European Union vote 2016

Degeneratefk

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

mattsl1983 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

i see that the older people are blaming the millenials for not being engaged. seems to me the boomers are the ones driving the leave movement.

problem with society today is that everyone is so focused on taking and posting the ultimate selfie of them standing in the voting line that they do not have time to think about the decision they are making in the voting booth.

you get enough people not paying attention and this can happen anywhere.

i saw on the facebook page that some women took a photo of her california primary ballot where she wrote in the name "eddie vedder".

i kid you not.

I would beg to disagree with you on that. You simply cannot dismiss anyone that disagrees with you as uninformed or not paying attention. What if they are informed and paying attention but just feel differently than you do? It's politics. There is no right or wrong answer. You can't just dismiss people and label them as uninformed. That is a huge generalization. It's good to disagree in politics. Just don't take an elitist stance that no one is educated if they feel differently than you. That's my thoughts on it anyway.

Keep up man.
Unless you agree on the train you are a racist, insensitive bigot.
Now carry on agreeing.

That is absolutely untrue. Anyone that disagrees and has valid points to submit are not only good for discussion, but is encouraged. There are a few people here, however, that add nothing but opinion backed up with no facts.

Well anything that even hints at supporting Trump is frowned upon the train no?

I haven't seen anyone that backs their endorsement of trump get a hard time if they back their points up with facts. The problem with most trump support is that there is no fact backing up trump. He's got no political experience. So to say he can accomplish anything he has campaigned for can't be backed up by any fact.

He has campaigned on his beliefs.
Fact - Americans are listening.

His disapproval ratings say otherwise. It's real interesting to see how trump fans react to actual nunmbers. There's nothing that indicates trump will win in November. Yet trump supporters still think "America is listening."

PJfanwillneverleave1

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

mattsl1983 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

i see that the older people are blaming the millenials for not being engaged. seems to me the boomers are the ones driving the leave movement.

problem with society today is that everyone is so focused on taking and posting the ultimate selfie of them standing in the voting line that they do not have time to think about the decision they are making in the voting booth.

you get enough people not paying attention and this can happen anywhere.

i saw on the facebook page that some women took a photo of her california primary ballot where she wrote in the name "eddie vedder".

i kid you not.

I would beg to disagree with you on that. You simply cannot dismiss anyone that disagrees with you as uninformed or not paying attention. What if they are informed and paying attention but just feel differently than you do? It's politics. There is no right or wrong answer. You can't just dismiss people and label them as uninformed. That is a huge generalization. It's good to disagree in politics. Just don't take an elitist stance that no one is educated if they feel differently than you. That's my thoughts on it anyway.

Keep up man.
Unless you agree on the train you are a racist, insensitive bigot.
Now carry on agreeing.

That is absolutely untrue. Anyone that disagrees and has valid points to submit are not only good for discussion, but is encouraged. There are a few people here, however, that add nothing but opinion backed up with no facts.

Well anything that even hints at supporting Trump is frowned upon the train no?

I haven't seen anyone that backs their endorsement of trump get a hard time if they back their points up with facts. The problem with most trump support is that there is no fact backing up trump. He's got no political experience. So to say he can accomplish anything he has campaigned for can't be backed up by any fact.

He has campaigned on his beliefs.
Fact - Americans are listening.

His disapproval ratings say otherwise. It's real interesting to see how trump fans react to actual nunmbers. There's nothing that indicates trump will win in November. Yet trump supporters still think "America is listening."

Trump fans?
Trump supporters react to numbers or "nunmbers" as you say with a roll with the punches attitude.
If he wins in November great if not Hillary wins.

Degeneratefk

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

mattsl1983 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

i see that the older people are blaming the millenials for not being engaged. seems to me the boomers are the ones driving the leave movement.

problem with society today is that everyone is so focused on taking and posting the ultimate selfie of them standing in the voting line that they do not have time to think about the decision they are making in the voting booth.

you get enough people not paying attention and this can happen anywhere.

i saw on the facebook page that some women took a photo of her california primary ballot where she wrote in the name "eddie vedder".

i kid you not.

I would beg to disagree with you on that. You simply cannot dismiss anyone that disagrees with you as uninformed or not paying attention. What if they are informed and paying attention but just feel differently than you do? It's politics. There is no right or wrong answer. You can't just dismiss people and label them as uninformed. That is a huge generalization. It's good to disagree in politics. Just don't take an elitist stance that no one is educated if they feel differently than you. That's my thoughts on it anyway.

Keep up man.
Unless you agree on the train you are a racist, insensitive bigot.
Now carry on agreeing.

