Are social issues nearly as important as issues like biodiversity and climate?
Comments
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I give them, not take them.PJfanwillneverleave1 said:
Am I reading this right? You want a purple nurple?hedonist said:
Am I reading this right? Because someone comments on social or lighter issues means there's no care about other topics to the satisfaction of a few? It's not necessarily about it being "not having time for X" but more about dealing with the other wondrous and overwhelming shit that life gives us.brianlux said:
I doubt you can change the world, Gambs, and Simon isn't old enough to and I sure can't. It has to be a team effort. What kind of gets me is that so many say they don't have time for these issues and yet most of us here on AMT seem to have take a lot of time to discuss social issues not to mention aliens or Bruce Jenner's sex change or Bill Cosby's status as womanizer. Not sure how to twist that into an explanation.rgambs said:I used to be much more into activism than I am now... Nowadays I am no longer focused on changing the world, I only try to change myself. I hope that I can be an example for Simon, and maybe he will have the will and the means that I lack to change the world. Some days I feel like I need to do more, but, in all honesty, most days I feel like I am doing more on my isolated little farm than I ever did writing legislators, donating money, marching, or preaching to friends, family, and acquaintances.
In my 20s I came up with a saying that I stuck with... No excuses, just explanations.
Fits well here.
So maybe no one here is owed an explanation. Shit, I talk about what I want. Have fun here or pontificate (or try to) or have heavy time, it's our own business. It's my business. No one else's.
That's not twisting, at least to me.
(purple nurples are a different story though)0 -
Absolutely. Good point.Free said:
We vote with our dollars every day.dignin said:
On point Brian. That's why I don't buy the argument by some on here that they have enough trouble worrying about the day to day. That's an excuse. Voting is just one way to change things, activism is another. Putting our heads in the sand and saying "Well the problem is too big and I want to have fun while I'm still around" is the reason were in this mess to begin with, and completely irresponsible and a shitty thing to do to the next generations.brianlux said:
This especially works if we take the time to let our gov. officials know what we want and they are qualified enough to know what's best for the world. That doesn't happen enough on either end.dignin said:
This is exactly why we have government. We worry about our day to day while they can use our tax dollars and regulation to tackle the bigger things in life.rgambs said:
I understand what you are saying, and in the grandest, biggest scale, I completely agree. When you scale it down to individuals who have true suffering to deal with, it's hard to imagine they will place the Panamanian Golden Frog on the same level importance as they struggles that keep them mired.brianlux said:
But about the rest of animal life? Are we the only ones who count? Anthropocentric thinking only sees life, our planet and the universe from a human perspective. Biocentric thinking sees all of it as all encompassing, all valuable and all interconnected. Many people think we are more important or above all other life. The irony is that such a limited viewpoint is actually counter productive to our own well being!rgambs said:The way I see it, you sort of have the analogy backward. Worrying about the environment when you can't afford food or can't marry and direct the medical care of the person you love deeply is like worrying about painting the eaves on a house that is burning down around you.
Social and socioeconomic issues have direct, tangible effects on a person's well-being and happiness. Environmental issues are a distant concern, even with changing climate and desperately shrinking biodiversity, the time has not yet come when those issues will impact us all in painful, unforgettable ways.
It sucks, we are a short-sighted race of fools.
But don't listen to me, Gambs. I really do encourage you to check out E. O. Wilson's book!
Let's take climate change for example. Here's how Wilson opens the chapter on climate change:
"Having risen above all the biosphere, set to alter everything everywhere, the wrathful demon of climate change is our child that we left unrestrained for too long. By using the atmosphere as the carbon dump of the Industrial Revolution, and pressing on without caution, humanity has raised the concentration of greenhouse gasses , primarily carbon dioxide and methane, to a dangerous level." (Half Earth, p. 65)
Why did this happen? Because a) too many have refused to acknowledge for too long that this is what we have done and b) too few have spoken out about doing something to change the situation and c) too many of our governing officials have relented to big business which stands to lose money if they admit this is a problem.
