Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
But trumpeters are so down with it! They don't care? As evidenced by the memes posted, they're still afraid of the elimination of the white race. After all, they just want their country back. Speaking of which, it's been eight years, right? Just about, right? Anyone been to a FEMA camp? How about had your guns confiscated? Maybe saw UN troops occupying Main Street? Oh, oh, oh, I know, been before a death panel and had your life taken away? Maybe seen the economy crash and the country go bankrupt because of Fed policies and socialist, Marxist, communist, Kenyan policies ruining the economy? Oh, oh, oh, wait, wait, wait, it's the millions, millions, millions of illegals that have been granted amnesty and keep flooding across our borders and taking over? Oh, no, no, no, I know what it is, gay marriage and all those happy loving couples have brought on the End of Days? Well, it is pretty windy out and temps are in the single digits, minuses with wind chill, so it must be climate change is a hoax?
Yup, it's been almost eight years and not one of your single fantasies came true. You're as delusional as suicide bombers and 101 virgins, virgins, virgins!!!
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
Exactly. A government is only as self-serving as its options.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
Exactly. A government is only as self-serving as its options.
so ... it's okay to start a war in a sovereign country because they can? ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
Exactly. A government is only as self-serving as its options.
so ... it's okay to start a war in a sovereign country because they can? ...
I'm not sure I see the correlation between my comment and your response. Let me try to explain my thoughts a bit better (and this is all opinion, not fact). My feeling is that international actions don't exist in a vacuum, and nefarious actors are plentiful. Thus, unless you globally (and successfully) outlaw nefarious actions, the reality is that taking the moral high ground risks putting a nation at a strategic disadvantage compared to other nefarious actors who continue to ignore the humanitarian angle of an action (which is a serious problem and makes it harder for morality and strategy to coexist in a powerful nation's government). It is an elected politician's obligation to unilaterally protect its populace from actions from foreign players which aspire to circumvent the nation's rule of law, and a failure to do so is a violation of the unofficial obligation of a government agent. Once again, it all boils down to this: until you can mandate humanitarianism and morality in government positions globally, it will be exceptionally hard to find politicians who will take on that mandate willingly - and even harder for them to find success in those metrics.
'05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
Exactly. A government is only as self-serving as its options.
so ... it's okay to start a war in a sovereign country because they can? ...
I'm not sure I see the correlation between my comment and your response. Let me try to explain my thoughts a bit better (and this is all opinion, not fact). My feeling is that international actions don't exist in a vacuum, and nefarious actors are plentiful. Thus, unless you globally (and successfully) outlaw nefarious actions, the reality is that taking the moral high ground risks putting a nation at a strategic disadvantage compared to other nefarious actors who continue to ignore the humanitarian angle of an action (which is a serious problem and makes it harder for morality and strategy to coexist in a powerful nation's government). It is an elected politician's obligation to unilaterally protect its populace from actions from foreign players which aspire to circumvent the nation's rule of law, and a failure to do so is a violation of the unofficial obligation of a government agent. Once again, it all boils down to this: until you can mandate humanitarianism and morality in government positions globally, it will be exceptionally hard to find politicians who will take on that mandate willingly - and even harder for them to find success in those metrics.
the correlation is that mrussel claimed that the only reasons certain countries involve themselves in other countries is because they have the power to do so which you seem to agree with ... my comment is tied into the fact that this so called involvement can involve starting wars which is what we are seeing in Syria ..
laws already exist that is meant to protect sovereign nations ... they mean nothing tho in a world of globalization where those laws have no enforcement protocol ... if the most powerful country in the world can arbitrarily ignore international law ... it's pretty useless ...
the issue here is whether the populace understands what is being done by their gov't in their interests ... i really don't think so ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
Question 3
Is it more atrocious egregious to kill your own people or to kill someone else's people?
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
that is simply not true ... it's part of the propaganda campaign put forth by the mainstream media ... again - go to the syria and US thread and see the links we've put up ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
Question 3
Is it more atrocious egregious to kill your own people or to kill someone else's people?
Historically, it's far more atrocious to kill your own people. If your own leaders kill your people, you don't have a tenable country. Both violate the 7th Commandment though, from a morality standpoint.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
Exactly. A government is only as self-serving as its options.
so ... it's okay to start a war in a sovereign country because they can? ...
