Normalized as in "believing in the tooth fairy isn't normal and believing in God is".
I personally have absolutely no qualms in saying I'm an Atheist is any and all situations, because I couldn't care less what other people think about it. Also, I'm always extremely intrigued when I discover that someone is a devout whatever. When I find out a co-worker or someone actually attends Church and is really religious, I'm genuinely fascinated, and want nothing more than to discuss their beliefs and their experiences with that. I find that most very religious people are weirdly closed-lipped and self-conscious of their faith, while I've never met an Atheist who is.... And these are not faithful people who get persecuted or teased or anything about their religion at all. So that makes me wonder wtf they're so uncomfortable about. Perhaps they are insecure about it because deep down they know that a lot of it is pretty ludicrous, or maybe are afraid a non-religious person is going to be able to easily poke holes in the beliefs (I wouldn't do that in this scenario)... That makes me wonder if their faith is as solid as they seem to want it to be. Either that, or they are basically just a bunch of snobs who don't think an Atheist is worth sharing with. And no, I don't do anything to make them feel weird or judged. I show genuine, friendly interest and curiosity about it. I really enjoy hearing their perspectives about it, especially when they're converts from other faiths or something. I dunno... lately I feel like a lot of religious folks, particularly Christians, have a persecution complex that acts like a kind of defense mechanism.
this is because many atheists who act 'intrigued' at someone's beliefs are really only after one thing: mockery and superiority. i am at the same point as you, where i am genuinely interested in someone's beliefs, and my brother understands that i'm asking out of curiosity, not as a reason to mock him. but he honestly feels like his religion is under siege, and i can't say that in some ways i blame that thought. now, he is more talking in the context of being called a bigot for his beliefs, but in a more general sense, a lot of atheists mock theists using slights like the flying spaghetti monster, santa claus, easter bunny, etc, as seen above.
the difference is, we all know santa et al aren't real. we KNOW that. we don't know how we were created, and by what/whom. so it's pretty arrogant, to me, to tell people, no matter your beliefs, what is fact. it bothers me when theists tell me for a fact they know god exists, and it also bothers me when atheists tell me for a fact a god doesn't exist. there aren't any that we know of at this point.
in my opinion, we are all agnostic, just most of us don't know it.
Well I have honestly never met an Atheist in my whole life who asks a religious person about their faith to their face and then turned around and mocked and ridiculed them, so I'm not sure where in the hell that fear comes from. I rather think it's imagined, or at least majorly exaggerated in their heads because they think something they see on the internet has way more weight than it really does. I personally think this "my religion is under siege" idea is pure delusion (unless you're a Muslim in America, that is). What they're actually experiencing is the power of Christianity and that establishment shinking. They are the religious equivalent of those white men who are freaking out because they are losing power in modern society.
Oh, and no, I'm not agnostic in any way, shape or form. I am definitely 100% Atheist, and I don't care who that bothers. I don't think the view you're expressing is logical. As I've said before, I know God doesn't exist the same way I know a giant polk-a-dotted, cottonball breathing dragon doesn't exist. I think that saying there is no way to know that god doesn't exist is a logical absurdity. Doesn't matter to me if others don't agree with my viewpoint. I hold it unwaveringly. And no, that is not equal to the other side of the coin.
a logical absurdity to me is thinking you know all of the secrets of the universe from your porch in vancouver.
i think saying you 'know' there is no higher power is just as ridiculous as someone saying they 'know' there is.
I don't think I know all the secrets of the universe, Mr. Sarcasm. I just know that just because something is made up by people I have no obligation to humour the idea, and I also think that to say believing in the existence of something ludicrous conjured up by people and not believing in the existence of something ludicrous conjured up by people are the same thing is extremely messed up logic. It makes no sense to act like the two are comparable.
i am not talking about religion. that is man made. the idea that everything has a creator is not. it is logic.
The concept of God - i.e. a creator - is also man made.
no, it's simple logic. everything that is made has to have a creator, whether it's some god, or an energy, or something.
I disagree.
Maybe one could try to argue that everything that exists came from something, though physics has some ideas on that, but that is not at all the same thing as saying that everything has a creator, i.e. an active force that creates
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
/\/\/\ Ok, call me ignorant, but what thing that we know of is not created by some other thing through some action or reaction? I'm drawing a blank.
I'm not explaining myself well. "Creator" suggest a level of deliberateness. The concept of a creator with intent is man-made. The current concept of how the universe came to be does not involve any level of "creator" or creation; it simply is, with no creation of it.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Typically the person making a claim is the holder of the burden of proof, right? In this case claiming I have super powers I have to prove it. Someone claiming there is a god would have the same need to prove their claim to someone who disputes it. Why, with religion, does this not hold?
