I think some Inuit have flown on planes ... the shame they bring.
So your argument has been reduced to sarcasm for things irrelevant to your defence of slaughtering whales?
Look... I'm in favour of propping up FN people as much as the next guy, but I'm not in favour of affording a license to do whatever they please in any manner they so choose.
This little rock in the middle of infinity was bound to get where it is at now with regards to population. Europeans were not going to live on top of each other until the next ice age, so it is what it is. FN people living in harmony with nature as they might have 400 years ago is simply not realistic. So... let's move on. If you seek the lifestyle your ancestors lived... then go get it, but don't lament it while at the same time enjoying the advancements that have taken the edge of 'simpler times'.
You know... I heard a FN elder speak once and he spoke of how his people were a 'great warring nation of people' and had seized much land as a result of their conquests. Interesting eh? Being okay with land seizures as long as it works for you?
As we work towards reconciliation, there's a significant amount of hypocrisy in this issue that never gets talked about and I'm kind of getting tired of. Let's place all the cards on the table- not just select ones.
Meltdown...
Were you going to respond to this or just the man bun posts?
In particular... the 'hypocrisy' aspect of this post. How do you feel about the fact that FN people bemoan the loss of their land and culture to European people, but engaged in warfare and land seizures themselves? To the vanquished... I'm struggling to see a difference.
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
nice man bun.
gotta love the fools and their man bun ...
I’m thinking it’s not the haircut that makes a fool.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Some Inuit even use gas powered ATV's in pursuit of their sustenance lifestyle ... the fucking nerve of these people to spit in the of self righteous...
Some Inuit even use gas powered ATV's in pursuit of their sustenance lifestyle ... the fucking nerve of these people to spit in the of self righteous...
Will you ever acknowledge the obvious fact that such technology means it isn’t actually subsistence level living, and thus is probably not sustainable, especially in a land that is relatively unproductive.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,757
I don't care if the Inuit are killing whales with nuclear weapons or their bare hands. It's still wrong. They are not going to starve if they don't kill whales. It's not their main source of food. It's an outdated and unnecessary custom.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I don't care if the Inuit are killing whales with nuclear weapons or their bare hands. It's still wrong. They are not going to starve if they don't kill whales. It's not their main source of food. It's an outdated and unnecessary custom.
Agreed. I hate seeing whales being killed but at least they use every last single piece of it, nothing goes to waste.
I don't care if the Inuit are killing whales with nuclear weapons or their bare hands. It's still wrong. They are not going to starve if they don't kill whales. It's not their main source of food. It's an outdated and unnecessary custom.
"Speak what you think today in hard words..."
I dig it B! And even as a meat eater that has looked his dinner in the eye as it passes, I have to agree.
Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,757
I don't care if the Inuit are killing whales with nuclear weapons or their bare hands. It's still wrong. They are not going to starve if they don't kill whales. It's not their main source of food. It's an outdated and unnecessary custom.
Agreed. I hate seeing whales being killed but at least they use every last single piece of it, nothing goes to waste.
Probably true, but when they've killed the last one there will be nothing to use or waste.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
The Inuit are not going to hunt every last whale ... that's just ridiculous.
Probably true, but Japan and Iceland and a few other places will help them. They will try anyway. And I will try in any way I can just as hard to support those who fight back against whaling. If I could go out and be on a ship on the sea, I would be out there doing just that.
Post edited by brianlux on
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. [name calling deleted]
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
Post edited by Sea on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
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mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,858
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
where exactly are you getting the food you eat from? hmm? any of it harvested via machine?
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
where exactly are you getting the food you eat from? hmm? any of it harvested via machine?
I create it out of thin air.
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
The Inuit are not responsible for the decline in whale populations. They have a varied diet, they do not just eat whales. It is not practical for them to buy their meat when they can harvest their own, something they've been doing for 100's of years. And I will say again, this is their land ... they do not need permission from government set up by European conquerers as far as I'm concerned.
The Inuit are not responsible for the decline in whale populations. They have a varied diet, they do not just eat whales. It is not practical for them to buy their meat when they can harvest their own, something they've been doing for 100's of years. And I will say again, this is their land ... they do not need permission from government set up by European conquerers as far as I'm concerned.
No one here is talking about permission. We are talking about morality and ethics and sustainability, not permission.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
I respect your decision and lifestyle.
