but they do that in saudi arbia too. must be another reason
...
The Western region of Pakistan is Bin Laden country. He is there for a reason... it provides him protection from us.
Yet, look at the money and weapons we are giving to Pakistan. Why? Because Musharaf says he's with us on this one. Is he? I don't think he is... especially when the majority of his nation is on Bin Laden's side, not ours. We are fools for giving them our tax dollars and weapons... and Musharaf knows we are fools.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
i see these guys can be a little tough on you once in a while, i am glad you can handle it
for the record, i dont think your crazy or anything like that. i dont think you want war or any of that nonsense. from what i can tell your probably a nice guy that means well. i respect the fact that we see things different and i would gladly buy you a beer.
but you have to admit that some of these arguments are a tad stretching. you really dont think that the good ol USA would not walk into any country on the fucking planet and take out Osama if it wanted to? it wouldnt matter what country it was, china, russia, or pakistan. and do you really believe that if this country wanted to really turn the dogs loose it wouldnt find him ASAP? they can get a satelite image of my bong from alaska right now in about 15 seconds. i am sure you can see the MANY benefits of keeping mr osama alive and well. if we had him in a cell average joe thumb up his ass would say the "war on terror" is over so lets get the fuck out of the middle east and stop oppressing my fucking rights back here in the states. with the boogey man still alive and making rap video's once a week they can continue to do whatever the fuck they want under the guise of "terror, security, and the homeland".
other reason they may not want to catch him... they do not want to make this guy the king of all martyrs. if we killed or jailed this guy he would immediately explode with popularity in those communities even more than now. i personally dont buy it, but it can be argued.
...
The Western region of Pakistan is Bin Laden country. He is there for a reason... it provides him protection from us.
Yet, look at the money and weapons we are giving to Pakistan. Why? Because Musharaf says he's with us on this one. Is he? I don't think he is... especially when the majority of his nation is on Bin Laden's side, not ours. We are fools for giving them our tax dollars and weapons... and Musharaf knows we are fools.
yea I agree with you. pakistan sucks. but they have done some good. they cant be overlooked. they captured some high level people. but the area in question.."bin laden country" as you say, is out of musharafs control.
i see these guys can be a little tough on you once in a while, i am glad you can handle it
for the record, i dont think your crazy or anything like that. i dont think you want war or any of that nonsense. from what i can tell your probably a nice guy that means well. i respect the fact that we see things different and i would gladly buy you a beer.
thanks hands. if you make it too chicago, let me know. beers on me.
but you have to admit that some of these arguments are a tad stretching. you really dont think that the good ol USA would not walk into any country on the fucking planet and take out Osama if it wanted to? it wouldnt matter what country it was, china, russia, or pakistan. and do you really believe that if this country wanted to really turn the dogs loose it wouldnt find him ASAP?
sadly, no I dont think we could. while I do believe USA is the most powerful country in the world, we have our limits. marching into pakistan and looking for bin laden is one of them, especially today with our military stretched so thin.
they can get a satelite image of my bong from alaska right now in about 15 seconds. i am sure you can see the MANY benefits of keeping mr osama alive and well. if we had him in a cell average joe thumb up his ass would say the "war on terror" is over so lets get the fuck out of the middle east and stop oppressing my fucking rights back here in the states. with the boogey man still alive and making rap video's once a week they can continue to do whatever the fuck they want under the guise of "terror, security, and the homeland".
I just dont buy it. osama is smart. he knows how to blend in and hide. not to mention he is in one of the most remote areas of the world. outsiders just arent there. but your reasons are logically I just dont see it that way.
other reason they may not want to catch him... they do not want to make this guy the king of all martyrs. if we killed or jailed this guy he would immediately explode with popularity in those communities even more than now.
this is also possible. but I dont see the US keeping its finger off the trigger if they see bin laden in the crosshairs.
yea I agree with you. pakistan sucks. but they have done some good. they cant be overlooked. they captured some high level people. but the area in question.."bin laden country" as you say, is out of musharafs control.
...