Fme, PhD, gettin’ all philosophically, on you, on me, of vodka do I see in thee?
it comes up as my brother is ultra religious, as is his wife and son. their son especially judges me like a motherfucker. i really think he thinks i'm the devil. he creeps me the fuck out. in a unabomber kinda way.
they believe homosexuality is a choice and is curable. my brother told me last night at dinner that the he finds the american (republican) version of christianity is so bastardized that it barely resembles christianity at all. which i found interesting.
it also comes up in my house a lot as my wife is catholic and so i agreed to raise our kids as such. or rather, i said i'd allow her to teach them that as kids, and they can make their minds up about it when they can frame it themselves. my youngest asks me questions about my beliefs all the time. it's kind of fun as, for an 8 year old, she comes up with fascinatingly intelligent questions. and i enjoy talking to her about it, because she's so young, there's zero judgment, only curiosity. which is refreshing.
my daughter's guitar teacher gave her a ball to carry around the house as exercise in how to hold her finger picking hand. i looked at it and it said "smile....jesus loves you". i nearly stuffed it in his fucking mouth.
Serious question...you want others to respect your beliefs, so why the last sentence?
I persoannly don;t believe in organized religion. I do believe in something...or maybe I just want to. But to me it just feels like there is something that ties us all together. But then there are times when I think there is no way.
I also am a bit like you in that I seem to have a terrible reaction to others beliefs at times and it bothers me. But I'm trying to not do that as much. Because some of the time they are being judgmental and deserve it, but most of the time it's pretty innocent and just normal life for them. And really it doesn't effect me anymore than someone's sexuality so I should stop being such a jerk about it all the time.
the last sentence because it just seems so underhanded to give a "gift" to a child and it turning out to be something that happens to be part of their agenda. I find that disgusting. people do that shit knowing full well how awkward it is to confront the person about it with their child right there and the parent giving them shit for a gift they gave them. it turns into 'how did I become the asshole in this situation?'.
I wasn't actually as angry about it and that statement made it sound. He's a nice guy, and for all I know, he got it for free to give to his students and thought nothing of it. I don't know. I looked at it, chuckled to myself, and put it down.
the difference between someone's sexuality and religion is that no one is trying to ram their sexuality down anyone's throat. They are proud, they want to make you aware who they are, but by no means are they trying to convert you.
Exactly he could of just given her a ball with no writing on it !
I can't speak for other religions (hell, I can't speak for Christianity. It's just what I grew up around) but it's existence relies on people jammingbjt down everyone's throat. Doesn't Christianity teach that all Christians must spread the word? Why do you think people always say "I'll pray for you?" Aren't they praying that you or whoever will turn to Christ?
I grew up a reform Jew (what many Jewish people call “barely/just Jewish”, but was sent to Jewish day school. To this day I still remember sixth grade when I didn’t do my homework and was put in the vice principal’s office and told to pray out loud. This was done out of pure malice from the witch in charge (at risk of saying the true words I would reserve only for her which would get me banned), as she was well aware I already had questions about religion which were being ignored, and I had refused to pray (a weekly activity at the school) until I was explained what the words I was being asked to utter meant.
I sat there and cried like a fucking baby and that has fueled why I will never tolerate that crock of shit undue thought control those bastards unleash on impressionable young people. When people in a position of power supposedly there to teach people “better ways” abuse that power so profoundly and so regularly, it shatters all illusions about why religion truly exists.
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EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
Anna....good question. As stated before I am very happy for those who get great things from religion and certainly if they do not harm any others in pursuing their beliefs. I cannot believe in things that I feel cannot be proven, really....but if I had to choose? Huh
I guess I would think it would be great if the god there turns out to be would be a good god. No wars due to religion, no "hell" for people who believe differently, etc.
Tough. I was raised strictly RC and attanedsd private Catholic School. Lots of conflicts to resolve about the goodness of what can come from zealots.
I'm a puny little human with a barely above average intelligence and I can think of a better system than this supposed Creator has devised. What's that say? Says a lot.
I grew up in a strict Catholic household with very devote parents. Think daily mass, nightly family rosary prayers, attending prayer groups and other church related stuff. Thankfully, my parents didn't force me or my brother to be alter boys since the priest at our parish turned out to be a molester. Anyways, deep down I always questioned a lot of things I was being taught/told because some of the stuff was very contradictory. When I questioned things, I never got straight answers, but trope such as "we are not the question god's will, or the churches authority." Things like that, but still I went along with stuff because I wanted to be a good kid, confused, overwhelmed with guilt, and scared to death that I was going to hell . As I got older I still attended Sunday mass and such, but I still questioned myself as to why.