I don't respect your disdain for those that eat meat (shitty people eat meat). As a meat eater, I can tell you I won't apologize for my existence. We were not born herbivores. If a human has become a herbivore... that is by choice. So congratulations on your personal choice.
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
You forgive the lion for eating the gazelle, no? Yes, we are much smarter, smart enough to know better and caring enough to empathize with the gazelle...but I thought those factors were irrelevant to the equation?
You cast the issue in such stark terms: right is absolutely right and wrong is absolutely wrong. It really, really isn't that simple. My guess is that you have never been on a working farm and you don't have an intimate knowledge of how inputs and outputs work, the roles that animals play in vegetable food production. A sustainable farm mimics an ecosystem as closely as possible and disrupting that balance requires a shift in inputs that can be disastrous for the environment. An immediate shift to vegetarian/vegan eating by a majority of the world's population would have huge unforseen and predictable consequences. You live in northern Europe, right? What do you eat all winter as a vegetarian? Dried beans, turnips, and winter squash? Or do you eat imported fresh produce that is shipped from warmer climes? What happens if the demand for winter produce skyrockets? The climate surely suffers. It's all just way more complicated than you want to believe with your moral absolutes.
You've probably never seen a beautiful, innocent looking cow or horse haul off and kick somebody nearly to death. People nowadays love to convince themselves that "animals are innocent"...morons one and all lol Do you know that the cow gif you posted is a dairy cow that was never intended for meat consumption to begin with?
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
You forgive the lion for eating the gazelle, no? Yes, we are much smarter, smart enough to know better and caring enough to empathize with the gazelle...but I thought those factors were irrelevant to the equation?
You cast the issue in such stark terms: right is absolutely right and wrong is absolutely wrong. It really, really isn't that simple. My guess is that you have never been on a working farm and you don't have an intimate knowledge of how inputs and outputs work, the roles that animals play in vegetable food production. A sustainable farm mimics an ecosystem as closely as possible and disrupting that balance requires a shift in inputs that can be disastrous for the environment. An immediate shift to vegetarian/vegan eating by a majority of the world's population would have huge unforseen and predictable consequences. You live in northern Europe, right? What do you eat all winter as a vegetarian? Dried beans, turnips, and winter squash? Or do you eat imported fresh produce that is shipped from warmer climes? What happens if the demand for winter produce skyrockets? The climate surely suffers. It's all just way more complicated than you want to believe with your moral absolutes.
You've probably never seen a beautiful, innocent looking cow or horse haul off and kick somebody nearly to death. People nowadays love to convince themselves that "animals are innocent"...morons one and all lol Do you know that the cow gif you posted is a dairy cow that was never intended for meat consumption to begin with?
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
I respect your decision and lifestyle.
I don't respect your disdain for those that eat meat (shitty people eat meat). As a meat eater, I can tell you I won't apologize for my existence. We were not born herbivores. If a human has become a herbivore... that is by choice. So congratulations on your personal choice.
I have never understood peoples "we were born..."-argument. It has no bearing other than what... some fatalistic view of what... exactly?
We as a species can make a choice in 2018 with how far we have come and guided by our empathy.
I have a hard time respecting those who are too ignorant to see that supporting the murder of living beings - when we in no way have to, to move forward - is fucked up. How could you not feel some level of disdain for that.
Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
I respect your decision and lifestyle.
I don't respect your disdain for those that eat meat (shitty people eat meat). As a meat eater, I can tell you I won't apologize for my existence. We were not born herbivores. If a human has become a herbivore... that is by choice. So congratulations on your personal choice.
I have never understood peoples "we were born..."-argument. It has no bearing other than what... some fatalistic view of what... exactly?
We as a species can make a choice in 2018 with how far we have come and guided by our empathy.
I have a hard time respecting those who are too ignorant to see that supporting the murder of living beings - when we in no way have to, to move forward - is fucked up. How could you not feel some level of disdain for that.
Because we are animals. It's the cycle of life. There are animals that will feast on us too given the chance.
We sit on top of the food chain with our resourcefulness.
I agree that the death of any animal (including insects) is not something to be celebrated; however, just as lions take down zebras, bears eat salmon, snakes eat small mammals, lizards eat bugs, sharks eat turtles, and eagles eat marmots... humans eat their preferred food.
