I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.
And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?
Trump is telling you that he wants to be a dictator. So are countless people who worked for and with Trump. The "liberal media" is not putting words in his mouth. If the New York Times quotes John Kelly calling Trump a fascist, it's still John Kelly calling him a fascist.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
How in the world does she have to when the other person is Trump with everything he comes with?
I don't see how this would be anything to ponder for an intelligent human being that has any empathy
He has clearly shown (and said) that he doesn't care about climate change for example. How can you sit and even ponder this choice. It's fucking absurd.
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights. It is the same over and over again. I welcome a truly objective perspective, but alas, it has evaded me. Have any suggestions? I welcome that.
It is a machine to reach an objective, and it ultimately is a popularity contest. And I did check a few of the convictions. At least what is available supports the findings. Let's not get it twisted, both sides are playing the political game and it sucks. A barrage of ads in the 45-30 days before the election is what is informing the US public and is what is determining who voters vote for. There are exceptions of course, and I applaud those exceptions.
Please. Only one side is extrapolating that 250 known voter fraud offences since 2020 is a grave concern, in an attempt to discredit all results. Repeat: only one fucking side is doing this.
But it is happening. Even on a small scale it is worth discussing. In 2024, is there any reason this should be happening? In this digital age? It just makes me scratch my head as to why everything our government manages, feels so antiquated. Six weeks to get a passport. Maybe they should be talking about that level of inefficiency. I think it is the same with the voting process. I will show up and vote next week, but I am not sure that I really feel strongly about one or the other.
No, it isn't. It isn't worth discussing when, in a nation of 330 million people with over 200 million eligible voters, there are a small number of voting errors, many of which are just the result of misunderstandings or clerical mistakes, and which are not enough to affect the outcome of any race.
I got my passport in 18 days earlier this year. I did not pay to expedite it. By the way, if they issued passports in a week, some people would complain that we're not vetting them closely enough and that "terrorists" and "illegals" are taking advantage of it.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.
And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?
Are you being serious? You are incapable of listening to his words, understanding history and drawing your own conclusions?
Serious about not believing everything the media or a candidate says. It is just another sales pitch to get the job. Frankly the comparisons to Nazi Germany make me sick.
The question isn't whether you believe we are down a Nazi path. Hyperbole runs rampant in an election. The question is whether he is a threat to it institutions and allies. Or is Harris. In that, you should be able to draw your own conclusions simply by listening both of them speak and listening to their surrogates
Direct information is actually available to you.
There is simply no way to reach the other side on this. When 45 says he will be a dictator on day 1, his defense is he was joking and the believers believe
He gets the votes from the traditional gop voters and a new breed of macho tough guys who never used to vote.
Which is why he is tough to beat, when also considering the gop electoral college advantage
The forum hasn't been discussing the polling as much as previous election. Have you been following the cross tabs? This seems to be trumps best polling in his 3 elections?
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.
And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?
I’ll play along. You can find factual information across different sources, so it sounds more like you disagree with how some outlets present it. Go watch unedited clips or transcripts of what he’s said and draw your own conclusions.
Nothing says good political instincts like turning a roast comic loose and following that up with Stephen Miller
it's really something, isn't it? prior to the age of trump, any ONE of the thousand things this party has done in the last 8 years would have absolutely SUNK them in campaigns past.
At this point I'm convinced it's a Brewster's Millions situation where there is some insane reward for whichever campaign loses
I continue to not understand why he's still President. Harris should be President now and he should be eating pudding in a bathrobe.
Dang you're impatient for Kamala to be POTUS! Just hold tight mister.
I mean situations like this are one reason why we have a VP
Trump was president for 4 years.
Do you think he can even finish a book or get what adults say during a regular work meeting?
Shouldn't a VP have stepped in on day one in that case
Not for cognition issues like Biden but he should have been impeached at least one other time and removed from office. So directionally yeah another instance where we needed the VP.
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.
His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.
It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.
His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.
It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Ignorance is only an excuse when you haven't been informed. Once you have been informed and still ignore it, then it moves to stupidity.
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.
His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.
