Christians and Homosexuality

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  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    titefka wrote:
    Oh don't be so miscellaneous , a bad day ?I have a hangover ,it is not always so easy to express thoughts.
    I understood what you meant. :)
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    miller8966 wrote:
    the bible especially the new testament is a loving book..unlike the koran the bible is about spreading gods word through love and compassion for humans.


    Hahahaha....oh god.....Hahahahahaha.....I....Hahahaha....I can't.....Hahahahaha......I can't......stop .......laughing...Hahahahaha

    Oh man, that's the funniest shit you have ever posted, Miller!
  • brainofPJ
    brainofPJ Posts: 2,361
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    Well my thinking started when it suddenly struck me: Leviticus. It totally condemns people with any physical blemish, or anyone disabled, being in the priesthood; and of course, most of the Bible reinforces the damaging rubbish that says if you're disabled, it's because of some sin you've done.

    It isn't a sexual issue, granted. And I know there are still some morons who believe this. But what criteria do we use when picking and choosing what laws to still uphold in our day? Sexually, the Bible was explicitly against many sexual acts (and otherwise) we consider perfectly normal, and holy, now.

    I'm not making a case, necessarily, just explaining what started me off finding all this interesting. I've found an essay online, which is very thought-provoking. Here's the link, maybe we could discuss it?

    http://home.wanadoo.nl/inspiritus/Christian%20and%20Homosexual%20Gay%20or%20Lesbian.htm



    i have to say that points 1-14 are easily explained. the problem is many people just read what is in front of them and fail to do an in depth search of the scriptures. he's a professor? do a little more research in the scriptures and other historical accounts proving the Bible's authenticity.

    the Bible is very consistent in it's teachings.

    if i need to explain i will, later...too much right now. :)


    Esther's here and she's sick?

    hi Esther, now we are all going to be sick, thanks
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    brainofPJ wrote:
    i have to say that points 1-14 are easily explained. the problem is many people just read what is in front of them and fail to do an in depth search of the scriptures. he's a professor? do a little more research in the scriptures and other historical accounts proving the Bible's authenticity.

    the Bible is very consistent in it's teachings.

    if i need to explain i will, later...too much right now. :)
    I would love to hear the easy explanations regarding points 1-14.

    It makes sense that as a professor of biblical interpretation and as a minister that he might have been inclined to fail to do an indepth search of scriptures. ;)
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • keeponrockin
    keeponrockin Posts: 7,446
    miller8966 wrote:
    the bible especially the new testament is a loving book..unlike the koran the bible is about spreading gods word through love and compassion for humans.

    I have never seen one positive post out of you.
    Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
  • brainofPJ
    brainofPJ Posts: 2,361
    angelica wrote:
    I would love to hear the easy explanations regarding points 1-14.

    It makes sense that as a professor of biblical interpretation and as a minister that he might have been inclined to fail to do an indepth search of scriptures. ;)


    i would love to...it will just take time, things are getting hectic around here. but my no means do i want to avoid this...it's a good and interesting conversation.

    i failed to mention that i too am a minister. :)


    Esther's here and she's sick?

    hi Esther, now we are all going to be sick, thanks
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    brainofPJ wrote:
    i would love to...it will just take time, things are getting hectic around here. but my no means do i want to avoid this...it's a good and interesting conversation.

    i failed to mention that i too am a minister. :)
    I look forward to hearing it.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • boxwine_in_hell
    boxwine_in_hell Posts: 1,263
    This is an interesting question. Some biblical scholars have even gone so far as to allude that Jesus was a homosexual. Their argument is completely circumstantial but definately plausable. He was never married, he hung out with 12 other "Apostles".....etc, etc. Also, 2000 years ago homosexuality was much more tolerated and open. Just go look at some Roman mosaics and you'll see the lax attitude first hand toward homsexuality. Something to think about I guess.
    one foot in the door
    the other foot in the gutter
    sweet smell that they adore
    I think I'd rather smother
    -The Replacements-
  • titefka
    titefka Posts: 35
    angelica wrote:
    I understood what you meant. :)


    thank you angelica :)
    www.myspace.com/titefka
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    titefka wrote:
    thank you angelica :)
    You are welcome. :)
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • bicyclejoe
    bicyclejoe USA Posts: 1,203
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    Right, I'm a Christian. I was always 'taught' that a homosexual lifestyle is sinful. It's been getting my goat really recently, because, just suddenly, I'm starting to wonder why we think that as Christians. Because not all of us do. And, well, I've forgotten why I once did, as well.

