I know you know, you know. . . but I just wanted to clarify it for everyone. 8o)
HR676 is Universal, Single Payer, Not for Profit, Health Care.
'Health Care' being the key word. All of the other candidates want to give some or most of us 'Health Insurance'.
HR676 takes the insurance companies out of the picture, Saving us 30% of every dollar that goes toward health insurance.
HR 676 is in legislative form, it just has to be voted on and we have it! If your representatives didn't, put someone in there that will.
The only reason Kucinich and Nader have so far been unsuccessful in their presidential aspirations is because no one knows anything about them.
The Democratic Party, big money/insurance companies are responsible for these crimes.
Nader is kept off the State ballots so you can't even vote for him.
Kucinich is taken out of the debates by silly qualifications immediately before: 1. New Hampshire 2. Iowa 3. Nevada primary's/caucuses . . . . . . .was there another one?
Not to mention certain green party members joining in on that stoning of DJK.
The majority of Americans overwhelming support the issues they stand for.
The corporate media and other squirrelly folk with a semi-interest in jaded politics force it in our ears that there is no hope for what the majority of us want because it appears to be to deep and dark and out of reach.
Thats why We have to be there As Citizens to turn on the light of truth within ourselves and everyone around us.
Because once the spark is within us that cannot be extinguished all of this will be attainable if we simply stand up together and demand it as a people.
I started a thread on Single Payer last weekend with a link to a petition and links to contact your representatives. Here's the thread if anyone is interested:
my point is be careful when going down the slippery slope of senate and house votes... voting is very tricky and when just looked at can give you the wrong picture...
so i was showing some strange non votes and no votes from a politician we both highly respect... if just looking at the votes listed it looked as if he skipped 50 very important votes, and voted NO to child healthcare and NO to iraq withdrawl... of course those are not his stances, but if i just look at the votes provided thats the way it would look... especially if i had a a persoanl agenda to find any reason i didnt like kucinich
as far as voting for nader or another candiate besides the Dem ticket... i want all of those Nader supporters to think back over the last 8 years and how much destruction has been done, and honestyly ask themselves if the same damage would have been done under gore?... hopefully an honest reflection will show them why they need to i november
if nader voters hand McCain the white house, i will move to canada (again i suppurt nader even though he enjoys investing in the same companies he rails against, but i am looking at the big picture here, just as i did in 2000)
just remeber... there will never be a perfect politician... and if you dig enough on ANYBODY you can find negative things you will not like
i may not like the radio in a new car i am buying, but it is the whole package i am buying, not just the radio... and the entire package is the important part
and anybody thinking there will ever be a president that can get elected without SOME level of corporate support, is just not being realistic
my point is be careful when going down the slippery slope of senate and house votes... voting is very tricky and when just looked at can give you the wrong picture...
so i was showing some strange non votes and no votes from a politician we both highly respect... if just looking at the votes listed it looked as if he skipped 50 very important votes, and voted NO to child healthcare and NO to iraq withdrawl... of course those are not his stances, but if i just look at the votes provided thats the way it would look... especially if i had a a persoanl agenda to find any reason i didnt like kucinich
Again, as for as non votes go, Obama has Kucinich beat by a landslide and some of these were very important votes, as well. People can't be there for every vote, obviously but I would expect them to be there as much as they could instead of going out selling themselves as a great leader and not doing his job. Everyone campaigns, this is true but some have taken it to new heights.
Now back to talking about actual votes cast which was the real problem with Obama. I've already asked how you felt about those votes and broke each one down to a single question. I would love those to be addressed when you find the time. There is no personal agenda against Obama. He just happens to be the likely nod and the one people are saying is going to bring such change to america. I dont see it and have clearly pointed out the reasons why. There's no way in hell i'm going to ever vote for a guy with his kind of record and past. Sorry. I could not support him in good conscience. If the Dem front runner had been anyone else and still had a questionable record, I would still be on here railing against them and you know it. It has nothing to do with the person but everything to do with the type of leader I'd like to see in office and the types I'm tired of seeing in office. Obama falls in the second catagory for me.