It's not murder. It's reality. Come to terms with it.
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
You forgive the lion for eating the gazelle, no? Yes, we are much smarter, smart enough to know better and caring enough to empathize with the gazelle...but I thought those factors were irrelevant to the equation?
You cast the issue in such stark terms: right is absolutely right and wrong is absolutely wrong. It really, really isn't that simple. My guess is that you have never been on a working farm and you don't have an intimate knowledge of how inputs and outputs work, the roles that animals play in vegetable food production. A sustainable farm mimics an ecosystem as closely as possible and disrupting that balance requires a shift in inputs that can be disastrous for the environment. An immediate shift to vegetarian/vegan eating by a majority of the world's population would have huge unforseen and predictable consequences. You live in northern Europe, right? What do you eat all winter as a vegetarian? Dried beans, turnips, and winter squash? Or do you eat imported fresh produce that is shipped from warmer climes? What happens if the demand for winter produce skyrockets? The climate surely suffers. It's all just way more complicated than you want to believe with your moral absolutes.
You've probably never seen a beautiful, innocent looking cow or horse haul off and kick somebody nearly to death. People nowadays love to convince themselves that "animals are innocent"...morons one and all lol Do you know that the cow gif you posted is a dairy cow that was never intended for meat consumption to begin with?
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
You forgive the lion for eating the gazelle, no? Yes, we are much smarter, smart enough to know better and caring enough to empathize with the gazelle...but I thought those factors were irrelevant to the equation?
You cast the issue in such stark terms: right is absolutely right and wrong is absolutely wrong. It really, really isn't that simple. My guess is that you have never been on a working farm and you don't have an intimate knowledge of how inputs and outputs work, the roles that animals play in vegetable food production. A sustainable farm mimics an ecosystem as closely as possible and disrupting that balance requires a shift in inputs that can be disastrous for the environment. An immediate shift to vegetarian/vegan eating by a majority of the world's population would have huge unforseen and predictable consequences. You live in northern Europe, right? What do you eat all winter as a vegetarian? Dried beans, turnips, and winter squash? Or do you eat imported fresh produce that is shipped from warmer climes? What happens if the demand for winter produce skyrockets? The climate surely suffers. It's all just way more complicated than you want to believe with your moral absolutes.
You've probably never seen a beautiful, innocent looking cow or horse haul off and kick somebody nearly to death. People nowadays love to convince themselves that "animals are innocent"...morons one and all lol Do you know that the cow gif you posted is a dairy cow that was never intended for meat consumption to begin with?
And there's this.
2 out of 11 posts... RG has a good one.
Come on, can't you spot me a 3 out of 12???
Sometimes... when you are starting your next '2 for 11' cycle... you start with a gooder on your very 1st post.
This also qualifies your previous '2 for 11' as a '3 for 12'!
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
I respect your decision and lifestyle.
I don't respect your disdain for those that eat meat (shitty people eat meat). As a meat eater, I can tell you I won't apologize for my existence. We were not born herbivores. If a human has become a herbivore... that is by choice. So congratulations on your personal choice.
I have never understood peoples "we were born..."-argument. It has no bearing other than what... some fatalistic view of what... exactly?
We as a species can make a choice in 2018 with how far we have come and guided by our empathy.
I have a hard time respecting those who are too ignorant to see that supporting the murder of living beings - when we in no way have to, to move forward - is fucked up. How could you not feel some level of disdain for that.
I can understand the disdain, I have a similar disdain for city folk (like you perhaps? just a guess) that are entirely disconnected from their place in the planetary ecosystem, the production of food, and essentially all ties to their natural self, yet feel like they can tell people what's right and wrong about lifestyles they've not experienced and don't understand. I try my best to temper that disdain and keep it to myself.
I'm not against hunting and fishing, both are part of my own heritage and I still engage in both from time to time. Whales though...those fuckers might be just as smart as us and they are certainly as loving as us. I don't like the idea of killing whales and dolphins, it's just not groovy.
Killing any animal - when it is not needed - is not groovy. Shouldn't need tiers on how loving or intelligent they are.
That thar be a slippery slope! What about the insects that are deliberately murdered on your veggie crops?
Not a fan of it.
But you accept it. Why?
In what way do you mean I accept it?