Yes, we agree. And I don't buy into that whole 'Enemy of my enemy' thing because we got burned on it in the past by Hussein and Bin Laden. Pakistan would love to see us smoked by a nuke... we should not be aiding a country that hates us... well, at least, that's the call I'd make.
We just need to come to the realization that Bin Laden has fled the security of Afghanistan to the sanctity of Pakistan and simply admit it... there's not much we can do about it. This lie about 'War on Terror' and 'Hunt For Bin Laden' needs to be told as it is... i believe the American people deserve the truth... no matter how horrible and ugly it is.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
thanks hands. if you make it too chicago, let me know. beers on me.
sadly, no I dont think we could. while I do believe USA is the most powerful country in the world, we have our limits. marching into pakistan and looking for bin laden is one of them, especially today with our military stretched so thin.
I just dont buy it. osama is smart. he knows how to blend in and hide. not to mention he is in one of the most remote areas of the world. outsiders just arent there. but your reasons are logically I just dont see it that way.
this is also possible. but I dont see the US keeping its finger off the trigger if they see bin laden in the crosshairs.
haha good, i was just starting to like you
so you think pakistan wouldnt extract osama by any means neccesary if we threatened to completely cut them off. i think they would hand him right over considering we support musharaff and his oppresive regime by funneling massive amounts of military aid to them?
i think he would be on the ground here in usa custody by breakfast tommorow.
On November 6, 2001, US President Bush declared his polity: "You are either with us or against us". President Musharraf later claimed that U.S. threatened to bomb Pakistan "back to the Stone Age" after the Sept. 11 attacks if Pakistan refused to help America with its war on terrorism.[1]
Musharraf writes in his "In the Line of Fire" [2]:
The next morning I was chairing an important meeting at the Governor's House when my military secretary told me that the U.S. secretary of state, General Colin Powell, was on the phone. I said that I would call back later, but he insisted that I come out of the meeting and take the call. Powell was quite candid: "You are either with us or against us." I took this as a blatant ultimatum. ... our director general of Inter Services Intelligence, who happened to be in Washington, told me on the phone about his meeting with the U.S. deputy secretary of state, Richard Armitage. ... told the director general not only that we had to decide whether we were with America or with the terrorists, but that if we chose the terrorists, then we should be prepared to be bombed back to the Stone Age. This was a shockingly barefaced threat, but it was obvious that the United States had decided to hit back, and hit back hard.
I also analysed our national interest. First, India had already tried to step in by offering its bases to the United States. If we did not join the United States, it would accept India's offer. What would happen then? ...
Second, the security of our strategic assets would be jeopardized. ... And India, needless to say, would have loved to assist the United States to the hilt.
Third, our economic infrastructure, built over half a century, would have been decimated. The ultimate question that confronted me was whether it was in our national interest to destroy ourselves for the Taliban. Were they worth committing suicide over? The answer was a resounding no.
Eric Margolis who had interviewd Musharraf, writes [3]:
Leaked cabinet documents from 10 Downing Street show three months before invading Iraq in 2003, President Bush told British PM Tony Blair that once he finished off Iraq, he planned to `go after’ Pakistan and Saudi Arabia. Pakistan was in America’s cross hairs.
Every time Pakistan got into trouble with Washington, it would suddenly discover `one of al-Qaida’s top commanders’ and deliver him to the Americans. So far, almost 700 have been sent, in each case for rewards of millions of dollars, as Musharraf unwisely boasted.
Musharraf acknowledges the payments in his book:
"We've captured 689 and handed over 369 to the United States. We've earned bounties totaling millions of dollars"
so you think pakistan wouldnt extract osama by any means neccesary if we threatened to completely cut them off. i think they would hand him right over considering we support musharaff and his oppresive regime by funneling massive amounts of military aid to them?
i think he would be on the ground here in usa custody by breakfast tommorow.
I really dont know. but I love the threat you propose. there has to be alot pakistan isnt telling us. I dont trust them really at all. but musaraf has to protect himself first. I believe that country is and would be much more out of control if we didnt have musaraf there.
