Viruses / Vaccines

PJNB

Also that broken arm is obviously an example and there are plenty of other reasons why kids are in the hospital and then get covid or had it and are counted towards the hospitalization number. Why would we not want the legitimate number instead of an inflated one. I have no clue how inflated it is. Could be one extra could be a hundred extra hell could be no extra some days. Point is tell us instead of mixing them as one. 

bootlegger10

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

bootlegger10

HughFreakingDillon said:

bootlegger10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

bootlegger10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

bootlegger10 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJNB said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJNB said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

Show me where these kids are in the hospital from covid and not with covid please. Almost 2 years into this pandemic and we still can't differentiate between the two for some odd reason. If someone is in the hospital because of covid tally that one up as a hospitalization. If they are in the hospital for something else and also have covid with mild symptoms then tally that one up as not a hospitalization. It is not hard. 

My wife likes to listen to talk radio....yesterday in the car, our head nurse was being interviewed. she was asked direct questions about how many people in the ICU were vaccinated vs unvaccinated. she sidestepped the question and gave stats on your likelihood of being in the ICU vs not if you are vaccinated. he then asked if those percentages bear out in the numbers she is seeing in our hospitals....PAUSE...."yes". 

clearly (to me), she just didn't want to say that there are indeed people in hospital and ICU who are fully vaccinated, as they don't want to discourage people from getting the vaccine. give me the facts. MAKE me trust you. don't bullshit me for your agenda just because you think the ends justify the means. 

Very true. I do think our population is too dumb to be honest to follow a lot of the real numbers though. Just because there are vaccinated people in the ICU that does not mean the vaccine does not work. If 95% of the vulnerable population is vaccinated and the unvaccinated are still outnumbering the vaccinated in the hospital that is a staggering difference to think about. For some reason a lot of people can't see this though. I have had numerous discussions with people that are against the vaccine that just look at the numbers in the hospital. If it is a 60/40 split how does the vaccine work I was asked. Well if 80% of the population is double vaxxed how is that number not even greater if the vaccine does not work I replied. They just can't get it and like you said the way they feed it to us does not help and only leads to more speculation and doubt a lot of the time.

there is absolutely that angle to it, for sure. they don't want to fuel a misinterpretation of the data. I just get frustrated that we're all forced to listen to a remedial version of the facts because of stupids. 

Hence, no trust.  The masks was one of the first big lies besides Trump’s.  That was a bad one.

What lie about masks are you referring to?

Anthony Fauci and the U.S. government’s noble COVID-19 lies. (slate.com)

yes, this was done, it seems, across the board. Theresa Tamm here in canada did the same thing, apparently for the same reasons. Now, intelligent adults like ourselves can hear this information and be mildly annoyed yet understand the intent behind it. Does it sow some mistrust? No question. But creating messaging that:

1) people will legitimately adhere to, and
2) be backed up by all data
3) without creating panic or causing complacency (depending on positive/negative ratio of message)

is a very difficult tight rope to walk on. Do I agree with what he and others have done? not all the time, no. However, we saw the Toilet Paper Fiasco of March 2020. When people are told too much negative truth, they panic. When they are told too much positive truth, they get complacent. 

So what, in your view, should he/they have done? (not challenging, honest question)

I think they need to tell the truth and the information they have available.  If masks are important, then say that.  

It is tough though.  But we saw the lack of preparedness and that is what forced the lie or noble lie.  We should be more prepared.  

The consequences of an untrustworthy government are probably worse in the long run compared to a run on masks or toilet paper.

The government works for us.  I think we and the government forget that a lot.  It is not their place to withhold information from us that is important to our health because they weren’t prepared to deal with it.

they do work for us, for sure, but do you think they should just trust the general public with any and all information, regardless of risk of mass panic?

I am sure that there are situations where it is better to avoid mass panic.  I think with the masks though they are better off telling the public what they can do to avoid catching a virus instead of not.  Otherwise you end up in a situation where we are now where there is mistrust and it gets politicized.  

mrussel1

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

bbiggs

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

I’m guessing more people would engage in a good faith, healthy debate or disagreement with you if you didn’t come out of the gate with a blanket “fuck them” statement. 

PJNB

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

Now this is a number I would love to see. We used excess deaths the last couple of years as a measure to prove how deadly this virus is testing positive or not. Hospitalizations should be used in the same way imo.

