i get the feeling that TEN is the only record that will get the super deluxe treatment. i can see them re-pressing the vinyls b/c people love the vinyls...maybe some b-sides, etc. but i doubt that they'll do much more than that.
i do think it's cool that they are doing this their way...and not letting the record co make it their project. it makes it a bit more personal.
...
maybe we can make a deal with them...
You (Pearl Jam) offer us those things from the Vault individually... instead of bundled up... AND...
We (everyone who is not Pearl Jam) will quit stealing your stuff (and promise to pay for all the stuff we've already stolen).
that would be a hell of a lot better than tying in all the cool stuff with re-releases and charging us more because we have to buy an album we already own JUST to get the extras.
I wore out all my originals or they got stolen or left some place...no one is holding a gun to yer head and making you buy anything....Long live REISSUES
ok, this point is like beating a dead horse. not what i was saying at any time and if you actually read and comprehended earlier points mentioned you would realize that.
ok, for the new, good mix, and b-sides, and unplugged, all of which you approve of (thank gawd), you will have to pay $31. that does not sound like a lot of money for all that stuff to me. so the things you said you approve of are being sold for a very reasonable price (not more. if they wanted to charge more, it would all be separate). not understanding...
i respectfully disagree. a remixed album with 6 b-sides = 17 songs = it's one album which should run 12-13 bucks. one unplugged dvd...should be like 10-12 bucks. so 22-25, all told. 31 is not OUTRAGEOUS but it is a slight rip.
let's be honest here and not act so shocked and like pearl jam can do no wrong....some of the merch is in fact a rip/overpriced...look at some of the prices of things in goods, it's obvious.
just for reference, i am not in the "PJ can do no wrong" camp at all. i think their ticket prices are getting a bit ridiculous, the verizon thing pisses me off, and the new bootlegs are WAY shittier than in 2000 or 2003...that being said, they DO treat their fans better than most do. i just think to complain about finally getting a listenable version of TEN is a bit over the top...
plus, any excuse for them to FINALLY start releasing stuff from the vault is a good thing, IMHO:)
just for reference, i am not in the "PJ can do no wrong" camp at all. i think their ticket prices are getting a bit ridiculous, the verizon thing pisses me off, and the new bootlegs are WAY shittier than in 2000 or 2003...that being said, they DO treat their fans better than most do. i just think to complain about finally getting a listenable version of TEN is a bit over the top...
plus, any excuse for them to FINALLY start releasing stuff from the vault is a good thing, IMHO:)
ok, but see, i'm not complaining about finally getting a listenable version of ten...didn't you see? i retracted my earlier statement; i said i was okay with the ten rerelease now. i'm talking about other points which i've already mentioned and am not going to list again...see my last few posts for reference.
and YES, i AGREE...it IS good if they finally start releasing stuff from the vault! ALL i'm saying is...it isn't cool if they tie in all the unreleased/bsides/goodies stuff to a re-release of a record we already have for future rereleases...because then we would be forced to spend MORE...cuz we would be buying the cool stuff AND a record we already have...when all we really need is the stuff thats never before been released. it should be sold as a separate entity at a fair, low price....not tied into a rerelease of an album everybody already has, leading to an unnecessarily higher price.
just for reference, i am not in the "PJ can do no wrong" camp at all. i think their ticket prices are getting a bit ridiculous, the verizon thing pisses me off, and the new bootlegs are WAY shittier than in 2000 or 2003...that being said, they DO treat their fans better than most do. i just think to complain about finally getting a listenable version of TEN is a bit over the top...
plus, any excuse for them to FINALLY start releasing stuff from the vault is a good thing, IMHO:)
ok, but see, i'm not complaining about finally getting a listenable version of ten...didn't you see? i retracted my earlier statement; i said i was okay with the ten rerelease now. i'm talking about other points which i've already mentioned and am not going to list again...see my last few posts for reference.
and YES, i AGREE...it IS good if they finally start releasing stuff from the vault! ALL i'm saying is...it isn't cool if they tie in all the unreleased/bsides/goodies stuff to a re-release of a record we already have for future rereleases...because then we would be forced to spend MORE...cuz we would be buying the cool stuff AND a record we already have...when all we really need is the stuff thats never before been released. it should be sold as a separate entity at a fair, low price....not tied into a rerelease of an album everybody already has, leading to an unnecessarily higher price.