It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Ignorance is only an excuse when you haven't been informed. Once you have been informed and still ignore it, then it moves to stupidity.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.
And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?
Are you being serious? You are incapable of listening to his words, understanding history and drawing your own conclusions?
Serious about not believing everything the media or a candidate says. It is just another sales pitch to get the job. Frankly the comparisons to Nazi Germany make me sick.
The question isn't whether you believe we are down a Nazi path. Hyperbole runs rampant in an election. The question is whether he is a threat to it institutions and allies. Or is Harris. In that, you should be able to draw your own conclusions simply by listening both of them speak and listening to their surrogates
Direct information is actually available to you.
There is simply no way to reach the other side on this. When 45 says he will be a dictator on day 1, his defense is he was joking and the believers believe
He gets the votes from the traditional gop voters and a new breed of macho tough guys who never used to vote.
Which is why he is tough to beat, when also considering the gop electoral college advantage
The forum hasn't been discussing the polling as much as previous election. Have you been following the cross tabs? This seems to be trumps best polling in his 3 elections?
It is puzzling that he could be polling better after all the shit he's pulled. It's amazing the level of amnesia among the electorate and how people forget how terrible things were four years ago. They seem to forget that Trump was president when the pandemic hit, and that his failures of leadership made the situation much worse. Having said that, the bar is low as Trump did not even get 47 percent of the vote in either of his two prior presidential elections. He won the first one because he drew an inside straight in the electoral college against perhaps the only opponent who was nearly as unpopular as he was. The candidates he endorsed did terribly in 2018 and 2022 and, of course, Trump lost in 2020. He has a high floor that keeps him competitive, but he also has a low ceiling because he's an objectively terrible candidate who doesn't do anything to try to appeal to more voters beyond his base and similarly disaffected, underinformed people who don't always vote. In a two-party system in a closely divided country, even a terrible candidate stands a really good chance of winning.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
And there it is, rolling out the “lesser of two evils” excuse. I thought you were Indy and have 5 or so alternatives that aren’t “evil?” Like this guy?
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.
And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?
Are you being serious? You are incapable of listening to his words, understanding history and drawing your own conclusions?
Serious about not believing everything the media or a candidate says. It is just another sales pitch to get the job. Frankly the comparisons to Nazi Germany make me sick.
The question isn't whether you believe we are down a Nazi path. Hyperbole runs rampant in an election. The question is whether he is a threat to it institutions and allies. Or is Harris. In that, you should be able to draw your own conclusions simply by listening both of them speak and listening to their surrogates
Direct information is actually available to you.
There is simply no way to reach the other side on this. When 45 says he will be a dictator on day 1, his defense is he was joking and the believers believe
He gets the votes from the traditional gop voters and a new breed of macho tough guys who never used to vote.
Which is why he is tough to beat, when also considering the gop electoral college advantage
The forum hasn't been discussing the polling as much as previous election. Have you been following the cross tabs? This seems to be trumps best polling in his 3 elections?
I have been watching. I won't go so far as saying I'm not worried, but I'm not super worried. Everything in the cross tabs and polling in general is based on what a pollster believes is the electoral makeup. If they get that wrong, the results are wrong. I think after 2020 they over- weighted the GOP vote and we saw that in 2022. The one thing that makes me a little nervous is the movement in the last month. If your methodology is consistent, even if wrong, you have to honor movement. But I've been saying for a few weeks that's it's all turnout and I think the Ds have a better ground game.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.
His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.
It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Ignorance is only an excuse when you haven't been informed. Once you have been informed and still ignore it, then it moves to stupidity.
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.
His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.
It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Great post, totally agree. Every example I put forth to Get Right is both factual and common knowledge for those that pay attention. I'm sure nothing i wrote surprised most of the people here. Hopefully he just didn't put it all together before now.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I'm sure the replies you're getting are very persuasive lol
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.
His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.
It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Ignorance is only an excuse when you haven't been informed. Once you have been informed and still ignore it, then it moves to stupidity.
I wasn't excusing it.