We need more people to be aware and involved and we need to tell our governing people what we want which (I hope) is a world suited for both human and non-human life.0 -
We have a garden. We recycle everything. We don't let our cars idle. We buy free range meats and eggs. We do all the little things we can to leave as minimal ecological footprint as we might while we enjoy our days in this rock in the middle of space.
That's it. If people think we should be doing more... I'd respectfully say 'no we won't'. We like to travel and we buy things we don't necessarily need at times.
We're never going to go off the grid and live as modestly as we might. But as it may be... we're not alone: the only people truly and consistently doing what they should for the environment in North America are the Amish.
So, if there is an Amish person commenting on this thread... I tip my hat to you and say the earth thanks you."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
^^^
Now now thirty you shall and you will do more.
Save the world!0 -
No one here is owed an explanation. Everyone is free to talk about whatever the heck they want (withing forum guidelines, of course). What you and everyone else here does is certainly yours and their business, not mine.hedonist said:
Am I reading this right? Because someone comments on social or lighter issues means there's no care about other topics to the satisfaction of a few? It's not necessarily about it being "not having time for X" but more about dealing with the other wondrous and overwhelming shit that life gives us.brianlux said:
I doubt you can change the world, Gambs, and Simon isn't old enough to and I sure can't. It has to be a team effort. What kind of gets me is that so many say they don't have time for these issues and yet most of us here on AMT seem to have take a lot of time to discuss social issues not to mention aliens or Bruce Jenner's sex change or Bill Cosby's status as womanizer. Not sure how to twist that into an explanation.rgambs said:I used to be much more into activism than I am now... Nowadays I am no longer focused on changing the world, I only try to change myself. I hope that I can be an example for Simon, and maybe he will have the will and the means that I lack to change the world. Some days I feel like I need to do more, but, in all honesty, most days I feel like I am doing more on my isolated little farm than I ever did writing legislators, donating money, marching, or preaching to friends, family, and acquaintances.
In my 20s I came up with a saying that I stuck with... No excuses, just explanations.
Fits well here.
So maybe no one here is owed an explanation. Shit, I talk about what I want. Have fun here or pontificate (or try to) or have heavy time, it's our own business. It's my business. No one else's.
That's not twisting, at least to me.
(purple nurples are a different story though)
Hedo, all I was doing was responding as honestly as I can. I throw ideas out and hope some are worthy and useful but I'm not out to tell people what to do. I'm not perfect either. I'm no one's boss except my own. I can't make people do what I think is best. I'm not an anything-Nazi. I say what I think and I spend a lot of time thinking about what I say. That's all- nothing more, nothing less."It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
I'm half-Amish. Does that count? And if so, how do you tip half a hat?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:We have a garden. We recycle everything. We don't let our cars idle. We buy free range meats and eggs. We do all the little things we can to leave as minimal ecological footprint as we might while we enjoy our days in this rock in the middle of space.
That's it. If people think we should be doing more... I'd respectfully say 'no we won't'. We like to travel and we buy things we don't necessarily need at times.
We're never going to go off the grid and live as modestly as we might. But as it may be... we're not alone: the only people truly and consistently doing what they should for the environment in North America are the Amish.
So, if there is an Amish person commenting on this thread... I tip my hat to you and say the earth thanks you.
Thirty, all the things you do are great. Of course you are in a minority. I would probably be bummed to see a poll that tally's the percentages of people who recycle most of their stuff, compost, ride share or take public transportation etc., etc., etc.
But I hope you get a chance to check out Wilson's book. What he and others, particularly Wildlands Network and Sea Shepherds, are telling us we need to do is give nature an opportunity to heal and most ecosystems today need healing badly and soon or all of this becomes irrelevant. Letting nature heal is more than recycling and composting. It is about creating more wildlands and connecting existing wildlands and doing more to defend against species die off. The best place to start with that is to develop a stronger understanding of biodiversity and seek what we can do to help keep species numbers from collapsing. The core problems we and the rest of life face are climate change, species die off, fresh water concerns, over-population and pollution. Those are facts, scientifically proven facts.
I'm not saying anyone here should do this or that but I do think it is worth taking the time explain and better understand those serious situations: climate change, species die off, fresh water concerns, over-population and pollution.
