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9/11 Mysteries

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    You are exactly right. It did take longer than near free fall speed for these building to fall. Conspiracy theorists say they fell at free fall speed or even faster.

    This is from Debunking911.com

    The mechanics of the collapse are really much more simple than conspiracy theorists would like you to believe. The heat expanded the steel in the truss in all directions. As a result they also expanded into the columns. The trusses/floor system, sagged in the middle because the columns were preventing the trusses from expanding in their direction. That led to the bowing of the exterior columns.

    In terms of mass, the floors were comparable to tree trunks and the columns were like branches. The floor connections of the long span floors could support a load of a couple story masses and had an energy absorbing ability of a couple hundredths of a GJ per story. The floor connections were like crepe connecting the floors to the columns. The crepe was sufficient for the structure in its static organized state but was a weak link during collapse when the structure in the region of the collapse front no longer resembled the static organized state.

    Listen to the NIST lead investigator explain the leading hypothesis for the towers collapse.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/wtc/sund-flash.html

    Oh if you listen to the govt reports and hold them up as sacred testament you're in some serious trouble for reality.

    Are you saying the entire building top to bottom was all heated up like "licorice" Do you think the heat was localized or systemic?

    There was a lot of good pristine building unaffected by any heat in the slightest to cave through like warm butter without slowing down.

    In the case of #7 the building just seemed to melt into the ground. Hmm steel turns into jello with a little open fire ...amazing how that works eh? Not!

    Oh yes....very real life scenario indeed :rolleyes:
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
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    MakingWavesMakingWaves Posts: 1,288
    Oh if you listen to the govt reports and hold them up as sacred testament you're in some serious trouble for reality.

    Are you saying the entire building top to bottom was all heated up like "licorice" Do you think the heat was localized or systemic?

    There was a lot of good pristine building unaffected by any heat in the slightest to cave through like warm butter without slowing down.

    In the case of #7 the building just seemed to melt into the ground. Hmm steel turns into jello with a little open fire ...amazing how that works eh? Not!

    Oh yes....very real life scenario indeed :rolleyes:

    I don't even understand what you are arguing about. We all know the buildings collapsed so what is your point?
    Seeing visions of falling up somehow.

    Pensacola '94
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    MakingWavesMakingWaves Posts: 1,288
    The black boxes will explain everything...the firemen found them and turned them in...oh but now they are lost...they never existed now

    uhhh fucking ...oops!

    hmm

    I seem to remember them playing the cockpit recordings for all the families.

    Again, what are we saying here. The planes were on autopilot and no one were on these planes??
    Seeing visions of falling up somehow.

    Pensacola '94
    New Orleans '95
    Birmingham '98
    New Orleans '00
    New Orleans '03
    Tampa '08
    New Orleans '10 - Jazzfest
    New Orleans '16 - Jazzfest
    Fenway Park '18
    St. Louis '22
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    I seem to remember them playing the cockpit recordings for all the families.

    Again, what are we saying here. The planes were on autopilot and no one were on these planes??

    I like how you keep adding one extra thing in your own words trying to lead somewhere like I'm saying it...lol priceless.

    Autopilot exists right? Yes. That's all. Are They concealing the black boxes? Yes. You see these are all facts.

    one of several thousands of links re this:
    http://www.counterpunch.org/lindorff12202005.html
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
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    I don't even understand what you are arguing about. We all know the buildings collapsed so what is your point?

    Maybe try to answer the questions instead of scratching your head.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
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    El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    autopilot anyone?


    back in the 80's nasa and the miliary successfully launched and landed a 747 by remote....
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
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    gue_bariumgue_barium Posts: 5,515
    El_Kabong wrote:
    back in the 80's nasa and the miliary successfully launched and landed a 747 by remote....

    Yup.

    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
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    gue_bariumgue_barium Posts: 5,515
    I don't even understand what you are arguing about. We all know the buildings collapsed so what is your point?

    They were collapsed by incendiary explosive means.

    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
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    Since nobody bumped your 9/11 thread g, figured I would.


    I would hope that 15 years later, people can understand that those towers falling was a direct result of the planes crashing into them and the subsequent fires.
    will myself to find a home, a home within myself
    we will find a way, we will find our place
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    Since nobody bumped your 9/11 thread g, figured I would.


    I would hope that 15 years later, people can understand that those towers falling was a direct result of the planes crashing into them and the subsequent fires.

    You're hoping for way too much in these parts of the woods. Common Sense 101 doesn't fly around here. 15 years later, common sense is obviously computer generated planes, planted eyewitnesses and other shit.
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    mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 27,863

    Since nobody bumped your 9/11 thread g, figured I would.


    I would hope that 15 years later, people can understand that those towers falling was a direct result of the planes crashing into them and the subsequent fires.