I imagine Dennis didn't support the child healthcare because he wanted his HR676, a much better bill, to be considered. And I'm pretty sure with withdrawl vote was based on it being not up to snuff. What do you think?
as far as voting for nader or another candiate besides the Dem ticket... i want all of those Nader supporters to think back over the last 8 years and how much destruction has been done, and honestyly ask themselves if the same damage would have been done under gore?... hopefully an honest reflection will show them why they need to i november
if nader voters hand McCain the white house, i will move to canada (again i suppurt nader even though he enjoys investing in the same companies he rails against, but i am looking at the big picture here, just as i did in 2000)
just remeber... there will never be a perfect politician... and if you dig enough on ANYBODY you can find negative things you will not like
i may not like the radio in a new car i am buying, but it is the whole package i am buying, not just the radio... and the entire package is the important part
and anybody thinking there will ever be a president that can get elected without SOME level of corporate support, is just not being realistic
I'm not casting my vote in fear. That's part of the reason why the Dems have gotten away with the crap they pull. They know they can just get you guys all worked up by the big bad republican lurking in the shadows and you'll line up to vote for them no matter what kind of crap they've done or not done throughout their career. I'm not going to be part of that problem anymore. And I'm certainly not going to blame Nader for the Democratic party's shortcomings. They lose elections because they weren't good enough to get the votes they needed...PERIOD. If they had tackled the issues and not been so busy being republican lite then they might have gotten people like me to vote for them, people who are voting on the issues and records...and not just voting for a questionable to Dem to keep a Rep out. That's silly and there will be no progress as long as this practice is continued. The level of corporate support might always be there but some are simply infested....that's the difference. They have everyone scared and feeling too powerless to stand up for the things they've always believed in.
I didn't have to dig too far to find this shit on Obama. It's all right there in his voting record. I never have once said any candidate is perfect so I really don't get why you guys feel the need to keep beating that dead horse into the ground. I have said, however, that Nader's platform looks much closer to the things I believe in than Obama's...they're not even close, imo. So I'm going to vote on the guy whose stances and past look the best to me. McCain will only get the white house because the Dem nod was not good enough to get the votes needed to beat him.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
my point is be careful when going down the slippery slope of senate and house votes... voting is very tricky and when just looked at can give you the wrong picture...
so i was showing some strange non votes and no votes from a politician we both highly respect... if just looking at the votes listed it looked as if he skipped 50 very important votes, and voted NO to child healthcare and NO to iraq withdrawl... of course those are not his stances, but if i just look at the votes provided thats the way it would look... especially if i had a a persoanl agenda to find any reason i didnt like kucinich
as far as voting for nader or another candiate besides the Dem ticket... i want all of those Nader supporters to think back over the last 8 years and how much destruction has been done, and honestyly ask themselves if the same damage would have been done under gore?... hopefully an honest reflection will show them why they need to i november
if nader voters hand McCain the white house, i will move to canada (again i suppurt nader even though he enjoys investing in the same companies he rails against, but i am looking at the big picture here, just as i did in 2000)
just remeber... there will never be a perfect politician... and if you dig enough on ANYBODY you can find negative things you will not like
i may not like the radio in a new car i am buying, but it is the whole package i am buying, not just the radio... and the entire package is the important part
and anybody thinking there will ever be a president that can get elected without SOME level of corporate support, is just not being realistic
I know you know, you know. . . but I just wanted to clarify it for everyone. 8o)
HR676 is Universal, Single Payer, Not for Profit, Health Care.
'Health Care' being the key word. All of the other candidates want to give some or most of us 'Health Insurance'.
HR676 takes the insurance companies out of the picture, Saving us 30% of every dollar that goes toward health insurance.
HR 676 is in legislative form, it just has to be voted on and we have it! If your representatives didn't, put someone in there that will.
The only reason Kucinich and Nader have so far been unsuccessful in their presidential aspirations is because no one knows anything about them.
The Democratic Party, big money/insurance companies are responsible for these crimes.
Nader is kept off the State ballots so you can't even vote for him.
Kucinich is taken out of the debates by silly qualifications immediately before: 1. New Hampshire 2. Iowa 3. Nevada primary's/caucuses . . . . . . .was there another one?
Not to mention certain green party members joining in on that stoning of DJK.
The majority of Americans overwhelming support the issues they stand for.
The corporate media and other squirrelly folk with a semi-interest in jaded politics force it in our ears that there is no hope for what the majority of us want because it appears to be to deep and dark and out of reach.
Thats why We have to be there As Citizens to turn on the light of truth within ourselves and everyone around us.
Because once the spark is within us that cannot be extinguished all of this will be attainable if we simply stand up together and demand it as a people.
i read somewhere that by 2015 $1 for every $5 spent will be on health care.
i would really like to know what the monetary figure for the 'affordable' in obama's affordable health insurance program
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Quote:
it in his original statement that was taken from.
Kucinich always does his research, thats all he does 24/7, that is his life of service, he's one of three that actually read the patriot act before voting on it.
i wonder if obama read it any of the times he voted to reauthorize it? i wonder if he read the fisa and intelligence issues he didn't vote on?
