Ukraine
Comments
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brianlux said:mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.I've heard others suggest the same thing, that the West needs to give Putin a way to save face. I understand that argument and, considering his power and instability of mind, it's probably for the best. But a better solution might be for him to be deposed or eliminated in some way by his own people. He has brought total shame to his people and country. Much of the world is united against him. But of course, because of that, the question becomes, how desperate and unstable has he become.As a side note, I'm a little surprised how relative little traction this event has been gained here on AMT. The war in Ukraine is the biggest current event to happen in the world in many years and yet only a handful of people post here while other, less pressing issues seem to get equal or greater attention. Strange and baffling!how little traction? wtf are you talking about.? created on Jan 25. now on 40 pages with some 1200 plus comments.seems inordinate amount of traction.and the world did not stop turning.NK fired off another hey remember I'm a madman missle , other fucked up important shit is still going on.why havent we addressed Myanmar? or the other atrocities going on in the world.in 6 hours last week I woke up to 438 comments here. in SIX HOURS too little traction....._____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
I think it's tough for the reasons I mentioned above. His inner circle are as corrupt as he is. If he is taken out, then he will have to be replaced by another corrupt depot. Otherwise the oligarchs will be in jail or against a wall pretty quickly as well.Meltdown99 said:
Is there any chance his inner circle will take him out?Spiritual_Chaos said:
I mean... he/Russia has swung back and forth more than Trump over figuring out a defense. The Defense has been marely freeing two isolated areas. Then freeing the whole of Ukraine from nenoazis. From drugusers. From Ukraine wanting to commit genocide. To now in the UN saying Ukraine was on the way to develop nukes. If I understood the russian delegate correctly.mrussel1 said:
I don't know, honestly. Depends on how desperate he is. If he is cornered, he could lash out and intensify the war, or he might want to cut his losses and say all he ever wanted was protection on the western flank. Of course his message that SC posted never says that BS line either. It's much more imperialistic.The Juggler said:
Do you think giving him the two breakaways would work? I was thinking about that this morning. I bet Putin would claim that as a win but it's obviously not what he originally wanted.mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.
Unless we think there will be a coup and he is deposed, there has to be an exit ramp for Putin. Because all the power (read: money) is concentrated into the oligarchs who are close to Putin, and who would be financially and legally devastated if he was deposed, I think a coup is unlikely. So then what's the next option for Ukraine/West?
The truth is - Putin is 70 year old and want's his legacy to be that he was the one who restored the Russian empire by taking back, at least, Ukraine.
I hope I'm wrong.0 -
For you americans, Football = soccer
Following the initial decisions adopted by the FIFA Council and the UEFA Executive Committee, which envisaged the adoption of additional measures, FIFA and UEFA have today decided together that all Russian teams, whether national representative teams or club teams, shall be suspended from participation in both FIFA and UEFA competitions until further notice.
These decisions were adopted today by the Bureau of the FIFA Council and the Executive Committee of UEFA, respectively the highest decision-making bodies of both institutions on such urgent matters.
Football is fully united here and in full solidarity with all the people affected in Ukraine. Both Presidents hope that the situation in Ukraine will improve significantly and rapidly so that football can again be a vector for unity and peace amongst people.
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
Ok. I did not know if these sanctions might be making people close to him nervous. However, I’m sure Vlad and his inner circle have billions that can’t be touched by sanctions…when this is over or maybe before it’s over, Ukraine should be given NATO membership…I’m not sure if they were offered NATO membership before Russia invaded if that would have stopped the invasion? And now that NATO countries are supplying weaponry, NATO countries are involved far more than I anticipated…mrussel1 said:
I think it's tough for the reasons I mentioned above. His inner circle are as corrupt as he is. If he is taken out, then he will have to be replaced by another corrupt depot. Otherwise the oligarchs will be in jail or against a wall pretty quickly as well.Meltdown99 said:
Is there any chance his inner circle will take him out?Spiritual_Chaos said:
I mean... he/Russia has swung back and forth more than Trump over figuring out a defense. The Defense has been marely freeing two isolated areas. Then freeing the whole of Ukraine from nenoazis. From drugusers. From Ukraine wanting to commit genocide. To now in the UN saying Ukraine was on the way to develop nukes. If I understood the russian delegate correctly.mrussel1 said:
I don't know, honestly. Depends on how desperate he is. If he is cornered, he could lash out and intensify the war, or he might want to cut his losses and say all he ever wanted was protection on the western flank. Of course his message that SC posted never says that BS line either. It's much more imperialistic.The Juggler said:
Do you think giving him the two breakaways would work? I was thinking about that this morning. I bet Putin would claim that as a win but it's obviously not what he originally wanted.mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.