i get what you are saying. but,
for one, the re-release is an attempt to introduce new people to a classic album. plus, if the original 10 was not included, people would be freaking out that they fucked with a masterpiece, etc...
two, i think all the releases are priced VERY fairly. $15 for both the original and new version of 10, $31 for those plus the dvd...albums cost normally about $15, dvds are usually a couple dollars more. so you are paying the price of what a remixed 10 and an unplugged dvd would be if they were sold separately, but you get the original 10 included as well. i think the super-deluxe is a bit pricey, but it is a premium product (and the one i got).
as for releasing stuff separately, i guess i can see that a bit. I mean, we have been taunted with potential vault releases for YEARS and have gotten pretty much nothing (aside from a damn mp3 of the vegas '93 show and the new years '92 show).
but if you want vault releases, like unplugged or drop in the park, its not like you are having to settle for the other stuff...the other stuff in the package is AWESOME! i really think that, for many of us, the super-deluxe is going to be one of the favorite PJ items of all time. and as much as i'd like to see them release a new vault show every few months or so, if this is the model they are taking for now (the reissue model i mean), then i am fine with it.
plus my original versions of these albums are all scratched as hell, and need to be replaced anyway.
what's wrong with the band making a celebration of what got them here? its a pretty nice set up. of course they want to make money, but i don't think that's the main thing behind it. if i had the money, i probably would buy the package because of the unplugged dvd. but my ass is broke and it ain't no joke, so i can't buy it like the rest of you blokes. cheers to those of you who can though.
I wore out all my originals or they got stolen or left some place...no one is holding a gun to yer head and making you buy anything....Long live REISSUES
...
I want the 'Vs.' Edition to include a soundboard recording of the 1993 Indio gig.
If that happens - and they include some extra tracks. Sold.
goldrush
everybody knows this is nowhere Posts: 7,307
I already have Ten on cd, European Tour Cd (the yellow one) the "vinyl reissue" cd, tape, vinyl and basketball picture disk vinyl... and I've still ordered the Super Deluxe version!
Basically, I wanted it so I've ordered it. If you don't want it, don't order it. I actually think the band taking control of their back catalogue using it as a celebration of the last 20 years is a great thing.I can't wait to see what goodies and rarities will come out in the next few years (Vitalogy and Yield especially!)
I really don't see what all the controversy is about. There's no need to piss and moan about being ripped off...
YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY IT!!!
Peace X
“Do not postpone happiness”
(Jeff Tweedy, Sydney 2007)
It's funny how everyone gets thier panties in a bunch when someone says, "sell-out."
PJ may be trying to control the integrity of the product, but if SONY were to release this without PJ I'm pretty sure we would not get the extras and the price would be reasonable.
So PJ wants to make sure we get something with quality, so they add $20 worth of material and jack the price $120.
I have no problem with PJ doing this, I would love to here them on some commercials.
I already have Ten on cd, European Tour Cd (the yellow one) the "vinyl reissue" cd, tape, vinyl and basketball picture disk vinyl... and I've still ordered the Super Deluxe version!
Basically, I wanted it so I've ordered it. If you don't want it, don't order it. I actually think the band taking control of their back catalogue using it as a celebration of the last 20 years is a great thing.I can't wait to see what goodies and rarities will come out in the next few years (Vitalogy and Yield especially!)
I really don't see what all the controversy is about. There's no need to piss and moan about being ripped off...
YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY IT!!!
Peace X
Wow. Just....wow. For the LAST time, that's NOT the point. The point is it shouldn't be happening! LOL, when will this be understood? Hahaha.
But, whatever. I'm over it now. Most people don't seem to care and seem excited for it, so great.
Seriously. I don't want to spoil everyone's fun. I'm willing to let the argument die now. Enjoy the re-releases.
I thought the timing of the presale right before Christmas was dumb, but I got railed here for voicing it...As for re-releasing being dumb, no way. I think there are enough PJ fans around to make it worth while. I think that the deluxe sets are priced perfectly to make it a worth while purchase...The CD version will probably sell the FEWEST copies compared to the deluxe set for $32 w/ DVD. THe DVD alone could sell for $20-$25...That is a great package for someone without the $140 to splurge, and if the reasoning isnt money, but that you dont have a turntable, go buy one FOR the LP edition, or deluxe ed...
I get you, Music for Rhinos..
I understand the TEN re-issue. It's the right time..And i'm looking forward to the vinyl. I also like to listen to some re-mastered version of older music..but I tend to like it like it was originally made.
