Unsolicited Opinion from a 27-year member

7777

Guys "...it's alright.  We all be thinking with our different brains."

mpedone

MG79478 said:

100 Pacer said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

I agree mostly, but not everyone had the means or were in situations that prevented them from maintaining their TC membership over the years. Please don't start with I've been a TC member longer so I'm a bigger/better fan. 

The fan club doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Having said that I think the majority have looked at seniority purely from a ticketing standpoint and the opportunity for better seats if seniority was maintained. That shouldn’t change. Seniority says nothing of one’s fandom level.

There is nothing more precious that we can give than our time.  Sure there are other measures of fandom, but to think that seniority (i.e. loyalty over time) says nothing about one's fandom level, is frankly ridiculous.

Some people have given the band plenty of their time, but maybe not their money, for various reasons. To quote the OP, "try to remember everyone leads a unique life with its own ups and downs".

I'm fine with seniority for seats. I can make excuses for why I let my membership lapse, but that's not important. What sticks in my craw are the people who think they deserve tickets over me because they were able to maintain their membership for longer, or joined when I was listening to Pearl Jam every day, but didn't even know the fan club existed. If that person want to tell me that they deserved 2nd row at Fenway over me, I won't argue. If they got shut out of Nashville, and try to tell me they deserve tickets more than me? Nope.

NewfieintheUSA

mpedone said:

MG79478 said:

100 Pacer said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

I agree mostly, but not everyone had the means or were in situations that prevented them from maintaining their TC membership over the years. Please don't start with I've been a TC member longer so I'm a bigger/better fan. 

The fan club doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Having said that I think the majority have looked at seniority purely from a ticketing standpoint and the opportunity for better seats if seniority was maintained. That shouldn’t change. Seniority says nothing of one’s fandom level.

There is nothing more precious that we can give than our time.  Sure there are other measures of fandom, but to think that seniority (i.e. loyalty over time) says nothing about one's fandom level, is frankly ridiculous.

Some people have given the band plenty of their time, but maybe not their money, for various reasons. To quote the OP, "try to remember everyone leads a unique life with its own ups and downs".

I'm fine with seniority for seats. I can make excuses for why I let my membership lapse, but that's not important. What sticks in my craw are the people who think they deserve tickets over me because they were able to maintain their membership for longer, or joined when I was listening to Pearl Jam every day, but didn't even know the fan club existed. If that person want to tell me that they deserved 2nd row at Fenway over me, I won't argue. If they got shut out of Nashville, and try to tell me they deserve tickets more than me? Nope.

This exactly!!!!

Merkin Baller

turbomav said:

I agree with most of what you say here but I feel like your 2nd and 4th points contradict one another. I have been a fan since I first heard Pearl Jam on the radio in 91 and I was at the first show in my area at the Palladium that year. I have always followed the band and everyone I know thinks I am a bit crazy with my level of commitment. I packed up my family and followed them as far as I could in 2018 and I am doing it again this summer in Europe. It has only been recently that I have had the means to travel and see shows like I am now. I only signed up for the fan club in 2018 after many years of my wife telling me I should. In all reality, I didn't realize the benefits of being in the fan club nor did I see the need to be in the fan club to justify my personal feelings about Pearl Jam and their music. I do empathize with those who did not get tickets as well and I understand their frustrations with being in the fan club and NOT getting tickets. I will say this, I absolutely appreciate the Ten Club and what they do for us now. Just the fact that we get access to tickets before others is amazing in it's own right. For most shows I see now, I end up paying a hefty price in the aftermarket. Although the system is not perfect, at least we have a chance at tickets we otherwise would not. The seniority issue has valid points on both sides. People who have supported the club for longer do deserve the seniority they have earned. The challenge is when others who were unaware of the benefits all along or did not have the means to support suffer as a result. Either way, we all walk our own journey and we are all hear because we love the band....and that is what matters most. This is an awesome community and I can't wait to run into many of you at some shows this year!

10C has been around for decades.

If an individual doesn't take the time to make themselves aware of the benefits, how is this in any way a challenge for the 10C after the fact? Or anyone else for that matter?