Again though it should be easy to differentiate between being in with or from covid. I am not a conspiracy nut (far from it) but you have to ask yourself why are we not getting these numbers?

mrussel1

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

Now this is a number I would love to see. We used excess deaths the last couple of years as a measure to prove how deadly this virus is testing positive or not. Hospitalizations should be used in the same way imo.

Again though it should be easy to differentiate between being in with or from covid. I am not a conspiracy nut (far from it) but you have to ask yourself why are we not getting these numbers?

Because I think the number is immaterial.  

PJNB

mrussel1 said:

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

Now this is a number I would love to see. We used excess deaths the last couple of years as a measure to prove how deadly this virus is testing positive or not. Hospitalizations should be used in the same way imo.

Again though it should be easy to differentiate between being in with or from covid. I am not a conspiracy nut (far from it) but you have to ask yourself why are we not getting these numbers?

Because I think the number is immaterial.  

I am not following how it is immaterial even with your last above posts reasoning. If half of the 378 daily cases (just using that one as an example) are in the hospital with covid and covid is not being treated that is a number I would like to know. I would also like to know how hospitals are fairing compared to 2018/2019 as well. More accurate info the better imo. 

mrussel1

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

Now this is a number I would love to see. We used excess deaths the last couple of years as a measure to prove how deadly this virus is testing positive or not. Hospitalizations should be used in the same way imo.

Again though it should be easy to differentiate between being in with or from covid. I am not a conspiracy nut (far from it) but you have to ask yourself why are we not getting these numbers?

Because I think the number is immaterial.  

I am not following how it is immaterial even with your last above posts reasoning. If half of the 378 daily cases (just using that one as an example) are in the hospital with covid and covid is not being treated that is a number I would like to know. I would also like to know how hospitals are fairing compared to 2018/2019 as well. More accurate info the better imo. 

I'm saying the number of kids in the hospital for something else AND has a mild case of COVID is likely immaterial.  But again,  compare the number of kids in the hospital now vs this time two years ago for a given state, region,  etc.,  and that's your answer to the fundamental question as to whether COVID in kids is causing a high number of very sick children. 

Lerxst1992

mrussel1 said:

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

Now this is a number I would love to see. We used excess deaths the last couple of years as a measure to prove how deadly this virus is testing positive or not. Hospitalizations should be used in the same way imo.

Again though it should be easy to differentiate between being in with or from covid. I am not a conspiracy nut (far from it) but you have to ask yourself why are we not getting these numbers?

Because I think the number is immaterial.  

I am not following how it is immaterial even with your last above posts reasoning. If half of the 378 daily cases (just using that one as an example) are in the hospital with covid and covid is not being treated that is a number I would like to know. I would also like to know how hospitals are fairing compared to 2018/2019 as well. More accurate info the better imo. 

I'm saying the number of kids in the hospital for something else AND has a mild case of COVID is likely immaterial.  But again,  compare the number of kids in the hospital now vs this time two years ago for a given state, region,  etc.,  and that's your answer to the fundamental question as to whether COVID in kids is causing a high number of very sick children. 

We could just ask a few doctors and ask what they are currently seeing?

mrussel1

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

PJNB said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

dignin said:

tish said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-sars-cov-2-variants-technical-briefings

Today's primary source UK data on vaccine efficacy with omicron and child vaccine data.

Thanks for this Tish.

I also saw this today.

COVID-19: U.S. children hospitalized in record numbers as vaccinations lag


"During the week of Dec. 22-28, an average of 378 children 17 and under were admitted per day to hospitals with the coronavirus, a 66 per cent increase from the week before, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Thursday"


https://globalnews-ca.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/amp/?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a6&usqp=mq331AQIKAGwASCAAgM=#amp_tf=From %1$s&aoh=16409746800752&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com&ampshare=https://globalnews.ca/news/8481415/covid-19-us-children-hospitalizations/

The results of parents making bad decisions.

And Fauci confirmed that a Covid positive kid with a broken arm counts as part of that 378. No Covid issues, broken arm.   We need legitimate numbers.

That's such a red herring. Kids rarely end up in the hospital.  And you don't get hospitalized for a broken arm either unless it's shattered and you need major surgery.  Point is that is hospitalizations suddenly have spiked in the last month,  you can feel pretty confident it's COVID. There's not a broken arm epidemic happening. 

They won't respond to this.

