don't think not making videos had anything to do with it. The ticketmaster thing hurt a bunch.....people couldn't see their favorite band (myself included). "Average" music fans were not willing to jump through the hoops to keep up with them. Also, the music scene shifted in between Vitalogy and No Code. "Grunge" died and took the casual fan with it. Kurt died, Soundgarden broke up, AIC went on hiatus, etc., all within two years or so. I think those things had as much to do with the drop in interest and sales as anything.
    Corrections: between Vitalogy and No Code was 1995 - Soundgarden was still together. Grunge wasn't dead because Alice In Chains' selft-titled went 2x platinum without touring.
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • dreamweaver
    dreamweaver New York Posts: 735
    This same conversation has been going on for years. Why is there such a concern for Pearl Jam's popularity? We should all feel lucky that they keep a Web-site going and are giving us this tour, in my opinion. It's something I look foward to in Life. Worrying about Rock being dead and stuff like that is all media driven bullshit and it's sad to see posts like this.
    Meadowlands, MSG 1, MSG 2 - '98
    Jones Beach NY 1 + 3 - '00
    MSG 1 + 2 - '03
    Boston Garden - '04
    Montreal - '05
    Boston Garden 1, Meadowlands 1 + 2 - '06
    Mansfield 1 - '08
    (EV solo) Boston 1 - '08
    Chicago 1 - '09
    MSG -'10
    Brooklyn 1+2 - '13
    Central Park - '15
    MSG - '16
    Fenway - '16
    Wrigley - '16
    (RRHOF) Brooklyn - '17
    Fenway - '18
    MSG - '22
    MSG 1 - '24
  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    dirtyT wrote:
    agree with Gremmie's page one post and this. The new shit coming out like Korn, is what caused it mostly.
    Yes true.

    People seems to forget that PJ was the MAIN reason why 1995's "Mirrorball" debuted at #5 and went gold. Mirrorball was Neil's best peek position since his smash "Harvest"

    So with that said, Vitalogy wasn't the reason nor was No Code. But mainly due to the new rap-metal and teenpop stuff basically when it comes to it. The "new voice" of the new generation :rolleyes:
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • FiveB247x
    FiveB247x Posts: 2,330
    I disagree. Some of the songs off Vitalogy were hits on the radio (Not for you, Betterman and a few others). Vitalogy (albeit with those hits), had some additional odds tracks which fans weren't used to, but that alone didn't "kill PJ's fanbase". In fact, if you recall correctly, PJ ran a pretty successful tour outside of ticketmaster contraints at which towards the end we all heard stories about the band being tired and also Cobain's death was still fresh. True at that moment, the "grunge era" perhaps took a downward spiral, but at the same point, it wasn't because of Vitalogy. Vitalogy had many songs which were in the old grunge style of ten and vs; and it wasn't til No Code where PJ totally changed their sound. In my opinion, fans loved Ten, Vs, then liked some songs on Vitalogy (which is why they sold roughly 900k+ albums), then once No Code came out, you didn't have radio friendly hits, the "grunge era" had mostly passed and those loyal PJ fans were expected a new album which closer fit the mold of ten and vs. Musically, Vitalogy put it all out there - no B-sides or rarities, everything was on the album. No Code on the other hand was very well arranged and put together, and by it's own nature and definition, meant Do not Resusitate (no code is a hospital term refering to that). PJ decided they wanted a different musical sound and to go another route that they had previously done, and in doing such, moved away from the fans which only worshiped their first two albums and sorta liked their 3rd. Another obvious sign that No Code did just that, is the fact that most "big" PJ fans nowadays refer to No Code as such a great album, where as most "pop" music fans forgot about PJ for albums thereafter. No Code was definitely the album which was the downfall of PJ's pop culture status.
    CONservative governMENt

    Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
  • Gremmie95
    Gremmie95 Posts: 749
    LongRd. wrote:
    Corrections: between Vitalogy and No Code was 1995 - Soundgarden was still together. Grunge wasn't dead because Alice In Chains' selft-titled went 2x platinum without touring.

