.my mother and some of her collegues began a drive to phone those in Quebec and convince them to say no....she spoke to so many pround Canadian's in Quebec that it brought her tears many times especially speaking to those that were so turned off of the fact of separating who were also in tears....she told me some people actually decided to vote no, instead of yes, just for the reason that there were those out there that actually did care (just by her one phone call!).....
That's a bloody awesome (and heartwarming) thing to do.
In fact, if there's another referendum, I think we should do the same.
I agree with your first thought....what bothers me is when people say they do not care (which in this province is the cool thing to do)....as a CANADIAN I love my country and my country includes Quebec...there are more pre-dominant issues than us english really understand (which I have learned through the teachings of thankyougrandma )...during the last referendum...my mother and some of her collegues began a drive to phone those in Quebec and convince them to say no....she spoke to so many pround Canadian's in Quebec that it brought her tears many times especially speaking to those that were so turned off of the fact of separating who were also in tears....she told me some people actually decided to vote no, instead of yes, just for the reason that there were those out there that actually did care (just by her one phone call!).....
I agree with your first thought....what bothers me is when people say they do not care (which in this province is the cool thing to do)....as a CANADIAN I love my country and my country includes Quebec...there are more pre-dominant issues than us english really understand (which I have learned through the teachings of thankyougrandma )...during the last referendum...my mother and some of her collegues began a drive to phone those in Quebec and convince them to say no....she spoke to so many pround Canadian's in Quebec that it brought her tears many times especially speaking to those that were so turned off of the fact of separating who were also in tears....she told me some people actually decided to vote no, instead of yes, just for the reason that there were those out there that actually did care (just by her one phone call!).....
I for one what Quebec in Canada.....
How many times Quebec need to be told we care? How much special recognition does it need?
What are the compelling reasons to keep try and keep Quebec in Canada if their hearts are set on seperating? Will it change how we feel about them? Will it change how we feel about Canada?
Are there other examples we can look to around the world where seperation has been good for both parties? Look at much of Europe, recognizing nations and new countries is accepted and doesn't seem to be feared as much as it is in Canada. Given the examples we see around the world I'm not sure why Canada seems to fear Quebec leaving so much. It seems to me like Quebec and Canada are in a marriage with irreconcilable differences but that doesn't mean they don't love each. But only that they don't want to be married anymore. If yo can find ways to make the marriage work for both parties great but I don't see that happening. I only see the differences getting worse over time. So without a compelling reason to try to keep Quebec in Canada I'd say our resources are better put to use else where.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
How many times Quebec need to be told we care? How much special recognition does it need?
What are the compelling reasons to keep try and keep Quebec in Canada if their hearts are set on seperating? Will it change how we feel about them? Will it change how we feel about Canada?
Are there other examples we can look to around the world where seperation has been good for both parties? Look at much of Europe, recognizing nations and new countries is accepted and doesn't seem to be feared as much as it is in Canada. Given the examples we see around the world I'm not sure why Canada seems to fear Quebec leaving so much. It seems to me like Quebec and Canada are in a marriage with irreconcilable differences but that doesn't mean they don't love each. But only that they don't want to be married anymore. If yo can find ways to make the marriage work for both parties great but I don't see that happening. I only see the differences getting worse over time. So without a compelling reason to try to keep Quebec in Canada I'd say our resources are better put to use else where.
Border-line 50% does not mean craziness to separate...it seems deep down you really want them to leave?
There is no fear from me its keeping intact the greatest country in the world having Quebec makes us so diverse and unique. I happen to love the people in Quebec without them many of GREAT Canadian poliitcal leaders would never have taken office.
Cheers for a united Canada....a thumbs down for separation...!
Border-line 50% does not mean craziness to separate...it seems deep down you really want them to leave?
There is no fear from me its keeping intact the greatest country in the world having Quebec makes us so diverse and unique. I happen to love the people in Quebec without them many of GREAT Canadian poliitcal leaders would never have taken office.
Cheers for a united Canada....a thumbs down for separation...!
It is only borderline 50% in Quebec but all it takes is 50% + 1. I see you had no compelling reasons for Quebec to stay.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
It is only borderline 50% in Quebec but all it takes is 50% + 1. I see you had no compelling reasons for Quebec to stay.
