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Are you in favor of giving illegal immigrants free health care?

brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
in A Moving Train
Here's an anonymous poll to see how we think on this subject.  I don't like labels, and liberal to moderate to conservative is not simply black, grey and white so just go with one of the three because we cant have endless categories.  This poll was inspired by what mrussel1 said in the Dem Candidates thread:  "I mean, here we are, the actual voting Democrats on the board of a liberal band like PJ.com, and we all seem to be in shock... I'm very, very worried because these candidates are not representing mainstream views."

Let's see if this poll verifies that notion.  (I'm guessing it will, but vote honestly because this is an anonymous poll.)

Again, the question is "Are you in favor of giving illegal immigrants free health care."

“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













Are you in favor of giving illegal immigrants free health care? 39 votes

Yes, and I am conservative
0% 0 votes
Yes, and I am moderate
2% 1 vote
Yes, and I am liberal
10% 4 votes
No, and I am conservative
15% 6 votes
No, and I am moderate
51% 20 votes
No, and I am liberal
20% 8 votes
«1345

Comments

  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    I will not vote (not American)...but in Ontario, we held provincial election a year ago...the conservatives and NDP were neck in neck at one point...and the NDP wanted to make Ontario a sanctuary province...the conservatives won easily.

    I live across from Detroit...no fucking way did I want freeloading Americans showing up at our hospitals looking for freebies...fuck that shit.  That is why we have photo ID health cards...


    Give Peas A Chance…
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    I'll check in here this evening and see if we get more than one vote, lol.  Catch you all later.  :smile:
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    brianlux said:
    I'll check in here this evening and see if we get more than one vote, lol.  Catch you all later.  :smile:
    I am not trying to derail your thread...just giving some personal insight.  
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,577
    define the concept please....
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,577
    Meltdown99 said:
    I will not vote (not American)...but in Ontario, we held provincial election a year ago...the conservatives and NDP were neck in neck at one point...and the NDP wanted to make Ontario a sanctuary province...the conservatives won easily.

    I live across from Detroit...no fucking way did I want freeloading Americans showing up at our hospitals looking for freebies...fuck that shit.  That is why we have photo ID health cards...


    but visitors ARE seen under your system if neccessary, right?
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,520
    Americas relationship with illegal immigrants is pretty Strange. Looking from Where I am looking. 
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    mickeyrat said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    I will not vote (not American)...but in Ontario, we held provincial election a year ago...the conservatives and NDP were neck in neck at one point...and the NDP wanted to make Ontario a sanctuary province...the conservatives won easily.

    I live across from Detroit...no fucking way did I want freeloading Americans showing up at our hospitals looking for freebies...fuck that shit.  That is why we have photo ID health cards...


    but visitors ARE seen under your system if neccessary, right?
    I do not believe we would ever turn away a medical emergency.  But our hospitals have ATM machines, debit/credit card machines...so they do expect payment if you do not have a valid health card...but I absolutely am convinced that anyone who shows up will be looked at...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 30,520
    Meltdown99 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    I will not vote (not American)...but in Ontario, we held provincial election a year ago...the conservatives and NDP were neck in neck at one point...and the NDP wanted to make Ontario a sanctuary province...the conservatives won easily.

    I live across from Detroit...no fucking way did I want freeloading Americans showing up at our hospitals looking for freebies...fuck that shit.  That is why we have photo ID health cards...


    but visitors ARE seen under your system if neccessary, right?
    I do not believe we would ever turn away a medical emergency.  But our hospitals have ATM machines, debit/credit card machines...so they do expect payment if you do not have a valid health card...but I absolutely am convinced that anyone who shows up will be looked at...
    Dont you have a deal with other nations about the care?

    I think that is How European countries do it atleast 
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    Canadians need coverage if they travel to the US, just in case...

    I never goto the US without out of province health care coverage.  Better to be safe than a huge medical bill.
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • vaggar99vaggar99 Posts: 3,427
    i favor all things illegal.
  • Jason PJason P Posts: 19,138
    I don't think any of the candidates truly have it on their agenda to follow this promise up.  It is just pandering ... although usually you pander to a group that can vote for you ... doesn't seem like a very wise strategy, but no candidate wants to get kicked out of the circle in the first debate.  This will come back to haunt the eventual democratic nomination (depending on what heat they first squared off in ... technically half of them can deny this promise)
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 Posts: 28,495
    This could be one of the dumbest ideas ever.  Trump will crush this election if candidates press this issue. 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    mcgruff10 said:
    This could be one of the dumbest ideas ever.  Trump will crush this election if candidates press this issue. 
    Sticking hot pokers in your eyes might be dumber, but otherwise, I agree!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    So far, the results are pretty clear hear.  But lets give it a few days and see. 

    So far no conservatives have voted?  Remember, it's an anonymous poll.  No need to hesitate to vote.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,671
    I really, really, really hope everyone was thinking about emergency care when they raised their hands, not fixing your bum elbow.  The whole debate was just an unmitigated disaster for all Democrats.  
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    I will not vote (not American)...but in Ontario, we held provincial election a year ago...the conservatives and NDP were neck in neck at one point...and the NDP wanted to make Ontario a sanctuary province...the conservatives won easily.

    I live across from Detroit...no fucking way did I want freeloading Americans showing up at our hospitals looking for freebies...fuck that shit.  That is why we have photo ID health cards...


    but visitors ARE seen under your system if neccessary, right?
    I do not believe we would ever turn away a medical emergency.  But our hospitals have ATM machines, debit/credit card machines...so they do expect payment if you do not have a valid health card...but I absolutely am convinced that anyone who shows up will be looked at...
    Dont you have a deal with other nations about the care?

