The white students who hung the nooses played a very stupid prank. They were punished accordingly. The choice they made did not cause physical harm to anyone.
The black students who beat the white kid to a pulp that landed him in the hospital should indeed be prosecuted for assault. The choice they made did cause physical harm to someone.
The later actions are not excused by the prior.
Try looking at this without the racial aspect. Take the color out of it and apply it to bullying in general.
Nonsense, you're looking at it likes it black and white when it's not. Take a look and read on the sequence of events in an atmosphere of 80% white students and a town about the same.
JACQUIE SOOHEN: A few days after the nooses were hung, the entire black student body staged an impromptu demonstration, crowding underneath the tree during lunch hour. Justin Purvis, the student who first asked to sit underneath the tree, described how the protest came about.
JUSTIN PURVIS: It was like, the first beginning, in the courtyard, they said, “Y’all want to go stand under the tree?” We said, “Yeah.” They said, “If you go, I’ll go. If you go, I’ll go.” One person went, the next person went, everybody else just went.
JACQUIE SOOHEN: The school responded to the protest by calling police and the district attorney. At an assembly the same day, the District Attorney Reed Walters, accompanied by armed policeman, addressed the students. Substitute teacher Michelle Rogers, one of the few black teachers at the school, was there. She recalls the DA's words to the assembled high schoolers.
MICHELLE ROGERS: The kids didn't say anything. They were listening. The kids were quiet. And so, District Attorney Reed Walters, you know, proceeded to tell those kids that “I could end your lives with the stroke of a pen.” And the kids were just -- it was like in awe that the district -- you know, Reed Walters would tell these kids that. He held a pen in his hand and told those kids that, “See this pen in my hand? I can end your lives with the stroke of a pen.”
JACQUIE SOOHEN: A series of incidents followed throughout the fall. In October, a black student was beaten for entering a private all-white party. Later that month, a white student pulled a gun on a group of black students at a gas station, claiming self-defense. The black students wrestled the gun away and reported the incident to police. They were charged with assault and robbery of the gun. No charges were ever filed against the white students in either incident. Then, in late November, someone tried to burn down the high school, creating even more tension.
Four days later, a white student was allegedly attacked in a school fight. The victim was taken to hospital and released shortly with a concussion. He attended a school function that evening. Six black students were charged with attempted second-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder, on charges that leave them facing between twenty and one hundred years in jail. The defendants, ranging in age from fifteen to seventeen, had their bonds set at between $70,000 and $138,000. The attack was written up in the local paper as fact, and DA Reed Walters published a statement in which he said, "When you are convicted, I will seek the maximum penalty allowed by law."
Here's the full interview from Democracy Now @ JENA SIX. One of the charges was assault with a deadly weapon and that weapon turns out to be a tennis shoe just to get that charge on the books.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Why would you argue with the owner about his sign, and then call him names at HIS business? If you didnt like it, you could have left.
I couldn't leave because a bus took you there from New Orleans and left after it dropped the tour off and wasn't coming back for three hours. We decided it would be safer if we stuck together, rather than 3 girls being seperated from the whole group in the middle of an alligator swamp. Trust me, if there was a way to leave, I most definitely would have.
I did get a bit of revenge when I got back to the city, tho. Every brochure of theirs I saw in all of the travel kiosks I threw in the garbage.
And BTW, if it had said in the brochure that people would be subjected to racist signs upon entry, I would never had gone.
"Where there is sacrifice there is someone collecting the sacrificial offerings."-- Ayn Rand
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
I couldn't leave because a bus took you there from New Orleans and left after it dropped the tour off and wasn't coming back for three hours. We decided it would be safer if we stuck together, rather than 3 girls being seperated from the whole group in the middle of an alligator swamp. Trust me, if there was a way to leave, I most definitely would have.
I did get a bit of revenge when I got back to the city, tho. Every brochure of theirs I saw in all of the travel kiosks I threw in the garbage.
And BTW, if it had said in the brochure that people would be subjected to racist signs upon entry, I would never had gone.
Perhaps it would have been smarter to wait until after the tour to say something?
What your opinion of racist is not going to be the same as someone elses. You went to his place. Regardless of how you felt about his sign, you still were at his place, and to get all pissed off, and resort to name calling (in his mind, perhaps calling him a redneck is just as bad as him calling a black person a Coon).. and then your revenge for him not kicking your ass out of his tour, you go back to town, and destroy his advertisements? and why exactly is HE the problem?
umkay.....traps similar to what one sees in cartoons are actually used..go figure.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
Perhaps it would have been smarter to wait until after the tour to say something?
