#47 - Musk/trump/Vance

1565759616285

Comments

  • sheckyshecky San Francisco Posts: 2,295

    Russia is willing to work with President-elect Trump to help improve relations with Ukraine so long as the U.S. makes the first move, Kremlin officials said this week, adding fresh momentum for the possibility of peace talks as its war in Ukraine threatens to stretch into a third year. 

    Speaking to reporters Thursday in Moscow, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov reiterated that Russia could be ready to come to the negotiating table regarding its "special military operation" in Ukraine — echoing the phrasing used by the Kremlin to describe its war in Ukraine — so long as the U.S. acted first. 

    "If the signals that are coming from the new team in Washington to restore the dialogue that Washington interrupted after the start of a special military operation [the war in Ukraine] are serious, of course, we will respond to them," Lavrov said in Moscow.

    But he stressed that the U.S. should move first, telling reporters that "the Americans broke the dialogue, so they should make the first move."

    His remarks come after Trump's pick for Ukraine envoy, retired Lieutenant-General Keith Kellogg, told Fox News in an interview this month that both Russia and Ukraine appear to be willing to negotiate an end to the war — citing heavy casualties, damage to critical infrastructure, and a general sense of exhaustion that has permeated both countries as the war drags well past the thousand-day mark.

    "I think both sides are ready," Kellogg said in the interview. "After a thousand days of war, with 350,000, 400,000 Russian [soldiers] down, and 150,000 Ukrainian dead, or numbers like that — both sides are saying, ‘okay, maybe this is the time, and we need to step back.’"

    To date, Russia has lost tens of thousands of soldiers in the war. As of this fall, an average of 1,200 soldiers were killed or injured per day, according to U.S. estimates. 

    In Ukraine, the country's energy infrastructure has seen extreme damage as the result of a protracted Russian bombing campaign, designed to collapse portions of the power grid, plunge the country into darkness, and ultimately, wear down the resolve of the Ukrainian people.

    Most recently, Russia launched a Christmas Day bombardment against Ukraine's power grid, directing some 70 cruise and ballistic missiles and 100 strike drones to hit critical energy infrastructure in the country. 

    Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said the Christmas Day timing was a "deliberate" choice by Putin. "What could be more inhuman?" he said in a statement. 

    Meanwhile, Ukraine's military has lost around 40% of the land it seized in Russia's Kursk region — a loss that could further erode morale. 

    Lavrov's remarks also come as Kellogg prepares to travel to Ukraine in January for what he described to Fox News as an information-gathering trip. 

    He declined to elaborate further on what he will aim to accomplish during the visit, saying only that he believes both countries are ready to end the protracted war — and that incoming President Trump could serve as the "referee."

    "Think of a cage fight. You've got two fighters, and both want to tap out. You need a referee to kind of separate them."

    Meanwhile, Russian President Vladimir Putin said Thursday that he is open to having the peace talks in the third country of Slovakia, citing an offer made by the country's prime minister during a visit to the Kremlin earlier this week. 

    It is unclear whether Ukraine would be willing to have the talks held in Slovakia, a country whose leaders have been vehemently opposed to sending more EU military aid to Ukraine. 

    Ukraine did not immediately respond to Fox News's request for comment on the peace talks, or whether it would be open to Slovakia's offer to host. 



  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,379
    shecky said:

    Russia is willing to work with President-elect Trump to help improve relations with Ukraine so long as the U.S. makes the first move, Kremlin officials said this week, adding fresh momentum for the possibility of peace talks as its war in Ukraine threatens to stretch into a third year. 

    Speaking to reporters Thursday in Moscow, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov reiterated that Russia could be ready to come to the negotiating table regarding its "special military operation" in Ukraine — echoing the phrasing used by the Kremlin to describe its war in Ukraine — so long as the U.S. acted first. 

    "If the signals that are coming from the new team in Washington to restore the dialogue that Washington interrupted after the start of a special military operation [the war in Ukraine] are serious, of course, we will respond to them," Lavrov said in Moscow.

    But he stressed that the U.S. should move first, telling reporters that "the Americans broke the dialogue, so they should make the first move."

