Was she canceled? If so then Alex Jones needs an apology.
This lady had no business holding any Ivy League degree, let alone being president of Harvard.
For those who have been victimized by DEI, it’s dangerous and deplorable.
So, if you believe in free speech then what she said, which didn't condemn nor promote it, should be an acceptable answer. "in context" was what the board didn't like. She could have answered it better but I understood where she was coming from. I also understand it is a loaded topic. Too bad the Asian communities weren't afforded this amount of support when they were being attacked.
The Alex Jones thing was tongue in cheek. He was libel and an idiot. He deserves to be cancelled.
As far as her being the president of a prestigious university? I don't know. Do I think everyone is trying to be diverse rather than have the best candidate? Probably.
Wasn't her defense at the hearing basically that as long as you don't act on it, and if it isn't to the point of harassment, then hate speech was okay? I disagree that aligns with freedom of speech. School campuses and work places should, and typically do, have limits on speech and not just actions. I don't know why she couldn't just say antisemitic speech is wrong, and keep circling back to the context.
I agree with your last sentence. Had she said that then this would be moot. She did include the "context" part which I agree with.
Lets say you wanted to discuss Hitler or genocide of a people, then it can fall under free speech. That is where if you don't act on it that it should be ok. It is also at a college where it is higher learning and people should be able to test boundaries. Maybe she was trying to get to that? I don't know. No matter what she says now will matter.
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,932
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
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The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,334
Same deal with the lady at Harvard. It's all disingenuous nonsense, all the time. Sadly some people can't, or won't try, to see through it.
Liz Magill’s ouster at Penn will help the worst people take down free speech, higher ed
Critics celebrating the scalping of Penn's president won't stop there. Free speech, and college itself, is in grave danger.
Rep. Elise Stefanik (R., N.Y.) speaks during a hearing of the House Committee on Education on Capitol Hill in Washington on Tuesday.Mark Schiefelbein / AP
by Will Bunch | ColumnistPublished Dec. 10, 2023, 11:44 a.m. ET
A band of raiders never stops at just one scalp. Just minutes after the University of Pennsylvania’s president Liz Magill pulled the plug on her stormy 17-month tenure, under intense pressure for her handling of antisemitism questions on Capitol Hill, her chief inquisitor — GOP Rep. Elise Stefanik of New York — was back on the battlefield calling for more.
“One down. Two to go,” a clearly ebullient Stefanik posted on X/Twitter, urging on her dream of an academic Saturday Night Massacre that would also take down the two college leaders who testified last week along with Magill — MIT’s Sally Kornbluth and Claudine Gay of Harvard, which, in a controversy with more ironies than a Jane Austen novel, happens to be Stefanik’s alma mater.
But what Stefanik promised on Saturday night, and what her allies are cheering on, goes well beyond a few high-profile resignations. She promised the current crisis — over what constitutes antisemitism on college campuses, and how administrators like Magill have been handling it — will lead to more congressional hearings on “all facets of their institutions’ negligent perpetration of antisemitism including administrative, faculty, and overall leadership and governance.”
This weekend, Magill’s resignation — urged on by some of Penn’s billionaire donors withholding massive donations, amid intense criticism from both political parties including the Biden White House — has been the lead national story everywhere. It’s bumped back coverage of Israel’s intensifying strikes on Gaza that have killed hundreds every day while taking out top Palestinian scholars and journalists, as well as holy sites. And it’s drowned out the Biden administration’s international pariah move of vetoing a U.N. cease-fire resolution backed by 13 out of 15 Security Council members. No wonder some folks prefer to keep the focus on a college campus 11,000 miles west of this carnage.
Magill’s legalistic, bloodless, deer-in-the-headlights response to incessant probing by Stefanik and other lawmakers was not good — not just because she blew a chance to condemn the never-ending horror of antisemitism, but also because it was a weak defense of free speech on campus. I’m not writing to express any regret over her departure. It seemed to me she governed Penn like a candle in the wind, wanting to defend academic freedom but then betraying those values, as when the university tried to ban a film presenting legitimate criticisms of Israel’s policies and then threatened to punish students for showing it anyway.
By ceding the high ground to demagogues like Stefanik, the fallout from this affair is more likely in the long run to hamper the fight against antisemitism than to bolster it, which is beyond unfortunate. Because no one can deny the scourge of antisemitism — especially not here in Pennsylvania, where a right-wing fanatic ginned up by immigration lies entered a Pittsburgh synagogue and murdered 11 Jews with the kind of AR-15 killing machine Stefanik and her Republican colleagues have no interest in holding hearings about, let alone outlawing.
And there’s no doubt that antisemitic incidents are on the rise — such reports increased 35% from 2021 to 2022 and then have spiked exponentially this year, as tensions over the war in the Middle East have boiled over during contentious protests here at home. Since the Hamas terror attack on Oct. 7 triggered the fighting, Islamophobia has also risen dramatically. College administrators have a responsibility to come down on anyone committing acts of violence, threatening actual violence, or undertaking vandalism, but that’s not really what the Stefanik-Magill showdown was about.
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Stefanik’s relentless questioning didn’t focus on actions at Penn — like October’s antisemitic graffiti on campus — but on words, and especially protesters’ use of the term intifada, which marchers see as a call for liberation but Israel’s staunchest defenders claim is an invitation to pogrom. No doubt the term is controversial and offensive to some, but Magill was actually right to insist there’s a line between speech and action.
