** KAMALA HARRIS FOR PRESIDENT -PART DEUX **

The Juggler

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lindsey Flimsey Flip Flop Faloozy, as predicted:

Sen. Lindsey Graham (S.C.), a Republican who is close to Trump, said he is encouraging the former president to do another debate, in part because he thinks Harris should have to answer “a tough question” — which he didn’t think she had to do tonight.

“The moderators sucked,” he said. “I thought it was horrible. It was awful.” Graham said he told Trump that one of his strongest moments was his closing argument — challenging Harris on why she hasn’t done more to change Americans’ lives over the past three and a half years.

“I think the president thinks he achieved his goal tonight of challenging her,” Graham said, “that you [Harris] own this. And you talk about all the things you’re going to do, why should we believe you?'”

He said he thinks Trump is open to another debate.

It's funny to me (but not surprising) that they are going after the moderators. They let trump take over the mic several times. I was kind of pissed off about it because he would just start talking and they would let him go. Harris did a few times but they seemed to push her off...partly because she was courteous and trump is a fucking idiot she would stop talking.

I haven't seen talking time stats yet...curious to see what those look like. Maybe I'm wrong but it seemed like he talked a lot more than her. And maybe that was her plan?

I actually didn't think that part was that bad. They said they would get a 1 minute rebuttal. It looked like to me Trump would just take that 1 minute without waiting to be prompted to respond, so it might have looked like he was just going off. Or he'd ask for a rebuttal before moving on and they'd grant it to him. The time seemed fair and within the rules that they set.

Harris spoke 23 times for 37 minutes. 
Trump spoke 39 times for 42 minutes.

They always seemed to let him get the last word....which worked to his detriment because he is an aging lunatic.

Difference of 4-5 minutes in a 90 minute debate is marginal. 

47% of time for Harris, 53% for trump....

I agree with most of what is being said about the debate. 
Only 2 differences in my opinion is Harris didn't look good either, Trump just looked a lot worse. She didn't have to make any good points, she just had to let Trump talk in order to win. But by doing so, you don't get your message out and you don't make yourself look strong either. I don't think she started out strong. She didn't answer questions either. She just didn't make any really weird statements that made you stop and be like "Wait, what? What cult is she in?" That's a pretty low bar though if that's what we expect in a president. 

And that difference in time is negligible. Who cares about 47 - 53% talking time. Trump got more rebuttals because he asked for it. I don't recall Harris being cut off or denied a chance to speak. Trump asked for a chance to respond and got it every time. She didn't. I just don't see this as being an issue one way or another. 

I think your analysis is way off base. He spoke 16 more times than she did. That is significant. Most of those times were to have the final word, which was not part of the rules. Usually the audience remembers the final thing the candidate says more than the rest....which is why Trump opted to give his closing statement last. So, yes, those extra 30-45 seconds at the end of every top mattered....only it backfired on him because he's just not up for this anymore. 

Also---Harris didn't look good either? I'm sorry...what? I think your bias is showing. You can argue she evaded some questions but that is what every candidate does in a debate when asked something they don't like. I understand you do not agree with her on a lot. But the argument you are making against her not looking good is what most argued against Trump in the first debate. This ain't that...at all. She pounded him on the issues that she needed to like abortion, and healthcare etc....and then she deftly threw grenades at him on topics she is vulnerable on like with immigration. This is when she pivoted to his rallies and Hannibal Lecter etc---completely threw him off his game on the topic he most wants to succeed at. That is the sign of an excellent debate performance.

Sorry Mace. She was fantastic. She made Trump look like a fool last night. The difference in the last debate is Biden did it all to himself. 

mace1229

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

The Juggler

Initial post debate polling looks decent. Prob will know for sure by this time next week though

Gern Blansten

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

Bonuses are not taxed at a higher rate. Your tax depends on your taxable income and tax bracket.

But yeah...tips are income so it's really stupid. My opinion is that the dems are just going along with it since it benefits mainly lower/middle income Americans. Any time the GOP is willing to cut taxes for lower/middle income taxpayers it should be taken advantage of....no matter how stupid.