What your opinion of racist is not going to be the same as someone elses. You went to his place. Regardless of how you felt about his sign, you still were at his place, and to get all pissed off, and resort to name calling (in his mind, perhaps calling him a redneck is just as bad as him calling a black person a Coon).. and then your revenge for him not kicking your ass out of his tour, you go back to town, and destroy his advertisements? and why exactly is HE the problem?
isn't this a tad apologetic for the owners ... it's like - it's ok to be racist because it's a private function ... i agree for the most part ultimately, one can choose to not support organizations they feel are racist but she had no way of knowing ...
anyhoo - if an assault on someone who doesn't even spend a night at the hospital warrants 22 years - it's pretty tragic ...
isn't this a tad apologetic for the owners ... it's like - it's ok to be racist because it's a private function ... i agree for the most part ultimately, one can choose to not support organizations they feel are racist but she had no way of knowing ...
anyhoo - if an assault on someone who doesn't even spend a night at the hospital warrants 22 years - it's pretty tragic ...
Legally, yeah, its okay to be racist as long as you arent hurting or threatening anyone. As well it should be- Just because i dont agree with it, doesnt mean it should be illegal.
I just dont think it was appropriate to start calling HIM names. It brought her down to his level, and then to go the extra step of attempting to damage his business by destroying brouchures he had paid for is ridiculous.
If it had been a black business owner with a sign that said "Cracker Count," do you think she would have called that owner a Nigger? Doubtful. Hateful words are hateful words.
Legally, yeah, its okay to be racist as long as you arent hurting or threatening anyone. As well it should be- Just because i dont agree with it, doesnt mean it should be illegal.
I just dont think it was appropriate to start calling HIM names. It brought her down to his level, and then to go the extra step of attempting to damage his business by destroying brouchures he had paid for is ridiculous.
If it had been a black business owner with a sign that said "Cracker Count," do you think she would have called that owner a Nigger? Doubtful. Hateful words are hateful words.
i'm guessing she would react the same way ... i could be wrong ...
i dunno - i view this sometimes like violence against women ... for too long - people have kept their mouths shut in order not to stir the shit - but there comes a time when things need to be put out there ...
like my original post in this thread said - america isn't interested in knowing they are a racist country ... it doesn't sit well with their ideals of who they think they are ... they'd much rather brush these things aside and focus on other things ...
Legally, yeah, its okay to be racist as long as you arent hurting or threatening anyone. As well it should be- Just because i dont agree with it, doesnt mean it should be illegal.
I just dont think it was appropriate to start calling HIM names. It brought her down to his level, and then to go the extra step of attempting to damage his business by destroying brouchures he had paid for is ridiculous.
If it had been a black business owner with a sign that said "Cracker Count," do you think she would have called that owner a Nigger? Doubtful. Hateful words are hateful words.
I'm having trouble posting so I'm not sure if this is going to go thru...
As I posted originally, the sign at the swamp tour had a noose as did the tree that the white boys hung them on in Jena. Nooses ARE taken as a threat by the black population because of all the lynching in the slavery days. It's obvious they have no problem threatening people, because they certainly did it to me.
Secondly, if the brochure had "Arian Nation Swamp Tour" on it I would have had the option not to go. Or if I did decide to go, I would have known full well what I was getting into. It's not fair to put out brochures that seem welcoming to "everyone", and when you get to the tour there are racist materials posted. Which is why I had no problem throwing them out. Let them be a little more honest in their advertising about their preference of color.
And thirdly, yes, I'm sorry I offended "rednecks" by lumping this scum in with them. By definiton a "redneck" is a poor, uneducated person from the American south. I should have called him a racist piece of garbage.
Of course I would have been smarter to wait until after the tour to confront the owner. But he was there at that time, and might not have been when I got back. And I really wanted to discuss it with him.
"Where there is sacrifice there is someone collecting the sacrificial offerings."-- Ayn Rand
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
I'm having trouble posting so I'm not sure if this is going to go thru...
As I posted originally, the sign at the swamp tour had a noose as did the tree that the white boys hung them on in Jena. Nooses ARE taken as a threat by the black population because of all the lynching in the slavery days. It's obvious they have no problem threatening people, because they certainly did it to me.
Secondly, if the brochure had "Arian Nation Swamp Tour" on it I would have had the option not to go. Or if I did decide to go, I would have known full well what I was getting into. It's not fair to put out brochures that seem welcoming to "everyone", and when you get to the tour there are racist materials posted. Which is why I had no problem throwing them out. Let them be a little more honest in their advertising about their preference of color.
And thirdly, yes, I'm sorry I offended "rednecks" by lumping this scum in with them. By definiton a "redneck" is a poor, uneducated person from the American south. I should have called him a racist piece of garbage.
Of course I would have been smarter to wait until after the tour to confront the owner. But he was there at that time, and might not have been when I got back. And I really wanted to discuss it with him.
Lynching is more of a post-slavery thing, but it went on in other places besides the South.
Redneck, by definition, is now universal. In other words, you can be a redneck and be from Boston.
Racial divisions in Louisiana are evolving even as we speak. The influx of Latino workers post-Katrina is adding additional tension to an area where there were at least three different cultures trying to carve out their niche....the cajuns, the blacks and the whites.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
And thirdly, yes, I'm sorry I offended "rednecks" by lumping this scum in with them. By definiton a "redneck" is a poor, uneducated person from the American south. I should have called him a racist piece of garbage.
