Harper unmoved by polls, remains firm on Mideast crisis, softwood

rebornFixer

beemster wrote:

He has a minority government, only been in office for 5 months and the sun still rises in the morning, you and every left wing socialist fear mongerer in Canuckistan make me sick.

Agreed, actually. Some people's ignorance really shines through when the topic of Harper comes up. Not all Canadians cheer for Islamic extremists, though. Canuckistan isn't a funny comment.

rebornFixer

Ahnimus wrote:

What's the relevancy to picking sides? To kiss ass?

It creates a threat to Canada from the Arab/Persian world which we alone can't deal with. It also shows are total lack of understanding for the conflict.

So you'd be happier huddled up in fear, acting like the "Arab-Persian world's" little bitch? Is that it? ooh, scary stuff!
Sorry, but appeasing extremists doesn't make them less threatening. It actually encourages them to become more brash.

Ahnimus

reborncareerist wrote:

So you'd be happier huddled up in fear, acting like the "Arab-Persian world's" little bitch? Is that it? ooh, scary stuff!
Sorry, but appeasing extremists doesn't make them less threatening. It actually encourages them to become more brash.

No, I just prefer not to pick sides. When two of my neighbours are fighting, I let them go at it. It's their fight, not mine. If things got way out of hand I might step in as mediator, but I certainly wouldn't pick sides.

Ahnimus

Rockin'InCanada wrote:

Wow thanks for CAP link...I found this anti-terror bill shocking....I cannot believe I have never heard of this......

http://canadianactionparty.ca/temp/articles/Anti_Terrorism_law.asp

Really? Yea it's like identical to the US patriot act. We even have a big Terrorism section in the Criminal Code.

Ahnimus

Ahnimus wrote:

Really? Yea it's like identical to the US patriot act. We even have a big Terrorism section in the Criminal Code.

And with that you need a special team Integrated National Security Enforcement Teams (INSET)

shiraz

Ahnimus wrote:

No, I just prefer not to pick sides. When two of my neighbours are fighting, I let them go at it. It's their fight, not mine. If things got way out of hand I might step in as mediator, but I certainly wouldn't pick sides.

Really? it seems to me you've already picked one, long long time ago.

Hizbullah is a terror organization, who is destroying northern Israel's & lebanon's civilians life. I'm happy that Canada at least care's about what's going on here. In case you haven't heard yet, Int forces are the key for our cease-fire around here. That doesn't seem like "picking sides", but more like "helping us get back to sanity".

Ahnimus

shiraz wrote:

Really? it seems to me you've already picked one, long long time ago.

Hizbullah is a terror organization, who is destroying northern Israel's & lebanon's civilians life. I'm happy that Canada at least care's about what's going on here. In case you haven't heard yet, Int forces are the key for our cease-fire around here. That doesn't seem like "picking sides", but more like "helping us get back to sanity".

Do you know what is going to result from us stating that we back israel? Is Canada going to launch a full-scale invasion of Iran? No. All that could possibly come out of it is an attack on Canada. What good does that do us?

shiraz

Ahnimus wrote:

Do you know what is going to result from us stating that we back israel? Is Canada going to launch a full-scale invasion of Iran? No. All that could possibly come out of it is an attack on Canada. What good does that do us?

What in the world are you talking about, did you read the first draft of the cease-fire agreement? What Iran has to do with launching an Int forces to southern Lebanon?

You are not backing Israel, you are backing sanity and our (Israel's & Lebanon's civilians) right to live here without any fanatic people to take us as their hostages. You are basically saying "yeah, it seems right but I'm scared Iran will do something bad to Canada". Well, according to that logic none of you should have rescued the jews in WW2 (btw, that was the logic in the begining of that war, a logic which costs 3 millions of people).

So do you know what? lets not help Sudan cause Bin Laden or Iran might come and gets us. god...

Ahnimus

shiraz wrote:

What in the world are you talking about, did you read the first draft of the cease-fire agreement? What Iran has to do with launching an Int forces to southern Lebanon?

