Jeffrey Epstein and Friends

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  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Bad day for Clinton, Prince Andrew, and especially Alan Dershowitz with these Epstein documents being released. 

    Some other people named in flight logs include Al Gore, Tom Hanks, Naomi Campbell, and Simpsons creator Matt Groenig. 
    Where is the info on the flight logs? I have just read/skimmed four articles (NYT, NPR, Guardian and another) and each of them only focuses on Giuffre's statements, which don't appear to include anything new. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Ledbetterman10
    Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,994
    edited July 2020
    oftenreading said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Bad day for Clinton, Prince Andrew, and especially Alan Dershowitz with these Epstein documents being released. 

    Some other people named in flight logs include Al Gore, Tom Hanks, Naomi Campbell, and Simpsons creator Matt Groenig. 
    Where is the info on the flight logs? I have just read/skimmed four articles (NYT, NPR, Guardian and another) and each of them only focuses on Giuffre's statements, which don't appear to include anything new. 
    Here's the flight logs, but I have to admit I don't know how to read it or get anything from it. 
    https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/1507315/epstein-flight-manifests.pdf

    But take the other names with a grain of salt because I'm seeing now that a fact-check showed that Tom Hanks wasn't on it, so Gore, Campbell, and Groening might be false too for all I know...
    https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-tom-hanks-not-on-epstein-pl-idUSKCN24F20V

    Edit: Well as for Groening, an accuser says she did massage his feet on Epstein's plane....
    https://truepundit.com/accuser-says-she-massaged-simpsons-creator-matt-groenings-feet-on-epsteins-private-plane/

    Post edited by Ledbetterman10 on
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024: Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

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  • Ledbetterman10
    Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,994
    dignin said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    dignin said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Bad day for Clinton, Prince Andrew, and especially Alan Dershowitz with these Epstein documents being released. 

    Some other people named in flight logs include Al Gore, Tom Hanks, Naomi Campbell, and Simpsons creator Matt Groenig. 
    What do we now know about Dershowitz that we didn't know? Haven't been keeping up.
    I don't think it's necessarily "new" because I think the alleged victim has gone on record before, but the documents suggest that "Jane Doe #3" was a sex slave on the island from 1999 through 2002, and that Dershowitz is one of the people she was trafficked to. 
    Thanks. Yeah, I had already heard that. Nice to see it getting a little more light today. The guy is a creep.
    One thing that came to light today (at least it's new to me) is a 1997 op-ed he wrote saying that satutory rape is "outdated." He's been defending it suggesting he was arguing in a legal sense, not a morality sense...

    https://meaww.com/alan-dershowitz-argued-op-ed-statutory-rape-outdated-concept-age-of-consent-should-be-lowered-to-15
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024: Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • Ledbetterman10
    Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,994
    edited July 2020
    Really, the only revelation today seems to be testimony from the girl that we've seen in the picture with Prince Andrew saying that Clinton was on the island with two young girls. 

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/jeffrey-epstein-and-ghislaine-maxwell-accuser-virginia-giuffre-says-bill-clinton-partied-on-pedophile-island
    Post edited by Ledbetterman10 on
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024: Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    oftenreading said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Bad day for Clinton, Prince Andrew, and especially Alan Dershowitz with these Epstein documents being released. 

    Some other people named in flight logs include Al Gore, Tom Hanks, Naomi Campbell, and Simpsons creator Matt Groenig. 
    Where is the info on the flight logs? I have just read/skimmed four articles (NYT, NPR, Guardian and another) and each of them only focuses on Giuffre's statements, which don't appear to include anything new. 
    Here's the flight logs, but I have to admit I don't know how to read it or get anything from it. 
    https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/1507315/epstein-flight-manifests.pdf

    But take the other names with a grain of salt because I'm seeing now that a fact-check showed that Tom Hanks wasn't on it, so Gore, Campbell, and Groening might be false too for all I know...
    https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-tom-hanks-not-on-epstein-pl-idUSKCN24F20V

    Edit: Well as for Groening, an accuser says she did massage his feet on Epstein's plane....
    https://truepundit.com/accuser-says-she-massaged-simpsons-creator-matt-groenings-feet-on-epsteins-private-plane/

    Thanks. I skimmed through a few pages. There is a box in the logs that seems to be for passenger list. Those on frequently are identified by initial - JE, presumably Epstein, GM, presumably Maxwell. “Bill Clinton, 4 Secret Service” is clearly spelled out just a few pages in. A few female names like “Jessica”. 