I try to not harm insects either, if I can help it. I try to by ecologically (maybe you call i organically though?) farmed things as much as possible.
And in a philosophical sense, I'd say we should try to not harm any other life - if we can help it.
But choosing a vegetarian option for you tomorrow for lunch instead of the slaughtered an murdered cow, or chicken, or fish is a very easy option to make. It's even SUPER EASY. It should be the only sane choice to make in 2018. Any other, shows a severe lack of empathy and thought.
What I mean is that thousands upon thousands of insects die for you to eat vegetables, whether grown organically or not, and you accept it and continue to eat the vegetables. If no distinction is to be made based on the intelligence and emotional depth of the living creature, then how do you draw the line. Shouldn't eating plants even be a problem under that ideology?
What do you think?
I think the distinction is relevant. We are animals too. Smart ones, sure, but animals nonetheless. We evolved to consume a large variety of living creatures and I don't think that can be cast aside easily. On the other hand, we really don't NEED to eat beef for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I think that starting with the smartest and most emotional animals as "off-limits" is a good way to push societies towards eating less meat over time. Guilt trips will only entrench the staunch carnivores, they won't make progress.
I also think veganism is silly. If you really care so much about your food then you should produce your own. There's nothing wrong with eggs, milk, and cheese if the animals aren't abused.
I have a hard time seeing the relevance of us being "animals too"? So?
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. The only reasons are lack of empathy, ignorance and gluttony. Shitty people eat meat.
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
You forgive the lion for eating the gazelle, no? Yes, we are much smarter, smart enough to know better and caring enough to empathize with the gazelle...but I thought those factors were irrelevant to the equation?
You cast the issue in such stark terms: right is absolutely right and wrong is absolutely wrong. It really, really isn't that simple. My guess is that you have never been on a working farm and you don't have an intimate knowledge of how inputs and outputs work, the roles that animals play in vegetable food production. A sustainable farm mimics an ecosystem as closely as possible and disrupting that balance requires a shift in inputs that can be disastrous for the environment. An immediate shift to vegetarian/vegan eating by a majority of the world's population would have huge unforseen and predictable consequences. You live in northern Europe, right? What do you eat all winter as a vegetarian? Dried beans, turnips, and winter squash? Or do you eat imported fresh produce that is shipped from warmer climes? What happens if the demand for winter produce skyrockets? The climate surely suffers. It's all just way more complicated than you want to believe with your moral absolutes.
You've probably never seen a beautiful, innocent looking cow or horse haul off and kick somebody nearly to death. People nowadays love to convince themselves that "animals are innocent"...morons one and all lol Do you know that the cow gif you posted is a dairy cow that was never intended for meat consumption to begin with?
And there's this.
2 out of 11 posts... RG has a good one.
Come on, can't you spot me a 3 out of 12???
Sometimes... when you are starting your next '2 for 11' cycle... you start with a gooder on your very 1st post.
This also qualifies your previous '2 for 11' as a '3 for 12'!
That's math almost beyond my ken, but I think that's a big thumbs up Captain.
City folk (like me) are disconnected with their food.
I understand this though. I understand the process undergone by other people who have grown or raised the food my family eats.
As much as evolution has been an astounding thing (getting to where he have come to)... it has its pitfalls.
You grew up rural didn't you? The country never leaves a person who was raised there.
We hunted and fished (we still 'casually' fish). I grew up with our deep freezer full of deer, moose, and fish- trout and salmon.
My parents owned a farm when I was small, but this doesn't count for me.
Gotcha, not full country mouse or city mouse, somewhere in between. I grew up and live still full country, but hunting has always been minimal for a country fella.
City folk (like me) are disconnected with their food.
I understand this though. I understand the process undergone by other people who have grown or raised the food my family eats.
As much as evolution has been an astounding thing (getting to where he have come to)... it has its pitfalls.
You grew up rural didn't you? The country never leaves a person who was raised there.
We hunted and fished (we still 'casually' fish). I grew up with our deep freezer full of deer, moose, and fish- trout and salmon.
My parents owned a farm when I was small, but this doesn't count for me.
Gotcha, not full country mouse or city mouse, somewhere in between. I grew up and live still full country, but hunting has always been minimal for a country fella.
I always feel a little guilty: I never raised my son and daughter as I was raised.
