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Iran is lying about its nuke program

jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
edited November 2007 in A Moving Train
seriously, does everyone think its ok for Iran to have nukes?


http://news.yahoo.com/s/mcclatchy/20071115/wl_mcclatchy/20071115bcusirannuclear_attn_national_foreign_editors_ytop

or this http://news.yahoo.com/s/mcclatchy/20071115/wl_mcclatchy/20071115bcusirannuclear_attn_national_foreign_editors_ytop

WASHINGTON — Iran has provided answers to questions about its past nuclear activities, the United Nations' atomic watchdog reported Thursday, but hasn't provided "full transparency" about its current activities and continues to enrich uranium in defiance of the U.N. Security Council .


The report by the International Atomic Energy Agency warns that the agency's knowledge about Iran's current nuclear program "is diminishing" because Iran hasn't provided the same type of information since early last year that it had previously.

"The agency is not in a position to provide credible assurances about the absence of undeclared nuclear material and activities in Iran ," says the confidential report, obtained by McClatchy Newspapers .
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Comments

  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    I don't believe it's alright for anyone to have nukes...but ya know.



    Anyway, this is stupid. As if there needs to be more fuel thrown onto the already large fire that is being stirred against Iran.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    I don't believe it's alright for anyone to have nukes...but ya know.

    Anyway, this is stupid. As if there needs to be more fuel thrown onto the already large fire that is being stirred against Iran.

    Iran is doing it to themselves. if that want nuclear technology for peaceful purposes, what do they have to hide?
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    jlew24asu wrote:
    Iran is doing it to themselves. if that want nuclear technology for peaceful purposes, what do they have to hide?



    I've not a clue. I'm wondering if they are doing this as a move to see what their opposers say/do. It's like one big fucking game.
  • ledveddermanledvedderman Posts: 7,761
    I don't want Iran to have nuclear weapons, but I remember the whole "what's there to hide" argument w/ Sadaam 5 years ago. That didn't really work out so well in the long run. It's a fine line to play because if we rush in and nothings there we're really fucked in world opinion, but we can't let this go on forever.
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  • chopitdownchopitdown Posts: 2,222
    the only way we know they are lying is if we know the truth (not what we want to be true). Don't get me wrong, I'd rather Iran NOT have nukes...believe me. Do i think they'd be underhanded enough to lie about it? Yep. But do we KNOW they are trying to develop them? I don't think we really know. I think it may very well be sort of a test or almost begging us to do something, then the US goes in to a country again and doesn't find anything.
    make sure the fortune that you seek...is the fortune that you need
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    I think it's Iran's way of saying get off our backs and leave us alone by pushing the envelope, and meaning it.

    The nuclear war equation is one of mutual destruction and everyone knows it (including Iran).

    It's the only weapon/status politicians seem to listen to and respect.

    They learned their lesson in the Iran/ Iraq war. Who can blame them.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
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  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    ledvedderman wrote:
    I don't want Iran to have nuclear weapons, but I remember the whole "what's there to hide" argument w/ Sadaam 5 years ago. That didn't really work out so well in the long run. It's a fine line to play because if we rush in and nothings there we're really fucked in world opinion, but we can't let this go on forever.

    I sure hope we never invade. even if proof is on the table. but they are just asking for trouble by doing this shit.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    chopitdown wrote:
    the only way we know they are lying is if we know the truth (not what we want to be true). Don't get me wrong, I'd rather Iran NOT have nukes...believe me. Do i think they'd be underhanded enough to lie about it? Yep. But do we KNOW they are trying to develop them? I don't think we really know. I think it may very well be sort of a test or almost begging us to do something, then the US goes in to a country again and doesn't find anything.

    this is exactly why Iran cant act all innocent. its not just the US who says they shouldnt have them. its practically the entire world.

    they continue to say they want it for peaceful purposes. ok fine. lets all play nice. they can easily avoid confrontation.
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    I think it's Iran's way of saying get off our backs and leave us alone by pushing the envelope, and meaning it.

    dont you see how contradictory this is? everyone would get off their backs and leave them alone if they did the opposite of what they are doing.
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    they can easily avoid confrontation.

    This is point of perspective. To avoid confrontation means to abandon all hopes of nuclear ambitions for energy and otherwise.

    From Iran's point of view that is out of the question. It's part and parcel of having nuclear energy to power their country.