Um.. Using the term "redneck" was an attempt to insult a person based on their cultural standing.
Calling a Southern, Country folk a redneck is like calling a black person any offensive name.
You are just as bad as the person you are so upset at.
I would like some of you to let me and 5 of my friends stomp on you repeatedly and then call it a "fist fight". a fist fight involves 2 people and 2 sets of fists, not 6 people stomping on 1 person. I swear some of the stupidest people on earth exist on this message board.
btw, somebody said "coon" is a bad word derived from such a "cute animal". my god. a raccoon is one of the nastiest animals on earth, both in demeanor and in the diseases they carry, get a clue. also, they are "hunted" with dogs, but they are "trapped" with traps. and if you're so offended by the use of the sign, don't go there, it IS a free country afterall.
there are plenty 'backwards' people and places in the south, just like the north. some of the most racist people I've ever met come from the north and the most racist person I've ever known is from Philly, so get off that "the south is such a racist place" crap.
I was in Daytona beach about 10 years ago. I thought I was going down for spring break, MTV, naked chicks, the whole deal. It was actually what is called "Black College Reunion" week. Its essentially when the "black" colleges break for spring and many head to Daytona Beach. It was an interresting experience to say the least to truely be the minority. That said, it was a great week and my white ass met a lot of cool people, of all colors and cultures.
I own property in Daytona Beach, and stay down there every chance I get...and you are blowing that whole thing WAY out of proportion. If anything, the businesses cater to african americans that week.
I own property in Daytona Beach, and stay down there every chance I get...and you are blowing that whole thing WAY out of proportion. If anything, the businesses cater to african americans that week.
Not when I was there. I am not bullshitting or blowing anything out of proportion either. I would never had known this event even existed had I not been there for it. You hear of bike week and spring break all over the place. Has anyone else in here ever heard of black college reunion week in Daytona?
Maybe I happened to be in the only two souvenier shops that were run by blatantly open racists who close their shops during this week. Who knows. Maybe I was in the only restaurant where they were openly racists, and apparently felt it was ok to be that way as long as it was in front of "whites". Who knows. I doubt it, but I guess anything is possible. My friend lived an half hour north of Daytona, and he told me stories about people closing shops and how they schedule their vacations around this event as well.
All that's sacred, comes from youth....dedications, naive and true.
Not when I was there. I am not bullshitting or blowing anything out of proportion either. I would never had known this event even existed had I not been there for it. You hear of bike week and spring break all over the place. Has anyone else in here ever heard of black college reunion week in Daytona?
Maybe I happened to be in the only two souvenier shops that were run by blatantly open racists who close their shops during this week. Who knows. Maybe I was in the only restaurant where they were openly racists, and apparently felt it was ok to be that way as long as it was in front of "whites". Who knows. I doubt it, but I guess anything is possible. My friend lived an half hour north of Daytona, and he told me stories about people closing shops and how they schedule their vacations around this event as well.
But is it blatently racist if they sustain significant losses via theft during that specific week? Can you really blame them for closing their business if it isnt profitable, just so they dont appear "racist". Sure, calling them niggers is over the line, but im willing to bet, if it made business sense to stay open, they probably would.
Um.. Using the term "redneck" was an attempt to insult a person based on their cultural standing.
Calling a Southern, Country folk a redneck is like calling a black person any offensive name.
You are just as bad as the person you are so upset at.
Yes, you're right! I am just as bad as the guy who hung a confederate flag and hung nooses against blacks on his property. And ya know, just the other day a supposed "friend" sent me a dumb blonde joke, and I thought, how dare this stereotyping racist send me a dumb blonde joke! She's just as bad as those people in the KKK! Next thing you know, she'll burn a bottle of peroxide on my lawn!
:rolleyes:
"Where there is sacrifice there is someone collecting the sacrificial offerings."-- Ayn Rand
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
Yes, you're right! I am just as bad as the guy who hung a confederate flag and*hung nooses against blacks on his property. And ya know, the just the other day a supposed "friend" sent me a dumb blonde joke, and I thought, how dare this stereotyping racist send me a dumb blonde joke! She's just as bad as those people in the KKK! Next thing you know, she'll burn a bottle of peroxide on my lawn!
A dumb blonde joke is totally different- its an attempt at HUMOR. his awful racist sign, was, a tasteless attempt at HUMOR. you calling him a redneck in ANGER is probably worse.
If he was truly a real hating racist, he probably would have said something to the black folk you mentioned that were there. Hell, he might have denied them entry. Instead he was a guy with some prejudices that are deep rooted as part of his culture.. but it sounds like he was accepting of them (or at least their money). You on the other hand, decided to attack his culture and call him a name based on a stereotype.
So no, i guess its not the same thing. You're worse.
A dumb blonde joke is totally different- its an attempt at HUMOR. his awful racist sign, was, a tasteless attempt at HUMOR. you calling him a redneck in ANGER is probably worse.