That is absolutely untrue. Anyone that disagrees and has valid points to submit are not only good for discussion, but is encouraged. There are a few people here, however, that add nothing but opinion backed up with no facts.

Well anything that even hints at supporting Trump is frowned upon the train no?

I haven't seen anyone that backs their endorsement of trump get a hard time if they back their points up with facts. The problem with most trump support is that there is no fact backing up trump. He's got no political experience. So to say he can accomplish anything he has campaigned for can't be backed up by any fact.

He has campaigned on his beliefs.
Fact - Americans are listening.

His disapproval ratings say otherwise. It's real interesting to see how trump fans react to actual nunmbers. There's nothing that indicates trump will win in November. Yet trump supporters still think "America is listening."

Trump fans?
Trump supporters react to numbers or "nunmbers" as you say with a roll with the punches attitude.
If he wins in November great if not Hillary wins.

You just proved my point.

PJfanwillneverleave1

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

Degeneratefk said:

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

mattsl1983 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

i see that the older people are blaming the millenials for not being engaged. seems to me the boomers are the ones driving the leave movement.

problem with society today is that everyone is so focused on taking and posting the ultimate selfie of them standing in the voting line that they do not have time to think about the decision they are making in the voting booth.

you get enough people not paying attention and this can happen anywhere.

i saw on the facebook page that some women took a photo of her california primary ballot where she wrote in the name "eddie vedder".

i kid you not.

I would beg to disagree with you on that. You simply cannot dismiss anyone that disagrees with you as uninformed or not paying attention. What if they are informed and paying attention but just feel differently than you do? It's politics. There is no right or wrong answer. You can't just dismiss people and label them as uninformed. That is a huge generalization. It's good to disagree in politics. Just don't take an elitist stance that no one is educated if they feel differently than you. That's my thoughts on it anyway.

Keep up man.
Unless you agree on the train you are a racist, insensitive bigot.
Now carry on agreeing.

That is absolutely untrue. Anyone that disagrees and has valid points to submit are not only good for discussion, but is encouraged. There are a few people here, however, that add nothing but opinion backed up with no facts.

Well anything that even hints at supporting Trump is frowned upon the train no?

I haven't seen anyone that backs their endorsement of trump get a hard time if they back their points up with facts. The problem with most trump support is that there is no fact backing up trump. He's got no political experience. So to say he can accomplish anything he has campaigned for can't be backed up by any fact.

He has campaigned on his beliefs.
Fact - Americans are listening.

His disapproval ratings say otherwise. It's real interesting to see how trump fans react to actual nunmbers. There's nothing that indicates trump will win in November. Yet trump supporters still think "America is listening."

Trump fans?
Trump supporters react to numbers or "nunmbers" as you say with a roll with the punches attitude.
If he wins in November great if not Hillary wins.

You just proved my point.

What a cavalier liberal thing to say.

dignin

PJ_Soul said:

Oh man.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2016/06/24/the-british-are-frantically-googling-what-the-eu-is-hours-after-voting-to-leave-it/

"That confusion over what Brexit might mean for the country's economy appears to have been reflected across the United Kingdom on Thursday. Google reported sharp upticks in searches not only related to the ballot measure but also about basic questions concerning the implications of the vote. At about 1 a.m. Eastern time, about eight hours after the polls closed, Google reported that searches for "what happens if we leave the EU" had more than tripled."

This is both sad and hilarious.

Noload

It was a close race. The winning side seems to desire more autonomy. I can't blame them for that. I was buying today aso the market went down. PJ cancelled their tour in Europe last year due to security concerns. Maybe this will help UK get a show. I hope they do in 2017. I guess we will see. I'm pulling for the UK.

muskydan

Hope and Change...Hope and Change. Way to have some Balls England. As The freeloaders of the the world weep the doers of the world celebrate...

muskydan

PJfanwillneverleave1 said:

mattsl1983 said:

gimmesometruth27 said:

i see that the older people are blaming the millenials for not being engaged. seems to me the boomers are the ones driving the leave movement.

problem with society today is that everyone is so focused on taking and posting the ultimate selfie of them standing in the voting line that they do not have time to think about the decision they are making in the voting booth.

you get enough people not paying attention and this can happen anywhere.

i saw on the facebook page that some women took a photo of her california primary ballot where she wrote in the name "eddie vedder".

i kid you not.

I would beg to disagree with you on that. You simply cannot dismiss anyone that disagrees with you as uninformed or not paying attention. What if they are informed and paying attention but just feel differently than you do? It's politics. There is no right or wrong answer. You can't just dismiss people and label them as uninformed. That is a huge generalization. It's good to disagree in politics. Just don't take an elitist stance that no one is educated if they feel differently than you. That's my thoughts on it anyway.