50%?, for quebec to separate i would assume it MUST be a different percentage for such a big step. 80-90% i say must agree. Im not a racist, biggot, stupid greedy dick that wants to push to benifit from the possible separation of Quebec. I love Canada the way it is. Quebec ads a great color to our country just like alberta, mind you alberta's color to me is shit but i don't mind them as a part of my country. some people just suck, but we must be accepted as a whole, if not where will it end?
50%?, for quebec to separate i would assume it MUST be a different percentage for such a big step. 80-90% i say must agree. Im not a racist, biggot, stupid greedy dick that wants to push to benifit from the possible separation of Quebec. I love Canada the way it is. Quebec ads a great color to our country just like alberta, mind you alberta's color to me is shit but i don't mind them as a part of my country. some people just suck, but we must be accepted as a whole, if not where will it end?
no for Quebec to seperate they need 50 + 1, provided it's a referendum like in 95. The funniest thing I find from this debate is the people out here who think Alberta should seperate, thought I would lighten the mood
"I'm not suicidal, except when I drink. That's why we don't all drink at the same time, there'd be no-one alive to drive home..."
Chris Cornell
no for Quebec to seperate they need 50 + 1, provided it's a referendum like in 95. The funniest thing I find from this debate is the people out here who think Alberta should seperate, thought I would lighten the mood
The US wants alberta, they planted seeds thier and they'll eventually get it, but first alberta is trying to get the rest of canada. Canada right now i feel is under a political invasion, but im a cynical jerk.
The US wants alberta, they planted seeds thier and they'll eventually get it, but first alberta is trying to get the rest of canada. Canada right now i feel is under a political invasion, but im a cynical jerk.
The US will never get Alberta.....NEVER! Im not sure what seeds you are talking about? I know the Amercian military has been coming to First Nations reservations over the last 10 or so years recruiting people for their military and using the Jay Treaty as an excuse to do so....is this what you mean?
>>>>
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
I don't have a problem with Quebec becoming it's own nation or country. being a nation would have almost no impact on how Canada goes about it business. Quebec becoming it's own country would be good for Canada, in that it would allow us to divert resources away from Quebec to address other issues. Not sure how Quebec would fare as a country, but I would wish them "Bon chance".
Special treatment for provinces will still occur. We'll still have Employment Insurance set up specifially to maximize use in the maritimes. Or turning a blind eye to oil exploration pollution for Alberta. We'd just have one less have not province to send money to, and another new country to visit. It's not like Quebec would be moving and we wouldn't get to see them when we wanted.
Nothing makes my blood boil like the assumption that everyone in the maritimes just lives off the Upper Canadian teat!! :mad: There were many people who didn't even want PEI to join Confederation as we ACTUALLY had money before we joined. Not everyone lives off of the dole and in fact most people I know have never been on fucking EI!! . Sure there are asswipes that abuse it here but I am pretty sure there are asswipes that abuse it ALL over Canada not just here. Way to stereotype :rolleyes:!!
i'm from montreal.. not a nationalist (quebecer or canadian).. i'm somewhat mixed on the issue of separation. personally, i would be more than willing to support independance, provided it led to a society that i feel would be beneficial to the greatest number of people. i feel that the views of the average canadian are much different than mine, and those of the average quebecer... i'm also somewhat disillusioned by harper/alberta, and the general culture of conservatism out west.. not that i was crazy about the liberals either, however.
Nothing makes my blood boil like the assumption that everyone in the maritimes just lives off the Upper Canadian teat!! :mad: There were many people who didn't even want PEI to join Confederation as we ACTUALLY had money before we joined. Not everyone lives off of the dole and in fact most people I know have never been on fucking EI!! . Sure there are asswipes that abuse it here but I am pretty sure there are asswipes that abuse it ALL over Canada not just here. Way to stereotype :rolleyes:!!
I said absolutely nothing about the people of the martitimes. I refered to a specific program that was changed purely for political vote garnering reasons. The changes weren't made for reasons of fairness. That is the facts, I can't deny the facts.