I really dont know. but I love the threat you propose. there has to be alot pakistan isnt telling us. I dont trust them really at all.
threat. it is what they would do. the usa has a long history of financially buying, or strangling, nations to influence policy... so i dont think they would do it to pakistan, especially by now...if they wanted bin laden
but musaraf has to protect himself first. I believe that country is and would be much more out of control if we didnt have musaraf there.
so you admit "we have" musharaf... and you like the idea of an iron fisted leader keeping the population "in control"?
I really dont know. but I love the threat you propose. there has to be alot pakistan isnt telling us. I dont trust them really at all. but musaraf has to protect himself first. I believe that country is and would be much more out of control if we didnt have musaraf there.
...
I think you have just validated my point... Musharaf will NOT live forever. But, the military weapons we give him... and the U.S. Taxpayer dollars he uses to expand his nuclear capability will be. We need to STOP giving Pakistan weapons and money to expand weapons and weapons delivery systems programs.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
...
I think you have just validated my point... Musharaf will NOT live forever. But, the military weapons we give him... and the U.S. Taxpayer dollars he uses to expand his nuclear capability will be. We need to STOP giving Pakistan weapons and money to expand weapons and weapons delivery systems programs.
yea I agree. but then we also face burning any bridges we have with potential new leaders of that country. its a fine line between friend or enemy with them.
would be interesting to read a thesis or something from someone who has expert knowledge on pakistan, its people, and its regions.
threat. it is what they would do. the usa has a long history of financially buying, or strangling, nations to influence policy... so i dont think they would do it to pakistan, especially by now...if they wanted bin laden
it still comes down to the area in question. these tribal areas shouldnt even be considered pakistan. but it is, so its treated and defended as such.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
o man. please dont waste your time with such garbage websites.
although I do believe it is a possibility he is dead. but we dont have proof
it's a collection of articles with references from major news outlets like BBC, CNN, Fox, NY times etc...
I think they probably have a very good idea that he is already dead which is why Bush has publicly stated that he's not that concerned with finding him.
I mean something is up that much we can all agree on. Saddam couldn't even hide in a hole in the ground in his own country even.
The only logical explanation is that he's already dead.
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
yea I agree. but then we also face burning any bridges we have with potential new leaders of that country. its a fine line between friend or enemy with them.
would be interesting to read a thesis or something from someone who has expert knowledge on pakistan, its people, and its regions.
because we cant prove osama is there. starting a war with this country would gain us hundreds of millions of more extremist muslim enemies. our military isnt large enough to be involved in such a large scale war. pakistan is not a small place. for further evidence why we shouldnt go into pakistan. see iraq.
i'm somewhat shocked that you would advocate invading a country as big and violent as pakistan. especially now with how fucked up the world is. you really dont get it.
I have seen and read much more then you on the subject and there is nothing out there that proves 9/11 was an inside job. I see all sides.
come back when you have something constructive to say. so far you have just embarrassed yourself along with your tini wini crew.
Thanks bro......So with your worldlly knowledge? (sic) Why did you go into Afgan again? You may as well spare me the "to get the bin man" as you comment says, "why go somewhere when you don't know where he is for sure". You are taking the intel and telling me it is solid proof? Riiiiiigh! And then to the Taliban who are not really a government but a tribe. What were you saying earlier about the tribal region. You back track more then your government does for somebody who has read and knows more than me. What a wanker.
...
I think you have just validated my point... Musharaf will NOT live forever. But, the military weapons we give him... and the U.S. Taxpayer dollars he uses to expand his nuclear capability will be. We need to STOP giving Pakistan weapons and money to expand weapons and weapons delivery systems programs.
You need to ask why you are giving them wepons, because i can promise you now the country benefits from this deal the most is America.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
You may as well spare me the "to get the bin man" as you comment says, "why go somewhere when you don't know where he is for sure". You are taking the intel and telling me it is solid proof? Riiiiiigh!
I'm american, my native language is english. I can't debate with you if yuo are going to give me this jibberish
What were you saying earlier about the tribal region. You back track more then your government does for somebody who has read and knows more than me. What a wanker.
so you are saying the country of Afghanistan is the same as the tribal areas of pakistan? at least I think thats what you are saying. your sentences are hard to figure out. but if thats the case, you are wrong. the taliban ruled the country and was the only government in place and had allowed al qaeda and bin laden OPEN free reign throughout the country.
you might stop repeating fox news so much after you learn about this new amazing little word.
