Donald Trump

tbergs

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Tiki said:

https://instagram.com/p/BnHEx6WlFkg/embed/

This alone should have sunk him.

I could have my kids make a collage on their walls to show how many things should have sunk him. Lots of air and buoyant material under that orange skin. Kind of looks like one of those inflatable rafts actually. That would explain it.

OnWis97

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

jeffbr said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

my2hands said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

When your only rebuttal is,”sad.” It’s, well, sad.

White Fox News Anchor Says Ron DeSantis's 'Monkey This Up' Comment Doesn't Sound Racist To Her - Newsweek https://apple.news/A-6gGp7B_TL6arTHgxz9LRw 

But it is Faux News afterall.

https://american-ledger.com/accountability/desantis-moderates-hate-filled-facebook-group-that-attacks-african-americans-parkland-survivors-and-muslims/

Well this sure monkeys up the argument it was an innocent slip of the tongue

that's definitely damning, no doubt about it. 

i will say, though, that many politicians make the mistake of blindly joining social media groups that pledge support to them without first vetting their content. But this doesn't look good. 

Yeah, perhaps if he was just a member of the Facebook group he could make a claim like that. But he wasn't just a member, he was an admin of the group. He was obviously actively involved enough with the group to be an admin/moderator. 

One would think, but he was 1 of 52 administrators. Not sure if you're aware of how that works... but any admin can make anyone else an administrator. With that many admins for a group, it's safe to assume that most of them were inactive admins and didn't give it a second thought. I've been a random admin in a bunch of FB groups, and I've never lifted a finger for most of them and really had nothing to do with the groups for the most part. I could still be an admin of some groups - I'm seriously not paying any attention. Now, I'm not defending any bad bahaviour, and certainly not defending this guy or any person for being in right wing nutzo FB groups at all. I'm just pointing out that being an admin like that doesn't necessarily mean much of anything, besides that the guy apparently tends to join right wing nut job FB groups (maybe whenever he's invited to by any random person; we don't even know if he reads any posts from the group).
..... Just trying to keep things even-keeled here, and not jump to conclusions, and view things objectively, that's all. If we want that from the right, then we need to practice it ourselves.

I was going to respond with this, but thought I'd come off as defending a little too hard. I agree with you that he easily could have been made an admin, and who knows if he was active or even knew he was. 

Halifax is right though, if he was aware of it, he's guilty of being a racist. if he wasn't aware of it, he's guilty of not being thorough enough to be a leader. 

It's not a court of law.  This may not "prove" he's a racist but it would be enough for me to not vote for him (not that I'd be likely to either way).  This walks, talks, and smells like a duck and I don't owe him the benefit of the doubt.

PJ_Soul

OnWis97 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

jeffbr said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

my2hands said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

When your only rebuttal is,”sad.” It’s, well, sad.

White Fox News Anchor Says Ron DeSantis's 'Monkey This Up' Comment Doesn't Sound Racist To Her - Newsweek https://apple.news/A-6gGp7B_TL6arTHgxz9LRw 

But it is Faux News afterall.

https://american-ledger.com/accountability/desantis-moderates-hate-filled-facebook-group-that-attacks-african-americans-parkland-survivors-and-muslims/

Well this sure monkeys up the argument it was an innocent slip of the tongue

that's definitely damning, no doubt about it. 

i will say, though, that many politicians make the mistake of blindly joining social media groups that pledge support to them without first vetting their content. But this doesn't look good. 

Yeah, perhaps if he was just a member of the Facebook group he could make a claim like that. But he wasn't just a member, he was an admin of the group. He was obviously actively involved enough with the group to be an admin/moderator. 

One would think, but he was 1 of 52 administrators. Not sure if you're aware of how that works... but any admin can make anyone else an administrator. With that many admins for a group, it's safe to assume that most of them were inactive admins and didn't give it a second thought. I've been a random admin in a bunch of FB groups, and I've never lifted a finger for most of them and really had nothing to do with the groups for the most part. I could still be an admin of some groups - I'm seriously not paying any attention. Now, I'm not defending any bad bahaviour, and certainly not defending this guy or any person for being in right wing nutzo FB groups at all. I'm just pointing out that being an admin like that doesn't necessarily mean much of anything, besides that the guy apparently tends to join right wing nut job FB groups (maybe whenever he's invited to by any random person; we don't even know if he reads any posts from the group).
..... Just trying to keep things even-keeled here, and not jump to conclusions, and view things objectively, that's all. If we want that from the right, then we need to practice it ourselves.

