When a friend finds God ...

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  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    Good segue by the way.
    Heineken Helen wrote:
    what? so you think that somebody who doesn't give into temptation is miserable? I'd imagine it to be the opposite... that it must be fantastic to have complete control over your life and body. I certainly don't. I don't' follow any religion but I know there's a god... and it certainly hasn't made me miserable :D
    No. I meant it's HARD not to give into temptation, and I don't believe anyone on Earth can resist. Not even those(Priest) whose are close to God.
    eMMI wrote:
    the thing is.. the Bible is written by humans and most of it isn't the direct word of God. so, if someone is trying to do everything the Book tells them to and believe everything in there is true word for word, it can make them miserable, but then we're definitely talking about religioon/people making them so, and not God. :)

    agreed, temptations are all around and people fall. we're humans, we can't help but fall into sin.. it's whether or not you know you did wrong (in the eyes of God or law) and regret it that counts.
    Heineken Helen wrote:
    Isn't that why there's such a thing as forgiveness? It's not always easy to accept you've done wrong and show remorse. But ultimately it's the right thing to do... whether you believe in god or not...
    How much forgiveness can one be pardon? In life, there is good and evil!!! If there was God who have strict principles, no way He/she would just forgive that easily.
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • Heineken Helen
    Heineken Helen Posts: 18,095
    LongRd. wrote:
    Good segue by the way.

    No. I meant it's HARD not to give into temptation, and I don't believe anyone on Earth can resist. Not even those(Priest) whose are close to God.



    How much forgiveness can one be pardon? In life, there is good and evil!!! If there was God who have strict principles, no way He/she would just forgive that easily.
    You're right, it's hard not to give into temptation... and I seriously doubt there is anybody alive today who has lived a life without ONCE giving into temptation. Who said anything about forgiving EASILY? Forgiveness is only granted if you really ARE remorseful... and if you really are remorseful it's not like you're gonna go out and do the same thing straight away again. If one makes an effort for a good chunk of their life, TRYING to live a good life and being sorry for the things they've done wrong.. they will be forgiven.
    The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
    Verona??? it's all surmountable
    Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
    Wembley? We all believe!
    Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
    Chicago 07? And love
    What a different life
    Had I not found this love with you
  • Heineken Helen
    Heineken Helen Posts: 18,095
    long red wrote:
    now ur talking about morals vs. ethics. morality is ethics with a paper halo.
    It's just a different word... I'm not getting into semantics :)
    The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
    Verona??? it's all surmountable
    Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
    Wembley? We all believe!
    Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
    Chicago 07? And love
    What a different life
    Had I not found this love with you
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    Heineken Helen wrote:
    It's just a different word... I'm not getting into semantics :)

    different meanings and sources. morals have basis in religion. whereas ethics are dictated by society.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • eMMI
    eMMI Posts: 6,262
    Heineken Helen wrote:
    Isn't that why there's such a thing as forgiveness? It's not always easy to accept you've done wrong and show remorse. But ultimately it's the right thing to do... whether you believe in god or not...

    yes! all our sins (if we regret them) are forgiven (in the eyes of God). because, mainly God knows we do stupid shite and, like a parent he will forgive us.

    accepting you've done wrong and remorse are definitely not easy things. they're as hard as apologising at times. but it has to be done, like you said, whether you believe in God or not.
    "Don't be faint-hearted, I have a solution! We shall go and commandeer some small craft, then drift at leisure until we happen upon another ideal place for our waterside supper with riparian entertainments."
  • Heineken Helen
    Heineken Helen Posts: 18,095
    long red wrote:
    different meanings and sources. morals have basis in religion. whereas ethics are dictated by society.
    but which came first... society or religion? ;) can anybody answer that question? So who knows whether morals came from ethics or the other way around?
    The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
    Verona??? it's all surmountable
    Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
    Wembley? We all believe!
    Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
    Chicago 07? And love
    What a different life
    Had I not found this love with you
  • noisy mind
    noisy mind Posts: 65
    long red wrote:
    dont insult me by calling me an atheist. I am nothing. Completely indifferent.

    keep lying to yourself. completely indifferent towards something doesn't include using terms like brainwashing or punching people in the throat for believing in something.

    when it comes down to it, who really cares as long as your friend finds some peace....and even then, few of us will truly care.

    regards,

    cynical american
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    Heineken Helen wrote:
    but which came first... society or religion? ;) can anybody answer that question? So who knows whether morals came from ethics or the other way around?

    i'm on summer break, I can't tackle that right now.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    noisy mind wrote:
    keep lying to yourself. completely indifferent towards something doesn't include using terms like brainwashing or punching people in the throat for believing in something.