But re-releasing all others albums..hmmm..Well they have the right to do whatever they like..but it's just unusual to me. I like music like it was at that time when it was recorded. So what if now it could be done better..it was done then and so it was..
If it was a painting?!..I know several world famous painters didn't like their work but if they just painted over and over it..well it will be a mess, detracted from original state of becoming, of origin, of that special moment and emotion that got it into material form.
I don't burden myself with how much profit they make. I focus on music. But judging from this board I can say that a lot of fans are willing to buy whatever they put out and it doesn't matter if it has to do anything with music or not. It's not a matter of rationality, they just have to have it, just to have it. If they put it on a shelf and never open it - for me that is a total nonsense - it makes the CD or whatever empty of it's meaning. That is because Pearl Jam are a brand for them. I think the band just gave into the demand. I don't judge them. Feed the hungry.
The worst enemies of music? Money and Mathematics. Combined with music, they both do the exact opposite of what they're supposed to do. Money makes music cheap, mathematics makes it stupid and predictable.
____
Zagreb 2006/ Munich 2007/ Venice 2007/ Berlin 2009 / Venice 2010 / 2 x Berlin 2012 / Stockholm 2012 / Milan 2014 / Trieste 2014 / Vienna 2014 / Florence (EV) 2019 / Padova 2018 / Prague 2018 / Imola 2022 / Budapest 2022 / Vienna 2022 / Prague 2022
One thing I amy not have seen or missed, what about if they draw in new fans with this? I know when I took my brothers to see them in 2006- they did not even realize PJ was still around, but have since gotten back into them more, and may be the types to buy the remastered albulm. So if they get more airplay with the rerelease and draw in new fans, is that bad? I don't think so, music today is pretty bad. Are people here upset that they may get their name back out there with new and younger fans? Or older fans who went away and now may get back into them?
...got a mind full of questions and a teacher in my soul...
This has been a very civil debate for seven pages. That's almost unheard of on here!
However, my only argument is the whole "if Pearl Jam from ten years ago would see them now" argument. Times have changed. Albums aren't selling anymore. The band members have family now so being a devoted touring band is much more difficult. Do I wish the box set was cheaper? Yes! Do I like the Verizon thing? Not really. However, this is how bands are going to have to make money now. It's not good enough to offer up 17 re-mastered tracks and a remix of the original album. We all know where to go where we could get it for free. So you throw in some special goodies.
I would have a lot more problem with this if it were at the height of their popularity. If they were still selling millions of every album and then re-released everything at a high price like this...it would suck. Let's not kid ourselves though, the package is directed at fans. Not just casual fans either.
I wore out all my originals or they got stolen or left some place...no one is holding a gun to yer head and making you buy anything....Long live REISSUES
...
I want the 'Vs.' Edition to include a soundboard recording of the 1993 Indio gig.
If that happens - and they include some extra tracks. Sold.
...
I am hoping... HOPING... for 'Vs.' to include the full '93 Indio gig (we know they have a copy because that where that 'Shoe' rant comes from) and some Demos, alternate/acoustic versions of songs from the album (if they exist) and unreleased songs from that era.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
I am hoping... HOPING... for 'Vs.' to include the full '93 Indio gig (we know they have a copy because that where that 'Shoe' rant comes from) and some Demos, alternate/acoustic versions of songs from the album (if they exist) and unreleased songs from that era.
Works for me...but replace Indio w/ 12/1/93 Vegas. There's a sweet sounding Indio bootleg already. The only copy I have of Vegas (night 2) sounds like garbage but MAN is it a good show.
Bright eyed kid: "Wow Typo Man, you're the best!"
Typo Man: "Thanks kidz, but remembir, stay in skool!"
I love it all; the more PJ stuff the better; don't like, don't buy it. We are the ones on here always asking for more and they give it; it's not like they can release new music every day or tour constantly. They always give.