I agree with the tiny handful of commentators not joining the anti-Magill pile on. That includes the New York Times’ Michelle Goldberg, who wrote that Magill and her colleagues walked into a trap by allowing Stefanik to define common pro-Palestinian rhetoric as “antisemitism” and then demanding what Goldberg called “egregious violations of free speech.” And also New York Magazine’s Jonathan Chait, who wrote after Magill’s resignation that the college presidents were right to insist that schools regulate conduct but not words, stating that “what Stefanik was demanding was the wholesale ban on rhetoric and ideas that Jews find threatening, regardless of context.”
Shortly before Magill’s resignation, Jeremy C. Young, who directs the Freedom to Learn program at PEN America (full disclosure: I’m a member), told me that the literary free expression group is deeply concerned that the outcry over antisemitism is already driving a bevy of legislative proposals with alarming implications for free speech. He cited proposed laws that would require universities to be “neutral” on controversial issues, proposals to force schools to embrace the strictest definition of antisemitism that includes opposing the idea of Zionism, and bans on the most aggressive pro-Palestinian groups like the one recently laid down in Florida by Gov. Ron DeSantis.
Young stressed he isn’t disagreeing that campus antisemitism is a problem or that college presidents have made a mess of things, but he noted those driving the controversy are attacking other topics — diversity initiatives, tenure for professors, and what universities are teaching students. He said antisemitism is “being used as a pretext to take power over college decisions from neutral arbiters and hand it to politicians who want to enforce ideological control on campus. Silencing and chilling speech on campus cannot be the solution.”
But that’s exactly the hoped-for solution from the avatars of America’s new McCarthyism, who are seizing on young people’s pro-Palestinian activism, and a handful of the most despicable acts, to foment a new kind of “Red Scare” that has both the nation’s extreme right and the billionaire winners of our class wars in sight of their real goal. That would be to cripple our colleges and universities as incubators of critical thinking that might cause the next generation to question their authority.
Indeed, Stefanik makes for an ideal 21st-century Joe McCarthy, since she has no sense of decency. It’s not just that her passion as an anti-antisemitism crusader was nowhere to be seen recently when her conservative allies were out in the schools banning books likeThe Diary of Anne Frank. Far worse, Stefanik, in 2022 campaign ads, seemed to be endorsing the racist “great replacement theory” that mass immigration is a liberal plot, using inflammatory rhetoric about a scheme to “overthrow our current electorate and create a permanent liberal majority in Washington.” It’s exactly that idea that animated the madman who shot up Pittsburgh’s Tree of Life synagogue.
Harvard president Claudine Gay (left) speaks as University of Pennsylvania president Liz Magill listens during a hearing of the House Committee on Education on Capitol Hill on Tuesday.Mark Schiefelbein / AP
How much of this is about antisemitism, and how much of this is about something else — such as the fact that the college presidents who testified on Capitol Hill don’t look like the 300 years of school leaders who came before them? Bill Ackman, billionaire hedge fund manager and deeply disgruntled Harvard alum and donor, said the quiet part out loud last week when he made the repulsive allegation in a tweet that his alma mater’s first Black president — a child of Haitian immigrants, an award-winning scholar — was only hired to satisfy diversity goals.
And the likes of Ackman, Stefanik, and their allies won’t stop at reversing a half-century of diversity on campus — not when their bigger strategic goal of weakening the already tottering American way of higher education suddenly seems within reach. Last week, Sen. J.D. Vance, the billionaire-backed Ohioan, tweeted that “if universities keep pushing racial hatred, euphemistically called DEI, we need to look at their funding.” In the swirling vortex that led to Magill’s resignation, these calls for financial retribution will accelerate — and students will suffer.
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We know this because it’s happened before. Today’s campus unrest is a distinct echo of the Vietnam era, when students at many of the same universities now under attack also led massive protests against U.S. militarism, making their parents’ generation uneasy. In 1966, Ronald Reagan was elected governor of California by running against campus unrest, and he promised to impose tuition on its virtually free public universities, stating taxpayers “should not subsidize intellectual curiosity.” His philosophy inspired a generation of conservative lawmakers to privatize and devalue higher education, as tuition soared and student debt climbed to $1.75 trillion. Now, with public faith in universities at an all-time low, Reagan’s political heirs might finish the job.
The first step would be painfully familiar to anyone familiar with the anti-communist hysteria of the 1950s when McCarthyism reigned: a climate of fear and silence on college campuses. Here at Penn, the Wharton School’s Board of Advisors — the hedge fund-flavored panel that played an instrumental role in driving out Magill — has also proposed a new code that critics say goes too far in curbing campus free speech. Jonathan Friedman, PEN America’s director of free expression, blasted it as vague and “patently wrongheaded and could chill an ocean of speech on campus.”
In the current climate of fear and loathing, it won’t be the last such proposal.
With Magill’s departure, those who want to fight back for free speech face an increasingly uphill struggle. It’s easy for folks like the Biden White House to follow the path of least resistance and pretend that by slam-dunking Penn’s ex-president they are claiming the moral high ground, even as they sell Israel more tank shells like the one that was used to deliberately target and kill a Reuters journalist. It’s a lot harder to defend free expression knowing that the worst people will even try to brand you as an antisemite, just as those who once called out McCarthyism were stigmatized as “fellow travelers.”