If he was truly a real hating racist, he probably would have said something to the black folk you mentioned that were there. Hell, he might have denied them entry. Instead he was a guy with some prejudices that are deep rooted as part of his culture.. but it sounds like he was accepting of them (or at least their money). You on the other hand, decided to attack his culture and call him a name based on a stereotype.
So no, i guess its not the same thing. You're worse.
The guy wanted to take their money AND humiliate them. Obviously.
Calling people names in anger is a very common thing, and often regretted later. This man took his time to hang offensive racist signs and a confederate flag at his place of business, and had plenty of time to think about what he was doing and he was still fine with it. Which I think is worse. Just because something is deep seated doesn't make it right. Your reasoning is just so far gone I can't even argue this anymore. It's just become beyond ridiculous.
BTW, from reading your past few posts, you seem very sympathetic to these white (seemingly) racist business owners. You don't happen to own an Alligator Swamp tour business in Louisiana, do you?
"Where there is sacrifice there is someone collecting the sacrificial offerings."-- Ayn Rand
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
The guy wanted to take their money AND humiliate them. Obviously.
Calling people names in anger is a very common thing, and often regretted later. This man took his time to hang offensive racist signs and a confederate flag at his place of business, and had plenty of time to think about what he was doing and he was still fine with it. Which I think is worse. Just because something is deep seated doesn't make it right. Your reasoning is just so far gone I can't even argue this anymore. It's just become beyond ridiculous.
BTW, from reading your past few posts, you seem very sympathetic to these white (seemingly) racist business owners. You don't happen to own an Alligator Swamp tour business in Louisiana, do you?
The coon thing can be debated as being racist, although in this case it appears as though it was in a racist fashion, so ill grant you that. It is part of his culture. an ugly part, but part of it. The Flag thing DOES NOT MEAN RACISM to many many many many people in the south. It may to you, and thats fine if thats your perception of what the flag stands for, but dont pretend to know what it means to him.
So if he was angry and called a black person a Nigger, thats better then hanging an offensive sign? Sorry, you called someone a name based on a negative stereotype. I dont care if its nigger, kike, polack, daigo, spic, gook, or redneck... you did it. You're no better, so maybe you should take a couple of steps down off that soapbox.
So he wants to humiliate black people? Good thing Mama Whitey is there to protect them from his evil redneck ways.
So because i present a counter point to your over the top actions and a possible explanation to a point made in another post i must be a racist too?
Glad race relations is so Cut and Dry to you, that no other point can be made without you pointing the damning finger of "Racist"
Apparently people in the South still believe that it is 1930 and blatant racism is acceptable.
In Jena, Louisiana there is a large tree in front of the town high school. Apparently the white students used to congregate under the tree during breaks. One day a black student decided to sit down under this tree. The next day three nooses were hung from the tree. The superintendent wrote it off as a prank and suspended the responsible students for three days. The blacks were upset by this and racial tension began to increase. A few months pass and several scuffles take place. One night a group of black students get into a fight with a white student, causing the white student to be hospitalized and released later that day. Following the fight, the black students were arrested and charged with attempted murder and face 20-100 yrs in jail.
This is obviously just a summary so go to jenasix.org to get the full story.
The fact that this story is receiving very little national coverage is despicable.
Fucking ignorant southerners. Sorry to generalize, (and sorry for offending those of you down there) but the south is basically 50 years behind the rest of the country. Maybe some day they'll evolve and PJ will actually give them a show....
Fucking ignorant southerners. Sorry to generalize, (and sorry for offending those of you down there) but the south is basically 50 years behind the rest of the country. Maybe some day they'll evolve and PJ will actually give them a show....
lol...priceless...
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
Fucking ignorant southerners. Sorry to generalize, (and sorry for offending those of you down there) but the south is basically 50 years behind the rest of the country. Maybe some day they'll evolve and PJ will actually give them a show....
ashville was VERY nice when we went down for the 2004 VFC tour. progressive and friendly little city with a few great bars. camping was great down there as well. amazing little corner of the world. but thats really the extent of my limited experience in the south.
not to mention that scalper had no clue he sold me 5th row floor right in front of mike fucking mccready... my friend shit his pants when i came back to the bar, threw them down on the table and ordered a round of shots!
The coon thing can be debated as being racist, although in this case it appears as though it was in a racist fashion, so ill grant you that. It is part of his culture. an ugly part, but part of it. The Flag thing DOES NOT MEAN RACISM to many many many many people in the south. It may to you, and thats fine if thats your perception of what the flag stands for, but dont pretend to know what it means to him.
So if he was angry and called a black person a Nigger, thats better then hanging an offensive sign? Sorry, you called someone a name based on a negative stereotype. I dont care if its nigger, kike, polack, daigo, spic, gook, or redneck... you did it. You're no better, so maybe you should take a couple of steps down off that soapbox.
So he wants to humiliate black people? Good thing Mama Whitey is there to protect them from his evil redneck ways.