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Again, as for as non votes go, Obama has Kucinich beat by a landslide and some of these were very important votes, as well. People can't be there for every vote, obviously but I would expect them to be there as much as they could instead of going out selling themselves as a great leader and not doing his job. Everyone campaigns, this is true but some have taken it to new heights.
Now back to talking about actual votes cast which was the real problem with Obama. I've already asked how you felt about those votes and broke each one down to a single question. I would love those to be addressed when you find the time. There is no personal agenda against Obama. He just happens to be the likely nod and the one people are saying is going to bring such change to america. I dont see it and have clearly pointed out the reasons why. There's no way in hell i'm going to ever vote for a guy with his kind of record and past. Sorry. I could not support him in good conscience. If the Dem front runner had been anyone else and still had a questionable record, I would still be on here railing against them and you know it. It has nothing to do with the person but everything to do with the type of leader I'd like to see in office and the types I'm tired of seeing in office. Obama falls in the second catagory for me.
I imagine Dennis didn't support the child healthcare because he wanted his HR676, a much better bill, to be considered. And I'm pretty sure with withdrawl vote was based on it being not up to snuff. What do you think?
I'm not casting my vote in fear. That's part of the reason why the Dems have gotten away with the crap they pull. They know they can just get you guys all worked up by the big bad republican lurking in the shadows and you'll line up to vote for them no matter what kind of crap they've done or not done throughout their career. I'm not going to be part of that problem anymore. And I'm certainly not going to blame Nader for the Democratic party's shortcomings. They lose elections because they weren't good enough to get the votes they needed...PERIOD. If they had tackled the issues and not been so busy being republican lite then they might have gotten people like me to vote for them, people who are voting on the issues and records...and not just voting for a questionable to Dem to keep a Rep out. That's silly and there will be no progress as long as this practice is continued. The level of corporate support might always be there but some are simply infested....that's the difference. They have everyone scared and feeling too powerless to stand up for the things they've always believed in.
I didn't have to dig too far to find this shit on Obama. It's all right there in his voting record. I never have once said any candidate is perfect so I really don't get why you guys feel the need to keep beating that dead horse into the ground. I have said, however, that Nader's platform looks much closer to the things I believe in than Obama's...they're not even close, imo. So I'm going to vote on the guy whose stances and past look the best to me. McCain will only get the white house because the Dem nod was not good enough to get the votes needed to beat him.
excellent post and points!!
they can't blame us, they're the ones who kept saying 'but, but, but, the media told us this guy was electable!!' obviously not if they can't beat grandpappy mccain
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
the american public does not have the political will to mandate single payer universal health care...
i know it, you know it, and they know it...
the insurance lobby has become to powerful to just push aside, especially with the half asleep american public hammered for years with lies and half truths about "socialized medicine", "giveaways", "welfare state", and how bad the actual services provided would be...
i think oabam realizes that, and is simply trying to be SUCCESFUL in "breaking the ice" on universal health care... then once the ice is broken long term prospects of progress on the front would be be more attainable
he has said that his approach is the best chance to bring universal health care to america... and he jusy might be correct
i fully support SPUHC, but i am in the minority as are many of my like minded friends on the left that prefer it...
the american public does not have the political will to mandate single payer universal health care...
i know it, you know it, and they know it...
the insurance lobby has become to powerful to just push aside, especially with the half asleep american public hammered for years with lies and half truths about "socialized medicine", "giveaways", "welfare state", and how bad the actual services provided would be...
i think oabam realizes that, and is simply trying to be SUCCESFUL in "breaking the ice" on universal health care... then once the ice is broken long term prospects of progress on the front would be be more attainable
he has said that his approach is the best chance to bring universal health care to america... and he jusy might be correct
i fully support SPUHC, but i am in the minority as are many of my like minded friends on the left that prefer it...
Sorry, I don't know that and don't believe it for a second.
Oh, I believe American people do have the will and would be able to handle it just fine seeing as how the Europeans, Canadians and Cubans can manage. Now that's not the line the media's gonna spin but I think we all know the obvious reasons for that.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Comments
Thank you.