You are not backing Israel, you are backing sanity and our (Israel's & Lebanon's civilians) right to live here without any fanatic people to take us as their hostages. You are basically saying "yeah, it seems right but I'm scared Iran will do something bad to Canada". Well, according to that logic none of you should have rescued the jews in WW2 (btw, that was the logic in the begining of that war, a logic which costs 3 millions of people).

So do you know what? lets not help Sudan cause Bin Laden or Iran might come and gets us. god...

I'm just saying I liked Canada's role in international conflicts in the past. We used to send people in to clean up the mess and provide humanitarian aid. We didn't send troops in to fight for one side or the other. Not very often anyway. Harper was quick to stand behind Israel in this conflict. I understand the logic. However, in the context of Israel, it's a complicated situation. I have to apologize, I mean, what did the Jews expect would happen when they went to Israel? Especially with the attitude that Jews should only live amongst other Jews and everyone else basically sucks. I don't mean to knock Judaism, but it seems Christ was right when he called the Pharisees hipocrits. It would seem that many of their followers are too. Israel has continuously played the holocaust card to win world view, however the genocide of palestinians was no different. For some reason we just see them as terrorists and potential terrorists. When are the 250,000 Israeli settlers going to pack it up and move out of Palestine? I mean, you can't expect to ever have peace with palestinians with Israel's foot in their door. This is a two-sided war, it's not just one factions fault, that's what I am trying to express. I don't want WW3 and I don't want billions of dead arabs or millions of dead jews. I just want them to work this shit out and if that means exposing one side or the other, then that's what I do. We already know Hizbollah's evil, I'm showing Israel's.

surferdude

Ahnimus wrote:

No, I just prefer not to pick sides. When two of my neighbours are fighting, I let them go at it. It's their fight, not mine. If things got way out of hand I might step in as mediator, but I certainly wouldn't pick sides.

That's a pretty poor attitude when it's your neighbour beating on his wife and kids. Sticking your head in the sand never helped to solve a problem. This attitude is quite sickening.

RockinInCanada

beemster wrote:

He has a minority government, only been in office for 5 months and the sun still rises in the morning, you and every left wing socialist fear mongerer in Canuckistan make me sick.

Cancukistan...wow Bill O'Reily here in person...

Ahnimus

surferdude wrote:

That's a pretty poor attitude when it's your neighbour beating on his wife and kids. Sticking your head in the sand never helped to solve a problem. This attitude is quite sickening.

Yea, a woman was getting beat with a baseball bat outside my front door. What am I suppose to do? She was a crack dealer and a heroin addict. I'm not getting involved in that.

shiraz

Ahnimus wrote:

I'm just saying I liked Canada's role in international conflicts in the past. We used to send people in to clean up the mess and provide humanitarian aid. We didn't send troops in to fight for one side or the other. Not very often anyway. Harper was quick to stand behind Israel in this conflict. I understand the logic.

Clearly you didn't. There are 3 sides here - the state of Israel, the state of Lebanon, and a terror organization named Hizbullah. Canada picked Isreal & Lebanon's right to live in peace, just like we did in the past 6 years. What can I say - Shame on you, Canada.

Ahnimus wrote:

However, in the context of Israel, it's a complicated situation. I have to apologize, I mean, what did the Jews expect would happen when they went to Israel? Especially with the attitude that Jews should only live amongst other Jews and everyone else basically sucks. I don't mean to knock Judaism, but it seems Christ was right when he called the Pharisees hipocrits. It would seem that many of their followers are too. Israel has continuously played the holocaust card to win world view, however the genocide of palestinians was no different. For some reason we just see them as terrorists and potential terrorists.

Wow, so many ignorance in one paragraph.

1. Jews "attitude" is to stick with eachother, like evey other commutiny does natually, but that doesn't mean we hate eveybody else, just like all muslim or Lebanese people doesn't hate the Jews etc'. What you said is a sick generalization.

2. Israel has continuously AVOIDED from playing the holocaust card, the only one who use it is so called peace activists and other demagogic people who dare to claim Palestine/Lebanon = holocaust. The holocaust was only the final reason for the decision to have our own country, in order to avoid any other future sick attempts to exterminat us. The state of Israel was established after the world voted 'yes', end of story.