    His remarks come after Trump's pick for Ukraine envoy, retired Lieutenant-General Keith Kellogg, told Fox News in an interview this month that both Russia and Ukraine appear to be willing to negotiate an end to the war — citing heavy casualties, damage to critical infrastructure, and a general sense of exhaustion that has permeated both countries as the war drags well past the thousand-day mark.

    "I think both sides are ready," Kellogg said in the interview. "After a thousand days of war, with 350,000, 400,000 Russian [soldiers] down, and 150,000 Ukrainian dead, or numbers like that — both sides are saying, ‘okay, maybe this is the time, and we need to step back.’"

    To date, Russia has lost tens of thousands of soldiers in the war. As of this fall, an average of 1,200 soldiers were killed or injured per day, according to U.S. estimates. 

    In Ukraine, the country's energy infrastructure has seen extreme damage as the result of a protracted Russian bombing campaign, designed to collapse portions of the power grid, plunge the country into darkness, and ultimately, wear down the resolve of the Ukrainian people.

    Most recently, Russia launched a Christmas Day bombardment against Ukraine's power grid, directing some 70 cruise and ballistic missiles and 100 strike drones to hit critical energy infrastructure in the country. 

    Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said the Christmas Day timing was a "deliberate" choice by Putin. "What could be more inhuman?" he said in a statement. 

    Meanwhile, Ukraine's military has lost around 40% of the land it seized in Russia's Kursk region — a loss that could further erode morale. 

    Lavrov's remarks also come as Kellogg prepares to travel to Ukraine in January for what he described to Fox News as an information-gathering trip. 

    He declined to elaborate further on what he will aim to accomplish during the visit, saying only that he believes both countries are ready to end the protracted war — and that incoming President Trump could serve as the "referee."

    "Think of a cage fight. You've got two fighters, and both want to tap out. You need a referee to kind of separate them."

    Meanwhile, Russian President Vladimir Putin said Thursday that he is open to having the peace talks in the third country of Slovakia, citing an offer made by the country's prime minister during a visit to the Kremlin earlier this week. 

    It is unclear whether Ukraine would be willing to have the talks held in Slovakia, a country whose leaders have been vehemently opposed to sending more EU military aid to Ukraine. 

    Ukraine did not immediately respond to Fox News's request for comment on the peace talks, or whether it would be open to Slovakia's offer to host. 



    Yeah Ok how about Russia gets the fuck out of Ukraine all together they are the ones that invaded Ukraine! 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • ChoccoloccotideChoccoloccotide A grass shack nailed to a pinewood floor Posts: 1,236
    mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,379
    mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
    Wrong Ukraine needs to keep defending themselves from the aggressors who invaded their country! What slaughter are you referring too? Surely you’d defend your home against invaders no? Or would you negotiate to let them keep the kitchen? 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • ChoccoloccotideChoccoloccotide A grass shack nailed to a pinewood floor Posts: 1,236
    mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
    Wrong Ukraine needs to keep defending themselves from the aggressors who invaded their country! What slaughter are you referring too? Surely you’d defend your home against invaders no? Or would you negotiate to let them keep the kitchen? 
    What slaughter?  Omg, what slaughter?  You do live in a bubble buddy.   Nobody will take you seriously if you deny basic reality.

  • mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
    Wrong Ukraine needs to keep defending themselves from the aggressors who invaded their country! What slaughter are you referring too? Surely you’d defend your home against invaders no? Or would you negotiate to let them keep the kitchen? 
    What slaughter?  Omg, what slaughter?  You do live in a bubble buddy.   Nobody will take you seriously if you deny basic reality.

    Should you (the US) have continued on the slaughter in Europe in the 40s like you did, or not have prolonged it and stayed away from helping out?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,097
    mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
    So your concern for the Ukraine people leads you to think they would be better off living under the iron thumb of Russia yet again, rather than fighting for their freedom?  