Instead of jumping on the Magill scrum, let’s praise the courage of those defending our First Amendment rights. In a saga packed with irony, nothing would be more ironic than allowing a manipulated definition of “antisemitism” to shut down learning and inquiry, which are so central to the great Jewish traditions.
Liz Magill’s ouster at Penn will help the worst people take down free speech, higher ed
Critics celebrating the scalping of Penn's president won't stop there. Free speech, and college itself, is in grave danger.
Rep. Elise Stefanik (R., N.Y.) speaks during a hearing of the House Committee on Education on Capitol Hill in Washington on Tuesday.Mark Schiefelbein / AP
by Will Bunch | ColumnistPublished Dec. 10, 2023, 11:44 a.m. ET
A band of raiders never stops at just one scalp. Just minutes after the University of Pennsylvania’s president Liz Magill pulled the plug on her stormy 17-month tenure, under intense pressure for her handling of antisemitism questions on Capitol Hill, her chief inquisitor — GOP Rep. Elise Stefanik of New York — was back on the battlefield calling for more.
“One down. Two to go,” a clearly ebullient Stefanik posted on X/Twitter, urging on her dream of an academic Saturday Night Massacre that would also take down the two college leaders who testified last week along with Magill — MIT’s Sally Kornbluth and Claudine Gay of Harvard, which, in a controversy with more ironies than a Jane Austen novel, happens to be Stefanik’s alma mater.
But what Stefanik promised on Saturday night, and what her allies are cheering on, goes well beyond a few high-profile resignations. She promised the current crisis — over what constitutes antisemitism on college campuses, and how administrators like Magill have been handling it — will lead to more congressional hearings on “all facets of their institutions’ negligent perpetration of antisemitism including administrative, faculty, and overall leadership and governance.”
This weekend, Magill’s resignation — urged on by some of Penn’s billionaire donors withholding massive donations, amid intense criticism from both political parties including the Biden White House — has been the lead national story everywhere. It’s bumped back coverage of Israel’s intensifying strikes on Gaza that have killed hundreds every day while taking out top Palestinian scholars and journalists, as well as holy sites. And it’s drowned out the Biden administration’s international pariah move of vetoing a U.N. cease-fire resolution backed by 13 out of 15 Security Council members. No wonder some folks prefer to keep the focus on a college campus 11,000 miles west of this carnage.
Magill’s legalistic, bloodless, deer-in-the-headlights response to incessant probing by Stefanik and other lawmakers was not good — not just because she blew a chance to condemn the never-ending horror of antisemitism, but also because it was a weak defense of free speech on campus. I’m not writing to express any regret over her departure. It seemed to me she governed Penn like a candle in the wind, wanting to defend academic freedom but then betraying those values, as when the university tried to ban a film presenting legitimate criticisms of Israel’s policies and then threatened to punish students for showing it anyway.
By ceding the high ground to demagogues like Stefanik, the fallout from this affair is more likely in the long run to hamper the fight against antisemitism than to bolster it, which is beyond unfortunate. Because no one can deny the scourge of antisemitism — especially not here in Pennsylvania, where a right-wing fanatic ginned up by immigration lies entered a Pittsburgh synagogue and murdered 11 Jews with the kind of AR-15 killing machine Stefanik and her Republican colleagues have no interest in holding hearings about, let alone outlawing.
And there’s no doubt that antisemitic incidents are on the rise — such reports increased 35% from 2021 to 2022 and then have spiked exponentially this year, as tensions over the war in the Middle East have boiled over during contentious protests here at home. Since the Hamas terror attack on Oct. 7 triggered the fighting, Islamophobia has also risen dramatically. College administrators have a responsibility to come down on anyone committing acts of violence, threatening actual violence, or undertaking vandalism, but that’s not really what the Stefanik-Magill showdown was about.
ADVERTISEMENT
Stefanik’s relentless questioning didn’t focus on actions at Penn — like October’s antisemitic graffiti on campus — but on words, and especially protesters’ use of the term intifada, which marchers see as a call for liberation but Israel’s staunchest defenders claim is an invitation to pogrom. No doubt the term is controversial and offensive to some, but Magill was actually right to insist there’s a line between speech and action.
I agree with the tiny handful of commentators not joining the anti-Magill pile on. That includes the New York Times’ Michelle Goldberg, who wrote that Magill and her colleagues walked into a trap by allowing Stefanik to define common pro-Palestinian rhetoric as “antisemitism” and then demanding what Goldberg called “egregious violations of free speech.” And also New York Magazine’s Jonathan Chait, who wrote after Magill’s resignation that the college presidents were right to insist that schools regulate conduct but not words, stating that “what Stefanik was demanding was the wholesale ban on rhetoric and ideas that Jews find threatening, regardless of context.”
Shortly before Magill’s resignation, Jeremy C. Young, who directs the Freedom to Learn program at PEN America (full disclosure: I’m a member), told me that the literary free expression group is deeply concerned that the outcry over antisemitism is already driving a bevy of legislative proposals with alarming implications for free speech. He cited proposed laws that would require universities to be “neutral” on controversial issues, proposals to force schools to embrace the strictest definition of antisemitism that includes opposing the idea of Zionism, and bans on the most aggressive pro-Palestinian groups like the one recently laid down in Florida by Gov. Ron DeSantis.
