Pearl Jam or Taylor Swift?

BF25394

bootlegger10 said:

BF25394 said:

YourDirtisMyfood said:

Taylor does have a song called Hey Stephen from one of her earlier songs about, presumably a previous boyfriend.

Presumably. She also has a song called "Dear John" that people presume is about John Mayer, but the point is that she has never said it's about John Mayer. She also has a song where she mentions people named James, Inez and Betty, and people speculate about whether those are real people she's given pseudonyms or just characters she created. She's not saying.

I have no doubt she's written songs about prior and/or current relationships. Every artist does. But, for some reason, her love life is dissected endlessly. Some people would say that she lives these relationships out in public and wants people talking about it (see Travis Kelce), but she had a five- or six-year relationship before that with Joe Alwyn where they were as off the radar as someone as famous as she is can be. A lot of what people think they know about her personal life is based on other people speculating about it, not her actually talking about it. I think it's pretty lame for a (male) journalist to just assert that songs are about specific people based on his presumed knowledge about her love life.

Are you delusional?  Either the songs are about ex-boyfriends or she wants us to assume they are.    I have paid for all of her albums so not some hater. She kisses and tells like no one else.

Am I delusional? Quoting myself, "I have no doubt she's written songs about prior and/or current relationships." So, no, I don't think I'm delusional. The point is that she has not said that any specific song is about any specific person. Everything you hear or see written about the songs is people speculating about what they think they know about her love life, not her saying, "I wrote this song about my ex-boyfriend Joe." She generally demurs from talking publicly about her relationships. Of course she will have written songs about her own relationships, like every other artist basically ever. But she also writes songs that are made-up stories that have nothing or little to do with her own experience, like every other artist basically ever. And she's not telling which is which.

droptheleash9

Pearl Jam - Dark Matter

BF25394 said:

bootlegger10 said:

BF25394 said:

YourDirtisMyfood said:

Taylor does have a song called Hey Stephen from one of her earlier songs about, presumably a previous boyfriend.

Presumably. She also has a song called "Dear John" that people presume is about John Mayer, but the point is that she has never said it's about John Mayer. She also has a song where she mentions people named James, Inez and Betty, and people speculate about whether those are real people she's given pseudonyms or just characters she created. She's not saying.

I have no doubt she's written songs about prior and/or current relationships. Every artist does. But, for some reason, her love life is dissected endlessly. Some people would say that she lives these relationships out in public and wants people talking about it (see Travis Kelce), but she had a five- or six-year relationship before that with Joe Alwyn where they were as off the radar as someone as famous as she is can be. A lot of what people think they know about her personal life is based on other people speculating about it, not her actually talking about it. I think it's pretty lame for a (male) journalist to just assert that songs are about specific people based on his presumed knowledge about her love life.

Are you delusional?  Either the songs are about ex-boyfriends or she wants us to assume they are.    I have paid for all of her albums so not some hater. She kisses and tells like no one else.

Am I delusional? Quoting myself, "I have no doubt she's written songs about prior and/or current relationships." So, no, I don't think I'm delusional. The point is that she has not said that any specific song is about any specific person. Everything you hear or see written about the songs is people speculating about what they think they know about her love life, not her saying, "I wrote this song about my ex-boyfriend Joe." She generally demurs from talking publicly about her relationships. Of course she will have written songs about her own relationships, like every other artist basically ever. But she also writes songs that are made-up stories that have nothing or little to do with her own experience, like every other artist basically ever. And she's not telling which is which.

Songs about personal relationships are a hallmark of her writing, particularly in the early albums. For better or worse, it's what she is and will continue be known for from a songwriting perspective. She had so many songs about relationships, including ones with obvious nods to specific individuals, on her first few records that fans and non-fans alike came to expect that. Perception has become her reality and now people want to guess which current or ex-boyfriend her songs are about (regardless of whether they are about real people or not). Doesn't mean that perception is fair but it is what it is at this point.

BF25394

droptheleash9 said:

BF25394 said:

bootlegger10 said:

BF25394 said:

YourDirtisMyfood said:

Taylor does have a song called Hey Stephen from one of her earlier songs about, presumably a previous boyfriend.

Presumably. She also has a song called "Dear John" that people presume is about John Mayer, but the point is that she has never said it's about John Mayer. She also has a song where she mentions people named James, Inez and Betty, and people speculate about whether those are real people she's given pseudonyms or just characters she created. She's not saying.

