Las Vegas massacre.

JC29856

On Monday, just after the deadliest mass shooting in modern U.S. history, gunmakers saw a boom in their stock prices: American Outdoor Brands Corp. (previously Smith & Wesson), Sturm, Ruger & Co., and Vista Outdoor climbed by 2.3 percent, 3.7 percent and 1.4 percent, respectively, in morning trade, according to MarketWatch.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/gun-stocks-climb-after-las-vegas-shooting_us_59d24477e4b06791bb11f178

Spiritual_Chaos

The "US" view on, availability of and love for guns is such a Twilight Zone episode. 

EDIT: Kimmel is such a nice dude.

mace1229

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

HughFreakingDillon

hedonist said:

Maybe some are just trying to take this shit in.  It never even occurred to me to create a discussion about this.

why not? every other mass shooting on this scale has had its own thread. But I think it got gobbled up by the gun violence thread, which someone pointed out, so maybe thought there was no need. 

it's not that people are becoming numb to this as someone else said. I think there's plenty of outrage about this type of thing still. 

my2hands

brianlux said:

tempo_n_groove said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

Yes there is a problem.

Why do people shoot each other so easily?

Why is killing so easy for people?

Why is this release of violence the only answer?

These are questions I'd ask and try to solve answers to.

We're a violence loving society.  We eat violence like Cheerios in the morning.  And it sells.

https://youtu.be/hii17sjSwfA

PJ_Soul

CM189191 said:

tbergs said:

tempo_n_groove said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

The sad reason that there is no thread is that mass shootings are now so common in America that it no longer shocks anyone and we automatically just figure the latest will be covered in the gun violence thread. This is what your country has become, it no longer surprises the rest of the world when one of your citizens randomly decides to go out an murder a bunch of strangers

I think the news sensationalizes it more than anything.  You need only 5 minutes to understand what's going on, yet they have 24hr non stop news coverage.  I find that more disgusting than anything.

How many news channels are looking for an "exclusive" with the shooters brother right now?  Most likely all of them.

It's a tragedy that grows to being perverse unfortunately.

A positive I did see is all the Las Vegas residents lining up to give blood, some waiting hours.  

How has the news sensationalized the deadliest mass shooting in history? You want them to neatly summarize it in 5 minutes and move on? 5 fucking minutes? Why, so Americans can get back to being lazy, ignorant drones and continue to ignore our gun violence problem. I want them talking about it non stop because that's the only way anything will ever change. Once they stop talking about it is when it loses the momentum needed to influence change. And I'm sorry, but there currently has been no positive to this shooting. People lining up to give blood because hundreds were shot. What low expectations we have.

Kind of how I've felt watching the news.  They keep trying to find the positive spin.  There is no positive spin here.  People coming together in the wake of another crisis is not good news, it's reaction to a tragedy.  Good news would be if we found ways from this happening again.  Instead it is getting worse.  

I agree with this. Enough of this pandering "now's not the time" bullshit, which even the fucking Trump government is getting on board with because they don't want to confront any issues. I am so fucking sick of this crap, and even the media is pushing that idea, as though they are trying to guilt those people who want to confront the issues that this present head on into shutting up.

rgambs

mace1229 said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

No, won't is the word you were looking for.
The whole world agrees on how to begin fixing it, but your side WON'T accept what's obvious.

PJ_Soul

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

No, won't is the word you were looking for.
The whole world agrees on how to begin fixing it, but your side WON'T accept what's obvious.

That is a fact. That is why Trump and friends are trying to tell everyone that it's not appropriate to talk about it at all.

OnWis97

At this point, as a country, we've made a deal.  People can have essentially any firearm they want to protect their families but sometimes those arms will be used for sinister purposes that get a lot of innocent people killed.  It's similar to the deal our culture has made with driving: we want the movement and individuality that comes with driving and we accept that some of us are going to die as a result.  There are plenty of ways we could slash the number of people killed each year on the road; we choose our "freedoms" (which include weak enforcement of actual illegal things).  We're not going to change that greatly and there's no indication we're going to do so with guns, either.  So in both cases, you'd better be strapped.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

No, won't is the word you were looking for.
The whole world agrees on how to begin fixing it, but your side WON'T accept what's obvious.