My premise throughout this thread is that too few people understand or care to do much about these problems. I am not criticizing anyone in particular (other than myself which I have done) or, as much as I hope people will take action, I'm not telling people what to do. I'm just putting out some information I believe to be true and see if maybe we can act on it.
Oh, and plugging what I believe is one hell of a good book.
That's it! Good night!"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
A half is pretty awesome, Brian. You get a tip of the cap!brianlux said:
I'm half-Amish. Does that count? And if so, how do you tip half a hat?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:We have a garden. We recycle everything. We don't let our cars idle. We buy free range meats and eggs. We do all the little things we can to leave as minimal ecological footprint as we might while we enjoy our days in this rock in the middle of space.
That's it. If people think we should be doing more... I'd respectfully say 'no we won't'. We like to travel and we buy things we don't necessarily need at times.
We're never going to go off the grid and live as modestly as we might. But as it may be... we're not alone: the only people truly and consistently doing what they should for the environment in North America are the Amish.
So, if there is an Amish person commenting on this thread... I tip my hat to you and say the earth thanks you.
Thirty, all the things you do are great. Of course you are in a minority. I would probably be bummed to see a poll that tally's the percentages of people who recycle most of their stuff, compost, ride share or take public transportation etc., etc., etc.
But I hope you get a chance to check out Wilson's book. What he and others, particularly Wildlands Network and Sea Shepherds, are telling us we need to do is give nature an opportunity to heal and most ecosystems today need healing badly and soon or all of this becomes irrelevant. Letting nature heal is more than recycling and composting. It is about creating more wildlands and connecting existing wildlands and doing more to defend against species die off. The best place to start with that is to develop a stronger understanding of biodiversity and seek what we can do to help keep species numbers from collapsing. The core problems we and the rest of life face are climate change, species die off, fresh water concerns, over-population and pollution. Those are facts, scientifically proven facts.
I'm not saying anyone here should do this or that but I do think it is worth taking the time explain and better understand those serious situations: climate change, species die off, fresh water concerns, over-population and pollution.
My premise throughout this thread is that too few people understand or care to do much about these problems. I am not criticizing anyone in particular (other than myself which I have done) or, as much as I hope people will take action, I'm not telling people what to do. I'm just putting out some information I believe to be true and see if maybe we can act on it.
Oh, and plugging what I believe is one hell of a good book.
That's it! Good night!
I guess the point I was trying to make was that our household is conscious of the environment, but we're kind of trapped in a lifestyle that isn't helping- and enjoying the lifestyle (selfishly I guess). We do what we can and don't mind doing it, but we are doing more harm than good with our ecological footprint."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
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Had not heard of them, Free. The video doesn't explain much about them so I looked them up. Their website says, "B Corp is to business what Fair Trade certification is to coffee or USDA Organic certification is to milk.Free said:
B Corps are for-profit companies certified by the nonprofit B Lab to meet rigorous standards of social and environmental performance, accountability, and transparency."
Will check into them more, thanks!"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
Also called benefit corporations, Brian. I Believe so, anyway.0
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I always appreciate your honesty, but your other post *edit - came off to me as a bit judge-y, especially with the italicized part. So some want to talk about potential ET stuff, transgender stuff, and (seems weird to put that in with this) the possible drugging and raping of women (which in Cosby's or anything's realm isn't even a "social" issue. It's just a big issue). It is what it is, and we're here for our own reasons. I guess we participate and chime in here and there for the same.brianlux said:
No one here is owed an explanation. Everyone is free to talk about whatever the heck they want (withing forum guidelines, of course). What you and everyone else here does is certainly yours and their business, not mine.hedonist said:
Am I reading this right? Because someone comments on social or lighter issues means there's no care about other topics to the satisfaction of a few? It's not necessarily about it being "not having time for X" but more about dealing with the other wondrous and overwhelming shit that life gives us.brianlux said:
I doubt you can change the world, Gambs, and Simon isn't old enough to and I sure can't. It has to be a team effort. What kind of gets me is that so many say they don't have time for these issues and yet most of us here on AMT seem to have take a lot of time to discuss social issues not to mention aliens or Bruce Jenner's sex change or Bill Cosby's status as womanizer. Not sure how to twist that into an explanation.rgambs said:I used to be much more into activism than I am now... Nowadays I am no longer focused on changing the world, I only try to change myself. I hope that I can be an example for Simon, and maybe he will have the will and the means that I lack to change the world. Some days I feel like I need to do more, but, in all honesty, most days I feel like I am doing more on my isolated little farm than I ever did writing legislators, donating money, marching, or preaching to friends, family, and acquaintances.