Growing up, we were at the lake all summer. In the fall we hunted. During the winter it was skidooing and ice fishing every weekend. In the spring we fished.
My kids have not experienced this and I'm not sure if they have been ripped off or not?
Comments
Were you going to respond to this or just the man bun posts?
In particular... the 'hypocrisy' aspect of this post. How do you feel about the fact that FN people bemoan the loss of their land and culture to European people, but engaged in warfare and land seizures themselves? To the vanquished... I'm struggling to see a difference.
I dig it B!
And even as a meat eater that has looked his dinner in the eye as it passes, I have to agree.
http://www.theiflife.com/the-inuit-paradox-high-fat-lower-heart-disease-and-cancer/
Maybe we should adopt their diet...
I don't see how that could not be cast aside easily -- when it's easily proven it without a problem can be cast aside easily?
I also don't see the point in calling veganism or vegans silly. That way of living harms less living creatures than your diet, destroys the planet less and don't harm anyone. "It's silly to care". I'm trying to eat vegan as much as possible, but would not have a problem eating eggs etc if I had a couple of hens my self.
But, anyways - there is no defendable reason to eat meat in the western world in 2018. [name calling deleted]
And I don't think we should kill whales if we can avoid it.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
I respect your decision and lifestyle.
I don't respect your disdain for those that eat meat (shitty people eat meat). As a meat eater, I can tell you I won't apologize for my existence. We were not born herbivores. If a human has become a herbivore... that is by choice. So congratulations on your personal choice.
Yes, we are much smarter, smart enough to know better and caring enough to empathize with the gazelle...but I thought those factors were irrelevant to the equation?
You cast the issue in such stark terms: right is absolutely right and wrong is absolutely wrong.
It really, really isn't that simple. My guess is that you have never been on a working farm and you don't have an intimate knowledge of how inputs and outputs work, the roles that animals play in vegetable food production. A sustainable farm mimics an ecosystem as closely as possible and disrupting that balance requires a shift in inputs that can be disastrous for the environment. An immediate shift to vegetarian/vegan eating by a majority of the world's population would have huge unforseen and predictable consequences.
You live in northern Europe, right? What do you eat all winter as a vegetarian? Dried beans, turnips, and winter squash? Or do you eat imported fresh produce that is shipped from warmer climes? What happens if the demand for winter produce skyrockets? The climate surely suffers. It's all just way more complicated than you want to believe with your moral absolutes.
You've probably never seen a beautiful, innocent looking cow or horse haul off and kick somebody nearly to death. People nowadays love to convince themselves that "animals are innocent"...morons one and all lol
Do you know that the cow gif you posted is a dairy cow that was never intended for meat consumption to begin with?
And there's this.
2 out of 11 posts... RG has a good one.
We as a species can make a choice in 2018 with how far we have come and guided by our empathy.
I have a hard time respecting those who are too ignorant to see that supporting the murder of living beings - when we in no way have to, to move forward - is fucked up. How could you not feel some level of disdain for that.
Because we are animals. It's the cycle of life. There are animals that will feast on us too given the chance.
We sit on top of the food chain with our resourcefulness.
I agree that the death of any animal (including insects) is not something to be celebrated; however, just as lions take down zebras, bears eat salmon, snakes eat small mammals, lizards eat bugs, sharks eat turtles, and eagles eat marmots... humans eat their preferred food.
It's not murder. It's reality. Come to terms with it.
Sometimes... when you are starting your next '2 for 11' cycle... you start with a gooder on your very 1st post.
This also qualifies your previous '2 for 11' as a '3 for 12'!
I try my best to temper that disdain and keep it to myself.
I understand this though. I understand the process undergone by other people who have grown or raised the food my family eats.
As much as evolution has been an astounding thing (getting to where he have come to)... it has its pitfalls.
We hunted and fished (we still 'casually' fish). I grew up with our deep freezer full of deer, moose, and fish- trout and salmon.
My parents owned a farm when I was small, but this doesn't count for me.
I grew up and live still full country, but hunting has always been minimal for a country fella.
I always feel a little guilty: I never raised my son and daughter as I was raised.
Growing up, we were at the lake all summer. In the fall we hunted. During the winter it was skidooing and ice fishing every weekend. In the spring we fished.
My kids have not experienced this and I'm not sure if they have been ripped off or not?