"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
No i'm talking in terms of history, america is only interested in helping other countries when it benefits them, natrually of course.
Nothing that is done by america is done out of goodwill it's about what will i gain.
The taliban is shining example of that. America created it.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
The taliban is shining example of that. America created it.
The Taliban initially had enormous goodwill from Afghans weary of the corruption, brutality and incessant fighting of Mujahideen warlords. Two contrasting narratives of the beginnings of the Taliban[9] are that the rape and murder of boys and girls from a family traveling to Kandahar or a similar outrage by Mujahideen bandits sparked Mullah Omar and his students to vow to rid Afghanistan of these criminals. [10] The other is that the Pakistan-based lorry shipping mafia known as the "Afghanistan Transit Trade" and their allies in the Pakistan government, trained, armed and financed the Taliban to clear the southern road across Afghanistan to the Central Asian Republics of extortionate bandit gangs. [11] In either or both cases, the Taliban were based in the Helmand, Kandahar and Uruzgan region, and were overwhelmingly ethnic Pashtuns and predominantly Durrani Pashtuns. They received training and arms from Pakistan although they retained some independence, often refusing the advice of the Pakistan government.
The first major military activity of the Taliban was in October-November 1994 when they marched from Maiwand in southern Afghanistan to capture Kandahar City and the surrounding provinces, losing only a few dozen men.[12] Starting with the capture of a border crossing and a huge ammunition dump from warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, a couple weeks later they freed "a convoy trying to open a trade route from Pakistan to Central Asia" from another group of warlords attempting to extort money.[13] In the next three months this hitherto "unknown force" took control of twelve of Afghanistan's 34 provinces, with Mujahideen warlords often surrendering to them without a fight and the "heavily armed population" giving up their weapons.[14] By September 1996 they captured Afghanistan's capital, Kabul.
you might stop repeating fox news so much after you learn about this new amazing little word.
"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
again with these baseless personal attacks. is that all you got?
it still comes down to the area in question. these tribal areas shouldnt even be considered pakistan. but it is, so its treated and defended as such.
so if it isnt even pakistan what the hell are we waiting for? i honetly think it is a tad naive to think we "cant" go into a tribal area of western pakistan to extract the worlds most wanted man?
its a fucked up country, that much I know. I dont believe the country can be control any other way.
i am sorry to see you advocating authoritarian rule and the oppresion of any people or country. you might want to think about that position for a while. pakistans people are just that, people just like me and you. its a pretty sad stance for an american. esecially one that advocated the escalation of the iraq war to try and ensure "freedom and democracy" :rolleyes:
so if it isnt even pakistan what the hell are we waiting for?
dude thats just my opinion. obviously the tribal areas are considered pakistan and are defended as such and recongized by the internaltional community as pakistan.
i honetly think it is a tad naive to think we "cant" go into a tribal area of western pakistan to extract the worlds most wanted man?
sadly yes. we cant go. just think about what your saying. you seem to think we CAN go. then we would be at war with pakistan. pakistan would send it army there. musaraf might get overthrown, the country HAS nukes. India would probably get involved. I dont think I need to explain to you the consequences of going into pakistan.
i am sorry to see you advocating authoritarian rule and the oppresion of any people or country. you might want to think about that position for a while.
of course I dont like it. but look what good it has done in Iraq. you know me, I'm all for deomcracy and freedom. you think i'm "advocating" otherwise? whats the alternative, invade every country that has a dictator? dont try to sit there and have a bleeding heart for people under oppressive governemnts. in that case you would be praises Bush for freeing Iraq from a very very brutal dictator.
pakistans people are just that, people just like me and you. its a pretty sad stance for an american. esecially one that advocated the escalation of the iraq war to try and ensure "freedom and democracy" :rolleyes:
dude get off it already. your bullshit and you know it. I want pakistanis, iraqis, noth Koreans, all of them to be free.
...
The Western region of Pakistan is Bin Laden country. He is there for a reason... it provides him protection from us.