That is a fact. That is why Trump and friends are trying to tell everyone that it's not appropriate to talk about it at all.

pro-gunners always trots that line out every mass shooting. "can we not respect the fallen and wait until the bodies are no longer warm to talk about the issue?" blah blah BLAH. all in hopes that people will forget about it after their unknown predetermined amount of respect time. 

HesCalledDyer

drakeheuer14 said:

I wish they wouldn’t give out the persons name. I get that we have a right to know, but it just gives them the extra attention they may have wanted. Society shouldn’t give them that glory to be known for doing such a horiffic thing. It probably really affects the lives of those closely related too by giving out the name. The brother is already being harassed by the news. 

They absolutely should give out the person's name and plaster his stupid fucking face all over the news.  Because if they didn't, Trump would have every fucking moron who voted for him convinced via twitter that it was done by ISIS, a black man, or "an illegal."

The brother is already being harassed? Whoop-de-do.  People are fucking dead.

pjhawks

OnWis97 said:

At this point, as a country, we've made a deal.  People can have essentially any firearm they want to protect their families but sometimes those arms will be used for sinister purposes that get a lot of innocent people killed.  It's similar to the deal our culture has made with driving: we want the movement and individuality that comes with driving and we accept that some of us are going to die as a result.  There are plenty of ways we could slash the number of people killed each year on the road; we choose our "freedoms" (which include weak enforcement of actual illegal things).  We're not going to change that greatly and there's no indication we're going to do so with guns, either.  So in both cases, you'd better be strapped.

except guns are made strictly for the purpose to kill while cars are not.

i also love when the gun folks trot out they  need their guns to protect their families. where the heck do these people live that people are coming into their homes for their families?  the number of deaths in the home by assailants those who die don't know is incredibly small in an given point of time.

OnWis97

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

No, won't is the word you were looking for.
The whole world agrees on how to begin fixing it, but your side WON'T accept what's obvious.

That is a fact. That is why Trump and friends are trying to tell everyone that it's not appropriate to talk about it at all.

pro-gunners always trots that line out every mass shooting. "can we not respect the fallen and wait until the bodies are no longer warm to talk about the issue?" blah blah BLAH. all in hopes that people will forget about it after their unknown predetermined amount of respect time. 

In other words, wait until America has moved on to who's going to win America's got Talent.

josevolution

tempo_n_groove said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

Yes there is a problem.

Why do people shoot each other so easily?

Why is killing so easy for people?

Why is this release of violence the only answer?

These are questions I'd ask and try to solve answers to.

we glorify killing in this country just start with holywood violence sells big time in this country ...

tempo_n_groove

josevolution said:

tempo_n_groove said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

Yes there is a problem.

Why do people shoot each other so easily?

Why is killing so easy for people?

Why is this release of violence the only answer?

These are questions I'd ask and try to solve answers to.

we glorify killing in this country just start with holywood violence sells big time in this country ...

That is make believe and not real life...

Is society not grasping reality and thinks everything is a movie or video game?  I don't buy that.  You grew up watching Tom & Jerry and they beat the hell out of each other.

josevolution

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

tempo_n_groove said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

Yes there is a problem.

Why do people shoot each other so easily?

Why is killing so easy for people?

Why is this release of violence the only answer?

These are questions I'd ask and try to solve answers to.

we glorify killing in this country just start with holywood violence sells big time in this country ...

That is make believe and not real life...

Is society not grasping reality and thinks everything is a movie or video game?  I don't buy that.  You grew up watching Tom & Jerry and they beat the hell out of each other.


Are you saying this country doesn't glorify guns and violence , i didn't say people can't tell real life from movies ...

brianlux

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

tempo_n_groove said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

Yes there is a problem.

Why do people shoot each other so easily?

Why is killing so easy for people?

Why is this release of violence the only answer?

These are questions I'd ask and try to solve answers to.

we glorify killing in this country just start with holywood violence sells big time in this country ...

That is make believe and not real life...