    If you 'do' go with this line of thinking, could you refresh my memory? Because at present, I'm sort of scratching my head.

    If you 'do not' think that (i.e. if you're a Christian and for homosexuality, perhaps gay yourself) I'd love to have your opinion on why you are in the place you are theologically.

    Please, no stating the obvious people. No crap like 'Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve'. I know why I 'should' believe homosexuality is wrong. I just have my reasons as to whether I think it actually is in today's society. I can elaborate if anyone likes.

    Pearl Jam fan/Theology student here. Read the four Gospels, Christ does not speak of homosexuality once. More than anything, he teaches how we should treat our neighbors and the "least among us," especially the poor. There are 2,103 verses of Scripture pertaining to the poor. Jesus Christ
    only speaks of judgment once. It is not all about the things that the church
    bangs on about. It is not about sexual immorality. It is about the poor. "I was naked and you clothed me. I was a stranger and you let me in." This is at the heart of the gospel.
    My Pearl Jam Road: 10/22/90 Seattle | 12/22/90 Seattle, Moore Theater | 9/29/92 Seattle, Magnusson Park, Drop in the Park | 9/5/93 The Gorge, with Neil Young and Blind Melon | 7/20/06 Portland, Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall with Sleater-Kinney | 7/22/06 The Gorge, 10/21/06 Mountain View, Shoreline Ampitheatre, Bridge School Benefit | 9/21/09 Seattle | 9/22/09 Seattle | 9/26/09 Portland, OR | 7/14/2011 Eddie Vedder, Portland, OR | 11/29/13 Portland, OR
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    Here's a simple example that should be eye opening. I do think homosexuality is a sin just like many, many, many other sins that all of us commit, BUT people need to remember this:

    Paul wrote the majority of the New Testament and he was a MURDERER before he became a Christian. That simple fact demonstrates that people can be forgiven and used by God and we shouldn't alienate homosexuals from the church.

    To me, murder is the one sin that seems to be worse than others because if you kill someone who is not a Christian, you have condemned them to hell.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • harmless_little_f***
    harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    know1 wrote:
    To me, murder is the one sin that seems to be worse than others because if you kill someone who is not a Christian, you have condemned them to hell.

    I'm not sure I agreed with much of what you said; you're equating homosexuality with murder. I've heard it a million times before, but I'm not buying it. Homosexuals require 'forgiveness'; not really an 'original thought' I'm afraid.

    That said, this above kind of takes the cake. Really? You think that? God help you. Sorry, that's just really pissed me off. So all the people who are dying in Iraq right now who haven't met Jesus - kid, woman, man - are all going to hell... don't be so stupid dude.

    Yeah, you've opened my eyes, but not for the reason you hoped.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    know1 wrote:
    Paul wrote the majority of the New Testament and he was a MURDERER before he became a Christian. That simple fact demonstrates that people can be forgiven and used by God and we shouldn't alienate homosexuals from the church.

    Yeah, that was a great sequel. Can't wait for the third installment of the franchise. "The New, New Testament: Jesus and Bernie Out For The Weekend". I hear Scott Stapp has auditioned for the Jesus role.

    Can't wait for the trailers.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    my mother is as roman catholic as you can get and she supports gay marriage tooth and nail. on the other hand; most of the people i know are agnostic and athiests and hate gays to the point of boycotting their businesses; etc.
    my question is why do people assume it's christians that are anti-gay. being a christian means accepting everyone for what they are.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    I'm not sure I agreed with much of what you said; you're equating homosexuality with murder. I've heard it a million times before, but I'm not buying it. Homosexuals require 'forgiveness'; not really an 'original thought' I'm afraid.