    I think after 8 years of war from Iraq fueled by the US, and the US now taking over Iraq. They are sick to death of what the US has to say, and wise by political standards to do so. They think that they are next on the middle east invasion list, and they are right.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • even flow?even flow? Posts: 8,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    Iran is doing it to themselves. if that want nuclear technology for peaceful purposes, what do they have to hide?

    You live in the States and ask this question. They say they want it for peaceful purposes and the spin takes it in another direction. I am sure that once upon a time the US and Russia wanted it for peaceful purposes and then like the fucked up species that we are, we found a better way to use the stuff.

    Why do they have to hide? A better question would be why the States and the Jews need to halt their abitions!
    You've changed your place in this world!
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    even flow? wrote:
    You live in the States and ask this question. They say they want it for peaceful purposes and the spin takes it in another direction. I am sure that once upon a time the US and Russia wanted it for peaceful purposes and then like the fucked up species that we are, we found a better way to use the stuff.

    Why do they have to hide? A better question would be why the States and the Jews need to halt their abitions!

    what spin? the IAEA is making these claims, not the US. thats who they have to answer to and they're not.
  • AhnimusAhnimus Posts: 10,560
    Seems like a carrot on a string at this point. They are asking the U.S. or Israel to launch a strike. In the end the western civilizations will side with their allies and the Arabs will side with the Persians. The results, might be, Iran gains support in the region.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • even flow?even flow? Posts: 8,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    what spin? the IAEA is making these claims, not the US. thats who they have to answer to and they're not.


    Yes I get that. And who controls what? Anyway, it all depends on which side of the fence you live on and what you believe as to who should own what and what they are going to do with it and what you should do about it. Isn't the world a great place!
    You've changed your place in this world!
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    even flow? wrote:
    Yes I get that. And who controls what? Anyway, it all depends on which side of the fence you live on and what you believe as to who should own what and what they are going to do with it and what you should do about it. Isn't the world a great place!

    if Iran says they want nukes for peaceful purposes and were 100% transparent about it, no one would could have much of a problem with it. and those who did (US) would lose most likely the argument. its just stupid.
  • mammasanmammasan Posts: 5,656
    jlew24asu wrote:
    seriously, does everyone think its ok for Iran to have nukes?


    http://news.yahoo.com/s/mcclatchy/20071115/wl_mcclatchy/20071115bcusirannuclear_attn_national_foreign_editors_ytop

    WASHINGTON — Iran has provided answers to questions about its past nuclear activities, the United Nations' atomic watchdog reported Thursday, but hasn't provided "full transparency" about its current activities and continues to enrich uranium in defiance of the U.N. Security Council .


    The report by the International Atomic Energy Agency warns that the agency's knowledge about Iran's current nuclear program "is diminishing" because Iran hasn't provided the same type of information since early last year that it had previously.

    "The agency is not in a position to provide credible assurances about the absence of undeclared nuclear material and activities in Iran ," says the confidential report, obtained by McClatchy Newspapers .

    This is definitely not a good sign, but we should apply more pressure to encourage Iran to be more cooperative with the IAEA. We should offer then a little incentive to see if that will lure them out of the shadows before we try to do so with more sanctions and/or military force. If the incentives don't work then we should proceed to sanctions and elevated survellence. The minutes we have definitive proof then and only then should military force be an option.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    What if your neighbor launched an 8 year war on your house (and family) paid for by the guy down the street? How willing do you think you'd be to listen to the guy down the street when he interrogates you, then threatens you personally, then has the nerve to tell you you're not allowed to use electricity, and if you don't shut off your electricity, he's going to personally burn your house down and kill your children. Oh and you'd better be smiling and curteous when he talks to you or he's going to smear your reputation up and down the street and try to make everyone else hate you.

    I know what I'd tell him. How bout you?
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    What if your neighbor launched an 8 year war on your house (and family) paid for by the guy down the street? How willing do you think you'd be to listen to the guy down the street when he interrogates you, then threatens you personally, then has the nerve to tell you you're not allowed to use electricity, and if you don't shut off your electricity, he's going to personally burn your house down and kill your children. Oh and you'd better be smiling and curteous when he talks to you or he's going to smear your reputation up and down the street and try to make everyone else hate you.

    I know what I'd tell him. How bout you?

    thats the dumbest thing I've ever heard. no offense
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    thats the dumbest thing I've ever heard. no offense


    You can't see the direct parallels?

    ok...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    You can't see the direct parallels?

    ok...

    its not as cut and dry in comparison to the cute story you made up.
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    its not as cut and dry in comparison to the cute story you made up.

    Well lets look at it...