    when it comes down to it, who really cares as long as your friend finds some peace....and even then, few of us will truly care.

    regards,

    cynical american

    like i said before ... i'm indifferent towards religion unless it grows on a friend like fungus.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • Heineken Helen
    Heineken Helen Posts: 18,095
    long red wrote:
    i'm on summer break, I can't tackle that right now.
    :D excuses excuses... it's possible religion was the first form of society or one of. I wonder if religion came from society or if society was born out of people drawn together by a common interest such as some kinda thing they perceived to be a god. I would imagine society came first, makes sense... but words like 'ethics' or 'morals' who knows which came when or why.
    The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
    Verona??? it's all surmountable
    Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
    Wembley? We all believe!
    Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
    Chicago 07? And love
    What a different life
    Had I not found this love with you
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    catefrances wrote:
    long red:
    how is it an insult to be called an atheist?

    because it insinuates that I spend time classifying myself based on someone else's religious beliefs.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • Ledbetterman10
    Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,994
    long red wrote:
    Don't you just want to punch him in the fucking throat? Brainwashing is alive and well.

    good ole long red
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024: Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    Heineken Helen wrote:
    :D excuses excuses... it's possible religion was the first form of society or one of. I wonder if religion came from society or if society was born out of people drawn together by a common interest such as some kinda thing they perceived to be a god. I would imagine society came first, makes sense... but words like 'ethics' or 'morals' who knows which came when or why.

    yea, i'm thinking society came first and religion was born out of the need to explain what they didn't understand. (i.e. thunder, lightning, death). As for morals or ethics, in caveman times, it was probably wrong to smash your fellow caveman's head in with a club. and thats a societal wrong. something that came before religion.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • LONGRD
    LONGRD Posts: 6,036
    long red wrote:
    yea, i'm thinking society came first and religion was born out of the need to explain what they didn't understand. (i.e. thunder, lightning, death). As for morals or ethics, in caveman times, it was probably wrong to smash your fellow caveman's head in with a club. and thats a societal wrong. something that came before religion.
    It's Evolution Baby!
    PJ- 04/29/2003.06/24,25,27,28,30/2008.10/27,28,30,31/2009
    EV- 08/09,10/2008.06/08,09/2009
  • Heineken Helen
    Heineken Helen Posts: 18,095
    long red wrote:
    yea, i'm thinking society came first and religion was born out of the need to explain what they didn't understand. (i.e. thunder, lightning, death). As for morals or ethics, in caveman times, it was probably wrong to smash your fellow caveman's head in with a club. and thats a societal wrong. something that came before religion.
    how do you know? It was probably completely acceptable to smash your fellow cavemans head in... see this is something we could debate but you don't know, I don't know... which came first! Until you know whether 'morals' or 'ethics' came first... they're just the same as eachother!
    The Astoria??? Orgazmic!
    Verona??? it's all surmountable
    Dublin 23.08.06 "The beauty of Ireland, right there!"
    Wembley? We all believe!
    Copenhagen?? your light made us stars
    Chicago 07? And love
    What a different life
    Had I not found this love with you
  • you are
    you are Posts: 1,651
    long red wrote:
    i'm no moper.

    BUT ... Life is miserable! We each exist for a miniscule, insignificant amount of time. Nothing we do will have any kind of impact in the grand scheme of the universe. Some people find that so depressing that they need to invent a scenario that puts them on "high" at the right hand of an invisible man, resting on mattress made of clouds.

    bogus!

    but I, sir, am no moper. I am content in my nothingness.

    that's your belief and i feel like you're shoving it down my throat
    No need to be void, or save up on life...
    You got to spend it all
  • harmless_little_f***
    harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    long red wrote:
    because it insinuates that I spend time classifying myself based on someone else's religious beliefs.

    Come on man, you either believe in God or you don't. 'Atheist' is no more a derogatory term than 'Astronaut' and atheists freely define themselves as atheists.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    you are wrote:
    that's your belief and i feel like you're shoving it down my throat

    because it's so delicious? I understand.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • orig_long red
    orig_long red Posts: 2,029
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    Come on man, you either believe in God or you don't. 'Atheist' is no more a derogatory term than 'Astronaut' and atheists freely define themselves as atheists.

    let the atheists define themselves as such. I chose not to. my belief system is without definition.
    Jam out with your clam out.
  • harmless_little_f***
    harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    long red wrote:
    let the atheists define themselves as such. I chose not to. my belief system is without definition.

    An astronaut cannot get away from the fact he is an astronaut. A table cannot get away from being a table. A tree cannot get away from being a tree. Now stop annoying me with your pseudo-Freidrich Nietzsche 'language means nothing' bullshit.

    Do you believe in God?
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison

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