Young stressed he isn’t disagreeing that campus antisemitism is a problem or that college presidents have made a mess of things, but he noted those driving the controversy are attacking other topics — diversity initiatives, tenure for professors, and what universities are teaching students. He said antisemitism is “being used as a pretext to take power over college decisions from neutral arbiters and hand it to politicians who want to enforce ideological control on campus. Silencing and chilling speech on campus cannot be the solution.”
But that’s exactly the hoped-for solution from the avatars of America’s new McCarthyism, who are seizing on young people’s pro-Palestinian activism, and a handful of the most despicable acts, to foment a new kind of “Red Scare” that has both the nation’s extreme right and the billionaire winners of our class wars in sight of their real goal. That would be to cripple our colleges and universities as incubators of critical thinking that might cause the next generation to question their authority.
Indeed, Stefanik makes for an ideal 21st-century Joe McCarthy, since she has no sense of decency. It’s not just that her passion as an anti-antisemitism crusader was nowhere to be seen recently when her conservative allies were out in the schools banning books likeThe Diary of Anne Frank. Far worse, Stefanik, in 2022 campaign ads, seemed to be endorsing the racist “great replacement theory” that mass immigration is a liberal plot, using inflammatory rhetoric about a scheme to “overthrow our current electorate and create a permanent liberal majority in Washington.” It’s exactly that idea that animated the madman who shot up Pittsburgh’s Tree of Life synagogue.
Harvard president Claudine Gay (left) speaks as University of Pennsylvania president Liz Magill listens during a hearing of the House Committee on Education on Capitol Hill on Tuesday.Mark Schiefelbein / AP
How much of this is about antisemitism, and how much of this is about something else — such as the fact that the college presidents who testified on Capitol Hill don’t look like the 300 years of school leaders who came before them? Bill Ackman, billionaire hedge fund manager and deeply disgruntled Harvard alum and donor, said the quiet part out loud last week when he made the repulsive allegation in a tweet that his alma mater’s first Black president — a child of Haitian immigrants, an award-winning scholar — was only hired to satisfy diversity goals.
And the likes of Ackman, Stefanik, and their allies won’t stop at reversing a half-century of diversity on campus — not when their bigger strategic goal of weakening the already tottering American way of higher education suddenly seems within reach. Last week, Sen. J.D. Vance, the billionaire-backed Ohioan, tweeted that “if universities keep pushing racial hatred, euphemistically called DEI, we need to look at their funding.” In the swirling vortex that led to Magill’s resignation, these calls for financial retribution will accelerate — and students will suffer.
ADVERTISEMENT
We know this because it’s happened before. Today’s campus unrest is a distinct echo of the Vietnam era, when students at many of the same universities now under attack also led massive protests against U.S. militarism, making their parents’ generation uneasy. In 1966, Ronald Reagan was elected governor of California by running against campus unrest, and he promised to impose tuition on its virtually free public universities, stating taxpayers “should not subsidize intellectual curiosity.” His philosophy inspired a generation of conservative lawmakers to privatize and devalue higher education, as tuition soared and student debt climbed to $1.75 trillion. Now, with public faith in universities at an all-time low, Reagan’s political heirs might finish the job.
The first step would be painfully familiar to anyone familiar with the anti-communist hysteria of the 1950s when McCarthyism reigned: a climate of fear and silence on college campuses. Here at Penn, the Wharton School’s Board of Advisors — the hedge fund-flavored panel that played an instrumental role in driving out Magill — has also proposed a new code that critics say goes too far in curbing campus free speech. Jonathan Friedman, PEN America’s director of free expression, blasted it as vague and “patently wrongheaded and could chill an ocean of speech on campus.”
In the current climate of fear and loathing, it won’t be the last such proposal.
With Magill’s departure, those who want to fight back for free speech face an increasingly uphill struggle. It’s easy for folks like the Biden White House to follow the path of least resistance and pretend that by slam-dunking Penn’s ex-president they are claiming the moral high ground, even as they sell Israel more tank shells like the one that was used to deliberately target and kill a Reuters journalist. It’s a lot harder to defend free expression knowing that the worst people will even try to brand you as an antisemite, just as those who once called out McCarthyism were stigmatized as “fellow travelers.”
Instead of jumping on the Magill scrum, let’s praise the courage of those defending our First Amendment rights. In a saga packed with irony, nothing would be more ironic than allowing a manipulated definition of “antisemitism” to shut down learning and inquiry, which are so central to the great Jewish traditions.
Absolutely not the same deal as Harvard. The Harvard president was 100% a plagiarist, a woman who should not hold an ivy league degree let alone be president of one. for those of us who have been adversely impacted by DEI policies, there is a disgusting wave of reverse discrimination permeating our country. Chosing the best on the basis of gender or skin color is wrong, in either direction.
As far as Magill goes, those calls at Penn were for genocide. The article cites the first amendment, but ignores the Brandenburg test. Since there is no direct evidence she was supporting imminent lawless action, she is barely clear from criminal or civil penalty. Wow, what an accomplishment for an Ivy president.
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
he has a job for now. many elite athletes do not get back to what they were before an achilles tear. it ususally ends up becoming a career ender. they rehab for 9-12 months and just never get back to what they were. they tend to be slower and less mobile.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
good point
Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013 Toronto I&II 2016 10C: 220xxx
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
he has a job for now. many elite athletes do not get back to what they were before an achilles tear. it ususally ends up becoming a career ender. they rehab for 9-12 months and just never get back to what they were. they tend to be slower and less mobile.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
I was referring more about him losing his spot on the McAfee show for the post season due to his outspoken opinions.