    Thanks for the history lessons. Grunge was well on it's way out within the two year period I am talking about (Kurt died in 94, Soundgarden broke up in late 96)
  • hailhail1980
    hailhail1980 Posts: 427
    "History of the Downfall of PJ in Popular Culture"

    is this some sort of subject I need to pass to get the band to play in South America?
    Ebi
  • dirtyT
    dirtyT Posts: 3,620
    Gremmie95 wrote:
    Thanks for the history lessons. Grunge was well on it's way out within the two year period I am talking about (Kurt died in 94, Soundgarden broke up in late 96)
    i was with you, some people are just so paticular!
    Cuyahoga Falls 98, Columbus 00, Cleveland 03, Columbus 03, Toledo 04, Grand Rapids 04, Kitchener 05, Cleveland 06, Cincinnati 06, Washington DC 08, Philadelphia IV 09, Columbus 10, Cleveland 10, Chicago 13, Pittsburgh 13, Cincinnati 14, Chicago (1) 16, Chicago (2) 16
  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    Gremmie95 wrote:
    Thanks for the history lessons. Grunge was well on it's way out within the two year period I am talking about (Kurt died in 94, Soundgarden broke up in late 96)
    Officially in Spring '97 after touring.
    http://web.stargate.net/soundgarden/articles/gw_2-98.shtml
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • Gremmie95
    Gremmie95 Posts: 749
    LongRd. wrote:
    Officially in Spring '97 after touring.
    http://web.stargate.net/soundgarden/articles/gw_2-98.shtml


    Now LongRd., nobody likes a smart ass!
  • thecory
    thecory Posts: 290
    dreamweaver wrote:
    This same conversation has been going on for years. Why is there such a concern for Pearl Jam's popularity? We should all feel lucky that they keep a Web-site going and are giving us this tour, in my opinion. It's something I look foward to in Life. Worrying about Rock being dead and stuff like that is all media driven bullshit and it's sad to see posts like this.

    Good call. It's like he wants [Pearl Jam] to be liked by everyone. I mean Led Zeppelin didn't write tunes everybody liked. They left that to the Bee Gees. - wayne
  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    Gremmie95 wrote:
    Now LongRd., nobody likes a smart ass!
    nor a wise ass, which I'm more compatible to (not smart ass) :D
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • Gremmie95
    Gremmie95 Posts: 749
    LongRd. wrote:
    nor a wise ass, which I'm more compatible to (not smart ass) :D

    NICE!
  • Coming back to life
    Coming back to life Posts: 401
    Whatever album it was, I'm glad it fucked them wankers off.
    A restaurant with a smoking section is like a swimming pool with a pissing section
  • harmless_little_f***
    harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    thecory wrote:
    Good call. It's like he wants [Pearl Jam] to be liked by everyone. I mean Led Zeppelin didn't write tunes everybody liked. They left that to the Bee Gees. - wayne

    Nice!
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • Taft
    Taft Posts: 457
    thecory wrote:
    Good call. It's like he wants [Pearl Jam] to be liked by everyone. I mean Led Zeppelin didn't write tunes everybody liked. They left that to the Bee Gees. - wayne

    You and dreamweaver are way off....that was not my intent or the point of my post. As I stated, I could careless about their popularity, in fact, I am VERY happy PJ is not loved by everyone and pulled back the way they did.

    I just think this issue is widely misreported on this forum and other places (like Bill Simmons article), and I was stating my opinion that No Code was not ground zero as many believe.
  • aNiMaL
    aNiMaL Posts: 7,117
    dreamweaver wrote:
    This same conversation has been going on for years. Why is there such a concern for Pearl Jam's popularity? We should all feel lucky that they keep a Web-site going and are giving us this tour, in my opinion. It's something I look foward to in Life. Worrying about Rock being dead and stuff like that is all media driven bullshit and it's sad to see posts like this.
    I think you have completely missed the point of this thread. In fact, I am not even sure you read the opening post. It is almost as though you saw the headline and couldn't wait to post your thoughts on what you thought this thread was about.

    Taft, hang in there.

Categories