I was going to respond with this, but thought I'd come off as defending a little too hard. I agree with you that he easily could have been made an admin, and who knows if he was active or even knew he was. 

Halifax is right though, if he was aware of it, he's guilty of being a racist. if he wasn't aware of it, he's guilty of not being thorough enough to be a leader. 

It's not a court of law.  This may not "prove" he's a racist but it would be enough for me to not vote for him (not that I'd be likely to either way).  This walks, talks, and smells like a duck and I don't owe him the benefit of the doubt.

I'm not even arguing that he's not racist. He's with Team Trump, and Trump is calling him awesome or whatever - that alone makes me assume he's probably racist, lol. I think the issue is how to deal with these things objectively instead of with knee jerk reactions/assumptions.

Go Beavers

Interesting posts in twitter from someone on the monkey it up phrase. He said it has origins in auto shops, and that ‘monkey it up’ was a racist statement about screwing up the repair job. 

“When a redneck auto mechanic scolds a colleague for “monkeying something up,” it means he did the repair like a black person would do it”. 

PJPOWER

Maybe he just likes poorly written children’s movies, lol

https://m.imdb.com/title/tt4820278/

Kev - Coat and Keys

So the racist Florida guy ended up being a racist - how many more benefits of the doubt for Trumpism? 
As posted above with the insulting the disabled journalist everyone knew what was on offer very early and America went with it.

Good luck to anyone gambling on November's results (Blue wave or a white robes?).

tbergs

The economy has never been better, unemployment is at record lows, tax cuts made everyone wealthier and if Trump wasn't president we'd all be sorry, but yet no raises for Federal employees. Hmmm, that's odd? Oh wait, it really isn't.

"Despite the expanding economy and Republican control of Congress, the federal government is on track to rack up annual deficits in excess of $1 trillion in the coming years following a tax overhaul passed last year."

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-30/trump-stops-automatic-pay-raises-for-federal-workers-in-2019

Halifax2TheMax

Kev - Coat and Keys said:

So the racist Florida guy ended up being a racist - how many more benefits of the doubt for Trumpism? 
As posted above with the insulting the disabled journalist everyone knew what was on offer very early and America went with it.

Good luck to anyone gambling on November's results (Blue wave or a white robes?).

White robes it is.

Most Donald Trump Voters Don't Think Using the N-Word Is Racist, Or Even Offensive, New Poll Indicates - Newsweek https://apple.news/AW6hII5xFQaGQ6SlkZGwACg

PJ_Soul

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

another person I work with, a woman in her 50's, is constantly making comments about "those aboriginals" or "all the asians" blah blah blah. She honestly thinks she is not being racist because she believes all of "them" do (insert behaviour). And then I get told to calm down when I call her on it. The passive agressive nature of it always gets me. 

HughFreakingDillon

Kev - Coat and Keys said:

So the racist Florida guy ended up being a racist - how many more benefits of the doubt for Trumpism? 
As posted above with the insulting the disabled journalist everyone knew what was on offer very early and America went with it.

Good luck to anyone gambling on November's results (Blue wave or a white robes?).

sorry, I'm not willing to paint an entire group of people as racist simply because of their association to their leader. he said something that could have been taken more than one way; he ended up being guilty of it (I believe), but that doesn't make everyone else somehow smarter. we all had a 50/50 chance of being correct. 

I give all individuals the benefit of the doubt until they give me reason not to. 

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

another person I work with, a woman in her 50's, is constantly making comments about "those aboriginals" or "all the asians" blah blah blah. She honestly thinks she is not being racist because she believes all of "them" do (insert behaviour). And then I get told to calm down when I call her on it. The passive agressive nature of it always gets me. 