    That said, this above kind of takes the cake. Really? You think that? God help you. Sorry, that's just really pissed me off. So all the people who are dying in Iraq right now who haven't met Jesus - kid, woman, man - are all going to hell... don't be so stupid dude.

    Yeah, you've opened my eyes, but not for the reason you hoped.

    hell is earth and people will be born again to earth until they reach enlightenment. God is inside everyone; be it any name you choose to call him. all religions lead to God. the enlightenment is a state of mind or a level of consiousness. God sent his son to many religions. as Jesus; Krishna; and other names. the root of all religions is love.
    more later. there's a thunderstorm overhead.
  • cornnifer
    cornnifer Posts: 2,130
    onelongsong wrote:
    my mother is as roman catholic as you can get and she supports gay marriage tooth and nail. on the other hand; most of the people i know are agnostic and athiests and hate gays to the point of boycotting their businesses; etc.
    my question is why do people assume it's christians that are anti-gay. being a christian means accepting everyone for what they are.


    Thank you. I've been making this and similar points forever. No one listens.
    "When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
  • harmless_little_f***
    harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    onelongsong wrote:
    hell is earth and people will be born again to earth until they reach enlightenment. God is inside everyone; be it any name you choose to call him. all religions lead to God. the enlightenment is a state of mind or a level of consiousness. God sent his son to many religions. as Jesus; Krishna; and other names. the root of all religions is love.
    more later. there's a thunderstorm overhead.

    Now don't get me wrong, I appreciate your input. But can't two Christians have a chat (incidentally, I was disagreeing with the poster I'd quoted) without someone jumping on the discussion and BOTH of their viewpoints with a far more politically correct viewpoint (which, obviously, is THE right one, because you say so)?
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • harmless_little_f***
    harmless_little_f*** Posts: 8,005
    onelongsong wrote:
    my mother is as roman catholic as you can get and she supports gay marriage tooth and nail. on the other hand; most of the people i know are agnostic and athiests and hate gays to the point of boycotting their businesses; etc.
    my question is why do people assume it's christians that are anti-gay. being a christian means accepting everyone for what they are.

    Well no, being a Christian means accepting people for who they are and, if they are leading sinful lives, helping them lovingly to change - therefore helping them to be different, the person who they are not at the moment, but are trying to become. Jesus rarely let sinful people stay exactly as they were.

    That said, whether Christians should be anti-gay is a seperate issue. People assume Christians are anti-gay because, well, loads of them are. It's an unfortunate truth, but it is the truth. My question was whether Christians should view homosexuality as 'sinful' at all.

    It's specifically a question for Christians, really, since obviously the majority of the board will view homosexuality as completely natural and OK with them.
    'We're learning songs for baby Jesus' birthday. His mum and dad were Merry and Joseph. He had a bed made of clay and the three kings bought him Gold, Frankenstein and Merv as presents.'

    - the great Sir Leo Harrison
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    harmless_little_f*** wrote:
    I'm not sure I agreed with much of what you said; you're equating homosexuality with murder. I've heard it a million times before, but I'm not buying it. Homosexuals require 'forgiveness'; not really an 'original thought' I'm afraid.

    That said, this above kind of takes the cake. Really? You think that? God help you. Sorry, that's just really pissed me off. So all the people who are dying in Iraq right now who haven't met Jesus - kid, woman, man - are all going to hell... don't be so stupid dude.

    Yeah, you've opened my eyes, but not for the reason you hoped.

    Absolutely not. I was NOT EQUATING homosexuality with murder by any means at all. I was equating homosexuality with all of the sins all of us commit and was saying that if God could forgive and use a murderer - which is much worse than homosexuality - it should be a lesson to all of us not to alienate anyone.

    Go back and read what I read again and see if you really think I said what you inferred here.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.

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