Finally, when I was 30, I walked away from the church/deities/religion and have zero intentions of going back. Hands down the one of the best things I've ever done. It was a huge weight lifted off of my shoulders. No regrets. It initially has caused a little riff with my family, but we come to an agreement to just not discuss religion. We get along even better now.
A couple of books I found helpful with explaining my non-belief to believers:
God is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens (say what you will about him, I don't agree with some of his views/writings, but this book was helpful to me)
Letters From the Underworld by Mark Twain
The Demon-haunted World: A Candle in the Dark by Carl Sagan
I grew up in a strict Catholic household with very devote parents. Think daily mass, nightly family rosary prayers, attending prayer groups and other church related stuff. Thankfully, my parents didn't force me or my brother to be alter boys since the priest at our parish turned out to be a molester. Anyways, deep down I always questioned a lot of things I was being taught/told because some of the stuff was very contradictory. When I questioned things, I never got straight answers, but trope such as "we are not the question god's will, or the churches authority." Things like that, but still I went along with stuff because I wanted to be a good kid, confused, overwhelmed with guilt, and scared to death that I was going to hell . As I got older I still attended Sunday mass and such, but I still questioned myself as to why.
Finally, when I was 30, I walked away from the church/deities/religion and have zero intentions of going back. Hands down the one of the best things I've ever done. It was a huge weight lifted off of my shoulders. No regrets. It initially has caused a little riff with my family, but we come to an agreement to just not discuss religion. We get along even better now.
A couple of books I found helpful with explaining my non-belief to believers:
God is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens (say what you will about him, I don't agree with some of his views/writings, but this book was helpful to me)
Letters From the Underworld by Mark Twain
The Demon-haunted World: A Candle in the Dark by Carl Sagan
Check out Losing Faith in Faith by Dan Barker. He is a former evangelist/minister.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
I can't remember a time in decades when anyone has asked me if I believe in god. Very occasionally people have asked if I attend church but that seemed to have been more of a social question, and there was never a negative reaction when I said no. In my experience, this just isn't something that people are concerned about in my neck of the woods.
I understand where you're coming from here. It's not something I'm asked on a weekly or even a monthly basis. But occasionally, whether it be at work, or at a social event, or a party, politics comes up and that inevitably leads to a religious discussion.
Normalized as in "believing in the tooth fairy isn't normal and believing in God is".
I personally have absolutely no qualms in saying I'm an Atheist is any and all situations, because I couldn't care less what other people think about it. Also, I'm always extremely intrigued when I discover that someone is a devout whatever. When I find out a co-worker or someone actually attends Church and is really religious, I'm genuinely fascinated, and want nothing more than to discuss their beliefs and their experiences with that. I find that most very religious people are weirdly closed-lipped and self-conscious of their faith, while I've never met an Atheist who is.... And these are not faithful people who get persecuted or teased or anything about their religion at all. So that makes me wonder wtf they're so uncomfortable about. Perhaps they are insecure about it because deep down they know that a lot of it is pretty ludicrous, or maybe are afraid a non-religious person is going to be able to easily poke holes in the beliefs (I wouldn't do that in this scenario)... That makes me wonder if their faith is as solid as they seem to want it to be. Either that, or they are basically just a bunch of snobs who don't think an Atheist is worth sharing with. And no, I don't do anything to make them feel weird or judged. I show genuine, friendly interest and curiosity about it. I really enjoy hearing their perspectives about it, especially when they're converts from other faiths or something. I dunno... lately I feel like a lot of religious folks, particularly Christians, have a persecution complex that acts like a kind of defense mechanism.
this is because many atheists who act 'intrigued' at someone's beliefs are really only after one thing: mockery and superiority. i am at the same point as you, where i am genuinely interested in someone's beliefs, and my brother understands that i'm asking out of curiosity, not as a reason to mock him. but he honestly feels like his religion is under siege, and i can't say that in some ways i blame that thought. now, he is more talking in the context of being called a bigot for his beliefs, but in a more general sense, a lot of atheists mock theists using slights like the flying spaghetti monster, santa claus, easter bunny, etc, as seen above.
the difference is, we all know santa et al aren't real. we KNOW that. we don't know how we were created, and by what/whom. so it's pretty arrogant, to me, to tell people, no matter your beliefs, what is fact. it bothers me when theists tell me for a fact they know god exists, and it also bothers me when atheists tell me for a fact a god doesn't exist. there aren't any that we know of at this point.
in my opinion, we are all agnostic, just most of us don't know it.