    Would that be your choice were you a man in that position in Ukraine? To live as a vassal, not a free man?
  • Hawk123Hawk123 Posts: 2,273
    edited December 2024
    mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
    Wrong Ukraine needs to keep defending themselves from the aggressors who invaded their country! What slaughter are you referring too? Surely you’d defend your home against invaders no? Or would you negotiate to let them keep the kitchen? 
    What slaughter?  Omg, what slaughter?  You do live in a bubble buddy.   Nobody will take you seriously if you deny basic reality.

    Explain how this should’ve played out in your mind since we obviously disagree. Russia invades Ukraine on Feb 24, 2022 and starts to slaughter, to use your word, babies, elderly, innocent Ukrainians. What happens now? 
    Post edited by Hawk123 on
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • josevolutionjosevolution Posts: 30,379
    mickeyrat said:
    US has nothing to do with it. Its a Russia Ukraine negotiation
    You’re right it has nothing to do with us which is why we shouldn’t be continuing the slaughter by financing it.
    Wrong Ukraine needs to keep defending themselves from the aggressors who invaded their country! What slaughter are you referring too? Surely you’d defend your home against invaders no? Or would you negotiate to let them keep the kitchen? 
    What slaughter?  Omg, what slaughter?  You do live in a bubble buddy.   Nobody will take you seriously if you deny basic reality.

    Yes I know the slaughter is of Ukrainian citizens that’s the slaughter that matters to me! 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Lol
     
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,097
    Lol
     
    America First when it comes to low paying jobs that were can’t get anyone to do here, but sure let’s bring in highly skilled workers from India.  Repulsive. 
  • mrussel1 said:
    Lol
     
    America First when it comes to low paying jobs that were can’t get anyone to do here, but sure let’s bring in highly skilled workers from India.  Repulsive. 
    “America First” because no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public. 
  • Hawk123Hawk123 Posts: 2,273
    Lol
     
    Clown show, Trump had an issue with these until President Musk said he was all good with them. President Musk running the show 
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, Colorado Posts: 10,948
    Hawk123 said:
    Lol
     
    Clown show, Trump had an issue with these until President Musk said he was all good with them. President Musk running the show 

  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925

    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • sheckyshecky San Francisco Posts: 2,295

    There are two pieces of very good news that have come out of the infighting over H-1B visas for foreign skilled workers in Trump World this week. The first happy accident is that tensions are already easing, much to the chagrin of liberals who hoped they were witnessing a permanent schism. 

    The second, even better development, is that both sides of the admittedly zesty debate have listened, compromised, and arrived at a better and clearer set of positions for the Republican Party moving forward. 

    In the red corner, we had the twin heads of the Department of Government Efficiency, Vivek Ramaswamy and Elon Musk who appeared at first to call for expansion of the H-1B visa program that allows employers to use foreign labor when they cannot find qualified Americans. 

    In the other red corner, we had Steve Bannon and a host of prominent America Firsters all but calling for an end of the skilled foreign worker program, a policy that would no doubt cause considerable chaos and disruption. 

    On Saturday, President-elect Trump weighed in, sort of, telling the New York Post that he likes the visa program and uses it himself, but not endorsing any expansion. And this is of course the same Trump who fired board members of the Tennessee Valley Authority for using foreign workers over Americans. 

    By Sunday morning, as parents quietly sipped coffee and spied the news on their phones, the kids getting a little more sleep before church, things had calmed down considerably in this impromptu intramural immigration debate. 

    For his part, Ramaswamy, after an ill-advised X post this week criticizing American families for having more sleepovers and movie nights than their South Asian counterparts, has backed off of his cultural high hill and retrained his sights on the real issue at hand. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. 

    Meanwhile, Musk arguably moved even further to the center of the issue, posting late Saturday night that the excesses of the H-1B visa program are "easily fixed by raising the minimum salary significantly and adding a yearly cost for maintaining the H-1B, making it materially more expensive to hire from overseas than domestically." 

    Or as Musk ally and head of Trump’s office of Artificial Intelligence David Sacks put it, ‘Elon has said that H1B should be overhauled, that it should focus on exceptional talent in high-value areas, and that the scams and low-pay jobs should end. This is not to say there aren’t still differences but less than it first appeared. Time to move forward as one team.’ 

     This is music to the ears of the America First crowd and great news for the young American architect or graphic designer who just wants a level playing field, one where they don’t lose again and again to cheap foreign competition. 