    I didn’t wade through much further. 

    Now, are these logs accurate? Who knows. I don’t know their source. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Ledbetterman10
    Ledbetterman10 Posts: 16,994
    edited July 2020
    oftenreading said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    oftenreading said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Bad day for Clinton, Prince Andrew, and especially Alan Dershowitz with these Epstein documents being released. 

    Some other people named in flight logs include Al Gore, Tom Hanks, Naomi Campbell, and Simpsons creator Matt Groenig. 
    Where is the info on the flight logs? I have just read/skimmed four articles (NYT, NPR, Guardian and another) and each of them only focuses on Giuffre's statements, which don't appear to include anything new. 
    Here's the flight logs, but I have to admit I don't know how to read it or get anything from it. 
    https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/1507315/epstein-flight-manifests.pdf

    But take the other names with a grain of salt because I'm seeing now that a fact-check showed that Tom Hanks wasn't on it, so Gore, Campbell, and Groening might be false too for all I know...
    https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-tom-hanks-not-on-epstein-pl-idUSKCN24F20V

    Edit: Well as for Groening, an accuser says she did massage his feet on Epstein's plane....
    https://truepundit.com/accuser-says-she-massaged-simpsons-creator-matt-groenings-feet-on-epsteins-private-plane/

    Thanks. I skimmed through a few pages. There is a box in the logs that seems to be for passenger list. Those on frequently are identified by initial - JE, presumably Epstein, GM, presumably Maxwell. “Bill Clinton, 4 Secret Service” is clearly spelled out just a few pages in. A few female names like “Jessica”. 

    I didn’t wade through much further. 

    Now, are these logs accurate? Who knows. I don’t know their source. 
    Exactly. There's no way for me to be sure. Like all news stories these days, you just have to take in what's available and then wade through the bullshit. Even in my post above, I had to edit because a fact-checking site said Tom Hanks wasn't on the flight, so then I questioned it all, and I had to dig deeper to find testimony that Matt Groening was on a flight. 
    Post edited by Ledbetterman10 on
    2000: Camden 1, 2003: Philly, State College, Camden 1, MSG 2, Hershey, 2004: Reading, 2005: Philly, 2006: Camden 1, 2, East Rutherford 1, 2007: Lollapalooza, 2008: Camden 1, Washington D.C., MSG 1, 2, 2009: Philly 1, 2, 3, 4, 2010: Bristol, MSG 2, 2011: PJ20 1, 2, 2012: Made In America, 2013: Brooklyn 2, Philly 2, 2014: Denver, 2015: Global Citizen Festival, 2016: Philly 2, Fenway 1, 2018: Fenway 1, 2, 2021: Sea. Hear. Now. 2022: Camden, 2024: Philly 2, 2025: Pittsburgh 1

    Pearl Jam bootlegs:
    http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    dignin said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    dignin said:
    Ledbetterman10 said:
    Bad day for Clinton, Prince Andrew, and especially Alan Dershowitz with these Epstein documents being released. 

    Some other people named in flight logs include Al Gore, Tom Hanks, Naomi Campbell, and Simpsons creator Matt Groenig. 
    What do we now know about Dershowitz that we didn't know? Haven't been keeping up.
    I don't think it's necessarily "new" because I think the alleged victim has gone on record before, but the documents suggest that "Jane Doe #3" was a sex slave on the island from 1999 through 2002, and that Dershowitz is one of the people she was trafficked to. 
    Thanks. Yeah, I had already heard that. Nice to see it getting a little more light today. The guy is a creep.
    One thing that came to light today (at least it's new to me) is a 1997 op-ed he wrote saying that satutory rape is "outdated." He's been defending it suggesting he was arguing in a legal sense, not a morality sense...

    https://meaww.com/alan-dershowitz-argued-op-ed-statutory-rape-outdated-concept-age-of-consent-should-be-lowered-to-15
    Ugh.
  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,610
    Dershowitz has been a jackass for some time.  Maybe we're getting some insight on why.

    It's really sad how prevalent pedophilia and statutory rape are and how so many large groups of adults can know about it and look the other way.
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  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    OnWis97 said:
    Dershowitz has been a jackass for some time.  Maybe we're getting some insight on why.