I'm not sure I see the correlation between my comment and your response. Let me try to explain my thoughts a bit better (and this is all opinion, not fact). My feeling is that international actions don't exist in a vacuum, and nefarious actors are plentiful. Thus, unless you globally (and successfully) outlaw nefarious actions, the reality is that taking the moral high ground risks putting a nation at a strategic disadvantage compared to other nefarious actors who continue to ignore the humanitarian angle of an action (which is a serious problem and makes it harder for morality and strategy to coexist in a powerful nation's government). It is an elected politician's obligation to unilaterally protect its populace from actions from foreign players which aspire to circumvent the nation's rule of law, and a failure to do so is a violation of the unofficial obligation of a government agent. Once again, it all boils down to this: until you can mandate humanitarianism and morality in government positions globally, it will be exceptionally hard to find politicians who will take on that mandate willingly - and even harder for them to find success in those metrics.
the correlation is that mrussel claimed that the only reasons certain countries involve themselves in other countries is because they have the power to do so which you seem to agree with ... my comment is tied into the fact that this so called involvement can involve starting wars which is what we are seeing in Syria ..
laws already exist that is meant to protect sovereign nations ... they mean nothing tho in a world of globalization where those laws have no enforcement protocol ... if the most powerful country in the world can arbitrarily ignore international law ... it's pretty useless ...
the issue here is whether the populace understands what is being done by their gov't in their interests ... i really don't think so ...
For the record, I'm not saying it's the only reason. I'm saying these are the countries we know do this and it's because they have the power to do so. I'm sure many more would like to do so. I would also be pleasantly surprised if countries like Canada, Denmark, Ireland, Spain and many others are not involved as well. The difference is that I think their agencies feed the US, UK, France, etc., information that they know is being used in espionage and counter-espionage.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
Question 3
Is it more atrocious egregious to kill your own people or to kill someone else's people?
Historically, it's far more atrocious to kill your own people. If your own leaders kill your people, you don't have a tenable country. Both violate the 7th Commandment though, from a morality standpoint.
in 2014 ... assad won almost 90% of the vote from a population that turned out to vote ... over 74% turnout ... he is overwhelmingly supported in his country ... it's the same BS that has people believing Castro killed innocent people regularly in Cuba ...
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
Question 3
Is it more atrocious egregious to kill your own people or to kill someone else's people?
Historically, it's far more atrocious to kill your own people. If your own leaders kill your people, you don't have a tenable country. Both violate the 7th Commandment though, from a morality standpoint.
in 2014 ... assad won almost 90% of the vote from a population that turned out to vote ... over 74% turnout ... he is overwhelmingly supported in his country ... it's the same BS that has people believing Castro killed innocent people regularly in Cuba ...
You are quoting presidential election numbers for a dictator? If 90% of the Syrians supported Assad, why did the FSA even form? Why was the army sent all over the country to all the major cities to quell protests starting in 2012? Why would 1000,000 soldiers and officers defect from a leader with 90% approval? How could a group with less than 10% support (assuming everyone voting against him believed in rebellion) hold a city like Aleppo? Something seems amiss with those election numbers. Politicians with 90% support do not have their country fall apart and gas their own citizens.
Yeah no shit... And as if we should be okay with Russia interfering with our elections. I don't give a damn if it's hypocritical or not.
and that's why many considered this past election as having the two worst candidates ever ... because people continue to turn a blind eye to the truths they don't really want to hear ... people just want to hear and only listen to the things that meet their biases ...
No, that's not at all what I mean. It means I'm fully aware of how the US government, through covert and overt actions, have attempted to influence and install governments for the past 100 years. But that doesn't mean I'm going to say "Oh, I know we do it so I can't really be mad at Russia". Every country has the right to be furious at the US. I have the right to be furious at Russia. The difference is that we can do something about it. Fuck them. Fuck Russia. Fuck Russia in particular. They have butchered my people for 300+ years.
the problem is that the only thing you are interested in having change is the intervention in your own system ... you may acknowledge the role of US imperialistic actions but you aren't doing anything about it ...