    "What if your neighbor launched an 8 year war on your house (and family) paid for by the guy down the street? "

    (Iran/ Iraq war).

    "How willing do you think you'd be to listen to the guy down the street when he interrogates you, then threatens you personally, then has the nerve to tell you you're not allowed to use electricity, and if you don't shut off your electricity, he's going to personally burn your house down and kill your children. "

    (US threat of cease and desist or Iran will be bombed back to the stone age).

    "Oh and you'd better be smiling and curteous when he talks to you or he's going to smear your reputation up and down the street and try to make everyone else hate you."

    (ongoing smear propaganda)

    Counter this with what Iran has done in their part of the equation to encourage it.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Well lets look at it...

    "What if your neighbor launched an 8 year war on your house (and family) paid for by the guy down the street? "

    (Iran/ Iraq war).

    "How willing do you think you'd be to listen to the guy down the street when he interrogates you, then threatens you personally, then has the nerve to tell you you're not allowed to use electricity, and if you don't shut off your electricity, he's going to personally burn your house down and kill your children. "

    (US threat of cease and desist or Iran will be bombed back to the stone age).

    "Oh and you'd better be smiling and curteous when he talks to you or he's going to smear your reputation up and down the street and try to make everyone else hate you."

    (ongoing smear propaganda)

    Counter this with what Iran has done in their part of the equation to encourage it.

    again, life isnt that simple. thats much more to it. you cant some up the last 20 years by a cute little 5 sentence story.
  • mammasanmammasan Posts: 5,656
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    What if your neighbor launched an 8 year war on your house (and family) paid for by the guy down the street? How willing do you think you'd be to listen to the guy down the street when he interrogates you, then threatens you personally, then has the nerve to tell you you're not allowed to use electricity, and if you don't shut off your electricity, he's going to personally burn your house down and kill your children. Oh and you'd better be smiling and curteous when he talks to you or he's going to smear your reputation up and down the street and try to make everyone else hate you.

    I know what I'd tell him. How bout you?

    Iran signed the NPT so they have to abide by the rules. If they don't they face the consequences of their actions. Now I know you are going to say that the US doesn't exactly obey the rules either. Agreed but an Iran with nuclear weapons, even if they never use them or threaten to use them, will cause an escalation in the region. The last thing we need is other countries like Saudi Arabia, Yemen, UAE, Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, etc... racing to arm themselves with nuclear missles.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    again, life isnt that simple. thats much more to it. you cant some up the last 20 years by a cute little 5 sentence story.


    Well you're wondering why Iran is acting the way it is. What have they done to encourage their current situation?
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Well you're wondering why Iran is acting the way it is. What have they done to encourage their current situation?

    then Iran shouldnt lie and say its only for peaceful purposes. US has and is doing nothing to encourage lying. they do that all on their own .
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    mammasan wrote:
    Iran signed the NPT so they have to abide by the rules. If they don't they face the consequences of their actions. Now I know you are going to say that the US doesn't exactly obey the rules either. Agreed but an Iran with nuclear weapons, even if they never use them or threaten to use them, will cause an escalation in the region. The last thing we need is other countries like Saudi Arabia, Yemen, UAE, Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, etc... racing to arm themselves with nuclear missles.

    When they signed the NPT I don't think they imagined the US would conquer their neighbor on such suspicious pretenses, and then proceed to paint their leader with colorful propaganda, so it kind of throws the bets off a little.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    then Iran shouldnt lie and say its only for peaceful purposes. US has and is doing nothing to encourage lying. they do that all on their own .

    8 years of war can make people tired of listening to the man, especially when they don't agree with him in the first place. It's purely political from Iran's perspective. China and Russia are backing them, so this is probably their way of flipping the US the finger for those 8 years of inflicted joy.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    When they signed the NPT I don't think they imagined the US would conquer their neighbor on such suspicious pretenses, and then proceed to paint their leader with colorful propaganda, so it kind of throws the bets off a little.

    looks like some of the colorful propaganda is turning out true, eh?
  • idratherbeidratherbe Posts: 367
    even flow? wrote:
    Yes I get that. And who controls what? Anyway, it all depends on which side of the fence you live on and what you believe as to who should own what and what they are going to do with it and what you should do about it. Isn't the world a great place!

    Bingo. The view's great from the ivory tower, eh? ;)

    ~peace~
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  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    jlew24asu wrote:
    looks like some of the colorful propaganda is turning out true, eh?

    It's a bit too early to say he's going to start nuking people don't you think?
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
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