In my 20s I came up with a saying that I stuck with... No excuses, just explanations.
Fits well here.
So maybe no one here is owed an explanation. Shit, I talk about what I want. Have fun here or pontificate (or try to) or have heavy time, it's our own business. It's my business. No one else's.
That's not twisting, at least to me.
(purple nurples are a different story though)
Hedo, all I was doing was responding as honestly as I can. I throw ideas out and hope some are worthy and useful but I'm not out to tell people what to do. I'm not perfect either. I'm no one's boss except my own. I can't make people do what I think is best. I'm not an anything-Nazi. I say what I think and I spend a lot of time thinking about what I say. That's all- nothing more, nothing less.
If I didn't respect you, really wouldn't give a shit. Figure our respective cents' worth are...worthy.Post edited by hedonist on0 -
My apologies for sounding judgemental. Not meaning to be! I am generally most critical of my own short-comings.hedonist said:
I always appreciate your honesty, but your other post *edit - came off to me as a bit judge-y, especially with the italicized part. So some want to talk about potential ET stuff, transgender stuff, and (seems weird to put that in with this) the possible drugging and raping of women (which in Cosby's or anything's realm isn't even a "social" issue. It's just a big issue). It is what it is, and we're here for our own reasons. I guess we participate and chime in here and there for the same.brianlux said:
No one here is owed an explanation. Everyone is free to talk about whatever the heck they want (withing forum guidelines, of course). What you and everyone else here does is certainly yours and their business, not mine.hedonist said:
Am I reading this right? Because someone comments on social or lighter issues means there's no care about other topics to the satisfaction of a few? It's not necessarily about it being "not having time for X" but more about dealing with the other wondrous and overwhelming shit that life gives us.brianlux said:
I doubt you can change the world, Gambs, and Simon isn't old enough to and I sure can't. It has to be a team effort. What kind of gets me is that so many say they don't have time for these issues and yet most of us here on AMT seem to have take a lot of time to discuss social issues not to mention aliens or Bruce Jenner's sex change or Bill Cosby's status as womanizer. Not sure how to twist that into an explanation.rgambs said:I used to be much more into activism than I am now... Nowadays I am no longer focused on changing the world, I only try to change myself. I hope that I can be an example for Simon, and maybe he will have the will and the means that I lack to change the world. Some days I feel like I need to do more, but, in all honesty, most days I feel like I am doing more on my isolated little farm than I ever did writing legislators, donating money, marching, or preaching to friends, family, and acquaintances.
In my 20s I came up with a saying that I stuck with... No excuses, just explanations.
Fits well here.
So maybe no one here is owed an explanation. Shit, I talk about what I want. Have fun here or pontificate (or try to) or have heavy time, it's our own business. It's my business. No one else's.
That's not twisting, at least to me.
(purple nurples are a different story though)
Hedo, all I was doing was responding as honestly as I can. I throw ideas out and hope some are worthy and useful but I'm not out to tell people what to do. I'm not perfect either. I'm no one's boss except my own. I can't make people do what I think is best. I'm not an anything-Nazi. I say what I think and I spend a lot of time thinking about what I say. That's all- nothing more, nothing less.
If I didn't respect you, really wouldn't give a shit. Figure our respective cents' worth are...worthy.
Your cents are worthy too!"It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
So, Just because one perceives someone's coming off Judgy, does not mean that that person is. If you need clarification, why can't we just ask instead of assuming someone's being judgmental?