The point I was making is that people who complain about some special treatment that Quebec gets should take a look at their own province. There is a lot of unfair and special treatment legislation that all the provinces have and sometimes abuse. With the maritimes it's the EI rules, with New Foundland it possibly could be the change in natural resource revenue sharing, with BC it could be the current olympic money they are getting.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
The point I was making is that people who complain about some special treatment that Quebec gets should take a look at their own province. There is a lot of unfair and special treatment legislation that all the provinces have and sometimes abuse. With the maritimes it's the EI rules, with New Foundland it possibly could be the change in natural resource revenue sharing, with BC it could be the current olympic money they are getting.
thats like comparing oranges and apples and your examples really have nothing to do with Quebec asking to be treated as a Nation.
A) There is not much for resources in Newfoundland so what the hell are they going to share...although there is an increase in resource exploration in Newfoundland ..but this could be said for all provinces. WIth respect to the EI rules it has do with A.
C) BC deserves any and all the Olympic money they are getting because.....ummmmm they are hosting the Olympics and I am all for a secure games so making sure that happens is important.
Comparing the 'special treatment' that Quebec is asking for to your examples is not even the same thing. Respect your opinion nonetheless.
>>>>
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
So, what do we think of Harper's declaration? I actually back the move, because a) it was basically a tactic to counter an impending Bloc motion, and I enjoyed watching Duceppe sputter, b) its purely symbolic, no real power changes are involved, and c) I think it shows an appropriate level of respect for Quebec's very real differences.
The US wants alberta, they planted seeds thier and they'll eventually get it, but first alberta is trying to get the rest of canada. Canada right now i feel is under a political invasion, but im a cynical jerk.
Well, the first step is admitting you've got a problem.
So, what do we think of Harper's declaration? I actually back the move, because a) it was basically a tactic to counter an impending Bloc motion, and I enjoyed watching Duceppe sputter, b) its purely symbolic, no real power changes are involved, and c) I think it shows an appropriate level of respect for Quebec's very real differences.
I somewhat agree. It was a blatant political ass-kissing move ala Dubya, sure it's symbolic but I just HATE giving Quebec anything else, I wouldnt give Duceppe the sweat off of my balls if he was dying of thirst in the desert....perhaps I said too much.
>>>>
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
I somewhat agree. It was a blatant political ass-kissing move ala Dubya, sure it's symbolic but I just HATE giving Quebec anything else, I wouldnt give Duceppe the sweat off of my balls if he was dying of thirst in the desert....perhaps I said too much.
Ha! Can't say I disagree with you about Duceppe ... I don't think its a Dubya-esque move at all, though. If Quebec politicians needs some symbolic affirmation that they are indeed special, I say give it to them. They'll work harder against the separatists now. I'd agree with you if this thing had the potential for constitutional change, but at this point it does not.
Ha! Can't say I disagree with you about Duceppe ... I don't think its a Dubya-esque move at all, though. If Quebec politicians needs some symbolic affirmation that they are indeed special, I say give it to them. They'll work harder against the separatists now. I'd agree with you if this thing had the potential for constitutional change, but at this point it does not.
Quebec politicinas will always need some reaffirmation that they are special and the more the govt bends for them, the more they will continue to do this. Hell, they could build a snowman in Quebec and say that it deserves different treatment then say a snowman in the Peg. "Our snowman has rights god damnit!"
>>>>
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
Quebec politicinas will always need some reaffirmation that they are special and the more the govt bends for them, the more they will continue to do this. Hell, they could build a snowman in Quebec and say that it deserves different treatment then say a snowman in the Peg. "Our snowman has rights god damnit!"
Face it Quebec is different than the rest of Canada. Maybe historically it wasn't but since the rise of the seperatist/sovereignty movement and Trudea coming to power Quebec has become different. I have no problem offically acknowledging that difference. Especially since it's symbolic. Though I think we all know that over time it will move from symbolic to legislated and probably to seperation. Like I said, I look around the world and I don't fear this change for either Quebec or Canada.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
When the Government grows some balls and decides to say no, moreover, the government should take away half of the seats that Quebec currently holds in the house to lessen their power.....one could say though, that the west is outgrowing Quebec and that we will eventually hold more seats then them anyway.