I have no doubt she's written songs about prior and/or current relationships. Every artist does. But, for some reason, her love life is dissected endlessly. Some people would say that she lives these relationships out in public and wants people talking about it (see Travis Kelce), but she had a five- or six-year relationship before that with Joe Alwyn where they were as off the radar as someone as famous as she is can be. A lot of what people think they know about her personal life is based on other people speculating about it, not her actually talking about it. I think it's pretty lame for a (male) journalist to just assert that songs are about specific people based on his presumed knowledge about her love life.

Are you delusional?  Either the songs are about ex-boyfriends or she wants us to assume they are.    I have paid for all of her albums so not some hater. She kisses and tells like no one else.

Am I delusional? Quoting myself, "I have no doubt she's written songs about prior and/or current relationships." So, no, I don't think I'm delusional. The point is that she has not said that any specific song is about any specific person. Everything you hear or see written about the songs is people speculating about what they think they know about her love life, not her saying, "I wrote this song about my ex-boyfriend Joe." She generally demurs from talking publicly about her relationships. Of course she will have written songs about her own relationships, like every other artist basically ever. But she also writes songs that are made-up stories that have nothing or little to do with her own experience, like every other artist basically ever. And she's not telling which is which.

Songs about personal relationships are a hallmark of her writing, particularly in the early albums. For better or worse, it's what she is and will continue be known for from a songwriting perspective. She had so many songs about relationships, including ones with obvious nods to specific individuals, on her first few records that fans and non-fans alike came to expect that. Perception has become her reality and now people want to guess which current or ex-boyfriend her songs are about (regardless of whether they are about real people or not). Doesn't mean that perception is fair but it is what it is at this point.

Yes, but what seems "obvious" can also be confirmation bias. People are always going to interpret art through their own lens, but a journalist should not be stating as fact that Song X is about Person X. There are ways to write about this stuff without asserting speculation as fact. Stating things as fact just feeds the perception you alluded to, because people will read it and have the takeaway that Song X is confirmed to be about Person X, when Taylor Swift isn't saying one way or the other.

kmcmanus

Pearl Jam - Dark Matter

I think for a certain segment of her fanbase the “is that about him or is it actually him?” aspect is a huge part of the appeal. She probably knows this and it may or may not impact her writing. The outlets that cover her DEFINITELY know this and it absolutely impacts their writing. 

CantKeepmedown

BF25394 said:

YourDirtisMyfood said:

Taylor does have a song called Hey Stephen from one of her earlier songs about, presumably a previous boyfriend.

Presumably. She also has a song called "Dear John" that people presume is about John Mayer, but the point is that she has never said it's about John Mayer. She also has a song where she mentions people named James, Inez and Betty, and people speculate about whether those are real people she's given pseudonyms or just characters she created. She's not saying.

It's sad that I know this (I have a Swifty loving daughter and wife) but these are Ryan Reynolds and Blake Lively's kids names. 

BF25394

kmcmanus said:

I think for a certain segment of her fanbase the “is that about him or is it actually him?” aspect is a huge part of the appeal. She probably knows this and it may or may not impact her writing. The outlets that cover her DEFINITELY know this and it absolutely impacts their writing. 

I was talking about the L.A. Times, though. There was actually a second article that ran yesterday in the main news section about the appeal of songs about love and heartbreak, and that reporter also baldly stated that specific songs were about specific people. It's just lazy, irresponsible journalism, in my opinion.

BF25394

CantKeepmedown said:

BF25394 said:

YourDirtisMyfood said:

Taylor does have a song called Hey Stephen from one of her earlier songs about, presumably a previous boyfriend.

Presumably. She also has a song called "Dear John" that people presume is about John Mayer, but the point is that she has never said it's about John Mayer. She also has a song where she mentions people named James, Inez and Betty, and people speculate about whether those are real people she's given pseudonyms or just characters she created. She's not saying.

It's sad that I know this (I have a Swifty loving daughter and wife) but these are Ryan Reynolds and Blake Lively's kids names. 

Right, but the characters in the songs are made up. Ryan Reynolds and Blake Lively's kids are not involved in a love triangle among themselves. At least I hope they're not.

And it is not sad that you know this any more than it's sad to know that "Layla" is about George Harrison's wife.

mvw

You wouldn’t last an hour in the asylum where they raised me.