Yeah, unfortunately my mom is like this, and when I call her on it she says that I just don't get it, lol. My sister is like this too, but worse and more blatant (and I feel like my sister is teaching it to her kids). Still they both have friends who are the ethnicities they are racist about, so figure that one out, lol ... My dad isn't, but he's totally anti-immigrant anyhow, because he doesn't want anything to develop anymore. No more population growth, nothing. He just wants everything to be like it was in the 60s... when he first immigrated here. .... Actually, I take that back. He is apparently xenophobic at least. He recently started babbling about how the government should never have allowed this big Sikh Temple to be built somewhat near his neighborhood (although across a city line from him), and that they should have been forced to build it in some small town in the middle of nowhere so that all the Sikhs wouldn't have flocked to the area. And somehow they all caused the affordability crisis, lol .... I accused him of being racist, he denied it, and I asked him if he would have the same weirdo fascist idea if it were an Anglican Church that attracted a bunch of white people from the UK, and he said, "Well, that depends. It would be okay if they're the posh types."
... That was a fucking fun conversation. My family can be difficult, lol.

Kev - Coat and Keys

HughFreakingDillon said:

Kev - Coat and Keys said:

So the racist Florida guy ended up being a racist - how many more benefits of the doubt for Trumpism? 
As posted above with the insulting the disabled journalist everyone knew what was on offer very early and America went with it.

Good luck to anyone gambling on November's results (Blue wave or a white robes?).

sorry, I'm not willing to paint an entire group of people as racist simply because of their association to their leader. he said something that could have been taken more than one way; he ended up being guilty of it (I believe), but that doesn't make everyone else somehow smarter. we all had a 50/50 chance of being correct. 

I give all individuals the benefit of the doubt until they give me reason not to. 

Well I have no issue with giving people the benefit of the doubt - as a Florida Republican the guy could easily just be dumb!
And I hope that all of society can think the best in people and not jump to attack over small things like odd word usage.
But I am sorry any Pro-Trump person is now tainted with his evil hatred, and lets be honest it is kinda all he has left to keep any support. 
Policy ain't that boys strong point.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

another person I work with, a woman in her 50's, is constantly making comments about "those aboriginals" or "all the asians" blah blah blah. She honestly thinks she is not being racist because she believes all of "them" do (insert behaviour). And then I get told to calm down when I call her on it. The passive agressive nature of it always gets me. 

Yeah, unfortunately my mom is like this, and when I call her on it she says that I just don't get it, lol. My sister is like this too, but worse and more blatant (and I feel like my sister is teaching it to her kids) ... My dad isn't, but he's totally anti-immigrant anyhow, because he doesn't want anything to develop anymore. No more population growth, nothing. He just wants everything to be like it was in the 60s... when he first immigrated here. .... Actually, I take that back. He is apparently xenophobic at least. He recently started babbling about how the government should never have allowed this big Sikh Temple to be built somewhat near his neighborhood (although across a city line from him), and that they should have been forced to build it in some small town in the middle of nowhere so that all the Sikhs wouldn't have flocked to the area. And somehow they all caused the affordability crisis, lol .... I accused him of being racist, he denied it, and I asked him if he would have the same weirdo fascist idea if it were an Anglican Church that attracted a bunch of white people from the UK, and he said, "Well, that depends. It would be okay if they're the posh types."
... That was a fucking fun conversation. My family can be difficult, lol.

"the posh types".

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

another person I work with, a woman in her 50's, is constantly making comments about "those aboriginals" or "all the asians" blah blah blah. She honestly thinks she is not being racist because she believes all of "them" do (insert behaviour). And then I get told to calm down when I call her on it. The passive agressive nature of it always gets me. 

Yeah, unfortunately my mom is like this, and when I call her on it she says that I just don't get it, lol. My sister is like this too, but worse and more blatant (and I feel like my sister is teaching it to her kids) ... My dad isn't, but he's totally anti-immigrant anyhow, because he doesn't want anything to develop anymore. No more population growth, nothing. He just wants everything to be like it was in the 60s... when he first immigrated here. .... Actually, I take that back. He is apparently xenophobic at least. He recently started babbling about how the government should never have allowed this big Sikh Temple to be built somewhat near his neighborhood (although across a city line from him), and that they should have been forced to build it in some small town in the middle of nowhere so that all the Sikhs wouldn't have flocked to the area. And somehow they all caused the affordability crisis, lol .... I accused him of being racist, he denied it, and I asked him if he would have the same weirdo fascist idea if it were an Anglican Church that attracted a bunch of white people from the UK, and he said, "Well, that depends. It would be okay if they're the posh types."
... That was a fucking fun conversation. My family can be difficult, lol.