SLC 11/2/95, Park City 6/21/98, Boise 11/3/00, Seattle 12/9/02, Vancouver 5/30/03, Gorge 9/1/05, Vancouver 9/2/05, Gorge 7/22/06, Gorge 7/23/06, Camden I 6/19/08, MSG I 6/24/08, MSG II 6/25/08, Hartford 6/27/08, Mansfield II 6/30/08; Eddie Albany 6/8/09, 6/9/09; Philly 10/30/09, 10/31/09; Boston 5/17/10
I thought the world...Turns out the world thought me
One thing I amy not have seen or missed, what about if they draw in new fans with this? I know when I took my brothers to see them in 2006- they did not even realize PJ was still around, but have since gotten back into them more, and may be the types to buy the remastered albulm. So if they get more airplay with the rerelease and draw in new fans, is that bad? I don't think so, music today is pretty bad. Are people here upset that they may get their name back out there with new and younger fans? Or older fans who went away and now may get back into them?
Excellent point, pjsteelerfan. That was one thing I thought about when reading this thread, but always forgot about when posting. I think we (I include myself in this) tend to look at what the band does as it applies to die-hards. I still think PJ thinks everything out a long time before they do anything and are not just doing it to make a buck. I know I have bought a lot of albums from bands that I was too young or not born when they were big that were remastered and with extra tracks (Who's Next comes to mind). Of course a super Who fan would have Who's Next already and probably crappy live versions of some of the b-sides on a cassette somewhere, but I think it benefits the new and older fans by re-releasing it.
I'm sure there will be more than one person who will buy the Ten re-release with Unplugged and become a lifelong fan, as many of us did seeing them early on.
Comments
just for reference, i am not in the "PJ can do no wrong" camp at all. i think their ticket prices are getting a bit ridiculous, the verizon thing pisses me off, and the new bootlegs are WAY shittier than in 2000 or 2003...that being said, they DO treat their fans better than most do. i just think to complain about finally getting a listenable version of TEN is a bit over the top...
plus, any excuse for them to FINALLY start releasing stuff from the vault is a good thing, IMHO:)
ok, but see, i'm not complaining about finally getting a listenable version of ten...didn't you see? i retracted my earlier statement; i said i was okay with the ten rerelease now. i'm talking about other points which i've already mentioned and am not going to list again...see my last few posts for reference.
and YES, i AGREE...it IS good if they finally start releasing stuff from the vault! ALL i'm saying is...it isn't cool if they tie in all the unreleased/bsides/goodies stuff to a re-release of a record we already have for future rereleases...because then we would be forced to spend MORE...cuz we would be buying the cool stuff AND a record we already have...when all we really need is the stuff thats never before been released. it should be sold as a separate entity at a fair, low price....not tied into a rerelease of an album everybody already has, leading to an unnecessarily higher price.
i get what you are saying. but,
for one, the re-release is an attempt to introduce new people to a classic album. plus, if the original 10 was not included, people would be freaking out that they fucked with a masterpiece, etc...
two, i think all the releases are priced VERY fairly. $15 for both the original and new version of 10, $31 for those plus the dvd...albums cost normally about $15, dvds are usually a couple dollars more. so you are paying the price of what a remixed 10 and an unplugged dvd would be if they were sold separately, but you get the original 10 included as well. i think the super-deluxe is a bit pricey, but it is a premium product (and the one i got).
as for releasing stuff separately, i guess i can see that a bit. I mean, we have been taunted with potential vault releases for YEARS and have gotten pretty much nothing (aside from a damn mp3 of the vegas '93 show and the new years '92 show).
but if you want vault releases, like unplugged or drop in the park, its not like you are having to settle for the other stuff...the other stuff in the package is AWESOME! i really think that, for many of us, the super-deluxe is going to be one of the favorite PJ items of all time. and as much as i'd like to see them release a new vault show every few months or so, if this is the model they are taking for now (the reissue model i mean), then i am fine with it.
plus my original versions of these albums are all scratched as hell, and need to be replaced anyway.
and congrats to Pearl Jam on a great career!
~~peace and love
If that happens - and they include some extra tracks. Sold.
BOS-9/28/04,9/29/04,6/28/08,6/30/08, 9/5/16, 9/7/16, 9/2/18
MTL-9/15/05, OTT-9/16/05
PHL-5/27/06,5/28/06,10/30/09,10/31/09
CHI-8/2/07,8/5/07,8/23/09,8/24/09
HTFD-6/27/08
ATX-10/4/09, 10/12/14
KC-5/3/2010,STL-5/4/2010
Bridge School-10/23/2010,10/24/2010
PJ20-9/3/2011,9/4/2011
OKC-11/16/13
SEA-12/6/13
TUL-10/8/14
Basically, I wanted it so I've ordered it. If you don't want it, don't order it. I actually think the band taking control of their back catalogue using it as a celebration of the last 20 years is a great thing.I can't wait to see what goodies and rarities will come out in the next few years (Vitalogy and Yield especially!)
