Do Schools Kill Creativity?

Alex_Coe

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

Did you watch the presentation on the link? We are all aware they have art class and pe

I don't have to read the link to make up my mind. I've already decided the issue without the help of the video.

Abookamongstthemany

Cosmo wrote:

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It's the one that makes the picture interesting.

It's so obvious the picture had too many oranges!

Abookamongstthemany

NMyTree wrote:

Didn't take, did it.:D

Because you dared to think for yourself and develope your own thought process, perceptions and opinions.

My grandmother always thought me to question everything and everyone. Except for her:D;)

That was an Ani quote.

My grandmother was a lot like that, too.

Abookamongstthemany

Alex_Coe wrote:

I don't have to read the link to make up my mind. I've already decided the issue without the help of the video.

So you've learned all there is know about the subject? Interesting.

Alex_Coe

Cosmo wrote:

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Unfortunately... it's possible that all you've learned was how to pass the test.

Well, at least in my school, the test will ask you everything you need to know.

For example, if the test asks you to convert this sentence to French, then it's at least an adequate indicator of "do you get it".

I hear people say it all the time: passing the math test doesn't mena you can do math" or some similar subject. Yeah, it's a problem. But what's your counter-proposal? Give kids a pill full of knowledge?

Alex_Coe

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

So you've learned all there is know about the subject? Interesting.

I took a look at the video... I think i've seen this before. In fact, I'm almost positive. We have this same thread every week or so. I heard a LOT of the same things. All the whiners in this thread (no one in particular) are simply parroting the content in the video.

Abookamongstthemany

Alex_Coe wrote:

I took a look at the video... I think i've seen this before. In fact, I'm almost positive. We have this same thread every week or so. I heard a LOT of the same things. All the whiners in this thread (no one in particular) are simply parroting the content in the video.

I must have missed those threads. Hmmm

Cosmo

Alex_Coe wrote:

Well, at least in my school, the test will ask you everything you need to know.

For example, if the test asks you to convert this sentence to French, then it's at least an adequate indicator of "do you get it".

I hear people say it all the time: passing the math test doesn't mena you can do math" or some similar subject. Yeah, it's a problem. But what's your counter-proposal? Give kids a pill full of knowledge?

...
How 'bout this... try TEACHING them the subjects. Teach the fundamentals when they are young... how to read and write and basic math.
And yeah... test them. but, how about also giving them aptittude tests to see how they relate to subjects. I mean, a high school kid that can tear apart and rebuild a motorcycle can probably contribute to society as an adult as a mechanic... why does he need to know Shakespeare if he doesn't give a damn about Shakespeare? We will always need mechanics to fix our cars and we will always need plumbers to fix our toilets. Maybe a parallel training path for kids that'll be the ones fixing your car... where he will learn about diagnosing that knocking sound coming from your left front wheel and not have to worry about getting an 'F' because he didn't understand 'Beowoulf'.
And seriously... most adults can get by in life without understanding or applying algebra in their day to day affairs... when was the last time you had to factor out a quadratic equation at work? That's why God created calculators.
...
And maybe they should focus on practical things too... so we don't have these bi-lingual French Majors with $25,453.43 in Credit Card debt because he hasn't got a clue on how credit Cards work.

Vedderlution_Baby

Alex_Coe wrote:

I took a look at the video... I think i've seen this before. In fact, I'm almost positive. We have this same thread every week or so. I heard a LOT of the same things. All the whiners in this thread (no one in particular) are simply parroting the content in the video.

I'm giving you first hand experience less than three years old. I didnt even watch the video.

El_Kabong

NMyTree wrote:

Which manifests itself in the behavior or lack of action by a lot of Americans.

I know you have, but this is a rhetorical question. Have you noticed fewer and fewer people in this country seem incapable of thinking for themselves or thinking outside the box?

Fewer and fewer people seem to need someone to tell them what to do or how to react, in just about every situation?

It'a all such a narrow road which spills into one culdesac of a corporate-approved (or dictated) mindest.

have you read 'dumbing us down'? it's a really good book! he won teh new york city and state teacher of the year awards

in it he says the literacy rate was higher before mandatory schooling and corporations like sears & roebuck made the first mass school systems....

http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/

know1

If anyone is killing creativity, it's the parents.

Jeanwah

I haven't watched the video yet, but you can blame the No Child Left Behind for the lack of real education, let alone educating creativity. These standardized tests are coming down from the big man for schools to mandatorily pass or the school's funding gets denied. Imagine the pressure on the teachers for that, let alone teachers encouraging students to think outside the box!

Collin

know1 wrote:

If anyone is killing creativity, it's the parents.

TV and video games.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

know1 wrote:

If anyone is killing creativity, it's the parents.