Yet, look at the money and weapons we are giving to Pakistan. Why? Because Musharaf says he's with us on this one. Is he? I don't think he is... especially when the majority of his nation is on Bin Laden's side, not ours. We are fools for giving them our tax dollars and weapons... and Musharaf knows we are fools.
I agree with alot of what you are saying, but our hand is being forced on this one. Pakistan is "one bullet" away from being an Islamic theocracy. Like you said, the majority of his country sides with Bin Laden. If they were to take over, they would gain control of nuclear weapons. Supporting Musharaf sucks, but it is better than the alternative.
I'm american, my native language is english. I can't debate with you if yuo are going to give me this jibberish
at the time of the invasion Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates recognized them as the government of Afghanistan.
so you are saying the country of Afghanistan is the same as the tribal areas of pakistan? at least I think thats what you are saying. your sentences are hard to figure out. but if thats the case, you are wrong. the taliban ruled the country and was the only government in place and had allowed al qaeda and bin laden OPEN free reign throughout the country.
yuo? Jibberish? Yeah!
Anyway my Pakistani intelligence, I think you should go in and get the guy and you don't. Pussy stance is all I can say.
He killed so many Yanks and we vowed to get him. But we are afraid to step on toes to do it. BULLSHIT that even your mentality can't twist around.
Thanks for the chat. When you actually offer up how to go about getting him in this thread, instead of "we can't go there" it will be a much better conversation. Until then...................................
Comments
The Western region of Pakistan is Bin Laden country. He is there for a reason... it provides him protection from us.
Yet, look at the money and weapons we are giving to Pakistan. Why? Because Musharaf says he's with us on this one. Is he? I don't think he is... especially when the majority of his nation is on Bin Laden's side, not ours. We are fools for giving them our tax dollars and weapons... and Musharaf knows we are fools.
Hail, Hail!!!
for the record, i dont think your crazy or anything like that. i dont think you want war or any of that nonsense. from what i can tell your probably a nice guy that means well. i respect the fact that we see things different and i would gladly buy you a beer.
but you have to admit that some of these arguments are a tad stretching. you really dont think that the good ol USA would not walk into any country on the fucking planet and take out Osama if it wanted to? it wouldnt matter what country it was, china, russia, or pakistan. and do you really believe that if this country wanted to really turn the dogs loose it wouldnt find him ASAP? they can get a satelite image of my bong from alaska right now in about 15 seconds. i am sure you can see the MANY benefits of keeping mr osama alive and well. if we had him in a cell average joe thumb up his ass would say the "war on terror" is over so lets get the fuck out of the middle east and stop oppressing my fucking rights back here in the states. with the boogey man still alive and making rap video's once a week they can continue to do whatever the fuck they want under the guise of "terror, security, and the homeland".
other reason they may not want to catch him... they do not want to make this guy the king of all martyrs. if we killed or jailed this guy he would immediately explode with popularity in those communities even more than now. i personally dont buy it, but it can be argued.
9/11 conspiracy's i will save for another day
sadly, no I dont think we could. while I do believe USA is the most powerful country in the world, we have our limits. marching into pakistan and looking for bin laden is one of them, especially today with our military stretched so thin.
I just dont buy it. osama is smart. he knows how to blend in and hide. not to mention he is in one of the most remote areas of the world. outsiders just arent there. but your reasons are logically I just dont see it that way.
this is also possible. but I dont see the US keeping its finger off the trigger if they see bin laden in the crosshairs.
haha good, i was just starting to like you
Yes, we agree. And I don't buy into that whole 'Enemy of my enemy' thing because we got burned on it in the past by Hussein and Bin Laden. Pakistan would love to see us smoked by a nuke... we should not be aiding a country that hates us... well, at least, that's the call I'd make.
We just need to come to the realization that Bin Laden has fled the security of Afghanistan to the sanctity of Pakistan and simply admit it... there's not much we can do about it. This lie about 'War on Terror' and 'Hunt For Bin Laden' needs to be told as it is... i believe the American people deserve the truth... no matter how horrible and ugly it is.