    Meanwhile, the Bannonistas, who have been by Trump’s side from the very beginning a decade ago, are easing their attacks on newcomers Ramaswamy and Musk, and appreciating that they are all on the same team. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. As Republicans work out their differences, instead of munching on popcorn, the left is eating crow. 

    There are some lessons to take from the recent unpleasantness. At one point, some in the pro H-1B crowd, and some on the left, accused those in opposition of anti-South Asian racism, a terrible lie and an even worse message. Thankfully, this did not last long. 

    And it is important that the generally leftist tactic of pointing and yelling racism did not work because these are exactly the fights that make our foreign foes with their trolling social media bot farms drool, and they were working overtime to divide Americans this week. 

    Thankfully, it failed.

    In the end, as tempers cooled and discourse bent back in the direction of congeniality and good faith. What we are left with is a fructive and fulsome debate over a nuanced issue.

    Of course, the United States wants to attract the best and the brightest to help chart out a technological course forward, but we also don’t want to tell a truck driver that the kid he sends to college is going to get passed over for cheaper foreign counterparts.

    The opportunity to balance these concerns over attracting the best from elsewhere, while not burdening our own citizens' ability to achieve is upon us. Compromise really is possible. It might not always look like a church social, it might get a little rough around the edges, but as a wise man once said, ‘politics ain’t beanbag.’

    Trump takes office in about three weeks, and it bodes well for his upcoming four years as president that those who serve and support can not only argue with pointed vigor, but also come together with an honest give and take when called for. 

    The battle of the H-1B turned out not to be a crisis in MAGAland, but rather a roadmap for compromise and competent governance.

  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,097
    shecky said:

    There are two pieces of very good news that have come out of the infighting over H-1B visas for foreign skilled workers in Trump World this week. The first happy accident is that tensions are already easing, much to the chagrin of liberals who hoped they were witnessing a permanent schism. 

    The second, even better development, is that both sides of the admittedly zesty debate have listened, compromised, and arrived at a better and clearer set of positions for the Republican Party moving forward. 

    In the red corner, we had the twin heads of the Department of Government Efficiency, Vivek Ramaswamy and Elon Musk who appeared at first to call for expansion of the H-1B visa program that allows employers to use foreign labor when they cannot find qualified Americans. 

    In the other red corner, we had Steve Bannon and a host of prominent America Firsters all but calling for an end of the skilled foreign worker program, a policy that would no doubt cause considerable chaos and disruption. 

    On Saturday, President-elect Trump weighed in, sort of, telling the New York Post that he likes the visa program and uses it himself, but not endorsing any expansion. And this is of course the same Trump who fired board members of the Tennessee Valley Authority for using foreign workers over Americans. 

    By Sunday morning, as parents quietly sipped coffee and spied the news on their phones, the kids getting a little more sleep before church, things had calmed down considerably in this impromptu intramural immigration debate. 

    For his part, Ramaswamy, after an ill-advised X post this week criticizing American families for having more sleepovers and movie nights than their South Asian counterparts, has backed off of his cultural high hill and retrained his sights on the real issue at hand. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. 

    Meanwhile, Musk arguably moved even further to the center of the issue, posting late Saturday night that the excesses of the H-1B visa program are "easily fixed by raising the minimum salary significantly and adding a yearly cost for maintaining the H-1B, making it materially more expensive to hire from overseas than domestically." 

    Or as Musk ally and head of Trump’s office of Artificial Intelligence David Sacks put it, ‘Elon has said that H1B should be overhauled, that it should focus on exceptional talent in high-value areas, and that the scams and low-pay jobs should end. This is not to say there aren’t still differences but less than it first appeared. Time to move forward as one team.’ 

     This is music to the ears of the America First crowd and great news for the young American architect or graphic designer who just wants a level playing field, one where they don’t lose again and again to cheap foreign competition. 

    Meanwhile, the Bannonistas, who have been by Trump’s side from the very beginning a decade ago, are easing their attacks on newcomers Ramaswamy and Musk, and appreciating that they are all on the same team. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. As Republicans work out their differences, instead of munching on popcorn, the left is eating crow. 