3. Maybe you & your freinds see the palestinians as terrorists, so that's your problem. If Israel thought all of them are terrorists we would have bomed everybody via air-force and "solving" it all.

Anyway, you are going way off topic (as usuall) - the situation in Lebanon in which Canada is involved in has nothing to do with the palestinians.

Ahnimus wrote:

When are the 250,000 Israeli settlers going to pack it up and move out of Palestine? I mean, you can't expect to ever have peace with palestinians with Israel's foot in their door. This is a two-sided war, it's not just one factions fault, that's what I am trying to express. I don't want WW3 and I don't want billions of dead arabs or millions of dead jews. I just want them to work this shit out and if that means exposing one side or the other, then that's what I do. We already know Hizbollah's evil, I'm showing Israel's.

Again, none of it has nothing to do with Lebanon & Canada's involvement, I'm not gonna bother to replay on that one (though I have lots of things to say) regarding the original topic.

RockinInCanada

shiraz wrote:

Clearly you didn't. There are 3 sides here - the state of Israel, the state of Lebanon, and a terror organization named Hizbullah. Canada picked Isreal & Lebanon's right to live in peace, just like we did in the past 6 years. What can I say - Shame on you, Canada.




Wow, so many ignorance in one paragraph.

1. Jews "attitude" is to stick with eachother, like evey other commutiny does natually, but that doesn't mean we hate eveybody else, just like all muslim or Lebanese people doesn't hate the Jews etc'. What you said is a sick generalization.

2. Israel has continuously AVOIDED from playing the holocaust card, the only one who use it is so called peace activists and other demagogic people who dare to claim Palestine/Lebanon = holocaust. The holocaust was only the final reason for the decision to have our own country, in order to avoid any other future sick attempts to exterminat us. The state of Israel was established after the world voted 'yes', end of story.

3. Maybe you & your freinds see the palestinians as terrorists, so that's your problem. If Israel thought all of them are terrorists we would have bomed everybody via air-force and "solving" it all.

Anyway, you are going way off topic (as usuall) - the situation in Lebanon in which Canada is involved in has nothing to do with the palestinians.




Again, none of it has nothing to do with Lebanon & Canada's involvement, I'm not gonna bother to replay on that one (though I have lots of things to say) regarding the original topic.

No I think they throw support only at Israel...if they really had shown support for Lebanon as well they would have called for a ceasefire...I hardly think supporting both those sides would constiute in the support of bombing involcinginnocents...with your logic if you seem to believe Harper is supporting both then where does that leave the rest of the world nations...what supporting Hezbollah? I do not think so, the rest of the world is defending both sides...there are three defending only Israel...

shiraz

Rockin'InCanada wrote:

No I think they throw support only at Israel...if they really had shown support for Lebanon as well they would have called for a ceasefire...I hardly think supporting both those sides would constiute in the support of bombing involcinginnocents...with your logic if you seem to believe Harper is supporting both then where does that leave the rest of the world nations...what supporting Hezbollah? I do not think so, the rest of the world is defending both sides...there are three defending only Israel...

Hizbullah DOES NOT represent the Lebanese people! Where is the "only Israeli interest" you are talking about, having an Int forces inside southern Lebanon right away in order to protect Israeli & Lebanese people from Hizbullah?!? What so wrong with that, what is your alternative?!? Hizbullah demonstrated last week no one can trust them, there was a cease-fire and they kept shooting missiles, including towards dipper areas inside Israel.

How the hell do you suggest Hizbullah, a terror organization, will have Israeli & Lebanese life in their hands? And the how hell does this kind of stand is protecting the civilians?!?

What supporting Hezbolla, is that what you care about, the interests of a terror organization who has just fire at least 10 missiles over my city?!? do you even realize what you are saying? No, I think you don't.

thankyougrandma

Supporting Israel is supporting terrorist, same as supporting Hezbollah, That's why we need to take a neutral stand, to support life not war and killing of innocent. But hey i guess i'm just a stupid Quebecer who hate war, who's an isolationist.