"the posh types".

I know, I think my jaw hit the floor when he said that - All of a sudden he became a serious elitist too - it really took me by surprise.

benjs

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

another person I work with, a woman in her 50's, is constantly making comments about "those aboriginals" or "all the asians" blah blah blah. She honestly thinks she is not being racist because she believes all of "them" do (insert behaviour). And then I get told to calm down when I call her on it. The passive agressive nature of it always gets me. 

Yeah, unfortunately my mom is like this, and when I call her on it she says that I just don't get it, lol. My sister is like this too, but worse and more blatant (and I feel like my sister is teaching it to her kids). Still they both have friends who are the ethnicities they are racist about, so figure that one out, lol ... My dad isn't, but he's totally anti-immigrant anyhow, because he doesn't want anything to develop anymore. No more population growth, nothing. He just wants everything to be like it was in the 60s... when he first immigrated here. .... Actually, I take that back. He is apparently xenophobic at least. He recently started babbling about how the government should never have allowed this big Sikh Temple to be built somewhat near his neighborhood (although across a city line from him), and that they should have been forced to build it in some small town in the middle of nowhere so that all the Sikhs wouldn't have flocked to the area. And somehow they all caused the affordability crisis, lol .... I accused him of being racist, he denied it, and I asked him if he would have the same weirdo fascist idea if it were an Anglican Church that attracted a bunch of white people from the UK, and he said, "Well, that depends. It would be okay if they're the posh types."
... That was a fucking fun conversation. My family can be difficult, lol.

...Was the mailman a liberal by any chance? 

PJ_Soul

benjs said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

Most racists don't actually think they're racist. They figure 1) everyone else is too sensitive, and 2) that their issues with whoever they're racist towards are completely justified, and that makes whatever hate or bigotry they feel simple common sense and/or the acknowledgement of fact, and therefore not racist. I've seen racists who don't know they're racist work their way around it first hand - it's really fucking frustrating. Now I've never met one of these "non-racist racists" who would claim the N-word isn't racist... I'm not quite sure how that works in their head. I guess they are just going with option #1? It's just a word and everyone is being too sensitive? I would suggest that the racists who actually think that - the ones who are unwilling to acknowledge or incapable of understanding historical context - are probably the dumbest of all the racists.

another person I work with, a woman in her 50's, is constantly making comments about "those aboriginals" or "all the asians" blah blah blah. She honestly thinks she is not being racist because she believes all of "them" do (insert behaviour). And then I get told to calm down when I call her on it. The passive agressive nature of it always gets me. 

Yeah, unfortunately my mom is like this, and when I call her on it she says that I just don't get it, lol. My sister is like this too, but worse and more blatant (and I feel like my sister is teaching it to her kids). Still they both have friends who are the ethnicities they are racist about, so figure that one out, lol ... My dad isn't, but he's totally anti-immigrant anyhow, because he doesn't want anything to develop anymore. No more population growth, nothing. He just wants everything to be like it was in the 60s... when he first immigrated here. .... Actually, I take that back. He is apparently xenophobic at least. He recently started babbling about how the government should never have allowed this big Sikh Temple to be built somewhat near his neighborhood (although across a city line from him), and that they should have been forced to build it in some small town in the middle of nowhere so that all the Sikhs wouldn't have flocked to the area. And somehow they all caused the affordability crisis, lol .... I accused him of being racist, he denied it, and I asked him if he would have the same weirdo fascist idea if it were an Anglican Church that attracted a bunch of white people from the UK, and he said, "Well, that depends. It would be okay if they're the posh types."
... That was a fucking fun conversation. My family can be difficult, lol.

...Was the mailman a liberal by any chance? 

I'm not sure, but here's a photo of him:

josevolution

Trump cancels pay raises for almost 2 million federal workers - POLITICO https://apple.news/AQ7fdJNaBRsCqvBulpuCwUg
lol I’m glad those ICE employees are getting the shaft ...

The Juggler

Gee, this doesn’t sound good for the president:

The Juggler