Well I have honestly never met an Atheist in my whole life who asks a religious person about their faith to their face and then turned around and mocked and ridiculed them, so I'm not sure where in the hell that fear comes from. I rather think it's imagined, or at least majorly exaggerated in their heads because they think something they see on the internet has way more weight than it really does. I personally think this "my religion is under siege" idea is pure delusion (unless you're a Muslim in America, that is). What they're actually experiencing is the power of Christianity and that establishment shinking. They are the religious equivalent of those white men who are freaking out because they are losing power in modern society.
Oh, and no, I'm not agnostic in any way, shape or form. I am definitely 100% Atheist, and I don't care who that bothers. I don't think the view you're expressing is logical. As I've said before, I know God doesn't exist the same way I know a giant polk-a-dotted, cottonball breathing dragon doesn't exist. I think that saying there is no way to know that god doesn't exist is a logical absurdity. Doesn't matter to me if others don't agree with my viewpoint. I hold it unwaveringly. And no, that is not equal to the other side of the coin.
a logical absurdity to me is thinking you know all of the secrets of the universe from your porch in vancouver.
i think saying you 'know' there is no higher power is just as ridiculous as someone saying they 'know' there is.
I don't think I know all the secrets of the universe, Mr. Sarcasm. I just know that just because something is made up by people I have no obligation to humour the idea, and I also think that to say believing in the existence of something ludicrous conjured up by people and not believing in the existence of something ludicrous conjured up by people are the same thing is extremely messed up logic. It makes no sense to act like the two are comparable.
i am not talking about religion. that is man made. the idea that everything has a creator is not. it is logic.
The concept of God - i.e. a creator - is also man made.
no, it's simple logic. everything that is made has to have a creator, whether it's some god, or an energy, or something.
Energy is not a creator. It's just energy. I truly do not understand how you are claiming that the concept of a creator in any form is simple logic. That seriously makes no sense.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I can't remember a time in decades when anyone has asked me if I believe in god. Very occasionally people have asked if I attend church but that seemed to have been more of a social question, and there was never a negative reaction when I said no. In my experience, this just isn't something that people are concerned about in my neck of the woods.
I understand where you're coming from here. It's not something I'm asked on a weekly or even a monthly basis. But occasionally, whether it be at work, or at a social event, or a party, politics comes up and that inevitably leads to a religious discussion.
"So where do you go to church?"
Lol. I don't get asked that.
will myself to find a home, a home within myself we will find a way, we will find our place
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
It often comes back to this question about how god can allow suffering. If we would say that there is no god, wouldn’t there still be suffering? It would probably still be suffering but there would be no one to turn to, no comfort to get. I prefer believing in god just because it feels better.
Geez, if I believed in God I'd blame all the suffering on him and hate him, and feel worse, lol. I don't get why God can cause all the suffering (and I mean the kind that has nothing to do with free will, which is a LOT of suffering), but then also be looked to for comfort to relieve the bad emotions attached to that very same suffering. I'm not sure how that is comforting to people.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
It often comes back to this question about how god can allow suffering. If we would say that there is no god, wouldn’t there still be suffering? It would probably still be suffering but there would be no one to turn to, no comfort to get. I prefer believing in god just because it feels better.
I'm with Pj_Soul, if I believed there was a God who could stop children from starving and being raped, but chose not to for no good reason, I would hate that God for being such a dick.
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
It often comes back to this question about how god can allow suffering. If we would say that there is no god, wouldn’t there still be suffering? It would probably still be suffering but there would be no one to turn to, no comfort to get. I prefer believing in god just because it feels better.
I'm with Pj_Soul, if I believed there was a God who could stop children from starving and being raped, but chose not to for no good reason, I would hate that God for being such a dick.
Yeah that's where I'm at.
If god is all powerful and does nothing to end suffering then that isn't a god I'm interested in paying much attention to.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
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So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
It would have to be a better one than the one I don't think we have currently - a less suffering based one would be cool.
But I am cool with my mistakes being mine I don't need any pre-determinism.
I agree about less suffering, but I think we humans are the ones making most of the suffering...we should do more to lessen it.
Tell that to the victims of the Tsunami in 2004 or the kids who starve to death in Africa because of drought or the Haitians who died of dehydration while trapped under a building after the earthquake. Or to all the people who die of all the many deadly diseases. Or to all the people who die a slow, miserable death just because of old age. I totally disagree that humans make most of the suffering in this world. Yes, of course humans do create their own horrors way too much, but Nature (or God, if you believe in that kind of thing) still causes by far the most suffering in this world.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
It often comes back to this question about how god can allow suffering. If we would say that there is no god, wouldn’t there still be suffering? It would probably still be suffering but there would be no one to turn to, no comfort to get. I prefer believing in god just because it feels better.