    There are some lessons to take from the recent unpleasantness. At one point, some in the pro H-1B crowd, and some on the left, accused those in opposition of anti-South Asian racism, a terrible lie and an even worse message. Thankfully, this did not last long. 

    And it is important that the generally leftist tactic of pointing and yelling racism did not work because these are exactly the fights that make our foreign foes with their trolling social media bot farms drool, and they were working overtime to divide Americans this week. 

    Thankfully, it failed.

    In the end, as tempers cooled and discourse bent back in the direction of congeniality and good faith. What we are left with is a fructive and fulsome debate over a nuanced issue.

    Of course, the United States wants to attract the best and the brightest to help chart out a technological course forward, but we also don’t want to tell a truck driver that the kid he sends to college is going to get passed over for cheaper foreign counterparts.

    The opportunity to balance these concerns over attracting the best from elsewhere, while not burdening our own citizens' ability to achieve is upon us. Compromise really is possible. It might not always look like a church social, it might get a little rough around the edges, but as a wise man once said, ‘politics ain’t beanbag.’

    Trump takes office in about three weeks, and it bodes well for his upcoming four years as president that those who serve and support can not only argue with pointed vigor, but also come together with an honest give and take when called for. 

    The battle of the H-1B turned out not to be a crisis in MAGAland, but rather a roadmap for compromise and competent governance.

    Oh wait Sheck.. you mean you didn't want to post Marcus's opinion piece from yesterday where he said Trump was going to kill this idea?  Within the span of 24 hours Marcus writes a new opinion piece after Trump comes out in support of importing foreign labor for our jobs.  

    Let's review his headline and punchline from yesterday and compare it to what he said today.  Remember, when supporting Trump and our new oligarchs, you are expected to check your principles at the door.  

    DAVID MARCUS: Big-brained Ramaswamy, Musk pick fight they can't win

    Let's hope these geniuses learn from the mistake of kicking American workers, families and culture

    Americans don’t celebrate Boxing Day, and we don’t celebrate rich people knocking the working man. Hopefully, for Vivek Ramaswammy and Elon Musk, this unforced error is a lesson learned.

    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/david-marcus-big-brained-ramaswamy-musk-pick-fight-cant-win
  • Get_RightGet_Right Posts: 13,379
    If you have ever had a friend or a colleague that applied for an H1B visa, it is a nightmare process and has been for 35+ years. Politics in our country is all supported by special interests. Donate 20K to your senator and that H1B might get fast tracked. That is how it works.
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,097
    Get_Right said:
    If you have ever had a friend or a colleague that applied for an H1B visa, it is a nightmare process and has been for 35+ years. Politics in our country is all supported by special interests. Donate 20K to your senator and that H1B might get fast tracked. That is how it works.
    Why do I want to expedite an H-1B?  

    We ran thousands of them at the bank I worked at, and there was plenty of similar talent here. It was just 20% cheaper. 
  • shecky said:

    There are two pieces of very good news that have come out of the infighting over H-1B visas for foreign skilled workers in Trump World this week. The first happy accident is that tensions are already easing, much to the chagrin of liberals who hoped they were witnessing a permanent schism. 

    The second, even better development, is that both sides of the admittedly zesty debate have listened, compromised, and arrived at a better and clearer set of positions for the Republican Party moving forward. 

    In the red corner, we had the twin heads of the Department of Government Efficiency, Vivek Ramaswamy and Elon Musk who appeared at first to call for expansion of the H-1B visa program that allows employers to use foreign labor when they cannot find qualified Americans. 

    In the other red corner, we had Steve Bannon and a host of prominent America Firsters all but calling for an end of the skilled foreign worker program, a policy that would no doubt cause considerable chaos and disruption. 

    On Saturday, President-elect Trump weighed in, sort of, telling the New York Post that he likes the visa program and uses it himself, but not endorsing any expansion. And this is of course the same Trump who fired board members of the Tennessee Valley Authority for using foreign workers over Americans. 