    It's really sad how prevalent pedophilia and statutory rape are and how so many large groups of adults can know about it and look the other way.
    Been like that for years. And will continue as such, because some people are simply sick fucks protected by other sick fucks. 
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,552
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
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  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,695
    It’s just disgusting I hope justice gets served! 
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
    Regardless of the appropriate terminology, the bottom line for me is that he and his cohorts like to control and fuck young girls. 
  • OnWis97
    OnWis97 St. Paul, MN Posts: 5,610
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
    That’s why I added statutory to my statement. I know creep dudes having sex wit 17 year olds are not pedophiles...though I didn’t know these terms.  At any rate hopping a plane to go have sex with anyone not old enough to consent is messed up.  And the nearly invariable tendency for large groups to to enable it is unreal.
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  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,552
    hedonist said:
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
    Regardless of the appropriate terminology, the bottom line for me is that he and his cohorts like to control and fuck young girls. 
    absolutely. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,552
    OnWis97 said:
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
    That’s why I added statutory to my statement. I know creep dudes having sex wit 17 year olds are not pedophiles...though I didn’t know these terms.  At any rate hopping a plane to go have sex with anyone not old enough to consent is messed up.  And the nearly invariable tendency for large groups to to enable it is unreal.
    i've always found these arbitrary age cutoffs a bit weird. i mean, obviously you have to draw the line somewhere. but it's just odd that one day the guy could go to prison for life, and literally the next day everything is normal. that's pretty fucked up. 

    i find it fucked up that any person would want to have relations with anyone that much younger than they are. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    OnWis97 said:
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
    That’s why I added statutory to my statement. I know creep dudes having sex wit 17 year olds are not pedophiles...though I didn’t know these terms.  At any rate hopping a plane to go have sex with anyone not old enough to consent is messed up.  And the nearly invariable tendency for large groups to to enable it is unreal.
    i've always found these arbitrary age cutoffs a bit weird. i mean, obviously you have to draw the line somewhere. but it's just odd that one day the guy could go to prison for life, and literally the next day everything is normal. that's pretty fucked up. 

    i find it fucked up that any person would want to have relations with anyone that much younger than they are. 
    Well, it happens with some adult couples. It’s the ones in their 20s, 30s, 40s, etc. who
    apply that same age difference with young ones. 
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 44,560
    edited August 2020
    so these minors can consent to being taken out of the country and not be considered of age to consent to sex? I mean "private island" who has jurisdiction?

    I think in the US taking a minor out of state is kidnapping. Seems so from some of the stories I have read concerning sex trafficking. Cant see how this is different.
    Post edited by mickeyrat on
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  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,552
    hedonist said:
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    OnWis97 said:
    HughFreakingDillon said:
    not trying to be a dick, but this isn't pedophilia. it's hebephilia (ages 11-14) or ephebophilia (15-19). i know people just use "pedo" as the universal term, but just in case anyone wants to know the actual term for being attracted to pubescent kids. 
    That’s why I added statutory to my statement. I know creep dudes having sex wit 17 year olds are not pedophiles...though I didn’t know these terms.  At any rate hopping a plane to go have sex with anyone not old enough to consent is messed up.  And the nearly invariable tendency for large groups to to enable it is unreal.
    i've always found these arbitrary age cutoffs a bit weird. i mean, obviously you have to draw the line somewhere. but it's just odd that one day the guy could go to prison for life, and literally the next day everything is normal. that's pretty fucked up. 

    i find it fucked up that any person would want to have relations with anyone that much younger than they are. 
    Well, it happens with some adult couples. It’s the ones in their 20s, 30s, 40s, etc. who
    apply that same age difference with young ones. 
    yes, sorry, that's what i mean. I don't mean a 20 or 30 year age difference applied unilaterally. a 15-45 couple obviously isn't the same as a 45-75 couple. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,391
    Team Trump Treason wishing her well, again. Such compassion.

    https://apple.news/AXp8_pYhbR7ya0sQpOnnL6Q

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  • tempo_n_groove
    tempo_n_groove Posts: 41,500
    I don't think anyone posted this.  The web gets thicker...

    https://fortune.com/2020/07/20/epstein-trial-judges-son-killed-hitman-deutsche-bank-esther-salas/

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