Joe Horn and Texas Law

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  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    soulsinging wrote:
    you get an armful of cd's and you get enough cash to get a nice rock of crack or bag of weed or 40 ounce. what more do you need?

    and that's suppose to be worth starttling a homeowner who will put a 2 inch hole through you?
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    onelongsong wrote:
    and that's suppose to be worth starttling a homeowner who will put a 2 inch hole through you?

    depends. it might be if you're a crackhead in withdrawal. it's rather unpleasant.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    Pacomc79 wrote:
    maybe he will make a few losers think twice about a home invasion next time.

    If you break into someones home you should be afraid of death. If you're not, what would stop anyone from doing it?

    Why investigate? They already know what happened. The investigation takes about 30 minutes and should take minimal paperwork. Two guys broke in putting the occupants of the domicile and their property in danger, they got shot, they died.

    Perhaps we aren't hard enough on people who invade homes and that's why it continues to occur at a rapid rate. It's not like we cut their hands off or arms off or something like they do in other countries, at worst they go to jail for a few months or years and learn how to become better criminals and thieves to not get caught as much.

    He knew as well as you and I calling the police was going to get no result for getting his property back.

    I just think if you choose commit a crime... you get what you get period. Is it the right course of action... hell no, but no one has to invade homes and steal property or murder people either.

    The police are mostly worthless when it comes to home invasion except after the fact and by that time whether they are murderers or thieves they don't get caught very often.

    It's not like vigilantism is rampant anyway especially considering the growing number of home invasions.

    He was home when they did it and they fucked up. I don't think we need to change any laws for two dead criminals.

    and we should also ask the question:
    "why did texas HAVE to enact that law?"

    great post btw.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    soulsinging wrote:
    depends. it might be if you're a crackhead in withdrawal. it's rather unpleasant.

    i wouldn't know.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    onelongsong wrote:
    i wouldn't know.

    you should see it firsthand sometime. maybe you'd learn something about sympathy and empathy.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    soulsinging wrote:
    you should see it firsthand sometime. maybe you'd learn something about sympathy and empathy.

    i caught my son with meth and called the police and put him in prison for 4 years.
    don't do the crime if you can't do the time.
    i still visit him every other week and he knows i did the right thing.
  • NoK
    NoK Posts: 824
    soulsinging wrote:
    you should see it firsthand sometime. maybe you'd learn something about sympathy and empathy.

    Why would you have sympathy or empathy for someone who willingly took drugs? Unless someone forced a needle into their arm I don't see myself getting sympathetic for a person suffering withdrawal.
  • Derrick
    Derrick Posts: 475
    A more in depth article, more damning of Joe Horn, but keep in mind he still operated inside the law as the law is written despite anything said in this article:
    http://wjz.com/national/joe.horn.shoots.2.570499.html
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    NoK wrote:
    Why would you have sympathy or empathy for someone who willingly took drugs? Unless someone forced a needle into their arm I don't see myself getting sympathetic for a person suffering withdrawal.

    that's how i saw it too. my best friend got caught up with cocaine. when he started smoking it he became a completely different person. i did everything i could to try to help him but he fought me tooth and nail because he didn't want help. that's why i put my kid in prison. that was the only place to clean him out and start talking some sense into him. he was mad at me for the first 60 days or so; but when the drugs were out of his system; he knew i saved his life.
  • Kel Varnsen
    Kel Varnsen Posts: 1,952
    onelongsong wrote:
    with all due respect kel; the legislators decided the penalty for robbing his neighbours house would be death if caught in the act; which they were. the legislators gave him the authority to dole out the punishment.
    there's no need for a homicide investigation because they were caught in the act. he was within the law so there'll be no trial.

    however; if they had lived; an investigation would be done for the robbery. a normal trial costs about $25K each for this type of crime. holding them in jail costs about $40K/year and keeping him on paper (probation, etc) about $5K/year. so he saved the taxpayers quite a bit.

    The way I read the story the law says you are allowed to use deadly force to defend yourself and your property. I have no problem with that if that is Texas law. But to me this wasn't defending protecting property since the break- in had already happened and the crooks were leaving (it was more like going on offence). To me this was no different than if he found out who they were and where they lived months later went to their house and shot them.