I am not saying that you did, my point is that someone can't claim ignorance after they have been informed.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I'm sure the replies you're getting are very persuasive lol
When someone is deep into false equivalencies, it can be difficult for them to come out if. Or they’re just a republican, using the same false equivalencies as your typical Trump voter, but they’re coming to AMT to try and present otherwise just for poops and giggles.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
Seems you just described a clear winner in the situation you have in front of you
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I'm sure the replies you're getting are very persuasive lol
Just having a conversation. I welcome all views and any comments that are not disparaging or insultive. Please do not dismiss what I am trying to say objectively because you feel strongly on one side or the other. Not directed at you.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
Sorry but that makes no sense. Virtually no one of significance from trump's administration supports him. That should be enough for anyone.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
Sorry but that makes no sense. Virtually no one of significance from trump's administration supports him. That should be enough for anyone.
They are all being paid so of course they will dance the dance. But you must be talking about people that are no longer being paid. Of course those are unbiased opinions.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
There really is a difference between the two. It isn't just white noise. I wonder if Eddie Vedder regrets stumping for Ralph Nader in 2000 because he thought that Al Gore and George W. Bush were "two evils." Ralph Nader is a great American whose advocacy saved tens of thousands of lives. He's also a mule whose political stubbornness indirectly cost hundreds of thousands of lives as a result of an invasion and war that wouldn't have happened if a different candidate had been elected president in 2000. This is why I've always had a little trouble swallowing "Bu$hleaguer." Eddie helped to give us Bush.
One of the parties (the Rs) wants to keep people from legally voting, and they target people whom they consider more likely to vote for the other party (see, e.g., military IDs as acceptable voter ID but not college IDs). They try to claim that they're trying to prevent people from illegally voting, but that's a pretext. Illegal votes are virtually non-existent; they're trying to stop people from voting legally for the other party. Some Republican politicians have even said this out loud. Meanwhile, the other party (the Ds) doesn't try to prevent anyone from voting legally, even the people who are more likely to vote for their opponents. Anyone who has paid attention for the last 20 years should see this disparity and recognize it for what it is. It's just one of many examples of how the parties are not equally bad. And, again, I'm not a Democrat.
I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.
Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.
And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.
You might want to vet your sources before you go off.
Just a thought.
I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.
In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?
For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.
I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
Sorry but that makes no sense. Virtually no one of significance from trump's administration supports him. That should be enough for anyone.
They are all being paid so of course they will dance the dance. But you must be talking about people that are no longer being paid. Of course those are unbiased opinions.
What are you even doing
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
Comments
I don't see how this would be anything to ponder for an intelligent human being that has any empathy
He has clearly shown (and said) that he doesn't care about climate change for example. How can you sit and even ponder this choice. It's fucking absurd.
I got my passport in 18 days earlier this year. I did not pay to expedite it. By the way, if they issued passports in a week, some people would complain that we're not vetting them closely enough and that "terrorists" and "illegals" are taking advantage of it.
He gets the votes from the traditional gop voters and a new breed of macho tough guys who never used to vote.
Which is why he is tough to beat, when also considering the gop electoral college advantage
The forum hasn't been discussing the polling as much as previous election. Have you been following the cross tabs? This seems to be trumps best polling in his 3 elections?
Pence, Mattis, Mulvaney, Kelly, Milley, Esper, etc, not supporting trump should be WAY more than enough to vote against him
but whatever...if he wins we deserve him
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.
Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.
If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.
Just having a conversation. I welcome all views and any comments that are not disparaging or insultive. Please do not dismiss what I am trying to say objectively because you feel strongly on one side or the other. Not directed at you.
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
One of the parties (the Rs) wants to keep people from legally voting, and they target people whom they consider more likely to vote for the other party (see, e.g., military IDs as acceptable voter ID but not college IDs). They try to claim that they're trying to prevent people from illegally voting, but that's a pretext. Illegal votes are virtually non-existent; they're trying to stop people from voting legally for the other party. Some Republican politicians have even said this out loud. Meanwhile, the other party (the Ds) doesn't try to prevent anyone from voting legally, even the people who are more likely to vote for their opponents. Anyone who has paid attention for the last 20 years should see this disparity and recognize it for what it is. It's just one of many examples of how the parties are not equally bad. And, again, I'm not a Democrat.