Hail, Hail!!!
so you think pakistan wouldnt extract osama by any means neccesary if we threatened to completely cut them off. i think they would hand him right over considering we support musharaff and his oppresive regime by funneling massive amounts of military aid to them?
i think he would be on the ground here in usa custody by breakfast tommorow.
On November 6, 2001, US President Bush declared his polity: "You are either with us or against us". President Musharraf later claimed that U.S. threatened to bomb Pakistan "back to the Stone Age" after the Sept. 11 attacks if Pakistan refused to help America with its war on terrorism.[1]
Musharraf writes in his "In the Line of Fire" [2]:
The next morning I was chairing an important meeting at the Governor's House when my military secretary told me that the U.S. secretary of state, General Colin Powell, was on the phone. I said that I would call back later, but he insisted that I come out of the meeting and take the call. Powell was quite candid: "You are either with us or against us." I took this as a blatant ultimatum. ... our director general of Inter Services Intelligence, who happened to be in Washington, told me on the phone about his meeting with the U.S. deputy secretary of state, Richard Armitage. ... told the director general not only that we had to decide whether we were with America or with the terrorists, but that if we chose the terrorists, then we should be prepared to be bombed back to the Stone Age. This was a shockingly barefaced threat, but it was obvious that the United States had decided to hit back, and hit back hard.
I also analysed our national interest. First, India had already tried to step in by offering its bases to the United States. If we did not join the United States, it would accept India's offer. What would happen then? ...
Second, the security of our strategic assets would be jeopardized. ... And India, needless to say, would have loved to assist the United States to the hilt.
Third, our economic infrastructure, built over half a century, would have been decimated.
The ultimate question that confronted me was whether it was in our national interest to destroy ourselves for the Taliban. Were they worth committing suicide over? The answer was a resounding no.
Eric Margolis who had interviewd Musharraf, writes [3]:
Leaked cabinet documents from 10 Downing Street show three months before invading Iraq in 2003, President Bush told British PM Tony Blair that once he finished off Iraq, he planned to `go after’ Pakistan and Saudi Arabia. Pakistan was in America’s cross hairs.
Every time Pakistan got into trouble with Washington, it would suddenly discover `one of al-Qaida’s top commanders’ and deliver him to the Americans. So far, almost 700 have been sent, in each case for rewards of millions of dollars, as Musharraf unwisely boasted.
Musharraf acknowledges the payments in his book:
"We've captured 689 and handed over 369 to the United States. We've earned bounties totaling millions of dollars"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S.-Pakistan_relations
I think you have just validated my point... Musharaf will NOT live forever. But, the military weapons we give him... and the U.S. Taxpayer dollars he uses to expand his nuclear capability will be. We need to STOP giving Pakistan weapons and money to expand weapons and weapons delivery systems programs.
Hail, Hail!!!
would be interesting to read a thesis or something from someone who has expert knowledge on pakistan, its people, and its regions.
its a fucked up country, that much I know. I dont believe the country can be control any other way.
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/osama_dead.html
.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
although I do believe it is a possibility he is dead. but we dont have proof
it's a collection of articles with references from major news outlets like BBC, CNN, Fox, NY times etc...
I think they probably have a very good idea that he is already dead which is why Bush has publicly stated that he's not that concerned with finding him.
I mean something is up that much we can all agree on. Saddam couldn't even hide in a hole in the ground in his own country even.
The only logical explanation is that he's already dead.
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
Here are a couple of great 'Frontline' features:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/taliban/
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/search/
Check them out.
Hail, Hail!!!
Thanks bro......So with your worldlly knowledge? (sic) Why did you go into Afgan again? You may as well spare me the "to get the bin man" as you comment says, "why go somewhere when you don't know where he is for sure". You are taking the intel and telling me it is solid proof? Riiiiiigh! And then to the Taliban who are not really a government but a tribe. What were you saying earlier about the tribal region. You back track more then your government does for somebody who has read and knows more than me. What a wanker.
Every f'n comment you have to say!