Unless we think there will be a coup and he is deposed, there has to be an exit ramp for Putin. Because all the power (read: money) is concentrated into the oligarchs who are close to Putin, and who would be financially and legally devastated if he was deposed, I think a coup is unlikely. So then what's the next option for Ukraine/West?
The truth is - Putin is 70 year old and want's his legacy to be that he was the one who restored the Russian empire by taking back, at least, Ukraine.
I hope I'm wrong.Give Peas A Chance…0 -
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0
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I hope the west will leave Vlad an exit strategy if things do go real bad…we don’t need Vlad feeling so desperate that he does something even dumber…Give Peas A Chance…0 -
mickeyrat said:brianlux said:mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.I've heard others suggest the same thing, that the West needs to give Putin a way to save face. I understand that argument and, considering his power and instability of mind, it's probably for the best. But a better solution might be for him to be deposed or eliminated in some way by his own people. He has brought total shame to his people and country. Much of the world is united against him. But of course, because of that, the question becomes, how desperate and unstable has he become.As a side note, I'm a little surprised how relative little traction this event has been gained here on AMT. The war in Ukraine is the biggest current event to happen in the world in many years and yet only a handful of people post here while other, less pressing issues seem to get equal or greater attention. Strange and baffling!how little traction? wtf are you talking about.? created on Jan 25. now on 40 pages with some 1200 plus comments.seems inordinate amount of traction.and the world did not stop turning.NK fired off another hey remember I'm a madman missle , other fucked up important shit is still going on.why havent we addressed Myanmar? or the other atrocities going on in the world.in 6 hours last week I woke up to 438 comments here. in SIX HOURS too little traction.....
I feel like I'm getting my ass chewed.
What, maybe 10 people posting here and most of the post from about half of those.Sometime I just feel like fuck this place. Angry nasty posts and stupid memes. Fuck it.
"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
It is too bad the exit strategy can't be taking him out. The "rules of war" won't be too meaningful if nukes start flying in multiple directions.Meltdown99 said:
I hope the west will leave Vlad an exit strategy if things do go real bad…we don’t need Vlad feeling so desperate that he does something even dumber…
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They are being personally sanctioned, so money they have in the West is getting frozen. Additionally, they can't travel to the West as their passports are invalid. Known family members and children will also be prohibited from attending western schools (which is important to them). I'm not sure if family will be restricted from travel. But these oligarchs are being hit. But if they think they will be at risk in Russia if Putin is deposed, then it's not happening. If they can protect their assets, remove Putin and get the support of the military, then it could happen.Meltdown99 said:
Ok. I did not know if these sanctions might be making people close to him nervous. However, I’m sure Vlad and his inner circle have billions that can’t be touched by sanctions…when this is over or maybe before it’s over, Ukraine should be given NATO membership…I’m not sure if they were offered NATO membership before Russia invaded if that would have stopped the invasion? And now that NATO countries are supplying weaponry, NATO countries are involved far more than I anticipated…mrussel1 said:
I think it's tough for the reasons I mentioned above. His inner circle are as corrupt as he is. If he is taken out, then he will have to be replaced by another corrupt depot. Otherwise the oligarchs will be in jail or against a wall pretty quickly as well.Meltdown99 said:
Is there any chance his inner circle will take him out?Spiritual_Chaos said:
I mean... he/Russia has swung back and forth more than Trump over figuring out a defense. The Defense has been marely freeing two isolated areas. Then freeing the whole of Ukraine from nenoazis. From drugusers. From Ukraine wanting to commit genocide. To now in the UN saying Ukraine was on the way to develop nukes. If I understood the russian delegate correctly.mrussel1 said:
I don't know, honestly. Depends on how desperate he is. If he is cornered, he could lash out and intensify the war, or he might want to cut his losses and say all he ever wanted was protection on the western flank. Of course his message that SC posted never says that BS line either. It's much more imperialistic.The Juggler said:
Do you think giving him the two breakaways would work? I was thinking about that this morning. I bet Putin would claim that as a win but it's obviously not what he originally wanted.mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.
Unless we think there will be a coup and he is deposed, there has to be an exit ramp for Putin. Because all the power (read: money) is concentrated into the oligarchs who are close to Putin, and who would be financially and legally devastated if he was deposed, I think a coup is unlikely. So then what's the next option for Ukraine/West?