Everytime a valid point is made they move the goalposts.

It's almost impossible to have a disagreement in good faith with most people hear because I guess they just can't handle bad news.

So when Fauci explains that some of the 378 are kids that tested positive but were admitted for other reasons, we should just ignore that as a red herring?  Kids get COVID and can get seriously ill (super rare), but let's get the numbers right.  The 378 number is not a correct number per Dr. Fauci if wanting to understand how many kids are being admitted for COVID reasons.  

The point is,  what does 378 even mean? Unless you have a habit of monitoring seasonal children's hospitalization numbers,  then that number would mean nothing to you,  or me.  The question is are the numbers significantly higher than historic numbers? If yes,  well then there you go.  The raw numbers of how many are there doesn't matter when comparing averages because that's baked into the numbers.  Further,  if a child has a mild case of COVID while recovered from the ailment that landed the child in the hospital,  the child will be released.  They aren't going to occupy a bed with a mild case. 

Now this is a number I would love to see. We used excess deaths the last couple of years as a measure to prove how deadly this virus is testing positive or not. Hospitalizations should be used in the same way imo.

Again though it should be easy to differentiate between being in with or from covid. I am not a conspiracy nut (far from it) but you have to ask yourself why are we not getting these numbers?

Because I think the number is immaterial.  

I am not following how it is immaterial even with your last above posts reasoning. If half of the 378 daily cases (just using that one as an example) are in the hospital with covid and covid is not being treated that is a number I would like to know. I would also like to know how hospitals are fairing compared to 2018/2019 as well. More accurate info the better imo. 

I'm saying the number of kids in the hospital for something else AND has a mild case of COVID is likely immaterial.  But again,  compare the number of kids in the hospital now vs this time two years ago for a given state, region,  etc.,  and that's your answer to the fundamental question as to whether COVID in kids is causing a high number of very sick children. 

We could just ask a few doctors and ask what they are currently seeing?

I don't buy anecdotes.  One would think the real number could be obtained. 

mickeyrat

maybe Fauci should let the CDC speak for themselves.  He doesn't  to my knowledge work for them.  He leads NIAID... 

https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-health-united-states-anthony-fauci-centers-for-disease-control-and-prevention-5f3e45e2f140f94df02267e22c307664 

cincybearcat

HughFreakingDillon said:

no one (that I've seen) has been saying we'll vaccine our way out of this. at least not lately. vaccines are the best way to keep our health care system afloat. if you don't understand that at this point......

The chance to vaccine out of this or to a much better place has come and gone. We messed it up by having so many Unvaxed.  Now this is a part of life moving forward. 

tempo_n_groove

My 83yo uncle caught Covid for the second time.  He wasn't nearly as bad as the first go around.  Felt ill for a day then back to normal.

josevolution

Hospital here will be scaling back on elective surgery we have over 200 COVID patients in-house…

Meltdown99

Ontario returns to Step 2 of reopening plan on Wednesday; students pivot to remote learning, indoor dining, gyms to be closed

https://www.cp24.com/news/ontario-returns-to-step-2-of-reopening-plan-on-wednesday-students-pivot-to-remote-learning-indoor-dining-gyms-to-be-closed-1.5726134

only 2 weeks, they say.  Get vaccinated they said?  Groundhog Day 

Meltdown99

Socialized medicine in Canada is really great until a crisis hits then it easily collapses…

just kidding it has never been great…

static111

Meltdown99 said:

Socialized medicine in Canada is really great until a crisis hits then it easily collapses…

just kidding it has never been great…

Well here in the US we have private for profit medicine, and it still sucks and gets overwhelmed, but we do pay an arm and a leg and keep those insurance company profits high!

HughFreakingDillon

yeah I'm really not interested in having to re-mortgage my house to get treated for a sprained ankle. 

Meltdown99

static111 said:

Meltdown99 said:

Socialized medicine in Canada is really great until a crisis hits then it easily collapses…

just kidding it has never been great…

Well here in the US we have private for profit medicine, and it still sucks and gets overwhelmed, but we do pay an arm and a leg and keep those insurance company profits high!

Oh please.  Cry me a river.  We pay a shit ton of tax for a system that bogs down at the 1st sign of a crisis.  And if you don’t think people in our socialized medicine don’t make big bucks…think again.  The CEO of my local hospital makes 500 grand a year…pretty generous for a so called not for profit system.