DING DING DING!!!!!!!

we have a winner!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

chopitdown

i think schools do kill creativity b/c schools can't test that or get rewarded for that. I also think our media and society kill the creativity. There's no need to think anymore or pretend b/c we have virtual reality, we have computer games, we want everything spelled out for us...i heard someone commenting on the sopranos series finale and how much of a letdown it was b/c it just faded to black and there was no reconciliation that was apparent. It left the end up to the imagination. We live in such a passive intellectual culture, and creativity requires being active.

cornnifer

Jeanwah wrote:

I haven't watched the video yet, but you can blame the No Child Left Behind for the lack of real education, let alone educating creativity. These standardized tests are coming down from the big man for schools to mandatorily pass or the school's funding gets denied. Imagine the pressure on the teachers for that, let alone teachers encouraging students to think outside the box!

Yeah, NCLB definitely sucks. Ask any public school teacher in America, and most will tell you as much. Does that mean the public school system sucks and kills creativity? No. Does that mean alternative systems such as homeschooling promote creativity? No. Many in, in fact most, public school teachers i know, (being one, as well as being married to one, i can safely say i know more than a few) do in fact encourage creativity and free thinking. Its assuming alot to say that because when you are four you are asked to determine the difference between oranges and pears you are being denied the right and ability to make your own aesthetic decisions. Thats just silly. It no more discourages creativity and free thinking than does asking the sum of 2 and 3. i encourage some of you to actually spend some time in some public school classrooms. My guess is that many of you have no real idea of what your discussing.
i'm not trying to discredit alternative means of education. Homeschooling for some is great. Personally, i don't really trust it it many cases. The door swings both ways. Free thinking is great. Free thinking wothout a skills and knowledge base creates nothing but free thinking morons. That can be disastrous. In public schools, due to bullshit legislation, testing is, in fact, overdone sometimes. On the otherside, homeschoolers go virtually unchecked. Also dangerous. My experience with homeschooled children, (i have known plenty of those as well) is that some have been lucky enough to have parents who are dedicated (and capable) to actually provide a balanced education. Academically they do very well. They tend to suffer socially. There are homeschool groups which claim to provide needed socialization for homeschool children, but they generally offer little to no diversity. They tend to socialize only with children who look, dress, speak and think just like them. How much free thinking does THAT encourage. Homeschoolers tend to offer their children only those ideas THEY decide are correct. How much free thinking does THAT encourage?
i always find it funny the way some here go on about free thinking while citing youtube videos and hippie folk singers. "You're only a free thinker if you think just like I do and agree with everything I say..." That doesn't fly with me.

edit: if a child's ONLY education happens in the school classroom, that child is suffering.

Alex_Coe

Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:

I'm giving you first hand experience less than three years old. I didnt even watch the video.

If you didn't watch it, then why must I watch it?

Vedderlution_Baby

Alex_Coe wrote:

If you didn't watch it, then why must I watch it?

I didn't say you had to watch it. You said most people were whining and parroting what was in the video. I was saying that i was giving you first hand experience that I know is relevant and true.

Abookamongstthemany

chopitdown wrote:

i think schools do kill creativity b/c schools can't test that or get rewarded for that. I also think our media and society kill the creativity. There's no need to think anymore or pretend b/c we have virtual reality, we have computer games, we want everything spelled out for us...i heard someone commenting on the sopranos series finale and how much of a letdown it was b/c it just faded to black and there was no reconciliation that was apparent. It left the end up to the imagination. We live in such a passive intellectual culture, and creativity requires being active.

Exactly. It seems schools these days teach children how to adapt to the already flawed ways of society instead of helping them build their own ideas and create new and better ways.

jeffbr

Cornnifer addressed the issue quite well.

I think you can get out of education exactly what you put into it. If you send your kids to public schools and that is the extent of their learning, that is your problem. If you send them to public schools, volunteer at the school, attend parent meetings, become active in the PTA, work with your kids after school on their homework, talk around the dinner table about what they've learned (and why you might disagree with it), then you'll have a completely different experience.

My kids are going through the public school system, but we're very actively participating in their educations. Consequently, they score well on state standardized tests, but they can also question what they're learning, discover other theories/opinions, do well on national tests, etc... I know "creative" homeschooled kids who are socially retarded and can't approach problems logically. I know public school kids who seem unable to think in ways other than what they've been taught in school and struggle to deal with discussions outside the bounds of their texts. In both those instances, it is quite easy to look to the parents for clues to the way their kids function.

If you use the school system (public or private) as a babysitter for your kid, they aren't going to do well. If you take an active role in what they're learning and how they're learning, you can create the experience you're looking for.