Gern Blansten

The Juggler said:

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

The Juggler said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

Lindsey Flimsey Flip Flop Faloozy, as predicted:

Sen. Lindsey Graham (S.C.), a Republican who is close to Trump, said he is encouraging the former president to do another debate, in part because he thinks Harris should have to answer “a tough question” — which he didn’t think she had to do tonight.

“The moderators sucked,” he said. “I thought it was horrible. It was awful.” Graham said he told Trump that one of his strongest moments was his closing argument — challenging Harris on why she hasn’t done more to change Americans’ lives over the past three and a half years.

“I think the president thinks he achieved his goal tonight of challenging her,” Graham said, “that you [Harris] own this. And you talk about all the things you’re going to do, why should we believe you?'”

He said he thinks Trump is open to another debate.

It's funny to me (but not surprising) that they are going after the moderators. They let trump take over the mic several times. I was kind of pissed off about it because he would just start talking and they would let him go. Harris did a few times but they seemed to push her off...partly because she was courteous and trump is a fucking idiot she would stop talking.

I haven't seen talking time stats yet...curious to see what those look like. Maybe I'm wrong but it seemed like he talked a lot more than her. And maybe that was her plan?

I actually didn't think that part was that bad. They said they would get a 1 minute rebuttal. It looked like to me Trump would just take that 1 minute without waiting to be prompted to respond, so it might have looked like he was just going off. Or he'd ask for a rebuttal before moving on and they'd grant it to him. The time seemed fair and within the rules that they set.

Harris spoke 23 times for 37 minutes. 
Trump spoke 39 times for 42 minutes.

They always seemed to let him get the last word....which worked to his detriment because he is an aging lunatic.

Difference of 4-5 minutes in a 90 minute debate is marginal. 

47% of time for Harris, 53% for trump....

I agree with most of what is being said about the debate. 
Only 2 differences in my opinion is Harris didn't look good either, Trump just looked a lot worse. She didn't have to make any good points, she just had to let Trump talk in order to win. But by doing so, you don't get your message out and you don't make yourself look strong either. I don't think she started out strong. She didn't answer questions either. She just didn't make any really weird statements that made you stop and be like "Wait, what? What cult is she in?" That's a pretty low bar though if that's what we expect in a president. 

And that difference in time is negligible. Who cares about 47 - 53% talking time. Trump got more rebuttals because he asked for it. I don't recall Harris being cut off or denied a chance to speak. Trump asked for a chance to respond and got it every time. She didn't. I just don't see this as being an issue one way or another. 

I think your analysis is way off base. He spoke 16 more times than she did. That is significant. Most of those times were to have the final word, which was not part of the rules. Usually the audience remembers the final thing the candidate says more than the rest....which is why Trump opted to give his closing statement last. So, yes, those extra 30-45 seconds at the end of every top mattered....only it backfired on him because he's just not up for this anymore. 

Also---Harris didn't look good either? I'm sorry...what? I think your bias is showing. You can argue she evaded some questions but that is what every candidate does in a debate when asked something they don't like. I understand you do not agree with her on a lot. But the argument you are making against her not looking good is what most argued against Trump in the first debate. This ain't that...at all. She pounded him on the issues that she needed to like abortion, and healthcare etc....and then she deftly threw grenades at him on topics she is vulnerable on like with immigration. This is when she pivoted to his rallies and Hannibal Lecter etc---completely threw him off his game on the topic he most wants to succeed at. That is the sign of an excellent debate performance.

Sorry Mace. She was fantastic. She made Trump look like a fool last night. The difference in the last debate is Biden did it all to himself. 

yeah those people crying about bias need to STFU. He was allowed to bloviate as much as he wanted. That's why he lost.

Kat

Sounds yummy.

From The Hill:
Ben & Jerry’s co-founders, Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, are unveiling a new ice cream flavor, “Kamala’s Coconut Jubilee,” as part of a get-out-the-vote initiative to elect Vice President Harris and other downballot Democrats in November.

Cohen and Greenfield will join progressive organization MoveOn Political Action for its “Scoop the Vote” ice cream truck tour, which kicks off in Philadelphia on Sept. 16, the same day early voting begins in Pennsylvania.

njhaley1

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

My opinion is that the dems are just going along with it since it benefits mainly lower/middle income Americans. 