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F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 30,666
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
Truth. I'd argue that they both made the same number of Super Bowls, despite everyone wanting to kiss Wroggers' ass. (He was wayyyyyyyyy better than Kaep, I just like one and despise the other. )
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
Truth. I'd argue that they both made the same number of Super Bowls, despite everyone wanting to kiss Wroggers' ass. (He was wayyyyyyyyy better than Kaep, I just like one and despise the other. )
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
he has a job for now. many elite athletes do not get back to what they were before an achilles tear. it ususally ends up becoming a career ender. they rehab for 9-12 months and just never get back to what they were. they tend to be slower and less mobile.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
I was referring more about him losing his spot on the McAfee show for the post season due to his outspoken opinions.
That's why he is on that show.
Aaron isn't getting cancelled for anything he said, it's just not egregious enough.
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F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 30,666
edited January 12
He should get cancelled for ruining his team's season. 4 plays in his old ass pops, and everything they built around the supposed glory of the guy who loses in the playoffs went poof/alakazam.
Aaron Rodgers can suck it!*
*referencing his horrendous snap chat- which would have likely cancelled him had he sent it recently
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
he has a job for now. many elite athletes do not get back to what they were before an achilles tear. it ususally ends up becoming a career ender. they rehab for 9-12 months and just never get back to what they were. they tend to be slower and less mobile.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
I was referring more about him losing his spot on the McAfee show for the post season due to his outspoken opinions.
That's why he is on that show.
Aaron isn't getting cancelled for anything he said, it's just not egregious enough.
I saw it reported he wasn't going to be on the show again at least this year (which wouldn't surprise me considering ESPN), but I guess he was back on yesterday. IDK the deal, I watch Pat McAfee & ESPN as much as I watch Jimmy Kimmel & late night tv, which is not at all.
There's definitely a growing market for petulant douchebags in our society, that's my takeaway from all this.
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F Me In The Brain
this knows everybody from other commets Posts: 30,666
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
he has a job for now. many elite athletes do not get back to what they were before an achilles tear. it ususally ends up becoming a career ender. they rehab for 9-12 months and just never get back to what they were. they tend to be slower and less mobile.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
I was referring more about him losing his spot on the McAfee show for the post season due to his outspoken opinions.
That's why he is on that show.
Aaron isn't getting cancelled for anything he said, it's just not egregious enough.
I saw it reported he wasn't going to be on the show again at least this year (which wouldn't surprise me considering ESPN), but I guess he was back on yesterday. IDK the deal, I watch Pat McAfee & ESPN as much as I watch Jimmy Kimmel & late night tv, which is not at all.
There's definitely a growing market for petulant douchebags in our society, that's my takeaway from all this.
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
he has a job for now. many elite athletes do not get back to what they were before an achilles tear. it ususally ends up becoming a career ender. they rehab for 9-12 months and just never get back to what they were. they tend to be slower and less mobile.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
I was referring more about him losing his spot on the McAfee show for the post season due to his outspoken opinions.
That's why he is on that show.
Aaron isn't getting cancelled for anything he said, it's just not egregious enough.
I saw it reported he wasn't going to be on the show again at least this year (which wouldn't surprise me considering ESPN), but I guess he was back on yesterday. IDK the deal, I watch Pat McAfee & ESPN as much as I watch Jimmy Kimmel & late night tv, which is not at all.
There's definitely a growing market for petulant douchebags in our society, that's my takeaway from all this.
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
I don't know a whole lot about that, but I do know Aaron's said he's got medical advice from Rogan in the past. There's probably a little bit of truth to that, and he almost certainly said it to own libs, ironic as that may be.
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
I don't know a whole lot about that, but I do know Aaron's said he's got medical advice from Rogan in the past. There's probably a little bit of truth to that, and he almost certainly said it to own libs, ironic as that may be.
i think that is how he took ivermectin. rogan pushed that for a while.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
i am sure that hgh may help with some issues. the achilles is one of the most important and dense tendons in the body. aside from the patellar tendon and quad tendon. the gastroc and soleus combine into that tendon. besides pushing off when you walk and run, the soleus is also an antigravity muscle, meaning as long as you are standing, that muscle is firing to hold you upright against gravity. same with the quadriceps, abdominals, and erector muscles in the spine. the fact that they are antigravity muscles makes them take longer to heal, because they serve their primary function of moving a joint, and also constantly firing to keep you upright against gravity. hgh causes significant muscle hypertrophy, or growth, increasing strength, and in many cases the muscle overpowers the tendon, which taking hgh as a powerlifter or something can cause the muscle to rupture the tendon. in someone with a repair, rapid muscle growth and significantly increased muscle power can cause the tendon to rupture either above or below where the repair was. also muscle growth can cause decreased flexibility/range of motion which can put you at greater risk for other injuries.
stem cells there is promising research in some areas. but since it is not a proven modality it is not covered by insurance in a lot of cases. once it has the evidence to back up the theory, it will be more accepted as a viable treatment option. once that happens it will get fda approval, and once medicare agrees to cover it, the rest of the insurance companies will follow suit. professional athletes injured on the field are considered employees and are under workman's comp. the team covers the expense of their treatment. if a team has millions invested in a player they have an interest in getting that player better, so they are willing to pay the cost of treatments, even if the fda still considers them "experimental". that is why you or i probably would have to pay out of pocket if we wanted stem cells for certain issues.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
I don't know a whole lot about that, but I do know Aaron's said he's got medical advice from Rogan in the past. There's probably a little bit of truth to that, and he almost certainly said it to own libs, ironic as that may be.
i think that is how he took ivermectin. rogan pushed that for a while.