    From the story it also sounds like there would have to be some sort of investigation to see whether or not this guy acted within the law or not (at least that is what I got from the last paragraph). After which point I would think the local prosecutor would have to decide whether or not to charge this guy.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    onelongsong wrote:
    i caught my son with meth and called the police and put him in prison for 4 years.
    don't do the crime if you can't do the time.
    i still visit him every other week and he knows i did the right thing.

    i dunno. maybe rehab would have been a better place to start?

    at least on the upside your boy will come out with a good working knowledge of how to pull off a home invasion, a great set of prison tats, a white power membership card, and an asshole looser and sloppier than your logic.

    i thought your one friend had his whole life ruined by a felony conviction? so you gave your kid one? i mean, from your previous arguments, wouldn't your son be better off dead than a felon who will never be able to get a job for the rest of his life?

    anyway, can't say i blame him. if i had you for a father, i'd be taking drugs too.
  • NoK
    NoK Posts: 824
    onelongsong wrote:
    that's how i saw it too. my best friend got caught up with cocaine. when he started smoking it he became a completely different person. i did everything i could to try to help him but he fought me tooth and nail because he didn't want help. that's why i put my kid in prison. that was the only place to clean him out and start talking some sense into him. he was mad at me for the first 60 days or so; but when the drugs were out of his system; he knew i saved his life.

    Even though I would not be sympathetic in nature, I would resort to other ways to try and help them if they wanted my help. I think prison will hold too much consequences for the future (i.e. you will have a record for the rest of your life). That will affect your job, your travels and many other things.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    NoK wrote:
    Why would you have sympathy or empathy for someone who willingly took drugs? Unless someone forced a needle into their arm I don't see myself getting sympathetic for a person suffering withdrawal.

    sometimes people make mistakes. i believe in giving people a second chance to make good for those mistakes before locking them away.
  • flywallyfly
    flywallyfly Posts: 1,453
    onelongsong wrote:
    i caught my son with meth and called the police and put him in prison for 4 years.
    don't do the crime if you can't do the time.
    i still visit him every other week and he knows i did the right thing.

    Something tells me you dont get any Father's Day cards. Just a hunch.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    nevermind.
  • NoK
    NoK Posts: 824
    soulsinging wrote:
    sometimes people make mistakes. i believe in giving people a second chance to make good for those mistakes before locking them away.

    Definately. Perhaps you can read post #33. I will try to help in whatever way I can but I will not be sympathetic. Big difference.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    NoK wrote:
    Definately. Perhaps you can read post #33. I will try to help in whatever way I can but I will not be sympathetic. Big difference.

    semantics.
  • Derrick
    Derrick Posts: 475
    Kel Varnsen wrote:
    The way I read the story the law says you are allowed to use deadly force to defend yourself and your property. I have no problem with that if that is Texas law. But to me this wasn't defending protecting property since the break- in had already happened and the crooks were leaving (it was more like going on offence). To me this was no different than if he found out who they were and where they lived months later went to their house and shot them.

    From the story it also sounds like there would have to be some sort of investigation to see whether or not this guy acted within the law or not (at least that is what I got from the last paragraph). After which point I would think the local prosecutor would have to decide whether or not to charge this guy.


    Unfortunately, you can shoot someone legally if they are in the act of robbery (in Texas).


    The actor's belief that the force was
    immediately necessary as described by this subsection is presumed
    to be reasonable if the actor knew or had reason to believe that the
    person against whom the force was used:
    (1) unlawfully entered, or was attempting to enter
    unlawfully, the actor's habitation, vehicle, or place of business
    or employment;
    (2) unlawfully removed, or was attempting to remove
    unlawfully, the actor from the actor's habitation, vehicle, or
    place of business or employment; or
    (3) was committing or attempting to commit aggravated
    kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault,
    robbery, or aggravated robbery.
  • NoK
    NoK Posts: 824
    soulsinging wrote:
    semantics.

    Not true. You can offer help but not sympathy.

    1) Help with sympathy: You will continue to try to help even if they refuse. There will be an emotional bondage involved.

    2) Help without sympathy: "If you don't want my help then get f*cked."

    Anyways this isn't the subject of the thread.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    NoK wrote:
    Not true. You can offer help but not sympathy.

    1) Help with sympathy: You will continue to try to help even if they refuse. There will be an emotional bondage involved.

    2) Help without sympathy: "If you don't want my help then get f*cked."

    Anyways this isn't the subject of the thread.

    i see any help as sympathy, period. no sympathy would be "tough shit dickhead, solve your own problem." your first example sounds more like enabling.

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