So because i present a counter point to your over the top actions and a possible explanation to a point made in another post i must be a racist too?
Glad race relations is so Cut and Dry to you, that no other point can be made without you pointing the damning finger of "Racist"
Ummm... who's the one on the soap box?? You're the one who seems to be making all the statements about what the rules of racism are here. As per you: If you say a racist comment in anger you're even more of a racist. If you say it with humor it's not as bad. If it's inbred with your culture it's not nice, but somewhat excusable and you can make some allowances for it. And I shouldn't pretend to know what is racist to some, (like the confederate flag) because it might mean something different to many, many, many WHITE southerners. Even though the NAACP, NCCJ, Bill Clinton (a southern man) along with many other organizations feel it's a racist symbol of white domination over blacks. Two African American girls in my office, one who lived in Texas and the other in Georgia, when I asked them about it, both felt it was a symbol of hatred and discrimination. But, as you point out, I'M in no position to judge it or him. But, of course, you are ok to judge me. And I think I got a pretty clear idea of what it means to him, because it was right by the sign with the noose.
In my original post, (note: NOT edited in any way) I wrote I "made the mistake of calling him a redneck" (meaning I didn't realize it was such a loaded, negative word) and you call me lower than low, but yet in every post I've read from you, you come up with a defense for the white business owners in Florida and a man who hangs nooses and confederate flags at his business, and yet how dare I "point the damning finger of racist" (soap box lingo if I ever heard it, btw) at you, when I never even wrote that. I said you "seemed sympathetic" and then made a joke about owning an alligator swamp business. If racism is "cut and dried" to anyone here, it's you.
And I take offense to being called Mama Whitey. It's a racist label!:D (I hope it wasnt said by you in anger! :eek:You know what that means!)
"Where there is sacrifice there is someone collecting the sacrificial offerings."-- Ayn Rand
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
Apparently people in the South still believe that it is 1930 and blatant racism is acceptable.
People in the "South"? Everyone in the South is guilty of racism because of this incident? I'm always inclined to think that the people involved in the situation are the guilty ones..not everyone that lives in the same geographical area. I'm so tired of these Southern racist generalizations.
The town of Jena, La., is coping with a case of racially motivated violence, even as court proceedings against those involved move forward. The case, centering on a tree at a high school campus that was a favorite meeting place for white students, has exposed racial tensions in the small town.
Earlier this week, a judge threw out one of the two charges against the first black student tried for beating up a white student at Jena High School, saying juveniles cannot be charged with conspiracy in adult court.
But Judge J.P. Mauffray Jr. rejected arguments that, for the same reason, he should throw out the aggravated second-degree battery charge on which Mychal Bell also was convicted. The judge's decision means Bell will face at most 15 years in prison, rather than 22.5, when he is sentenced Sept. 20.
The case's beginnings can be traced to a day when black students at Jena High sat under a tree that was known traditionally as a white student hangout. Shortly afterward, three nooses were found hanging from the tree.
That sparked a series of racially charged events, culminating in a schoolyard attack of a white student and the arrest of six black teenagers for the crime.
"The mood of Jena is very, very bad," said the Rev. Brian Moran, pastor of Antioch Baptist Church in Jena.
Noting that the black students who sat under the tree had asked the principal's permission to do so, Moran said that immediately after they sat there, the nooses appeared.
"It really confuses me why anybody would say that this is not a racist situation," Moran said.
Students accused of placing the nooses on the tree were suspended from school for a short period.
Pastor Eddie Thompson of the Sanctuary Family Worship Center in Jena said national news coverage of the case has led many other white ministers to avoid speaking to the media.
"Their small Southern town has kind of been offered up as a sacrifice for America's national sin," Thompson said.
He said he believes prejudice and bigotry exists in his community and elsewhere in the United States, but "the people are seeing their town portrayed in a way in the national media that is foreign to them, completely."
Moran and Thompson agree that the community's ministers should have maintained a sense of unity regarding the case. Instead, as details of the case emerged and opinions became more enflamed, an initial attempt at an alliance failed.
"Until the trials are settled, there's not going to be much of an opportunity for us to move forward," Thompson said.
The Jena school case drew protests after five of the six teens, dubbed the "Jena Six," were originally charged with attempted second-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder, carrying sentences of up to 80 years in prison. The sixth was charged in juvenile court.
The beating victim, Justin Barker, 18, was treated for injuries at a hospital and released the same day, and a motive for the alleged Dec. 4 attack at the high school was never established.
Bell was the first of six teens to go to trial. The attempted murder charges were reduced to aggravated second-degree battery and conspiracy to commit aggravated battery, and Bell was convicted.
But Mauffray threw out the conspiracy conviction Tuesday, saying juveniles could not be charged with conspiracy in adult court.
Both sides said they would appeal. Bell's attorneys want the battery charge throw out, as well, and the case returned to juvenile court.