Ya, cause it worked for Rogan Silly…as the rotten brains of the world lost their minds and tried cancelling him making him that much more popular.
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,932
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
I don't know a whole lot about that, but I do know Aaron's said he's got medical advice from Rogan in the past. There's probably a little bit of truth to that, and he almost certainly said it to own libs, ironic as that may be.
i think that is how he took ivermectin. rogan pushed that for a while.
Ya, cause it worked for Rogan Silly…as the rotten brains of the world lost their minds and tried cancelling him making him that much more popular.
along with a host of other actual medically approved treatments his $$$$ allowed for.
and in reality likely completely unnecessary given , as I recall, he wasnt that sick to begin with.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
I don't know a whole lot about that, but I do know Aaron's said he's got medical advice from Rogan in the past. There's probably a little bit of truth to that, and he almost certainly said it to own libs, ironic as that may be.
i think that is how he took ivermectin. rogan pushed that for a while.
Ya, cause it worked for Rogan Silly…as the rotten brains of the world lost their minds and tried cancelling him making him that much more popular.
along with a host of other actual medically approved treatments his $$$$ allowed for.
and in reality likely completely unnecessary given , as I recall, he wasnt that sick to begin with.
yeah he took prednisone and a bunch of other prescriptions. but i am the silly one.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,932
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
So Aaron Rodgers is (finally) done on ESPN. This whole Jimmy Kimmel / Aaron Rodgers thing has been very interesting to me. They represent the two sides of the culture war of late. I think Rodgers is a blow hard and an idiot who shouldn't have a platform to be honest... but at the same time, I think the way Jimmy handled the issue wasn't great either.
rodgers needs to go away. i work in medical device industry. there is no way in hell he was coming back from that achilles tear this year. no matter what product was used to repair the tendon, we cannot speed up physiology and healing and return to elite levels of function in 5 months. its just not possible. so this, along with his superimmunity to covid, he can fuck off with.
Look into HGH and stem cells.
hgh is actually known to weaken tendons because the muscle gets too strong and the tendon fails. would not be advisable for him to take it.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
Yah, but Aaron Rodgers gets medical advice from Joe Rogan among others, so there's that.
A handful of Yankees took it too for recovery time. But i'm also curious as to the benefits of it if there are, other countries tend to think so.
i am sure that hgh may help with some issues. the achilles is one of the most important and dense tendons in the body. aside from the patellar tendon and quad tendon. the gastroc and soleus combine into that tendon. besides pushing off when you walk and run, the soleus is also an antigravity muscle, meaning as long as you are standing, that muscle is firing to hold you upright against gravity. same with the quadriceps, abdominals, and erector muscles in the spine. the fact that they are antigravity muscles makes them take longer to heal, because they serve their primary function of moving a joint, and also constantly firing to keep you upright against gravity. hgh causes significant muscle hypertrophy, or growth, increasing strength, and in many cases the muscle overpowers the tendon, which taking hgh as a powerlifter or something can cause the muscle to rupture the tendon. in someone with a repair, rapid muscle growth and significantly increased muscle power can cause the tendon to rupture either above or below where the repair was. also muscle growth can cause decreased flexibility/range of motion which can put you at greater risk for other injuries.
stem cells there is promising research in some areas. but since it is not a proven modality it is not covered by insurance in a lot of cases. once it has the evidence to back up the theory, it will be more accepted as a viable treatment option. once that happens it will get fda approval, and once medicare agrees to cover it, the rest of the insurance companies will follow suit. professional athletes injured on the field are considered employees and are under workman's comp. the team covers the expense of their treatment. if a team has millions invested in a player they have an interest in getting that player better, so they are willing to pay the cost of treatments, even if the fda still considers them "experimental". that is why you or i probably would have to pay out of pocket if we wanted stem cells for certain issues.
The players did pay out of pocket because baseball has banned the practice. There are many stories of people seeking stem cell treatment in other countries with great success. Supposedly the religious right has a problem using stem cells?
I read stories on it every now and again so it is a thing still.
Comments
Lets say you wanted to discuss Hitler or genocide of a people, then it can fall under free speech. That is where if you don't act on it that it should be ok. It is also at a college where it is higher learning and people should be able to test boundaries. Maybe she was trying to get to that? I don't know. No matter what she says now will matter.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
https://www.inquirer.com/opinion/magill-resigns-penn-free-speech-20231210.html
Liz Magill’s ouster at Penn will help the worst people take down free speech, higher ed
Critics celebrating the scalping of Penn's president won't stop there. Free speech, and college itself, is in grave danger.
by Will Bunch | ColumnistPublished Dec. 10, 2023, 11:44 a.m. ET
A band of raiders never stops at just one scalp. Just minutes after the University of Pennsylvania’s president Liz Magill pulled the plug on her stormy 17-month tenure, under intense pressure for her handling of antisemitism questions on Capitol Hill, her chief inquisitor — GOP Rep. Elise Stefanik of New York — was back on the battlefield calling for more.