I'm with Pj_Soul, if I believed there was a God who could stop children from starving and being raped, but chose not to for no good reason, I would hate that God for being such a dick.
Yeah that's where I'm at.
If god is all powerful and does nothing to end suffering then that isn't a god I'm interested in paying much attention to.
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
It often comes back to this question about how god can allow suffering. If we would say that there is no god, wouldn’t there still be suffering? It would probably still be suffering but there would be no one to turn to, no comfort to get. I prefer believing in god just because it feels better.
I'm with Pj_Soul, if I believed there was a God who could stop children from starving and being raped, but chose not to for no good reason, I would hate that God for being such a dick.
Yeah that's where I'm at.
If god is all powerful and does nothing to end suffering then that isn't a god I'm interested in paying much attention to.
Believe me I hate that too, evil humans.
right....humans that are more powerful than god.
Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018) The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago 2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy 2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE) 2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston 2020: Oakland, Oakland:2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana 2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville 2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
So a sincere question for non believers, if you could choose, would you want there to be a God or not?
Absolutely not, if that God operates in this reality. Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill. Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold? Fuck that!
It often comes back to this question about how god can allow suffering. If we would say that there is no god, wouldn’t there still be suffering? It would probably still be suffering but there would be no one to turn to, no comfort to get. I prefer believing in god just because it feels better.
I'm with Pj_Soul, if I believed there was a God who could stop children from starving and being raped, but chose not to for no good reason, I would hate that God for being such a dick.
Yeah that's where I'm at.
If god is all powerful and does nothing to end suffering then that isn't a god I'm interested in paying much attention to.
Believe me I hate that too, evil humans.
right....humans that are more powerful than god.
Religion beats your very logical argument with the whole free will argument. God won't stop people from harming others because he prefers to sit back and let them choose to do that, because humans have to choose to be good. It is a clever argument, because it will always and forever "explain" the problem of the horrors brought on people even though God has the power to stop it, and it actually sets God up as the giver of our own ability to make decisions (not matter how much it hurts others), which apparently we're supposed to really, really appreciate.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Comments
Maybe one could try to argue that everything that exists came from something, though physics has some ideas on that, but that is not at all the same thing as saying that everything has a creator, i.e. an active force that creates
Ok, call me ignorant, but what thing that we know of is not created by some other thing through some action or reaction? I'm drawing a blank.
I'm not explaining myself well. "Creator" suggest a level of deliberateness. The concept of a creator with intent is man-made. The current concept of how the universe came to be does not involve any level of "creator" or creation; it simply is, with no creation of it.
R'amen
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I sat there and cried like a fucking baby and that has fueled why I will never tolerate that crock of shit undue thought control those bastards unleash on impressionable young people. When people in a position of power supposedly there to teach people “better ways” abuse that power so profoundly and so regularly, it shatters all illusions about why religion truly exists.
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Why would I want a wantonly malicious and supremely vain deity sitting in the sky like a child with a magnifier over an ant hill.
Why would anyone want to believe that there is an omnipotent being that sits back and watches the Holocaust unfold?
Fuck that!
As stated before I am very happy for those who get great things from religion and certainly if they do not harm any others in pursuing their beliefs.
I cannot believe in things that I feel cannot be proven, really....but if I had to choose? Huh
I guess I would think it would be great if the god there turns out to be would be a good god. No wars due to religion, no "hell" for people who believe differently, etc.
Tough. I was raised strictly RC and attanedsd private Catholic School. Lots of conflicts to resolve about the goodness of what can come from zealots.
What's that say? Says a lot.
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
Finally, when I was 30, I walked away from the church/deities/religion and have zero intentions of going back. Hands down the one of the best things I've ever done. It was a huge weight lifted off of my shoulders. No regrets. It initially has caused a little riff with my family, but we come to an agreement to just not discuss religion. We get along even better now.
A couple of books I found helpful with explaining my non-belief to believers:
God is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens (say what you will about him, I don't agree with some of his views/writings, but this book was helpful to me)
Letters From the Underworld by Mark Twain
The Demon-haunted World: A Candle in the Dark by Carl Sagan
God's a creeper? He's seen my bum?
But I am cool with my mistakes being mine I don't need any pre-determinism.
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
we will find a way, we will find our place
If god is all powerful and does nothing to end suffering then that isn't a god I'm interested in paying much attention to.
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana