if you are told lies to sign a contract, how is it valid??
El_Kabong
Posts: 4,141
just a thought i had...certain ppl say about the troops that they signed the contract so they get what they are given...but these same ppl will admit recruiters lie to get them to sign the contract...that they tell them whatever they think will get them to sign...so, then, how is the 'contract' valid if they were pretty much lied to and tricked into signing it??
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Hey Kabong!
I think it is dependent on what the contract states. Sadly, folks sign contracts everyday without understanding the legal ramifications, either by being misled, or lack of understanding the language of the contract. I think once the contract is signed, it is valid, even if the individual was misled or simply didn't understand it. It's very important to understand what you are signing. Unfortunately, it seems one needs a lawyer sometimes to translate the meaning and we all know how expensive that can be. :eek:
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
this shit happens all the time. we should be attacking the people who make the contracts, not the recruiters or the signees,...
what do we accomplish otherwise?
EDIT: i would assume the contract voided at this point, btw,...
~Ron Burgundy
http://www.medlawplus.com/askalawyer/contracts/index.tpl?qq=2
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i'm not so sure i agree w/ you on this one...at least for the recruiters...if they are knowingly lying to ppl to get them sent to a war based on more lies and bullshit....i don't find them that innocent.
if i set girls up w/ my friend who slipped them ruffies(sp) and raped them and i knew he was gonna do this...even if i don't rape them myself i am an accomplice in the act, right?
and i'm not trying to pigeonhole all recruiters, just the ones who knowingly trick ppl into signing up for this shit
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Fraud in the inducement requires proof of: (1) a false statement of material fact;(2) that the defendant knew or should have known was false; (3) that was made to induce the plaintiff to enter into a contract; and (4) that proximately caused injury to the plaintiff when acting in reliance on the misrepresentation
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9. FOR ALL ENLISTEES OR REENLISTEES: Many laws,regulations, and military customs will govern my conduct and require me to do things a civilian does not have to do. The following statements are not promises or guarantees of any kind. They explain some of the present laws affecting the Armed Forces which I cannot change but which Congress can change at any time. a. My enlistment is more than an employment agreement. As a member of the Armed Forces of the United States, I will be:
(1) Required to obey all lawful orders and perform all assigned duties.
(2) Subject to separation during or at the end of my enlistment. If my behavior fails to meet acceptable military standards, I may be discharged and given acertificate for less than honorable service, which may hurt my future job opportunities and my claim for veteran's benefits.
(3) Subject to the military justice system, which means, among other things, that I may be tried by military courts-martial.
(4) Required upon order to serve in combat or other hazardous situations.
(5) Entitled to receive pay, allowances, and other benefits as provided by law and regulation. b. Laws and regulations that govern military personnel may change without notice to me. Such changes may affect my status, pay, allowances, benefits, and responsibilities as a member of the Armed Forces REGARDLESS of the provisions of this enlistment/reenlistment document. c. In the event of war, my enlistment in the Armed Forces continues until six
(6) months after the war ends, unless my enlistment is ended sooner by the President ofthe United States.
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verbal lies are acceptable here.
Both of these definitions, btw, have more to do with commercial law than anything else.
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"The agreements in this section and attached annex(es) are all the promises made to me by the Government.
ANYTHING ELSE ANYONE HAS PROMISED ME IS NOT VALID AND WILL NOT BE HONORED."
True but I don't think the average young, inexperienced and perhaps naive person who signs looks at them this way. I mean hell, they aren't even considered mature enough to buy beer but we'll trust them make these kind of huge decisions knowing how impressionable and impulsive they often are. It seems like taking advantage of them in more ways than one.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Kind of like letting them go to college and rack up huge student loans.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
But I do see the trouble with your government using you in an illegal situation that wasn't spelled out properly for you when the ink dried.
No, not like that at all...
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
It might be taking advantage of them, but it isnt a fraudulent contract.
I know what you're saying, but I meant from the standpoint of having a young person make a decision that has big ramifications to their life. Those student loan papers don't exactly spell things out in big, bold terms.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
The kicker is in proving that the Iraq war is illegal. In that case, those soldiers refusing deployment on the grounds the war is illegal, would not be in breach of the contract.
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You could have a point there.
(I'm still waiting to hear what lies are told and whether they are told by all recruiters...)
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Too bad the war is legal. And lies are not lies because someone says they are, they have to be proven.
just makes no sense ... you can quit any job in this world why can't you quit the army especially when you realize the implications of what you are being told to do ...
mind boggling reasoning
That isnt true. You cant quit any job in which a contract is involved without breaching that contract, which would involve some type of penalty, usually monetary. Now granted, the military has stiffer penalties, but there are punishments for quitting other jobs if your committments in the contract are not fulfilled.
Recruiters try to be your new best friend. I still remember my recruiter's name, and I couldn't stand the guy. I was the one that went looking to enlist, not the other way around, but the way he behaved it seemed he had a set pattern on how to handle new prospects. He was calling the house every other day to see how I was doing, etc.. It was ridiculous. Whatever BS he told me went in one ear and out the other. Even at 16, I thought knew what I was getting in to, and the recruiter, at best, was just an unpleasant distraction.
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That can change. The truth has a way.
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like what? ... so, you don't get paid the rest of your salary ... i'm sure the soldiers don't mind facing relative penalties ... but imprisonment? ... now, we're talking extortion in a way ...
either way - what's the deal about living in a free country? ... what kind of system punishes a person for not wanting to do what is immoral?
Were they lies? As someone else said, just because someone on here alleges that lies are being told, does not make it true.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
depraved indifference