    You're hoping for way too much in these parts of the woods. Common Sense 101 doesn't fly around here. 15 years later, common sense is obviously computer generated planes, planted eyewitnesses and other shit.
    I want to hear some conspiracy theories god damn it! I want to hear why the us government murdered nearly 3000 of it's own people to do something....
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
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    Always fun to see old threads get bumped and be reminded of some of the old board members that no longer post. Thanks Just Breathe!
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    Ughhh for oil, to take away civil liberties and to rally the nation for war! Duh!
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    Yes! ledvedderman - you read my posts!
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    mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 27,863

    Yes! ledvedderman - you read my posts!

    I m guessing he s being very sarcastic
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
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    mcgruff10 said:

    Yes! ledvedderman - you read my posts!

    I m guessing he s being very sarcastic
    He most certainly is.
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    brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,701
    I'd rather be skeptical than sarcastic and I've done both here. I often regret the latter.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













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    I have been known to be a little sarcastic.

    I read all the posts here to catch up, and I didn't see any that come close to mine, so mcgruff - you asked for it:

    I think there are at least 3 levels of stories at play here (maybe more, but I'm currently at level 3)
    1) The official story - 19 dudes from Saudi Arabia or wherever hijacked 4 planes, blah blah blah. A story so full of holes and ridiculousness that the scientists and architects would cry fowl (by design). This story is going to render with 80% of the population, no questions asked (no offense to anyone here, I was at this level for 15 years, oops).
    2) The let's give conspiracy theorists and those scientists something to ponder for awhile - oh my, we found thermite in the dust! This is a controlled demo! What the hell? The scientists will demand a new investigation but never get one. This will go on for years. This level is for the 10% of folks that do a little digging (but not too far as the nice actor in the video link I sent in the other thread tells us - just stop at the towers and don't go any further!).
    3) This could be the real story, maybe not, but this then is the last 10%. This one is for the people who really dig but then once the people at this level figure it out and they tell people they get laughed at and ridiculed.
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    mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 27,863
    comatose, just to let you know i'm a conspiracy theory junkie. I absolutely love them. I've been teaching history for over 15 years and have a ba and some masters credits in history and ba in education.
    I meet seem it but I'm totally not yelling you at all, just trying to have some sort of intellectual discussion. let's do this!

    oh and by the way, I do admit when I'm wrong and am very open minded.
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
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    Nice!
    Since you have a lyric in your signature from one of my all time fav PJ songs, here goes:
    Let's start with the 2 towers. Ponder this:
    - No planes hit the buildings (there is the possibility nothing hit the buildings at all - pure CGI, followed by more CGI or explosives - I forget)
    - The towers were gutted prior to 9/11 - over the course of their history, they were probably not more than 30% capacity - they especially had trouble getting tenants after '93. I remember the clean up crews saying 'no door knobs, no desks, no phones' when going through the wreckage.
    - I think 2 fake companies were made up to make it seem like they were on the floors where the impact was - Cantor Fitzgerald comes to mind. These 2 companies comprised of about 1000 of the victims.
    - Google the 'Italian Artists Twin Towers' - they were in the building for 4 years I think prior to 2001. You will see them hanging out the windows and dropping dummies
    - I don't think the actual collapse of the buildings were shown on TV - CGI I think to throw off people with the molten steel and puffs of smoke and things like that
    Pretty crazy eh?
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    Crud - scratch the Italian artists search - i forget where i saw them at
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    So the Twin Towers was both CGI and "dropping dummies"?
    Come on, man. Those are people who jumped out of a real building because a real fire was closing in on them. They could either jump to a sure death or burn to death.
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    Here's the link I stumbled upon when researching this stuff - it goes into pretty good detail about how we shouldn't be so quick to believe TV.
    http://septemberclues.info/
    Gotta run - happy reading!
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,000
    So what happened to the real towers then? Not one of the millions of people captured the video or even saw it for that matter, or did the government kill anyone who witnessed the real collapse?
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    I literally almost stopped reading with the CGI comment. Then again with the buildings being gutted. Then again with "dropping dummies".
    Honestly, that sort of talk just discredits your whole argument and therefor disqualifies anything further you say.
    There are holes in the investigation that deserve answers. But that won't happen when far out theories like this are taken seriously.
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    hedonisthedonist standing on the edge of forever Posts: 24,524
    Man, I'm glad I didn't lose anyone in the towers, or at the Pentagon, or among those on Flight 93.

    Declaring the people who jumped to their deaths in the most horrific of situations as fakes is fucking insulting to them, and to those who loved them. And to all of those who were there to search for their bodies, and bring some dignity to their deaths, to how their lives ended.

    "Happy reading" indeed.

    Jesus.
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    /\ Indeed. I had a whole angry reply to that typed up but deleted. Very insulting.
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,000
    Just from the basics, why is it difficult to believe that a jumbo jet crashing into a sky scraper, completely destroying portion of the building that are required to keep it standing in the process, would fall without additional explosives?
    To me that's just the basic question, and the theories get more ridiculous from there requiring thousands of people to be involved.
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    I'm back. What if the people were also made up? Ever think that?
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    And the families might be actors? I'm not saying no one died but it's prob wayyy lower then we heard.
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