And they know it was 100% bluster - it'll never pass in congress. But now they have them on record.

Gern Blansten

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

My opinion is that the dems are just going along with it since it benefits mainly lower/middle income Americans. 

And they know it was 100% bluster - it'll never pass in congress. But now they have them on record.

yep...they'll put it in the tax bill and let the GOP vote against it. 

same crap going on with the GOP pushing that Harris wants to tax unrealized gains. That hasn't been proposed by her but the piece of Biden's proposal only applied to people with net worth greater than $100mil. And even then, it was a deposit on future tax on the gains. Refundable.

mace1229

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

Bonuses are not taxed at a higher rate. Your tax depends on your taxable income and tax bracket.

But yeah...tips are income so it's really stupid. My opinion is that the dems are just going along with it since it benefits mainly lower/middle income Americans. Any time the GOP is willing to cut taxes for lower/middle income taxpayers it should be taken advantage of....no matter how stupid.

I almost never get bonuses as a teacher, but several years ago we got one through a grant through Bill Gates somehow. Was a few thousand. It was taxed at like 50%. Maybe its changed since then, but I only saw about half of it. Had a separate tax form (like a w-2, but for a bonus) that we had to file. Maybe it was considered a gift instead of a bonus or something, I just know Bill Gates donated about half to teachers and about half to the government with this.

Johnny Abruzzo

Kat said:

Sounds yummy.

From The Hill:
Ben & Jerry’s co-founders, Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, are unveiling a new ice cream flavor, “Kamala’s Coconut Jubilee,” as part of a get-out-the-vote initiative to elect Vice President Harris and other downballot Democrats in November.

Cohen and Greenfield will join progressive organization MoveOn Political Action for its “Scoop the Vote” ice cream truck tour, which kicks off in Philadelphia on Sept. 16, the same day early voting begins in Pennsylvania.

Ugh I hate coconut. Guess I'll have to vote for Trump now. There goes PA. (LOL)

Tim Simmons

Sounds good. Would prefer chocolate to caramel. Feel like that works better with coconut. 

njhaley1

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

Bonuses are not taxed at a higher rate. Your tax depends on your taxable income and tax bracket.

But yeah...tips are income so it's really stupid. My opinion is that the dems are just going along with it since it benefits mainly lower/middle income Americans. Any time the GOP is willing to cut taxes for lower/middle income taxpayers it should be taken advantage of....no matter how stupid.

I almost never get bonuses as a teacher, but several years ago we got one through a grant through Bill Gates somehow. Was a few thousand. It was taxed at like 50%. Maybe its changed since then, but I only saw about half of it. Had a separate tax form (like a w-2, but for a bonus) that we had to file. Maybe it was considered a gift instead of a bonus or something, I just know Bill Gates donated about half to teachers and about half to the government with this.

They may have taken half out, but you ended up paying a bit less in taxes (or got a slightly larger return) in the filing year.

Correct, @gern?

mrussel1

Tim Simmons said:

Sounds good. Would prefer chocolate to caramel. Feel like that works better with coconut. 

You're a fucking Marxist. 

Halifax2TheMax

mrussel1 said:

Tim Simmons said:

Sounds good. Would prefer chocolate to caramel. Feel like that works better with coconut. 

You're a fucking Marxist. 

Marxist, communist, socialist, libtard.

Halifax2TheMax

And fuck the pope. Well, at least the repubs aren’t killing anyone, eh?

https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/13/politics/pope-francis-trump-harris-abortion/index.html

Gern Blansten

njhaley1 said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

mace1229 said:

Gern Blansten said:

njhaley1 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Tim Simmons said:

This is how it’s done. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna170948

Trump says he won’t tax overtime. Harris has copied some of his proposals before. Does anyone think she may copy this one as well? 

The response he would have got: 

We don’t know the full details though. This could impact social security depending on how the payroll tax would come into play. Hard to tell if it’s workable. 

Not taxing overtime is ridiculous. The rules behind that trick would be impossible to follow.