I'm not naive. You aren't going to get to a place where governments are not interfering. It's been done since the times of the Greeks. I guess I'm a little pessimistic about changing human nature. I don't blame the Russians for doing what they did, but I do blame Trump for his actions (or inaction) regarding this issue.
the majority of democratic gov'ts around the world do not engage in regime change and covert actions ... really, those countries that do can be narrowed down to the US, Israel, Russia, China, UK and France ...
AKA the countries with the resources to do it...
back and forth, thread to thread!
sooo ... basically, damn the russians for hacking a server and releasing information that ignorant voters don't really understand but oh well to the US funding terrorists groups in the middle east?
That's a different strategy... that's "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Russians did it in Vietnam, we did it in Afghanistan. Proxy war shit.
wow ... what a sad fucking day for humanity when people just casually shrug off a war that has already resulted in 500,000 dead and the displacement of 7 million people who have lost everything ... fucking disgusting ...
Who is shrugging it off? You're totally on a different point and discussion. If you want to discuss Vietnam, I'm willing to do so. No one is defending that shitty war that killed 50k Americans and over a million Vietnamese. We were discussing the US government influencing elections and governments. And I was saying that I was pissed that the Russians did it to us, and our President-elect doesn't seem to give a shit.
i'm talking about what you guys have been doing for the last 2 decades in the middle east including what is going on in syria now and yemen ...
Syria is not our doing, to my knowledge. And that is an ugly situation which has no "good' or evidently righteous answer. If we step in with the rebels, we are at another proxy war with Russia. And what happens if the Rebels win? It becomes another stronghold for ISIS. And Russians/Al-Assad regime are clearly evil so helping them is not a good option either.
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
Syria is definitely US doing ... you guys are funding and arming the rebels and your media companies are facilitating the propaganda campaign against assad ... go to the syria and us thread if you want to read more ...
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
But Assad is a butcher. He gasses and kills his own people. Is that okay??
Question 3
Is it more atrocious egregious to kill your own people or to kill someone else's people?
Historically, it's far more atrocious to kill your own people. If your own leaders kill your people, you don't have a tenable country. Both violate the 7th Commandment though, from a morality standpoint.
in 2014 ... assad won almost 90% of the vote from a population that turned out to vote ... over 74% turnout ... he is overwhelmingly supported in his country ... it's the same BS that has people believing Castro killed innocent people regularly in Cuba ...
You are quoting presidential election numbers for a dictator? If 90% of the Syrians supported Assad, why did the FSA even form? Why was the army sent all over the country to all the major cities to quell protests starting in 2012? Why would 1000,000 soldiers and officers defect from a leader with 90% approval? How could a group with less than 10% support (assuming everyone voting against him believed in rebellion) hold a city like Aleppo? Something seems amiss with those election numbers. Politicians with 90% support do not have their country fall apart and gas their own citizens.
i could answer those questions for you easily ... but these are the exact same questions I asked myself ... and again - i took the time to research this ... and if you did the same with any kind of objectivity - you will see that the FSA is essentially a terrorist group being armed by the US; ISIS - which is a supposed enemy controls more of Syria than FSA ... and that 1 million soldiers did not defect the syrian army ...
this has and always was a black ops operation conducted by US and other countries to overthrow Assad and his sovereign country ... it's been the MO of US foreign policy for decades ... it's what you guys do ...
Comments
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Yup, it's been almost eight years and not one of your single fantasies came true. You're as delusional as suicide bombers and 101 virgins, virgins, virgins!!!
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
back and forth, thread to thread!
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Define interfering?
Who said its okay?
EV
Toronto Film Festival 9/11/2007, '08 - Toronto 1 & 2, '09 - Albany 1, '11 - Chicago 1
Regardless, that wasn't the point of the topic. You are talking about the mid-East but the discussion was about Russia's hacking I believe.
again - i already acknowledged my role in the off topic nature but it was tied into the discussion about mainstream media and I simply responded to that ...
laws already exist that is meant to protect sovereign nations ... they mean nothing tho in a world of globalization where those laws have no enforcement protocol ... if the most powerful country in the world can arbitrarily ignore international law ... it's pretty useless ...
the issue here is whether the populace understands what is being done by their gov't in their interests ... i really don't think so ...
Is it more atrocious egregious to kill your own people or to kill someone else's people?
this has and always was a black ops operation conducted by US and other countries to overthrow Assad and his sovereign country ... it's been the MO of US foreign policy for decades ... it's what you guys do ...