BTW Canada have NO obligation to send troops anywhere, we are a sovereign country and deciding where and when we act with our military is legitimate and have nothing to do with our Nato or UN position, or unless we're not that sovereign, mmmmm would be interesting to debate that.

Stephen Harper talks like if he's talking to idiots, he talks like he's higher than everyone else, he thinks he's a superior mind and saying "our stand is every canadian stand" is just one of those "talk in slogan" thing than makes everyone look stupid but him, fuck him, can't wait to get him out of there.

Some post in this thread are not even worth commenting on, leftist rightist canuckistan what the fuck is this crap? Can't we just have a fucking opinion without being labelled on a group or another? fucking stupid...

edit: i agree, at least Stevie is standing by his principle, it's just that governing shouldn't be lead by personal principal, but national interest...

Ahnimus

thankyougrandma wrote:

Supporting Israel is supporting terrorist, same as supporting Hezbollah, That's why we need to take a neutral stand, to support life not war and killing of innocent. But hey i guess i'm just a stupid Quebecer who hate war, who's an isolationist.

BTW Canada have NO obligation to send troops anywhere, we are a sovereign country and deciding where and when we act with our military is legitimate and have nothing to do with our Nato or UN position, or unless we're not that sovereign, mmmmm would be interesting to debate that.

Stephen Harper talks like if he's talking to idiots, he talks like he's higher than everyone else, he thinks he's a superior mind and saying "our stand is every canadian stand" is just one of those "talk in slogan" thing than makes everyone look stupid but him, fuck him, can't wait to get him out of there.

Some post in this thread are not even worth commenting on, leftist rightist canuckistan what the fuck is this crap? Can't we just have a fucking opinion without being labelled on a group or another? fucking stupid...

edit: i agree, at least Stevie is standing by his principle, it's just that governing shouldn't be lead by personal principal, but national interest...

Well, Harper is leading us head-on into an American Union which will ultimately take our sovereignty.

thankyougrandma

Ahnimus wrote:

Well, Harper is leading us head-on into an American Union which will ultimately take our sovereignty.

Yeah thanks that's also what i'm thinking, if it's not already done... it's a sad situation... but hey it's ok, Harper said it was what Canadians want, he said that his stand is Canadians stand, or maybe i'm not canadian?

He also speak and ommit most of the things that peoples are angry about, which is the un-measured force Israel attacked Lebanon, yes we support the right for Israel to defend themselves, yes we are against terrorism, but he stop there, he forget to say that Israel must stop bombing, without any reserve, everything LEBANESE, not only Hezbollah, that's the part where i disagree with him, and i just can't understand anyone saying that all these killings are justified and needed for the future of Israel, people are rallying behind the Hezbollah as of now, the sympathy for them is going up, great for Israel i guess, bah i don't know what else to say...

Ahnimus

thankyougrandma wrote:

Yeah thanks that's also what i'm thinking, if it's not already done... it's a sad situation... but hey it's ok, Harper said it was what Canadians want, he said that his stand is Canadians stand, or maybe i'm not canadian?

He also speak and ommit most of the things that peoples are angry about, which is the un-measured force Israel attacked Lebanon, yes we support the right for Israel to defend themselves, yes we are against terrorism, but he stop there, he forget to say that Israel must stop bombing, without any reserve, everything LEBANESE, not only Hezbollah, that's the part where i disagree with him, and i just can't understand anyone saying that all these killings are justified and needed for the future of Israel, people are rallying behind the Hezbollah as of now, the sympathy for them is going up, great for Israel i guess, bah i don't know what else to say...

Well we certainly have more empathy for human life in Canada then what Harper portrays. The "accountable government" is what won the conservative minority. Which is just sad that it actually worked. I don't see a difference myself. Pulling out of Kyoto, for what? To save face? Sending troops to afghanistan? This is a little too much like US foreign policy.

rebornFixer

Ahnimus wrote:

Well, Harper is leading us head-on into an American Union which will ultimately take our sovereignty.

Except that no one here can actually point to ANYTHING that suggests our sovereignty is danger ... At least, anything that any other PM wouldn't have also done (softwood lumber).
You guys preach fear with regards to Harper, and sorry, it is getting tired.