The charges against two of the other teens, Carwin Jones and Theo Shaw, also were reduced Tuesday from attempted second-degree murder to aggravated second-degree battery and conspiracy. Robert Bailey Jr. and Bryant Purvis still face attempted murder charges, and the unidentified juvenile has yet to go to trial.
People in the "South"? Everyone in the South is guilty of racism because of this incident? I'm always inclined to think that the people involved in the situation are the guilty ones..not everyone that lives in the same geographical area. I'm so tired of these Southern racist generalizations.
But without the lumped into one accusations the generalizer misses out on that false sense of superiority that they so badly need to get through the day.
The two biggest racists involved with this whole Jena ordeal is Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton.
I'll bet anything that if the colors were reversed, and it was six white students charged with beating one black student they would be organizing a protest rally right now calling for the maximum sentence allowed.
Their constant "race pimping" and headline grabbing always seem to overshadow and demean the very cases they're trying to expostulate.
If they really want to contribute to the advancement of society and to the end of racisicm then they should step out of the public spotlight and quit engaging a media circus everytime an altercation between a white person and a black person happens. Believe it or not, race is not a motivating factor every time two people of different colors have a conflict. This particular incident seems to be racially motivated, but having Jackson and Sharpton preaching the evils of the white population from up on their platforms has opened more wounds than its healed.
Comments
Nonsense, you're looking at it likes it black and white when it's not. Take a look and read on the sequence of events in an atmosphere of 80% white students and a town about the same.
Here's the full interview from Democracy Now @ JENA SIX. One of the charges was assault with a deadly weapon and that weapon turns out to be a tennis shoe just to get that charge on the books.
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I did get a bit of revenge when I got back to the city, tho. Every brochure of theirs I saw in all of the travel kiosks I threw in the garbage.
And BTW, if it had said in the brochure that people would be subjected to racist signs upon entry, I would never had gone.
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
Perhaps it would have been smarter to wait until after the tour to say something?
What your opinion of racist is not going to be the same as someone elses. You went to his place. Regardless of how you felt about his sign, you still were at his place, and to get all pissed off, and resort to name calling (in his mind, perhaps calling him a redneck is just as bad as him calling a black person a Coon).. and then your revenge for him not kicking your ass out of his tour, you go back to town, and destroy his advertisements? and why exactly is HE the problem?
naděje umírá poslední
isn't this a tad apologetic for the owners ... it's like - it's ok to be racist because it's a private function ... i agree for the most part ultimately, one can choose to not support organizations they feel are racist but she had no way of knowing ...
anyhoo - if an assault on someone who doesn't even spend a night at the hospital warrants 22 years - it's pretty tragic ...
Legally, yeah, its okay to be racist as long as you arent hurting or threatening anyone. As well it should be- Just because i dont agree with it, doesnt mean it should be illegal.
I just dont think it was appropriate to start calling HIM names. It brought her down to his level, and then to go the extra step of attempting to damage his business by destroying brouchures he had paid for is ridiculous.
If it had been a black business owner with a sign that said "Cracker Count," do you think she would have called that owner a Nigger? Doubtful. Hateful words are hateful words.
i'm guessing she would react the same way ... i could be wrong ...
i dunno - i view this sometimes like violence against women ... for too long - people have kept their mouths shut in order not to stir the shit - but there comes a time when things need to be put out there ...
like my original post in this thread said - america isn't interested in knowing they are a racist country ... it doesn't sit well with their ideals of who they think they are ... they'd much rather brush these things aside and focus on other things ...
I'm having trouble posting so I'm not sure if this is going to go thru...
As I posted originally, the sign at the swamp tour had a noose as did the tree that the white boys hung them on in Jena. Nooses ARE taken as a threat by the black population because of all the lynching in the slavery days. It's obvious they have no problem threatening people, because they certainly did it to me.
Secondly, if the brochure had "Arian Nation Swamp Tour" on it I would have had the option not to go. Or if I did decide to go, I would have known full well what I was getting into. It's not fair to put out brochures that seem welcoming to "everyone", and when you get to the tour there are racist materials posted. Which is why I had no problem throwing them out. Let them be a little more honest in their advertising about their preference of color.
And thirdly, yes, I'm sorry I offended "rednecks" by lumping this scum in with them. By definiton a "redneck" is a poor, uneducated person from the American south. I should have called him a racist piece of garbage.
Of course I would have been smarter to wait until after the tour to confront the owner. But he was there at that time, and might not have been when I got back. And I really wanted to discuss it with him.
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
Redneck, by definition, is now universal. In other words, you can be a redneck and be from Boston.
Racial divisions in Louisiana are evolving even as we speak. The influx of Latino workers post-Katrina is adding additional tension to an area where there were at least three different cultures trying to carve out their niche....the cajuns, the blacks and the whites.
Um.. Using the term "redneck" was an attempt to insult a person based on their cultural standing.
Calling a Southern, Country folk a redneck is like calling a black person any offensive name.