To the same point, if an individual can't afford the dues, and missed out on years of being a member, that's life... but I still fail to see how that should be a challenge for 10C or anyone else.

IlliniGuy76

NewfieintheUSA said:

mpedone said:

MG79478 said:

100 Pacer said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

I agree mostly, but not everyone had the means or were in situations that prevented them from maintaining their TC membership over the years. Please don't start with I've been a TC member longer so I'm a bigger/better fan. 

The fan club doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Having said that I think the majority have looked at seniority purely from a ticketing standpoint and the opportunity for better seats if seniority was maintained. That shouldn’t change. Seniority says nothing of one’s fandom level.

There is nothing more precious that we can give than our time.  Sure there are other measures of fandom, but to think that seniority (i.e. loyalty over time) says nothing about one's fandom level, is frankly ridiculous.

Some people have given the band plenty of their time, but maybe not their money, for various reasons. To quote the OP, "try to remember everyone leads a unique life with its own ups and downs".

I'm fine with seniority for seats. I can make excuses for why I let my membership lapse, but that's not important. What sticks in my craw are the people who think they deserve tickets over me because they were able to maintain their membership for longer, or joined when I was listening to Pearl Jam every day, but didn't even know the fan club existed. If that person want to tell me that they deserved 2nd row at Fenway over me, I won't argue. If they got shut out of Nashville, and try to tell me they deserve tickets more than me? Nope.

This exactly!!!!

The only aspect of seniority that should be in play is seat assignment - anything more is simply PJ fan hubris.

100 Pacer

IlliniGuy76 said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

mpedone said:

MG79478 said:

100 Pacer said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

I agree mostly, but not everyone had the means or were in situations that prevented them from maintaining their TC membership over the years. Please don't start with I've been a TC member longer so I'm a bigger/better fan. 

The fan club doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Having said that I think the majority have looked at seniority purely from a ticketing standpoint and the opportunity for better seats if seniority was maintained. That shouldn’t change. Seniority says nothing of one’s fandom level.

There is nothing more precious that we can give than our time.  Sure there are other measures of fandom, but to think that seniority (i.e. loyalty over time) says nothing about one's fandom level, is frankly ridiculous.

Some people have given the band plenty of their time, but maybe not their money, for various reasons. To quote the OP, "try to remember everyone leads a unique life with its own ups and downs".

I'm fine with seniority for seats. I can make excuses for why I let my membership lapse, but that's not important. What sticks in my craw are the people who think they deserve tickets over me because they were able to maintain their membership for longer, or joined when I was listening to Pearl Jam every day, but didn't even know the fan club existed. If that person want to tell me that they deserved 2nd row at Fenway over me, I won't argue. If they got shut out of Nashville, and try to tell me they deserve tickets more than me? Nope.

This exactly!!!!

The only aspect of seniority that should be in play is seat assignment - anything more is simply PJ fan hubris.

Amen.

BennyLaRue

Quality post.

Feelings aside for a minute: the way it is now is good and balanced from a business standpoint. Were 10C to reward seniority more than it already does, like some are asking for, it would make it tough to grow the fan base. And it's important to all 10C members that membership continues to grow to at least offset the departures, otherwise, 10C membership fees would have to increase regularly to cover the increasing costs to run the thing the way it is today.

ForceofNature101

IlliniGuy76 said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

mpedone said:

MG79478 said:

100 Pacer said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

I agree mostly, but not everyone had the means or were in situations that prevented them from maintaining their TC membership over the years. Please don't start with I've been a TC member longer so I'm a bigger/better fan. 

The fan club doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Having said that I think the majority have looked at seniority purely from a ticketing standpoint and the opportunity for better seats if seniority was maintained. That shouldn’t change. Seniority says nothing of one’s fandom level.

There is nothing more precious that we can give than our time.  Sure there are other measures of fandom, but to think that seniority (i.e. loyalty over time) says nothing about one's fandom level, is frankly ridiculous.

Some people have given the band plenty of their time, but maybe not their money, for various reasons. To quote the OP, "try to remember everyone leads a unique life with its own ups and downs".