Wouldn't not clear up some of the fighting on these boards?Post edited by Free on0 -
Totally setting aside previous assumptions made on the part of others here...Free said:So, Just because one perceives someone's coming off Judgy, does not mean that that person is. If you need clarification, why can't we just ask instead of assuming someone's being judgmental?
Wouldn't not clear up some of the fighting on these boards?
...you did see what was posted in the time it took you to reply?
We're not fighting, mom.
0 -
Here's a poem from our boy WB that sort of encapsulates everything contributes and ties it all together.
The Future
For God’s sake, be done
with this jabber of “a better world.”
What blasphemy! No “futuristic”
twit or child thereof ever
in embodied light will see
a better world than this.
Do something! Go cut the weeds
beside the oblivious road. Pick up
the cans and bottles, old tires,
and dead predictions. No future
can be stuffed into this presence
except by being dead. The day is
clear and bright, and overhead
the sun not yet half finished
with his daily praise.
~ Wendell Berry ~
(Given)Monkey Driven, Call this Living?0 -
Make this board an agreement board?Free said:So, Just because one perceives someone's coming off Judgy, does not mean that that person is. If you need clarification, why can't we just ask instead of assuming someone's being judgmental?
Wouldn't not clear up some of the fighting on these boards?
Boring.
"My brain's a good brain!"0 -
Maybe a discussion board rather than an argument OR agreement board. Almost everyone here including, of course, yours truly has jumped to conclusions, made false assumptions, or reacted in anger and that's going to happen now and then but if we all made an effort to slow down, think about what others say and definitely use the preview button before posting we might get some clearer perspectives. AMT could be a great place to share good ideas for a.. OK Wendell, maybe not better world... for us humans to think and act more respectfully toward each other, toward other life and toward the planet as a whole. If we did that, maybe Planet Earth would even allow us to stick around a while longer.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Make this board an agreement board?Free said:So, Just because one perceives someone's coming off Judgy, does not mean that that person is. If you need clarification, why can't we just ask instead of assuming someone's being judgmental?
Wouldn't not clear up some of the fighting on these boards?
Boring."It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0 -
Are trolls considered human?brianlux said:
Maybe a discussion board rather than an argument OR agreement board. Almost everyone here including, of course, yours truly has jumped to conclusions, made false assumptions, or reacted in anger and that's going to happen now and then but if we all made an effort to slow down, think about what others say and definitely use the preview button before posting we might get some clearer perspectives. AMT could be a great place to share good ideas for a.. OK Wendell, maybe not better world... for us humans to think and act more respectfully toward each other, toward other life and toward the planet as a whole. If we did that, maybe Planet Earth would even allow us to stick around a while longer.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Make this board an agreement board?Free said:So, Just because one perceives someone's coming off Judgy, does not mean that that person is. If you need clarification, why can't we just ask instead of assuming someone's being judgmental?
Wouldn't not clear up some of the fighting on these boards?
Boring.0 -
A great question second only to Gary Numan's profoundly baffling question, "Are Friends Electric?"PJfanwillneverleave1 said:
Are trolls considered human?brianlux said:
Maybe a discussion board rather than an argument OR agreement board. Almost everyone here including, of course, yours truly has jumped to conclusions, made false assumptions, or reacted in anger and that's going to happen now and then but if we all made an effort to slow down, think about what others say and definitely use the preview button before posting we might get some clearer perspectives. AMT could be a great place to share good ideas for a.. OK Wendell, maybe not better world... for us humans to think and act more respectfully toward each other, toward other life and toward the planet as a whole. If we did that, maybe Planet Earth would even allow us to stick around a while longer.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Make this board an agreement board?Free said:So, Just because one perceives someone's coming off Judgy, does not mean that that person is. If you need clarification, why can't we just ask instead of assuming someone's being judgmental?
Wouldn't not clear up some of the fighting on these boards?
Boring."It's a sad and beautiful world"-Roberto Benigni0
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fsOUbMpdma4&ebc=ANyPxKq0sjEeULH7mY1hDizq8iB61gz0B2mquNSftkaOi22fSr38G867lYQulEASk37h_dPrxR0CyLVD4s-RDf9hMRpuaHkLLw
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