You are just as bad as the person you are so upset at.
btw, somebody said "coon" is a bad word derived from such a "cute animal". my god. a raccoon is one of the nastiest animals on earth, both in demeanor and in the diseases they carry, get a clue. also, they are "hunted" with dogs, but they are "trapped" with traps. and if you're so offended by the use of the sign, don't go there, it IS a free country afterall.
there are plenty 'backwards' people and places in the south, just like the north. some of the most racist people I've ever met come from the north and the most racist person I've ever known is from Philly, so get off that "the south is such a racist place" crap.
I own property in Daytona Beach, and stay down there every chance I get...and you are blowing that whole thing WAY out of proportion. If anything, the businesses cater to african americans that week.
Maybe I happened to be in the only two souvenier shops that were run by blatantly open racists who close their shops during this week. Who knows. Maybe I was in the only restaurant where they were openly racists, and apparently felt it was ok to be that way as long as it was in front of "whites". Who knows. I doubt it, but I guess anything is possible. My friend lived an half hour north of Daytona, and he told me stories about people closing shops and how they schedule their vacations around this event as well.
But is it blatently racist if they sustain significant losses via theft during that specific week? Can you really blame them for closing their business if it isnt profitable, just so they dont appear "racist". Sure, calling them niggers is over the line, but im willing to bet, if it made business sense to stay open, they probably would.
Yes, you're right! I am just as bad as the guy who hung a confederate flag and hung nooses against blacks on his property. And ya know, just the other day a supposed "friend" sent me a dumb blonde joke, and I thought, how dare this stereotyping racist send me a dumb blonde joke! She's just as bad as those people in the KKK! Next thing you know, she'll burn a bottle of peroxide on my lawn!
:rolleyes:
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
A dumb blonde joke is totally different- its an attempt at HUMOR. his awful racist sign, was, a tasteless attempt at HUMOR. you calling him a redneck in ANGER is probably worse.
If he was truly a real hating racist, he probably would have said something to the black folk you mentioned that were there. Hell, he might have denied them entry. Instead he was a guy with some prejudices that are deep rooted as part of his culture.. but it sounds like he was accepting of them (or at least their money). You on the other hand, decided to attack his culture and call him a name based on a stereotype.
So no, i guess its not the same thing. You're worse.
The guy wanted to take their money AND humiliate them. Obviously.
Calling people names in anger is a very common thing, and often regretted later. This man took his time to hang offensive racist signs and a confederate flag at his place of business, and had plenty of time to think about what he was doing and he was still fine with it. Which I think is worse. Just because something is deep seated doesn't make it right. Your reasoning is just so far gone I can't even argue this anymore. It's just become beyond ridiculous.
BTW, from reading your past few posts, you seem very sympathetic to these white (seemingly) racist business owners. You don't happen to own an Alligator Swamp tour business in Louisiana, do you?
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
The coon thing can be debated as being racist, although in this case it appears as though it was in a racist fashion, so ill grant you that. It is part of his culture. an ugly part, but part of it. The Flag thing DOES NOT MEAN RACISM to many many many many people in the south. It may to you, and thats fine if thats your perception of what the flag stands for, but dont pretend to know what it means to him.
So if he was angry and called a black person a Nigger, thats better then hanging an offensive sign? Sorry, you called someone a name based on a negative stereotype. I dont care if its nigger, kike, polack, daigo, spic, gook, or redneck... you did it. You're no better, so maybe you should take a couple of steps down off that soapbox.
So he wants to humiliate black people? Good thing Mama Whitey is there to protect them from his evil redneck ways.
So because i present a counter point to your over the top actions and a possible explanation to a point made in another post i must be a racist too?
Glad race relations is so Cut and Dry to you, that no other point can be made without you pointing the damning finger of "Racist"
City boys. Sheesh.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
lol...priceless...
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
ashville was VERY nice when we went down for the 2004 VFC tour. progressive and friendly little city with a few great bars. camping was great down there as well. amazing little corner of the world. but thats really the extent of my limited experience in the south.
not to mention that scalper had no clue he sold me 5th row floor right in front of mike fucking mccready... my friend shit his pants when i came back to the bar, threw them down on the table and ordered a round of shots!
Ummm... who's the one on the soap box?? You're the one who seems to be making all the statements about what the rules of racism are here. As per you: If you say a racist comment in anger you're even more of a racist. If you say it with humor it's not as bad. If it's inbred with your culture it's not nice, but somewhat excusable and you can make some allowances for it. And I shouldn't pretend to know what is racist to some, (like the confederate flag) because it might mean something different to many, many, many WHITE southerners. Even though the NAACP, NCCJ, Bill Clinton (a southern man) along with many other organizations feel it's a racist symbol of white domination over blacks. Two African American girls in my office, one who lived in Texas and the other in Georgia, when I asked them about it, both felt it was a symbol of hatred and discrimination. But, as you point out, I'M in no position to judge it or him. But, of course, you are ok to judge me. And I think I got a pretty clear idea of what it means to him, because it was right by the sign with the noose.