I really don't see what all the controversy is about. There's no need to piss and moan about being ripped off...
YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY IT!!!
Peace X
(Jeff Tweedy, Sydney 2007)
“Put yer good money on the sunrise”
(Tim Rogers)
PJ may be trying to control the integrity of the product, but if SONY were to release this without PJ I'm pretty sure we would not get the extras and the price would be reasonable.
So PJ wants to make sure we get something with quality, so they add $20 worth of material and jack the price $120.
I have no problem with PJ doing this, I would love to here them on some commercials.
Wow. Just....wow. For the LAST time, that's NOT the point. The point is it shouldn't be happening! LOL, when will this be understood? Hahaha.
But, whatever. I'm over it now. Most people don't seem to care and seem excited for it, so great.
Seriously. I don't want to spoil everyone's fun. I'm willing to let the argument die now. Enjoy the re-releases.
I understand the TEN re-issue. It's the right time..And i'm looking forward to the vinyl. I also like to listen to some re-mastered version of older music..but I tend to like it like it was originally made.
But re-releasing all others albums..hmmm..Well they have the right to do whatever they like..but it's just unusual to me. I like music like it was at that time when it was recorded. So what if now it could be done better..it was done then and so it was..
If it was a painting?!..I know several world famous painters didn't like their work but if they just painted over and over it..well it will be a mess, detracted from original state of becoming, of origin, of that special moment and emotion that got it into material form.
I don't burden myself with how much profit they make. I focus on music. But judging from this board I can say that a lot of fans are willing to buy whatever they put out and it doesn't matter if it has to do anything with music or not. It's not a matter of rationality, they just have to have it, just to have it. If they put it on a shelf and never open it - for me that is a total nonsense - it makes the CD or whatever empty of it's meaning. That is because Pearl Jam are a brand for them. I think the band just gave into the demand. I don't judge them. Feed the hungry.
____
Zagreb 2006/ Munich 2007/ Venice 2007/ Berlin 2009 / Venice 2010 / 2 x Berlin 2012 / Stockholm 2012 / Milan 2014 / Trieste 2014 / Vienna 2014 / Florence (EV) 2019 / Padova 2018 / Prague 2018 / Imola 2022 / Budapest 2022 / Vienna 2022 / Prague 2022
However, my only argument is the whole "if Pearl Jam from ten years ago would see them now" argument. Times have changed. Albums aren't selling anymore. The band members have family now so being a devoted touring band is much more difficult. Do I wish the box set was cheaper? Yes! Do I like the Verizon thing? Not really. However, this is how bands are going to have to make money now. It's not good enough to offer up 17 re-mastered tracks and a remix of the original album. We all know where to go where we could get it for free. So you throw in some special goodies.
I would have a lot more problem with this if it were at the height of their popularity. If they were still selling millions of every album and then re-released everything at a high price like this...it would suck. Let's not kid ourselves though, the package is directed at fans. Not just casual fans either.
http://www.reverbnation.com/brianzilm
I am hoping... HOPING... for 'Vs.' to include the full '93 Indio gig (we know they have a copy because that where that 'Shoe' rant comes from) and some Demos, alternate/acoustic versions of songs from the album (if they exist) and unreleased songs from that era.
Hail, Hail!!!
Works for me...but replace Indio w/ 12/1/93 Vegas. There's a sweet sounding Indio bootleg already. The only copy I have of Vegas (night 2) sounds like garbage but MAN is it a good show.
Typo Man: "Thanks kidz, but remembir, stay in skool!"
I thought the world...Turns out the world thought me
Excellent point, pjsteelerfan. That was one thing I thought about when reading this thread, but always forgot about when posting. I think we (I include myself in this) tend to look at what the band does as it applies to die-hards. I still think PJ thinks everything out a long time before they do anything and are not just doing it to make a buck. I know I have bought a lot of albums from bands that I was too young or not born when they were big that were remastered and with extra tracks (Who's Next comes to mind). Of course a super Who fan would have Who's Next already and probably crappy live versions of some of the b-sides on a cassette somewhere, but I think it benefits the new and older fans by re-releasing it.
I'm sure there will be more than one person who will buy the Ten re-release with Unplugged and become a lifelong fan, as many of us did seeing them early on.