The truth is - Putin is 70 year old and want's his legacy to be that he was the one who restored the Russian empire by taking back, at least, Ukraine.
I hope I'm wrong.0 -
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
mickey loves to chew a good ass. don't take it personally brian.brianlux said:mickeyrat said:brianlux said:mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.I've heard others suggest the same thing, that the West needs to give Putin a way to save face. I understand that argument and, considering his power and instability of mind, it's probably for the best. But a better solution might be for him to be deposed or eliminated in some way by his own people. He has brought total shame to his people and country. Much of the world is united against him. But of course, because of that, the question becomes, how desperate and unstable has he become.As a side note, I'm a little surprised how relative little traction this event has been gained here on AMT. The war in Ukraine is the biggest current event to happen in the world in many years and yet only a handful of people post here while other, less pressing issues seem to get equal or greater attention. Strange and baffling!how little traction? wtf are you talking about.? created on Jan 25. now on 40 pages with some 1200 plus comments.seems inordinate amount of traction.and the world did not stop turning.NK fired off another hey remember I'm a madman missle , other fucked up important shit is still going on.why havent we addressed Myanmar? or the other atrocities going on in the world.in 6 hours last week I woke up to 438 comments here. in SIX HOURS too little traction.....
I feel like I'm getting my ass chewed.What, maybe 10 people posting here and most of the post from about half of those.Sometime I just feel like fuck this place. Angry nasty posts and stupid memes. Fuck it.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
Norway breaks with tradition - they will also send lethal aid to Ukraine"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0
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mrussel1 said:
They are being personally sanctioned, so money they have in the West is getting frozen. Additionally, they can't travel to the West as their passports are invalid. Known family members and children will also be prohibited from attending western schools (which is important to them). I'm not sure if family will be restricted from travel. But these oligarchs are being hit. But if they think they will be at risk in Russia if Putin is deposed, then it's not happening. If they can protect their assets, remove Putin and get the support of the military, then it could happen.Meltdown99 said:
Ok. I did not know if these sanctions might be making people close to him nervous. However, I’m sure Vlad and his inner circle have billions that can’t be touched by sanctions…when this is over or maybe before it’s over, Ukraine should be given NATO membership…I’m not sure if they were offered NATO membership before Russia invaded if that would have stopped the invasion? And now that NATO countries are supplying weaponry, NATO countries are involved far more than I anticipated…mrussel1 said:
I think it's tough for the reasons I mentioned above. His inner circle are as corrupt as he is. If he is taken out, then he will have to be replaced by another corrupt depot. Otherwise the oligarchs will be in jail or against a wall pretty quickly as well.Meltdown99 said:
Is there any chance his inner circle will take him out?Spiritual_Chaos said:
I mean... he/Russia has swung back and forth more than Trump over figuring out a defense. The Defense has been marely freeing two isolated areas. Then freeing the whole of Ukraine from nenoazis. From drugusers. From Ukraine wanting to commit genocide. To now in the UN saying Ukraine was on the way to develop nukes. If I understood the russian delegate correctly.mrussel1 said:
I don't know, honestly. Depends on how desperate he is. If he is cornered, he could lash out and intensify the war, or he might want to cut his losses and say all he ever wanted was protection on the western flank. Of course his message that SC posted never says that BS line either. It's much more imperialistic.The Juggler said:
Do you think giving him the two breakaways would work? I was thinking about that this morning. I bet Putin would claim that as a win but it's obviously not what he originally wanted.mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.
Unless we think there will be a coup and he is deposed, there has to be an exit ramp for Putin. Because all the power (read: money) is concentrated into the oligarchs who are close to Putin, and who would be financially and legally devastated if he was deposed, I think a coup is unlikely. So then what's the next option for Ukraine/West?
The truth is - Putin is 70 year old and want's his legacy to be that he was the one who restored the Russian empire by taking back, at least, Ukraine.
I hope I'm wrong.
it comes down to, if they become deposed from positions freely given then exploited under putin, they still have that cash(even though frozen at present) as its not been seized, so how much is enough?
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
HughFreakingDillon said:
mickey loves to chew a good ass.brianlux said:mickeyrat said:brianlux said:mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.I've heard others suggest the same thing, that the West needs to give Putin a way to save face. I understand that argument and, considering his power and instability of mind, it's probably for the best. But a better solution might be for him to be deposed or eliminated in some way by his own people. He has brought total shame to his people and country. Much of the world is united against him. But of course, because of that, the question becomes, how desperate and unstable has he become.As a side note, I'm a little surprised how relative little traction this event has been gained here on AMT. The war in Ukraine is the biggest current event to happen in the world in many years and yet only a handful of people post here while other, less pressing issues seem to get equal or greater attention. Strange and baffling!how little traction? wtf are you talking about.? created on Jan 25. now on 40 pages with some 1200 plus comments.seems inordinate amount of traction.and the world did not stop turning.NK fired off another hey remember I'm a madman missle , other fucked up important shit is still going on.why havent we addressed Myanmar? or the other atrocities going on in the world.in 6 hours last week I woke up to 438 comments here. in SIX HOURS too little traction.....