I'm fine with seniority for seats. I can make excuses for why I let my membership lapse, but that's not important. What sticks in my craw are the people who think they deserve tickets over me because they were able to maintain their membership for longer, or joined when I was listening to Pearl Jam every day, but didn't even know the fan club existed. If that person want to tell me that they deserved 2nd row at Fenway over me, I won't argue. If they got shut out of Nashville, and try to tell me they deserve tickets more than me? Nope.

This exactly!!!!

The only aspect of seniority that should be in play is seat assignment - anything more is simply PJ fan hubris.

Agreed 100 percent

mace1229

Am I the only one who read this and did the math over and over thinking how can a 27 year old join in 1993? Then you have that o duh moment. Or was it just me?

Anyway, I can answer one question. The 10c bothers with tickets because they would probably lose 90% of memberships if they didnt.

IlliniGuy76

mace1229 said:

Am I the only one who read this and did the math over and over thinking how can a 27 year old join in 1993? Then you have that o duh moment. Or was it just me?

Anyway, I can answer one question. The 10c bothers with tickets because they would probably lose 90% of memberships if they didnt.

The ONLY reason they do - bingo

Darth Lizard King

!!

Darth Lizard King

Then how would you quantify fandom, if not for the amount of time someone has devoted to band loyalty? Seems like pretty much the longer you have been in the 10 Club, the bigger fan you are.

Darth Lizard King

Merkin Baller said:

turbomav said:

I agree with most of what you say here but I feel like your 2nd and 4th points contradict one another. I have been a fan since I first heard Pearl Jam on the radio in 91 and I was at the first show in my area at the Palladium that year. I have always followed the band and everyone I know thinks I am a bit crazy with my level of commitment. I packed up my family and followed them as far as I could in 2018 and I am doing it again this summer in Europe. It has only been recently that I have had the means to travel and see shows like I am now. I only signed up for the fan club in 2018 after many years of my wife telling me I should. In all reality, I didn't realize the benefits of being in the fan club nor did I see the need to be in the fan club to justify my personal feelings about Pearl Jam and their music. I do empathize with those who did not get tickets as well and I understand their frustrations with being in the fan club and NOT getting tickets. I will say this, I absolutely appreciate the Ten Club and what they do for us now. Just the fact that we get access to tickets before others is amazing in it's own right. For most shows I see now, I end up paying a hefty price in the aftermarket. Although the system is not perfect, at least we have a chance at tickets we otherwise would not. The seniority issue has valid points on both sides. People who have supported the club for longer do deserve the seniority they have earned. The challenge is when others who were unaware of the benefits all along or did not have the means to support suffer as a result. Either way, we all walk our own journey and we are all hear because we love the band....and that is what matters most. This is an awesome community and I can't wait to run into many of you at some shows this year!

10C has been around for decades.

If an individual doesn't take the time to make themselves aware of the benefits, how is this in any way a challenge for the 10C after the fact? Or anyone else for that matter?

To the same point, if an individual can't afford the dues, and missed out on years of being a member, that's life... but I still fail to see how that should be a challenge for 10C or anyone else.

This x 1000, for the win, long three from the wing, and splash. Oh, how I loathe the "b...b...but I didn't know - how was I supposed to know?" My good God. 

TN49724

Darth Lizard King said:

Then how would you quantify fandom, if not for the amount of time someone has devoted to band loyalty? Seems like pretty much the longer you have been in the 10 Club, the bigger fan you are.

Official equation for quantifying fandom (not really an equation, but a simple reference):

X>Y

X=Me, always constant
Y=You, varies by person and situation

very simple

blackhawks

As an ‘old’ fan (91 at CY Stevens in Ames IA row 4) and an older member here I think the seniority thing has run its course.  Sorry to those that disagree but it is a huge pain I bet selecting seats based on that.  And to automatically penalize someone who is younger and a fan seems odd just because they were born in a different time.  Perhaps there will be a better way in the future as they wind their career down.  Who knows.  Maybe I am softer because I saw them up front in their prime and traveling around a bunch doesn’t fit my life anymore....rather do other stuff quite frankly.  And I don’t see the need to see them 10-20 times per tour (never have understood that frankly).  But I love seeing them once or twice per tour if it fits my schedule.  I guess I would like to see others get the chance rather than seniority being the sole reason.