Maybe that's the point. We need yet another tax dodging loophole. 

As a tax guy I cannot imagine the parameters placed on such a rule. Is there an income limit? Is that limit an overall limit or just on your W-2?

Would the non taxable OT be deductible by the business? How could a law firm bring in income...deduct wages paid to it's owners as OT and then not pay tax on it at the individual level. Just a ridiculous proposal.

I don't get the no tax on tips or overtime.
Just because your income is mostly tips, you shouldn't pay taxes like everyone else? What is the rationale behind that? But seems like both sides are getting behind that.
OT should be taxed too, but at the normal rate. And why ar bonuses taxed at a higher rate? Everything should be the same, or are they trying to keep accountants and tax guys in business? 

Bonuses are not taxed at a higher rate. Your tax depends on your taxable income and tax bracket.

But yeah...tips are income so it's really stupid. My opinion is that the dems are just going along with it since it benefits mainly lower/middle income Americans. Any time the GOP is willing to cut taxes for lower/middle income taxpayers it should be taken advantage of....no matter how stupid.

I almost never get bonuses as a teacher, but several years ago we got one through a grant through Bill Gates somehow. Was a few thousand. It was taxed at like 50%. Maybe its changed since then, but I only saw about half of it. Had a separate tax form (like a w-2, but for a bonus) that we had to file. Maybe it was considered a gift instead of a bonus or something, I just know Bill Gates donated about half to teachers and about half to the government with this.

They may have taken half out, but you ended up paying a bit less in taxes (or got a slightly larger return) in the filing year.

Correct, @gern?

Correct... Withholding is not necessarily what you pay. If they withheld 50% you probably got a good refund 

Poncier

Kat said:

Sounds yummy.

From The Hill:
Ben & Jerry’s co-founders, Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, are unveiling a new ice cream flavor, “Kamala’s Coconut Jubilee,” as part of a get-out-the-vote initiative to elect Vice President Harris and other downballot Democrats in November.

Cohen and Greenfield will join progressive organization MoveOn Political Action for its “Scoop the Vote” ice cream truck tour, which kicks off in Philadelphia on Sept. 16, the same day early voting begins in Pennsylvania.

I can see Donnie now" Ben and Jerry, I never liked them. It's an inferior ice cream. I like Breyer's."

gimmesometruth27

Poncier said:

Kat said:

Sounds yummy.

From The Hill:
Ben & Jerry’s co-founders, Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, are unveiling a new ice cream flavor, “Kamala’s Coconut Jubilee,” as part of a get-out-the-vote initiative to elect Vice President Harris and other downballot Democrats in November.

Cohen and Greenfield will join progressive organization MoveOn Political Action for its “Scoop the Vote” ice cream truck tour, which kicks off in Philadelphia on Sept. 16, the same day early voting begins in Pennsylvania.

I can see Donnie now" Ben and Jerry, I never liked them. It's an inferior ice cream. I like Breyer's."

i can see him doing this bit at his next rally.

i agree with whomever above said chocolate may have been better. i am not a big coconut fan, but coconut with caramel sounds like it could be good.

gimmesometruth27

Johnny Abruzzo said:

Kat said:

Sounds yummy.

From The Hill:
Ben & Jerry’s co-founders, Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, are unveiling a new ice cream flavor, “Kamala’s Coconut Jubilee,” as part of a get-out-the-vote initiative to elect Vice President Harris and other downballot Democrats in November.

Cohen and Greenfield will join progressive organization MoveOn Political Action for its “Scoop the Vote” ice cream truck tour, which kicks off in Philadelphia on Sept. 16, the same day early voting begins in Pennsylvania.

Ugh I hate coconut. Guess I'll have to vote for Trump now. There goes PA. (LOL)

lol i knew deep down this would backfire somehow!!

JesseMcK

Halifax2TheMax said:

And fuck the pope. Well, at least the repubs aren’t killing anyone, eh?

https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/13/politics/pope-francis-trump-harris-abortion/index.html

Is anyone else surprised by the last line in that article:

"a majority of Catholics — 61% — believe abortion should be legal in all or most cases"