I started a thread on Single Payer last weekend with a link to a petition and links to contact your representatives. Here's the thread if anyone is interested:
http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=275011
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
my point is be careful when going down the slippery slope of senate and house votes... voting is very tricky and when just looked at can give you the wrong picture...
so i was showing some strange non votes and no votes from a politician we both highly respect... if just looking at the votes listed it looked as if he skipped 50 very important votes, and voted NO to child healthcare and NO to iraq withdrawl... of course those are not his stances, but if i just look at the votes provided thats the way it would look... especially if i had a a persoanl agenda to find any reason i didnt like kucinich
as far as voting for nader or another candiate besides the Dem ticket... i want all of those Nader supporters to think back over the last 8 years and how much destruction has been done, and honestyly ask themselves if the same damage would have been done under gore?... hopefully an honest reflection will show them why they need to i november
if nader voters hand McCain the white house, i will move to canada (again i suppurt nader even though he enjoys investing in the same companies he rails against, but i am looking at the big picture here, just as i did in 2000)
just remeber... there will never be a perfect politician... and if you dig enough on ANYBODY you can find negative things you will not like
i may not like the radio in a new car i am buying, but it is the whole package i am buying, not just the radio... and the entire package is the important part
and anybody thinking there will ever be a president that can get elected without SOME level of corporate support, is just not being realistic
Again, as for as non votes go, Obama has Kucinich beat by a landslide and some of these were very important votes, as well. People can't be there for every vote, obviously but I would expect them to be there as much as they could instead of going out selling themselves as a great leader and not doing his job. Everyone campaigns, this is true but some have taken it to new heights.
Now back to talking about actual votes cast which was the real problem with Obama. I've already asked how you felt about those votes and broke each one down to a single question. I would love those to be addressed when you find the time. There is no personal agenda against Obama. He just happens to be the likely nod and the one people are saying is going to bring such change to america. I dont see it and have clearly pointed out the reasons why. There's no way in hell i'm going to ever vote for a guy with his kind of record and past. Sorry. I could not support him in good conscience. If the Dem front runner had been anyone else and still had a questionable record, I would still be on here railing against them and you know it. It has nothing to do with the person but everything to do with the type of leader I'd like to see in office and the types I'm tired of seeing in office. Obama falls in the second catagory for me.
I imagine Dennis didn't support the child healthcare because he wanted his HR676, a much better bill, to be considered. And I'm pretty sure with withdrawl vote was based on it being not up to snuff. What do you think?
I'm not casting my vote in fear. That's part of the reason why the Dems have gotten away with the crap they pull. They know they can just get you guys all worked up by the big bad republican lurking in the shadows and you'll line up to vote for them no matter what kind of crap they've done or not done throughout their career. I'm not going to be part of that problem anymore. And I'm certainly not going to blame Nader for the Democratic party's shortcomings. They lose elections because they weren't good enough to get the votes they needed...PERIOD. If they had tackled the issues and not been so busy being republican lite then they might have gotten people like me to vote for them, people who are voting on the issues and records...and not just voting for a questionable to Dem to keep a Rep out. That's silly and there will be no progress as long as this practice is continued. The level of corporate support might always be there but some are simply infested....that's the difference. They have everyone scared and feeling too powerless to stand up for the things they've always believed in.
I didn't have to dig too far to find this shit on Obama. It's all right there in his voting record. I never have once said any candidate is perfect so I really don't get why you guys feel the need to keep beating that dead horse into the ground. I have said, however, that Nader's platform looks much closer to the things I believe in than Obama's...they're not even close, imo. So I'm going to vote on the guy whose stances and past look the best to me. McCain will only get the white house because the Dem nod was not good enough to get the votes needed to beat him.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
wow, thats alot of typos
*reminds self to not post before coffee intake*
now, that is one of the best posts i've read!
nice to see ya around
i read somewhere that by 2015 $1 for every $5 spent will be on health care.
i would really like to know what the monetary figure for the 'affordable' in obama's affordable health insurance program
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
i wonder if obama read it any of the times he voted to reauthorize it? i wonder if he read the fisa and intelligence issues he didn't vote on?
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
excellent post and points!!
they can't blame us, they're the ones who kept saying 'but, but, but, the media told us this guy was electable!!' obviously not if they can't beat grandpappy mccain
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
i know it, you know it, and they know it...
the insurance lobby has become to powerful to just push aside, especially with the half asleep american public hammered for years with lies and half truths about "socialized medicine", "giveaways", "welfare state", and how bad the actual services provided would be...
i think oabam realizes that, and is simply trying to be SUCCESFUL in "breaking the ice" on universal health care... then once the ice is broken long term prospects of progress on the front would be be more attainable
he has said that his approach is the best chance to bring universal health care to america... and he jusy might be correct
i fully support SPUHC, but i am in the minority as are many of my like minded friends on the left that prefer it...
Sorry, I don't know that and don't believe it for a second.
Oh, I believe American people do have the will and would be able to handle it just fine seeing as how the Europeans, Canadians and Cubans can manage. Now that's not the line the media's gonna spin but I think we all know the obvious reasons for that.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way