Flame away!

hedonist

blackhawks said:

As an ‘old’ fan (91 at CY Stevens in Ames IA row 4) and an older member here I think the seniority thing has run its course.  Sorry to those that disagree but it is a huge pain I bet selecting seats based on that.  And to automatically penalize someone who is younger and a fan seems odd just because they were born in a different time.  Perhaps there will be a better way in the future as they wind their career down.  Who knows.  Maybe I am softer because I saw them up front in their prime and traveling around a bunch doesn’t fit my life anymore....rather do other stuff quite frankly.  And I don’t see the need to see them 10-20 times per tour (never have understood that frankly).  But I love seeing them once or twice per tour if it fits my schedule.  I guess I would like to see others get the chance rather than seniority being the sole reason.

Flame away!

Not a flame, but the seniority applies to seat location only. I’m pretty sure there’s no conspiracy to withhold tickets to some based on their age

hedonist

And I’ll add one thing: it’s not for you or anyone to declare what someone else needs or does. 

I’ve been to two shows, last one in 2003, and that has zero impact on my happiness that others may get more under their belt. 

Mikemzl91

Darth Lizard King said:

Then how would you quantify fandom, if not for the amount of time someone has devoted to band loyalty? Seems like pretty much the longer you have been in the 10 Club, the bigger fan you are.

I've only been in this club for a couple of years now and the Chili Peppers are still my favorite band. Theres plenty of people with higher number that are bigger fans then me. 

But I do like the rest of your original post. 
Good stuff

MG79478

mpedone said:

MG79478 said:

100 Pacer said:

NewfieintheUSA said:

I agree mostly, but not everyone had the means or were in situations that prevented them from maintaining their TC membership over the years. Please don't start with I've been a TC member longer so I'm a bigger/better fan. 

The fan club doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Having said that I think the majority have looked at seniority purely from a ticketing standpoint and the opportunity for better seats if seniority was maintained. That shouldn’t change. Seniority says nothing of one’s fandom level.

There is nothing more precious that we can give than our time.  Sure there are other measures of fandom, but to think that seniority (i.e. loyalty over time) says nothing about one's fandom level, is frankly ridiculous.

Some people have given the band plenty of their time, but maybe not their money, for various reasons. To quote the OP, "try to remember everyone leads a unique life with its own ups and downs".

I'm fine with seniority for seats. I can make excuses for why I let my membership lapse, but that's not important. What sticks in my craw are the people who think they deserve tickets over me because they were able to maintain their membership for longer, or joined when I was listening to Pearl Jam every day, but didn't even know the fan club existed. If that person want to tell me that they deserved 2nd row at Fenway over me, I won't argue. If they got shut out of Nashville, and try to tell me they deserve tickets more than me? Nope.

Everyone does lead a unique life, some prioritized 10C, some did not.  For those that made 10C a priority, they can prove their loyalty and support, those who did not prioritize 10C can not. There is no "proof of support" form you can file.   It doesn't matter if you say you've listened to Vitology non-stop on repeat for the last 25 years, we'd just have to take your word for it.

MG79478

blackhawks said:

As an ‘old’ fan (91 at CY Stevens in Ames IA row 4) and an older member here I think the seniority thing has run its course.  Sorry to those that disagree but it is a huge pain I bet selecting seats based on that.  And to automatically penalize someone who is younger and a fan seems odd just because they were born in a different time.  Perhaps there will be a better way in the future as they wind their career down.  Who knows.  Maybe I am softer because I saw them up front in their prime and traveling around a bunch doesn’t fit my life anymore....rather do other stuff quite frankly.  And I don’t see the need to see them 10-20 times per tour (never have understood that frankly).  But I love seeing them once or twice per tour if it fits my schedule.  I guess I would like to see others get the chance rather than seniority being the sole reason.

Flame away!

You can start a trend... let your number lapse, sign up for a new one. I bet 10C would even just assign you a new number if you ask. You'd still get equal access to tickets, but it would help every other member get better seats. Post all the screen shots of your old number and your new one to inspire others to do the same.  We could call it Blackhawking, or something in your honor.