“One down. Two to go,” a clearly ebullient Stefanik posted on X/Twitter, urging on her dream of an academic Saturday Night Massacre that would also take down the two college leaders who testified last week along with Magill — MIT’s Sally Kornbluth and Claudine Gay of Harvard, which, in a controversy with more ironies than a Jane Austen novel, happens to be Stefanik’s alma mater.
But what Stefanik promised on Saturday night, and what her allies are cheering on, goes well beyond a few high-profile resignations. She promised the current crisis — over what constitutes antisemitism on college campuses, and how administrators like Magill have been handling it — will lead to more congressional hearings on “all facets of their institutions’ negligent perpetration of antisemitism including administrative, faculty, and overall leadership and governance.”
This weekend, Magill’s resignation — urged on by some of Penn’s billionaire donors withholding massive donations, amid intense criticism from both political parties including the Biden White House — has been the lead national story everywhere. It’s bumped back coverage of Israel’s intensifying strikes on Gaza that have killed hundreds every day while taking out top Palestinian scholars and journalists, as well as holy sites. And it’s drowned out the Biden administration’s international pariah move of vetoing a U.N. cease-fire resolution backed by 13 out of 15 Security Council members. No wonder some folks prefer to keep the focus on a college campus 11,000 miles west of this carnage.
Magill’s legalistic, bloodless, deer-in-the-headlights response to incessant probing by Stefanik and other lawmakers was not good — not just because she blew a chance to condemn the never-ending horror of antisemitism, but also because it was a weak defense of free speech on campus. I’m not writing to express any regret over her departure. It seemed to me she governed Penn like a candle in the wind, wanting to defend academic freedom but then betraying those values, as when the university tried to ban a film presenting legitimate criticisms of Israel’s policies and then threatened to punish students for showing it anyway.
By ceding the high ground to demagogues like Stefanik, the fallout from this affair is more likely in the long run to hamper the fight against antisemitism than to bolster it, which is beyond unfortunate. Because no one can deny the scourge of antisemitism — especially not here in Pennsylvania, where a right-wing fanatic ginned up by immigration lies entered a Pittsburgh synagogue and murdered 11 Jews with the kind of AR-15 killing machine Stefanik and her Republican colleagues have no interest in holding hearings about, let alone outlawing.
And there’s no doubt that antisemitic incidents are on the rise — such reports increased 35% from 2021 to 2022 and then have spiked exponentially this year, as tensions over the war in the Middle East have boiled over during contentious protests here at home. Since the Hamas terror attack on Oct. 7 triggered the fighting, Islamophobia has also risen dramatically. College administrators have a responsibility to come down on anyone committing acts of violence, threatening actual violence, or undertaking vandalism, but that’s not really what the Stefanik-Magill showdown was about.
Stefanik’s relentless questioning didn’t focus on actions at Penn — like October’s antisemitic graffiti on campus — but on words, and especially protesters’ use of the term intifada, which marchers see as a call for liberation but Israel’s staunchest defenders claim is an invitation to pogrom. No doubt the term is controversial and offensive to some, but Magill was actually right to insist there’s a line between speech and action.
I agree with the tiny handful of commentators not joining the anti-Magill pile on. That includes the New York Times’ Michelle Goldberg, who wrote that Magill and her colleagues walked into a trap by allowing Stefanik to define common pro-Palestinian rhetoric as “antisemitism” and then demanding what Goldberg called “egregious violations of free speech.” And also New York Magazine’s Jonathan Chait, who wrote after Magill’s resignation that the college presidents were right to insist that schools regulate conduct but not words, stating that “what Stefanik was demanding was the wholesale ban on rhetoric and ideas that Jews find threatening, regardless of context.”
Shortly before Magill’s resignation, Jeremy C. Young, who directs the Freedom to Learn program at PEN America (full disclosure: I’m a member), told me that the literary free expression group is deeply concerned that the outcry over antisemitism is already driving a bevy of legislative proposals with alarming implications for free speech. He cited proposed laws that would require universities to be “neutral” on controversial issues, proposals to force schools to embrace the strictest definition of antisemitism that includes opposing the idea of Zionism, and bans on the most aggressive pro-Palestinian groups like the one recently laid down in Florida by Gov. Ron DeSantis.
Young stressed he isn’t disagreeing that campus antisemitism is a problem or that college presidents have made a mess of things, but he noted those driving the controversy are attacking other topics — diversity initiatives, tenure for professors, and what universities are teaching students. He said antisemitism is “being used as a pretext to take power over college decisions from neutral arbiters and hand it to politicians who want to enforce ideological control on campus. Silencing and chilling speech on campus cannot be the solution.”
» READ MORE: Is Gaza becoming Joe Biden’s Vietnam? | Will Bunch Newsletter
But that’s exactly the hoped-for solution from the avatars of America’s new McCarthyism, who are seizing on young people’s pro-Palestinian activism, and a handful of the most despicable acts, to foment a new kind of “Red Scare” that has both the nation’s extreme right and the billionaire winners of our class wars in sight of their real goal. That would be to cripple our colleges and universities as incubators of critical thinking that might cause the next generation to question their authority.