Im all for stripping Quebec of their rights....sure they're going to be pissed but what are they going to do? Needless to say, Im a bit radical when it comes to Quebec.
>>>>
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
When the Government grows some balls and decides to say no, moreover, the government should take away half of the seats that Quebec currently holds in the house to lessen their power.....one could say though, that the west is outgrowing Quebec and that we will eventually hold more seats then them anyway.
Im all for stripping Quebec of their rights....sure they're going to be pissed but what are they going to do? Needless to say, Im a bit radical when it comes to Quebec.
We have a constitution that mandates that Quebec has one third of the seats regardless of their population. Quebec and the maritimes are currently over represented in government based on their population. BC and Alberta are under represented, that's part of BC and Alberta's dissatisfaction with the federal government. They will never have the say at the political table that they should.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
We have a constitution that mandates that Quebec has one third of the seats regardless of their population. Quebec and the maritimes are currently over represented in government based on their population. BC and Alberta are under represented, that's part of BC and Alberta's dissatisfaction with the federal government. They will never have the say at the political table that they should.
I know changing the constitution is no picnic, but this might have to be fixed. If the population of Alberta and BC eventually far outstrips that of Quebec, it makes no sense that the latter should have more seats. In fact, it is antithetical to democracy.
We have a constitution that mandates that Quebec has one third of the seats regardless of their population. Quebec and the maritimes are currently over represented in government based on their population. BC and Alberta are under represented, that's part of BC and Alberta's dissatisfaction with the federal government. They will never have the say at the political table that they should.
well yes thats part of it BUT the constitution has (1981) been changed and can be changed again, I figure if the conservative govt can bring up old issues like gay marriage then we can bring up Quebecs rights.
>>>>
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
Why the hell would Harper want to rock this boat? Politics obviously, however the ripple effects of this decision are unknown to everyone.
Harper is showing himself to be a very one dimentional figure, tax and spending cuts. Over the last few months he has shown to be a lightweight in just about every other department. Thank goodness he just has a minorty, but having him represent the country internationally makes me worry.
This sidewalk is for regular walking, not for fancy walking!
I know changing the constitution is no picnic, but this might have to be fixed. If the population of Alberta and BC eventually far outstrips that of Quebec, it makes no sense that the latter should have more seats. In fact, it is antithetical to democracy.
We aren't and never were a democracy. We have some democratic processes, but Canada does not believe in the one person one vote thing at all. A maritime vote is worth much more than a BC vote. It made sense when Canada started but makes no sense now.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
but having him represent the country internationally makes me worry.
canada stopped being a player internationally when we gutted our military and were unable to walk the talk. I agree with Harper's policy regarding China but he just went about it all wrong. Sometimes he has good ideas but just horrible plans to execute them.
“One good thing about music,
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
Comments
That's a bloody awesome (and heartwarming) thing to do.
In fact, if there's another referendum, I think we should do the same.
She said that it was one of the most self-rewarding things she had done in her whole life....very proud of her for that....
awesome post RIC
What are the compelling reasons to keep try and keep Quebec in Canada if their hearts are set on seperating? Will it change how we feel about them? Will it change how we feel about Canada?
Are there other examples we can look to around the world where seperation has been good for both parties? Look at much of Europe, recognizing nations and new countries is accepted and doesn't seem to be feared as much as it is in Canada. Given the examples we see around the world I'm not sure why Canada seems to fear Quebec leaving so much. It seems to me like Quebec and Canada are in a marriage with irreconcilable differences but that doesn't mean they don't love each. But only that they don't want to be married anymore. If yo can find ways to make the marriage work for both parties great but I don't see that happening. I only see the differences getting worse over time. So without a compelling reason to try to keep Quebec in Canada I'd say our resources are better put to use else where.
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
Border-line 50% does not mean craziness to separate...it seems deep down you really want them to leave?
There is no fear from me its keeping intact the greatest country in the world having Quebec makes us so diverse and unique. I happen to love the people in Quebec without them many of GREAT Canadian poliitcal leaders would never have taken office.
Cheers for a united Canada....a thumbs down for separation...!