Is society not grasping reality and thinks everything is a movie or video game?  I don't buy that.  You grew up watching Tom & Jerry and they beat the hell out of each other.

Sadly, I think people do absorb a lot of what they watch on TV and become like that.  My brother and I used to watch The Three Stooges and then go around acting like Two Stooges and we hurt each other once in awhile in the process (and, OK, I confess, I still like The Three Stooges, haha!). 

Americans very much emulate what media and entertainment sells them.  That's why so many guys want to be "bad ass" and so many women want to be "babes" rather than feel good about being grown women and men.

And I also agree with the notion that many people at least subconsciously see life as a video game or movie.  We easily become what we immerse ourselves in.  Look at the crap on TV-- so much of it is dark and violent or just plain stupid.  America is becoming dark and violent and stupid.  I think there is a correlation. 

There are other choices.  We could immerse ourselves in good music.  To me, life is music.  I was once mildly chastised for one too many times mentioning how something reminded me of a song (I still do that but I keep it to myself).  Several years ago I said "analogue love songs can save the world".  It was sort of a joke but now I believe it.

mace1229

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

No, won't is the word you were looking for.
The whole world agrees on how to begin fixing it, but your side WON'T accept what's obvious.

That is a fact. That is why Trump and friends are trying to tell everyone that it's not appropriate to talk about it at all.

pro-gunners always trots that line out every mass shooting. "can we not respect the fallen and wait until the bodies are no longer warm to talk about the issue?" blah blah BLAH. all in hopes that people will forget about it after their unknown predetermined amount of respect time. 

I agree that it is a good time to talk about it after an incident like this. Only a guess, but I think its part of a fear that there will be an over-reaction based on emotion.
Sort of like how 99% of the country wanted to go to war on 9/12/2001 , but when asked 2 years later the majority thought we never should have gone to begin with.
So the result is to not talk about it until the emotions fade.

PJ_Soul

josevolution said:

tempo_n_groove said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

Yes there is a problem.

Why do people shoot each other so easily?

Why is killing so easy for people?

Why is this release of violence the only answer?

These are questions I'd ask and try to solve answers to.

we glorify killing in this country just start with holywood violence sells big time in this country ...

It's not Hollywood. All of the other developed countries have just as much exposure to Hollywood productions, it sells big time everywhere, yet the gun problem only exists in America.
It doesn't hurt to remember that this gun violence problem is pretty much an American man problem. I think that is a really important aspect to examine.

brianlux

mace1229 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

rgambs said:

mace1229 said:

goldrush said:

After the Clovis shooting in August it was reported that "This incident marked the 244th mass shooting in 2017, according to Gun Violence Archive. To put this into perspective, we are 240 days into the year. In short, the U.S. has had more mass shootings than days in 2017."

I just cannot get my head around this. How can so many people be convinced that there is no problem?

I don't know many who deny there's a problem. Its just we can't agree on how to fix it.

No, won't is the word you were looking for.
The whole world agrees on how to begin fixing it, but your side WON'T accept what's obvious.

That is a fact. That is why Trump and friends are trying to tell everyone that it's not appropriate to talk about it at all.

pro-gunners always trots that line out every mass shooting. "can we not respect the fallen and wait until the bodies are no longer warm to talk about the issue?" blah blah BLAH. all in hopes that people will forget about it after their unknown predetermined amount of respect time. 

I agree that it is a good time to talk about it after an incident like this. Only a guess, but I think its part of a fear that there will be an over-reaction based on emotion.
Sort of like how 99% of the country wanted to go to war on 9/12/2001 , but when asked 2 years later the majority thought we never should have gone to begin with.
So the result is to not talk about it until the emotions fade.

Interesting points and I'm not disagreeing and I don't mean to side-track too much but I wonder--  do we let the emotions fade too much?  Do we get callous and jaded over time? I was thinking about the Vietnam thread.  I'm not as pissed off about the war in Vietnam now as I was in 1960 or '71 or whatever, but when I think about was a travesty it was, I do feel pissed off that it happened, and I do feel remorse that guys I knew died and guysI know today who still suffer the consequences. I don't think we should too easily forget these terrible incidents or become too accustomed to them or become too jaded.