In my original post, (note: NOT edited in any way) I wrote I "made the mistake of calling him a redneck" (meaning I didn't realize it was such a loaded, negative word) and you call me lower than low, but yet in every post I've read from you, you come up with a defense for the white business owners in Florida and a man who hangs nooses and confederate flags at his business, and yet how dare I "point the damning finger of racist" (soap box lingo if I ever heard it, btw) at you, when I never even wrote that. I said you "seemed sympathetic" and then made a joke about owning an alligator swamp business. If racism is "cut and dried" to anyone here, it's you.
And I take offense to being called Mama Whitey. It's a racist label!:D (I hope it wasnt said by you in anger! :eek:You know what that means!)
"Some of my friends sit around every evening and they worry about the times ahead,
But everybody else is overwhelmed by indifference and the promise of an early bed..."-- Elvis Costello
People in the "South"? Everyone in the South is guilty of racism because of this incident? I'm always inclined to think that the people involved in the situation are the guilty ones..not everyone that lives in the same geographical area. I'm so tired of these Southern racist generalizations.
The town of Jena, La., is coping with a case of racially motivated violence, even as court proceedings against those involved move forward. The case, centering on a tree at a high school campus that was a favorite meeting place for white students, has exposed racial tensions in the small town.
Earlier this week, a judge threw out one of the two charges against the first black student tried for beating up a white student at Jena High School, saying juveniles cannot be charged with conspiracy in adult court.
But Judge J.P. Mauffray Jr. rejected arguments that, for the same reason, he should throw out the aggravated second-degree battery charge on which Mychal Bell also was convicted. The judge's decision means Bell will face at most 15 years in prison, rather than 22.5, when he is sentenced Sept. 20.
The case's beginnings can be traced to a day when black students at Jena High sat under a tree that was known traditionally as a white student hangout. Shortly afterward, three nooses were found hanging from the tree.
That sparked a series of racially charged events, culminating in a schoolyard attack of a white student and the arrest of six black teenagers for the crime.
"The mood of Jena is very, very bad," said the Rev. Brian Moran, pastor of Antioch Baptist Church in Jena.
Noting that the black students who sat under the tree had asked the principal's permission to do so, Moran said that immediately after they sat there, the nooses appeared.
"It really confuses me why anybody would say that this is not a racist situation," Moran said.
Students accused of placing the nooses on the tree were suspended from school for a short period.
Pastor Eddie Thompson of the Sanctuary Family Worship Center in Jena said national news coverage of the case has led many other white ministers to avoid speaking to the media.
"Their small Southern town has kind of been offered up as a sacrifice for America's national sin," Thompson said.
He said he believes prejudice and bigotry exists in his community and elsewhere in the United States, but "the people are seeing their town portrayed in a way in the national media that is foreign to them, completely."
Moran and Thompson agree that the community's ministers should have maintained a sense of unity regarding the case. Instead, as details of the case emerged and opinions became more enflamed, an initial attempt at an alliance failed.
"Until the trials are settled, there's not going to be much of an opportunity for us to move forward," Thompson said.
The Jena school case drew protests after five of the six teens, dubbed the "Jena Six," were originally charged with attempted second-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder, carrying sentences of up to 80 years in prison. The sixth was charged in juvenile court.
The beating victim, Justin Barker, 18, was treated for injuries at a hospital and released the same day, and a motive for the alleged Dec. 4 attack at the high school was never established.
Bell was the first of six teens to go to trial. The attempted murder charges were reduced to aggravated second-degree battery and conspiracy to commit aggravated battery, and Bell was convicted.
But Mauffray threw out the conspiracy conviction Tuesday, saying juveniles could not be charged with conspiracy in adult court.
Both sides said they would appeal. Bell's attorneys want the battery charge throw out, as well, and the case returned to juvenile court.
The charges against two of the other teens, Carwin Jones and Theo Shaw, also were reduced Tuesday from attempted second-degree murder to aggravated second-degree battery and conspiracy. Robert Bailey Jr. and Bryant Purvis still face attempted murder charges, and the unidentified juvenile has yet to go to trial.
But without the lumped into one accusations the generalizer misses out on that false sense of superiority that they so badly need to get through the day.
i hearda seattle resident say nigger yesterday.
and i saw a lot of rebel flags in maryland back in the day.
blanket geralizations are awesome.
I'll bet anything that if the colors were reversed, and it was six white students charged with beating one black student they would be organizing a protest rally right now calling for the maximum sentence allowed.
Their constant "race pimping" and headline grabbing always seem to overshadow and demean the very cases they're trying to expostulate.
If they really want to contribute to the advancement of society and to the end of racisicm then they should step out of the public spotlight and quit engaging a media circus everytime an altercation between a white person and a black person happens. Believe it or not, race is not a motivating factor every time two people of different colors have a conflict. This particular incident seems to be racially motivated, but having Jackson and Sharpton preaching the evils of the white population from up on their platforms has opened more wounds than its healed.
http://www.myspace.com/christianjame (Music Page)
Myspace: http://www.myspace.com/19598996 (Personal Page)