You need to ask why you are giving them wepons, because i can promise you now the country benefits from this deal the most is America.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
I'm american, my native language is english. I can't debate with you if yuo are going to give me this jibberish
at the time of the invasion Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates recognized them as the government of Afghanistan.
so you are saying the country of Afghanistan is the same as the tribal areas of pakistan? at least I think thats what you are saying. your sentences are hard to figure out. but if thats the case, you are wrong. the taliban ruled the country and was the only government in place and had allowed al qaeda and bin laden OPEN free reign throughout the country.
Jlew i do wonder sometimes do you get your ideas from anywhere other than fox news?
Oh and please check out the meaning of propaganda heres a link to wiki
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda
you might stop repeating fox news so much after you learn about this new amazing little word.
"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
No i'm talking in terms of history, america is only interested in helping other countries when it benefits them, natrually of course.
Nothing that is done by america is done out of goodwill it's about what will i gain.
The taliban is shining example of that. America created it.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
really? so your saying we dont give out of goodwill? how bout this..http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/hivaids/
story came out 2 days ago
The Taliban initially had enormous goodwill from Afghans weary of the corruption, brutality and incessant fighting of Mujahideen warlords. Two contrasting narratives of the beginnings of the Taliban[9] are that the rape and murder of boys and girls from a family traveling to Kandahar or a similar outrage by Mujahideen bandits sparked Mullah Omar and his students to vow to rid Afghanistan of these criminals. [10] The other is that the Pakistan-based lorry shipping mafia known as the "Afghanistan Transit Trade" and their allies in the Pakistan government, trained, armed and financed the Taliban to clear the southern road across Afghanistan to the Central Asian Republics of extortionate bandit gangs. [11] In either or both cases, the Taliban were based in the Helmand, Kandahar and Uruzgan region, and were overwhelmingly ethnic Pashtuns and predominantly Durrani Pashtuns. They received training and arms from Pakistan although they retained some independence, often refusing the advice of the Pakistan government.
The first major military activity of the Taliban was in October-November 1994 when they marched from Maiwand in southern Afghanistan to capture Kandahar City and the surrounding provinces, losing only a few dozen men.[12] Starting with the capture of a border crossing and a huge ammunition dump from warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, a couple weeks later they freed "a convoy trying to open a trade route from Pakistan to Central Asia" from another group of warlords attempting to extort money.[13] In the next three months this hitherto "unknown force" took control of twelve of Afghanistan's 34 provinces, with Mujahideen warlords often surrendering to them without a fight and the "heavily armed population" giving up their weapons.[14] By September 1996 they captured Afghanistan's capital, Kabul.
i am sorry to see you advocating authoritarian rule and the oppresion of any people or country. you might want to think about that position for a while. pakistans people are just that, people just like me and you. its a pretty sad stance for an american. esecially one that advocated the escalation of the iraq war to try and ensure "freedom and democracy" :rolleyes:
sadly yes. we cant go. just think about what your saying. you seem to think we CAN go. then we would be at war with pakistan. pakistan would send it army there. musaraf might get overthrown, the country HAS nukes. India would probably get involved. I dont think I need to explain to you the consequences of going into pakistan.
of course I dont like it. but look what good it has done in Iraq. you know me, I'm all for deomcracy and freedom. you think i'm "advocating" otherwise? whats the alternative, invade every country that has a dictator? dont try to sit there and have a bleeding heart for people under oppressive governemnts. in that case you would be praises Bush for freeing Iraq from a very very brutal dictator.
dude get off it already. your bullshit and you know it. I want pakistanis, iraqis, noth Koreans, all of them to be free.
I agree with alot of what you are saying, but our hand is being forced on this one. Pakistan is "one bullet" away from being an Islamic theocracy. Like you said, the majority of his country sides with Bin Laden. If they were to take over, they would gain control of nuclear weapons. Supporting Musharaf sucks, but it is better than the alternative.
yuo? Jibberish? Yeah!
Anyway my Pakistani intelligence, I think you should go in and get the guy and you don't. Pussy stance is all I can say.
He killed so many Yanks and we vowed to get him. But we are afraid to step on toes to do it. BULLSHIT that even your mentality can't twist around.
Thanks for the chat. When you actually offer up how to go about getting him in this thread, instead of "we can't go there" it will be a much better conversation. Until then...................................