    By Sunday morning, as parents quietly sipped coffee and spied the news on their phones, the kids getting a little more sleep before church, things had calmed down considerably in this impromptu intramural immigration debate. 

    For his part, Ramaswamy, after an ill-advised X post this week criticizing American families for having more sleepovers and movie nights than their South Asian counterparts, has backed off of his cultural high hill and retrained his sights on the real issue at hand. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. 

    Meanwhile, Musk arguably moved even further to the center of the issue, posting late Saturday night that the excesses of the H-1B visa program are "easily fixed by raising the minimum salary significantly and adding a yearly cost for maintaining the H-1B, making it materially more expensive to hire from overseas than domestically." 

    Or as Musk ally and head of Trump’s office of Artificial Intelligence David Sacks put it, ‘Elon has said that H1B should be overhauled, that it should focus on exceptional talent in high-value areas, and that the scams and low-pay jobs should end. This is not to say there aren’t still differences but less than it first appeared. Time to move forward as one team.’ 

     This is music to the ears of the America First crowd and great news for the young American architect or graphic designer who just wants a level playing field, one where they don’t lose again and again to cheap foreign competition. 

    Meanwhile, the Bannonistas, who have been by Trump’s side from the very beginning a decade ago, are easing their attacks on newcomers Ramaswamy and Musk, and appreciating that they are all on the same team. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. As Republicans work out their differences, instead of munching on popcorn, the left is eating crow. 

    There are some lessons to take from the recent unpleasantness. At one point, some in the pro H-1B crowd, and some on the left, accused those in opposition of anti-South Asian racism, a terrible lie and an even worse message. Thankfully, this did not last long. 

    And it is important that the generally leftist tactic of pointing and yelling racism did not work because these are exactly the fights that make our foreign foes with their trolling social media bot farms drool, and they were working overtime to divide Americans this week. 

    Thankfully, it failed.

    In the end, as tempers cooled and discourse bent back in the direction of congeniality and good faith. What we are left with is a fructive and fulsome debate over a nuanced issue.

    Of course, the United States wants to attract the best and the brightest to help chart out a technological course forward, but we also don’t want to tell a truck driver that the kid he sends to college is going to get passed over for cheaper foreign counterparts.

    The opportunity to balance these concerns over attracting the best from elsewhere, while not burdening our own citizens' ability to achieve is upon us. Compromise really is possible. It might not always look like a church social, it might get a little rough around the edges, but as a wise man once said, ‘politics ain’t beanbag.’

    Trump takes office in about three weeks, and it bodes well for his upcoming four years as president that those who serve and support can not only argue with pointed vigor, but also come together with an honest give and take when called for. 

    The battle of the H-1B turned out not to be a crisis in MAGAland, but rather a roadmap for compromise and competent governance.

    Now, that’s some propaganda!
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 40,925
    shecky said:

    There are two pieces of very good news that have come out of the infighting over H-1B visas for foreign skilled workers in Trump World this week. The first happy accident is that tensions are already easing, much to the chagrin of liberals who hoped they were witnessing a permanent schism. 

    The second, even better development, is that both sides of the admittedly zesty debate have listened, compromised, and arrived at a better and clearer set of positions for the Republican Party moving forward. 

    In the red corner, we had the twin heads of the Department of Government Efficiency, Vivek Ramaswamy and Elon Musk who appeared at first to call for expansion of the H-1B visa program that allows employers to use foreign labor when they cannot find qualified Americans. 

    In the other red corner, we had Steve Bannon and a host of prominent America Firsters all but calling for an end of the skilled foreign worker program, a policy that would no doubt cause considerable chaos and disruption. 

    On Saturday, President-elect Trump weighed in, sort of, telling the New York Post that he likes the visa program and uses it himself, but not endorsing any expansion. And this is of course the same Trump who fired board members of the Tennessee Valley Authority for using foreign workers over Americans. 

    By Sunday morning, as parents quietly sipped coffee and spied the news on their phones, the kids getting a little more sleep before church, things had calmed down considerably in this impromptu intramural immigration debate. 

    For his part, Ramaswamy, after an ill-advised X post this week criticizing American families for having more sleepovers and movie nights than their South Asian counterparts, has backed off of his cultural high hill and retrained his sights on the real issue at hand. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. 