Indeed, Stefanik makes for an ideal 21st-century Joe McCarthy, since she has no sense of decency. It’s not just that her passion as an anti-antisemitism crusader was nowhere to be seen recently when her conservative allies were out in the schools banning books like The Diary of Anne Frank. Far worse, Stefanik, in 2022 campaign ads, seemed to be endorsing the racist “great replacement theory” that mass immigration is a liberal plot, using inflammatory rhetoric about a scheme to “overthrow our current electorate and create a permanent liberal majority in Washington.” It’s exactly that idea that animated the madman who shot up Pittsburgh’s Tree of Life synagogue.
How much of this is about antisemitism, and how much of this is about something else — such as the fact that the college presidents who testified on Capitol Hill don’t look like the 300 years of school leaders who came before them? Bill Ackman, billionaire hedge fund manager and deeply disgruntled Harvard alum and donor, said the quiet part out loud last week when he made the repulsive allegation in a tweet that his alma mater’s first Black president — a child of Haitian immigrants, an award-winning scholar — was only hired to satisfy diversity goals.
And the likes of Ackman, Stefanik, and their allies won’t stop at reversing a half-century of diversity on campus — not when their bigger strategic goal of weakening the already tottering American way of higher education suddenly seems within reach. Last week, Sen. J.D. Vance, the billionaire-backed Ohioan, tweeted that “if universities keep pushing racial hatred, euphemistically called DEI, we need to look at their funding.” In the swirling vortex that led to Magill’s resignation, these calls for financial retribution will accelerate — and students will suffer.
We know this because it’s happened before. Today’s campus unrest is a distinct echo of the Vietnam era, when students at many of the same universities now under attack also led massive protests against U.S. militarism, making their parents’ generation uneasy. In 1966, Ronald Reagan was elected governor of California by running against campus unrest, and he promised to impose tuition on its virtually free public universities, stating taxpayers “should not subsidize intellectual curiosity.” His philosophy inspired a generation of conservative lawmakers to privatize and devalue higher education, as tuition soared and student debt climbed to $1.75 trillion. Now, with public faith in universities at an all-time low, Reagan’s political heirs might finish the job.
The first step would be painfully familiar to anyone familiar with the anti-communist hysteria of the 1950s when McCarthyism reigned: a climate of fear and silence on college campuses. Here at Penn, the Wharton School’s Board of Advisors — the hedge fund-flavored panel that played an instrumental role in driving out Magill — has also proposed a new code that critics say goes too far in curbing campus free speech. Jonathan Friedman, PEN America’s director of free expression, blasted it as vague and “patently wrongheaded and could chill an ocean of speech on campus.”
In the current climate of fear and loathing, it won’t be the last such proposal.
With Magill’s departure, those who want to fight back for free speech face an increasingly uphill struggle. It’s easy for folks like the Biden White House to follow the path of least resistance and pretend that by slam-dunking Penn’s ex-president they are claiming the moral high ground, even as they sell Israel more tank shells like the one that was used to deliberately target and kill a Reuters journalist. It’s a lot harder to defend free expression knowing that the worst people will even try to brand you as an antisemite, just as those who once called out McCarthyism were stigmatized as “fellow travelers.”
Instead of jumping on the Magill scrum, let’s praise the courage of those defending our First Amendment rights. In a saga packed with irony, nothing would be more ironic than allowing a manipulated definition of “antisemitism” to shut down learning and inquiry, which are so central to the great Jewish traditions.
As far as Magill goes, those calls at Penn were for genocide. The article cites the first amendment, but ignores the Brandenburg test. Since there is no direct evidence she was supporting imminent lawless action, she is barely clear from criminal or civil penalty. Wow, what an accomplishment for an Ivy president.
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Aaron Rodgers still has his NFL job... somehow I don't see him getting blacklisted by the league like a certain other quarterback who also had outspoken opinions a few years back.
your average joe can get back to what they need to do to work and things if they have surgery or not. the outcomes are essentially the same. non op takes a little longer, operative has higher risks such as infection risk or risking the repair failing. but i do not think he will ever be the qb he was, especially at his advanced age. so he will end up being benched. that is my prediction. except the jets are terrible, so they may ride him out even with his decreased speed and mobility.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
Toronto I&II 2016
10C: 220xxx
(He was wayyyyyyyyy better than Kaep, I just like one and despise the other.
Aaron isn't getting cancelled for anything he said, it's just not egregious enough.
Aaron Rodgers can suck it!*
*referencing his horrendous snap chat- which would have likely cancelled him had he sent it recently
There's definitely a growing market for petulant douchebags in our society, that's my takeaway from all this.
the jury is out on stem cells and elite athletes with achilles ruptures and repairs. no long term data. there have been some studies that suggest it may help, but nothing conclusive.
i worked with an orthopedic surgeon for 10 years before going into sales.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
stem cells there is promising research in some areas. but since it is not a proven modality it is not covered by insurance in a lot of cases. once it has the evidence to back up the theory, it will be more accepted as a viable treatment option. once that happens it will get fda approval, and once medicare agrees to cover it, the rest of the insurance companies will follow suit. professional athletes injured on the field are considered employees and are under workman's comp. the team covers the expense of their treatment. if a team has millions invested in a player they have an interest in getting that player better, so they are willing to pay the cost of treatments, even if the fda still considers them "experimental". that is why you or i probably would have to pay out of pocket if we wanted stem cells for certain issues.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
I read stories on it every now and again so it is a thing still.