I feel like I'm getting my ass chewed.What, maybe 10 people posting here and most of the post from about half of those.Sometime I just feel like fuck this place. Angry nasty posts and stupid memes. Fuck it.
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
last night. couldnt readily isolate just the opening so ignore after. John shows some great video clips, in particukar of a Ukrainian woman confront a russian soldier...
_____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '140 -
Switzerland joins sanctions..Spiritual_Chaos said:Norway breaks with tradition - they will also send lethal aid to Ukraine
When you've lost the Swiss...0 -
Trump will gladly take Putin out.... to dinner.Spiritual_Chaos said:
Maybe Trump will.Meltdown99 said:
Is there any chance his inner circle will take him out?Spiritual_Chaos said:
I mean... he/Russia has swung back and forth more than Trump over figuring out a defense. The Defense has been marely freeing two isolated areas. Then freeing the whole of Ukraine from nenoazis. From drugusers. From Ukraine wanting to commit genocide. To now in the UN saying Ukraine was on the way to develop nukes. If I understood the russian delegate correctly.mrussel1 said:
I don't know, honestly. Depends on how desperate he is. If he is cornered, he could lash out and intensify the war, or he might want to cut his losses and say all he ever wanted was protection on the western flank. Of course his message that SC posted never says that BS line either. It's much more imperialistic.The Juggler said:
Do you think giving him the two breakaways would work? I was thinking about that this morning. I bet Putin would claim that as a win but it's obviously not what he originally wanted.mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.
Unless we think there will be a coup and he is deposed, there has to be an exit ramp for Putin. Because all the power (read: money) is concentrated into the oligarchs who are close to Putin, and who would be financially and legally devastated if he was deposed, I think a coup is unlikely. So then what's the next option for Ukraine/West?
The truth is - Putin is 70 year old and want's his legacy to be that he was the one who restored the Russian empire by taking back, at least, Ukraine.This weekend we rock Portland0 -
Which make Minnie quite happy.HughFreakingDillon said:
mickey loves to chew a good ass. don't take it personally brian.brianlux said:mickeyrat said:brianlux said:mrussel1 said:So the question may soon become.. What escape hatch will the West give Putin to withdraw and save face? This has to be a topic of conversation between Ukraine, US, Britain, Germany, etc. This cannot be an unconditional surrender against Putin. Let him keep the two breakaways? Let him keep one? He isn't going to disarm, obviously. Nor will his demand for Ukraine's military to overtake the political apparatus happen either.
May be too early to think about it, but I am. The war isn't going well for them and the economic sanctions are hitting fast. I can't believe they are mostly cutoff from SWIFT. I thought this would take much longer. Sberbank is going to fail. Market was closed today to protect it. They are literally an international pariah.I've heard others suggest the same thing, that the West needs to give Putin a way to save face. I understand that argument and, considering his power and instability of mind, it's probably for the best. But a better solution might be for him to be deposed or eliminated in some way by his own people. He has brought total shame to his people and country. Much of the world is united against him. But of course, because of that, the question becomes, how desperate and unstable has he become.As a side note, I'm a little surprised how relative little traction this event has been gained here on AMT. The war in Ukraine is the biggest current event to happen in the world in many years and yet only a handful of people post here while other, less pressing issues seem to get equal or greater attention. Strange and baffling!how little traction? wtf are you talking about.? created on Jan 25. now on 40 pages with some 1200 plus comments.seems inordinate amount of traction.and the world did not stop turning.NK fired off another hey remember I'm a madman missle , other fucked up important shit is still going on.why havent we addressed Myanmar? or the other atrocities going on in the world.in 6 hours last week I woke up to 438 comments here. in SIX HOURS too little traction.....
I feel like I'm getting my ass chewed.What, maybe 10 people posting here and most of the post from about half of those.Sometime I just feel like fuck this place. Angry nasty posts and stupid memes. Fuck it.This weekend we rock Portland0
https://youtu.be/0utzB6oDan0
https://youtu.be/xpFpzABdTFE
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