    Meanwhile, Musk arguably moved even further to the center of the issue, posting late Saturday night that the excesses of the H-1B visa program are "easily fixed by raising the minimum salary significantly and adding a yearly cost for maintaining the H-1B, making it materially more expensive to hire from overseas than domestically." 

    Or as Musk ally and head of Trump’s office of Artificial Intelligence David Sacks put it, ‘Elon has said that H1B should be overhauled, that it should focus on exceptional talent in high-value areas, and that the scams and low-pay jobs should end. This is not to say there aren’t still differences but less than it first appeared. Time to move forward as one team.’ 

     This is music to the ears of the America First crowd and great news for the young American architect or graphic designer who just wants a level playing field, one where they don’t lose again and again to cheap foreign competition. 

    Meanwhile, the Bannonistas, who have been by Trump’s side from the very beginning a decade ago, are easing their attacks on newcomers Ramaswamy and Musk, and appreciating that they are all on the same team. 

    The only real losers in the wake of this kerfuffle are the Democrats and liberal talking heads who hoped that they were watching MAGA tear itself apart. As Republicans work out their differences, instead of munching on popcorn, the left is eating crow. 

    There are some lessons to take from the recent unpleasantness. At one point, some in the pro H-1B crowd, and some on the left, accused those in opposition of anti-South Asian racism, a terrible lie and an even worse message. Thankfully, this did not last long. 

    And it is important that the generally leftist tactic of pointing and yelling racism did not work because these are exactly the fights that make our foreign foes with their trolling social media bot farms drool, and they were working overtime to divide Americans this week. 

    Thankfully, it failed.

    In the end, as tempers cooled and discourse bent back in the direction of congeniality and good faith. What we are left with is a fructive and fulsome debate over a nuanced issue.

    Of course, the United States wants to attract the best and the brightest to help chart out a technological course forward, but we also don’t want to tell a truck driver that the kid he sends to college is going to get passed over for cheaper foreign counterparts.

    The opportunity to balance these concerns over attracting the best from elsewhere, while not burdening our own citizens' ability to achieve is upon us. Compromise really is possible. It might not always look like a church social, it might get a little rough around the edges, but as a wise man once said, ‘politics ain’t beanbag.’

    Trump takes office in about three weeks, and it bodes well for his upcoming four years as president that those who serve and support can not only argue with pointed vigor, but also come together with an honest give and take when called for. 

    The battle of the H-1B turned out not to be a crisis in MAGAland, but rather a roadmap for compromise and competent governance.

    Now, that’s some propaganda!

    compromise? is he actually believing his own bullshit? they refuse to compromise with others. and that doesnt change amongst themselves
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Get_RightGet_Right Posts: 13,379
    mrussel1 said:
    Get_Right said:
    If you have ever had a friend or a colleague that applied for an H1B visa, it is a nightmare process and has been for 35+ years. Politics in our country is all supported by special interests. Donate 20K to your senator and that H1B might get fast tracked. That is how it works.
    Why do I want to expedite an H-1B?  

    We ran thousands of them at the bank I worked at, and there was plenty of similar talent here. It was just 20% cheaper. 

    It's not about the talent, or the payscale, it's about the process. Equally skilled people wait longer when they do not have the ability to pay for political or legal influence.
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,097
    Get_Right said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Get_Right said:
    If you have ever had a friend or a colleague that applied for an H1B visa, it is a nightmare process and has been for 35+ years. Politics in our country is all supported by special interests. Donate 20K to your senator and that H1B might get fast tracked. That is how it works.
    Why do I want to expedite an H-1B?  

    We ran thousands of them at the bank I worked at, and there was plenty of similar talent here. It was just 20% cheaper. 

    It's not about the talent, or the payscale, it's about the process. Equally skilled people wait longer when they do not have the ability to pay for political or legal influence.
    Great.  I don’t care. 
  • sheckyshecky San Francisco Posts: 2,295

    Count me in, brother! Just think, after this upcoming term as VP, and two probable terms as president, JD will still just be 52 years old!
Sign In or Register to comment.