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
50%?, for quebec to separate i would assume it MUST be a different percentage for such a big step. 80-90% i say must agree. Im not a racist, biggot, stupid greedy dick that wants to push to benifit from the possible separation of Quebec. I love Canada the way it is. Quebec ads a great color to our country just like alberta, mind you alberta's color to me is shit but i don't mind them as a part of my country. some people just suck, but we must be accepted as a whole, if not where will it end?
no for Quebec to seperate they need 50 + 1, provided it's a referendum like in 95. The funniest thing I find from this debate is the people out here who think Alberta should seperate, thought I would lighten the mood
Chris Cornell
http://www.myspace.com/mrwalkerb
The US wants alberta, they planted seeds thier and they'll eventually get it, but first alberta is trying to get the rest of canada. Canada right now i feel is under a political invasion, but im a cynical jerk.
The US will never get Alberta.....NEVER! Im not sure what seeds you are talking about? I know the Amercian military has been coming to First Nations reservations over the last 10 or so years recruiting people for their military and using the Jay Treaty as an excuse to do so....is this what you mean?
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
Nothing makes my blood boil like the assumption that everyone in the maritimes just lives off the Upper Canadian teat!! :mad: There were many people who didn't even want PEI to join Confederation as we ACTUALLY had money before we joined. Not everyone lives off of the dole and in fact most people I know have never been on fucking EI!! . Sure there are asswipes that abuse it here but I am pretty sure there are asswipes that abuse it ALL over Canada not just here. Way to stereotype :rolleyes:!!
just my two cents.
The point I was making is that people who complain about some special treatment that Quebec gets should take a look at their own province. There is a lot of unfair and special treatment legislation that all the provinces have and sometimes abuse. With the maritimes it's the EI rules, with New Foundland it possibly could be the change in natural resource revenue sharing, with BC it could be the current olympic money they are getting.
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
Hippiemom...... the French just like to have the right balance!
A) There is not much for resources in Newfoundland so what the hell are they going to share...although there is an increase in resource exploration in Newfoundland ..but this could be said for all provinces.
C) BC deserves any and all the Olympic money they are getting because.....ummmmm they are hosting the Olympics and I am all for a secure games so making sure that happens is important.
Comparing the 'special treatment' that Quebec is asking for to your examples is not even the same thing. Respect your opinion nonetheless.
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
Well, the first step is admitting you've got a problem.
I somewhat agree. It was a blatant political ass-kissing move ala Dubya, sure it's symbolic but I just HATE giving Quebec anything else, I wouldnt give Duceppe the sweat off of my balls if he was dying of thirst in the desert....perhaps I said too much.
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
Ha! Can't say I disagree with you about Duceppe ... I don't think its a Dubya-esque move at all, though. If Quebec politicians needs some symbolic affirmation that they are indeed special, I say give it to them. They'll work harder against the separatists now. I'd agree with you if this thing had the potential for constitutional change, but at this point it does not.
Quebec politicinas will always need some reaffirmation that they are special and the more the govt bends for them, the more they will continue to do this. Hell, they could build a snowman in Quebec and say that it deserves different treatment then say a snowman in the Peg. "Our snowman has rights god damnit!"
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
Point ... One can ask when it all should stop.
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
When the Government grows some balls and decides to say no, moreover, the government should take away half of the seats that Quebec currently holds in the house to lessen their power.....one could say though, that the west is outgrowing Quebec and that we will eventually hold more seats then them anyway.
Im all for stripping Quebec of their rights....sure they're going to be pissed but what are they going to do? Needless to say, Im a bit radical when it comes to Quebec.
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
I know changing the constitution is no picnic, but this might have to be fixed. If the population of Alberta and BC eventually far outstrips that of Quebec, it makes no sense that the latter should have more seats. In fact, it is antithetical to democracy.
well yes thats part of it BUT the constitution has (1981) been changed and can be changed again, I figure if the conservative govt can bring up old issues like gay marriage then we can bring up Quebecs rights.
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
Harper is showing himself to be a very one dimentional figure, tax and spending cuts. Over the last few months he has shown to be a lightweight in just about every other department. Thank goodness he just has a minorty, but having him represent the country internationally makes me worry.
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley
when it hits you, you feel to pain.
So brutalize me with music.”
~ Bob Marley