    I think that is How European countries do it atleast 
    LOL.  No, we do not.  We are even advised to get extra insurance when we go to another province in Canada...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    mrussel1 said:
    I really, really, really hope everyone was thinking about emergency care when they raised their hands, not fixing your bum elbow.  The whole debate was just an unmitigated disaster for all Democrats.  
    I kinda think that is what they meant, but someone should have asked for clarity on the question...cats out of the bag now...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    Meltdown99 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    I really, really, really hope everyone was thinking about emergency care when they raised their hands, not fixing your bum elbow.  The whole debate was just an unmitigated disaster for all Democrats.  
    I kinda think that is what they meant, but someone should have asked for clarity on the question...cats out of the bag now...
    If that was the case, clarification would have helped hugely.  Maybe someone working for DNC will think of that.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    brianlux said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    I really, really, really hope everyone was thinking about emergency care when they raised their hands, not fixing your bum elbow.  The whole debate was just an unmitigated disaster for all Democrats.  
    I kinda think that is what they meant, but someone should have asked for clarity on the question...cats out of the bag now...
    If that was the case, clarification would have helped hugely.  Maybe someone working for DNC will think of that.
    I am surprised the candidates have not clarified...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    I kinda wish there were no categories, politics, etc...like a simple "yes or no" or "other", etc.  Lots of shit runs the gamut, you know?
      
    "No, and I am a thinking person."  

    Anyway, I can't imagine handing out free health care if the rest of us slobs have to (usually) pay through the nose for it straight, or via insurance.

    And yes, mrussel, I agree with you.  Necessary and / or urgent care, of course.
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    hedonist said:
    I kinda wish there were no categories, politics, etc...like a simple "yes or no" or "other", etc.  Lots of shit runs the gamut, you know?
      
    "No, and I am a thinking person."  

    Anyway, I can't imagine handing out free health care if the rest of us slobs have to (usually) pay through the nose for it straight, or via insurance.

    And yes, mrussel, I agree with you.  Necessary and / or urgent care, of course.
    I hadn't even considered that aspect.  I think it makes sense.  EVERYBODY should receive urgent care when needed.  Why that wasn't stated in the debates seems strange. 

    But I took them saying "free health care" at face value.  Shit, a very big part of our budget has to be set aside for health care.  Very likely so for many or most of us.  Free?  No dice!
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    I will not vote (not American)...but in Ontario, we held provincial election a year ago...the conservatives and NDP were neck in neck at one point...and the NDP wanted to make Ontario a sanctuary province...the conservatives won easily.

    I live across from Detroit...no fucking way did I want freeloading Americans showing up at our hospitals looking for freebies...fuck that shit.  That is why we have photo ID health cards...


    but visitors ARE seen under your system if neccessary, right?
    I do not believe we would ever turn away a medical emergency.  But our hospitals have ATM machines, debit/credit card machines...so they do expect payment if you do not have a valid health card...but I absolutely am convinced that anyone who shows up will be looked at...
    Dont you have a deal with other nations about the care?

    I think that is How European countries do it atleast 
    I should mention that Ontario has deals with Michigan hospitals for procedures that need treatment ASAP and there are no DR's in nearby that can help...for example;  I live across from Detroit and sometimes our hospital directs the ambulance to Detroit to ensure the patient gets treated properly, but the hospital needs to seek provincial approval before they transport you to Detroit...
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    Meltdown99 said:
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Good question.  Anybody know?
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    brianlux said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Good question.  Anybody know?
    THEY don't even know.  They talk out of their ass, especially at these first go-arounds.

    Yeah, I may be just a bit cynical at this point.
  • brianluxbrianlux Posts: 42,023
    hedonist said:
    brianlux said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Good question.  Anybody know?
    THEY don't even know.  They talk out of their ass, especially at these first go-arounds.

    Yeah, I may be just a bit cynical at this point.
    Sadly, many of us are a bit cynical about all this these days, Hedo.
    “The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
    Variously credited to Mark Twain or Edward Abbey.













  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 Posts: 10,739
    In Canada, once you are in and went through the appropriate channels they receive money and full healthcare (I believe only for a year from the federal government and then they go on the provincial plan).  
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,671
    brianlux said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Good question.  Anybody know?
    Are you asking at the border, as part of ICE detention, or if someone goes to the ER in Bethesda MD?  
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,577
    mrussel1 said:
    brianlux said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Good question.  Anybody know?
    Are you asking at the border, as part of ICE detention, or if someone goes to the ER in Bethesda MD?  
    would assume since they ate in the system going through process, they are given work permits. so for some working full time , I would assume insurance benefits are asvailable like everyone else employed where ins is available.

    Otherwise, I would guess basic care is a part of DHS budget or other appropriate dept.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,671
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    brianlux said:
    Meltdown99 said:
    What about documented immigrants/asylum seekers/refugees?  Who pays their healthcare cost?
    Good question.  Anybody know?
    Are you asking at the border, as part of ICE detention, or if someone goes to the ER in Bethesda MD?  
    would assume since they ate in the system going through process, they are given work permits. so for some working full time , I would assume insurance benefits are asvailable like everyone else employed where ins is available.

    Otherwise, I would guess basic care is a part of DHS budget or other appropriate dept.
    If a person,  any person,  walks into a hospital needing immediate care,  there's a federal law requiring them to provide it.  Those costs are borne by the hospital and either eaten or absorbed by paying patients. 

    If it's part of the border issue,  I think the DHS budget would pay that,  so tax dollars.  

    This is my marginally educated guess. 
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