Keep up man.
Unless you agree on the train you are a racist, insensitive bigot.
Now carry on agreeing.

And don't forget your KY in this most excellent circle jerk known as the train....
Stick around thou, you will solidify every thought you have by reading their Kuum-by-ya thoughts. It's theopy really.

rgambs

muskydan said:

Hope and Change...Hope and Change. Way to have some Balls England. As The freeloaders of the the world weep the doers of the world celebrate...

Ha, you have that backwards, it is the doers of the world who lost billions and trillions collectively in the blink of an eye.
You know, the folks who have capital invested...ahhh nevermind, if you don't get it you never will.

BS44325

newy777 said:

mattsl1983 said:

The EU was been a failed experiment. I don't blame the UK for voting out of it.

Regardless of whichever opinion you have on it, no one knows if it was the best or worst thing to do. For every reason you look up why they should stay, there is a reason for why they should leave.

I feel this board share a lot of the same good values regardless of leave or remain. My view being that ´leave` is the best outcome is considered with acknowledging that there is an element of negativity amongst many voting for leave. I strongly reject the anti immigration sentiment - it really saddens me. However I am very passionate in understanding how can europe be prosperous again. It needs a strong foundation of democracy to start with - one thing sorely lacking in Brussels. Above else people need a voice and to be able to vote in and out lawmakers. My second consideration is the economic state of the european union. This is undoubtedly a factor which has stirred up the nationalism sentiment and people need to blame it on someone or something. So sometimes rightly but much more often wrongfully point to immigration being the cause of their lower standard of living. The EU seemingly works in good times but as the world wide debt supercycle comes to an end, it is extremely toxic to the society for such an organisation like the EU to dictate fiscal and monetary policy against the will of the european nations. It is psychologically crippling and it is the right environment for extreme political group to gain power. I want you all to understand that negative interest rates in nearly a third of the world is a big sign that the central planners have lost control and have no more options.ie helicopter money has failed miserably. We have to be honest and say there is a big problem and there are no easy ways to get back on track. I think an important issue regarding peace going forward is to see countries get their sovereignty back as I think people will be more responsive to knowing they have a vote. Countries like Greece will be able to start from scratch and become competitive again using a currency that is valued on it´s own merits and not shutting them out of opportunity to thrive. As it stands the european union very much is run by cronies and make it difficult for small business, entrepreneurs and innovation. It is that way even if people don´t sense it to be that way. The mess the EU is in is a product of its existence. The intentions of bringing peace to europe were very worthy but times have changed and the EU has evolved into something that I can never by priciple support.
I welcome constructive positive solutions to the problems of Europe and Britain. Even though many voters for leave voted for anti immigration I want those who voted for democracy to take Britain forward an hopefully inspire other countries to transition into a more respectful and sustainable europe. I also want to thank everyone for the insights on both sides.ie. Spags.
If there is no discussion there is no advancement. Cheers

Well done.

my2hands

I would look for other strong economies in the EU to flirt with leaving as well in the coming year

BS44325

rgambs said:

muskydan said:

Hope and Change...Hope and Change. Way to have some Balls England. As The freeloaders of the the world weep the doers of the world celebrate...

Ha, you have that backwards, it is the doers of the world who lost billions and trillions collectively in the blink of an eye.
You know, the folks who have capital invested...ahhh nevermind, if you don't get it you never will.

You're not wrong but I think you're just slightly missing the mark on who Musky is probably referring to when he says "doers". The people that lost billions collectively are those in investment banking/financial industry etc. While I don't want to disparage those people I don't typically use the term "doers" towards them as they are not producers (other then possibly the concept of producing returns for someone's retirement) but traders on the products of others. They are the ones hit hardest. The "doers" are the small business owners, the trades people, the average person getting up everyday to work a job and/or provide a tangible service in any field. Those "doers" are having there wages suppressed through confiscatory taxes, burdensome regulations, and unchecked immigration. With this vote these "doers" now have a chance to start a re-set of policy on a local level. Certianly it will bring short term instability but with time and proper stewardship these "doers" will be able to improve there standard of living and that of the less well off. It will only be the crony capitalists who rely on cheap wages and protectionism and who could afford the immense compliance costs that will be hurt. These crony capitalists are not the "doers".

rgambs

BS44325 said:

rgambs said:

muskydan said:

Hope and Change...Hope and Change. Way to have some Balls England. As The freeloaders of the the world weep the doers of the world celebrate...

Ha, you have that backwards, it is the doers of the world who lost billions and trillions collectively in the blink of an eye.
You know, the folks who have capital invested...ahhh nevermind, if you don't get it you never will.

You're not wrong but I think you're just slightly missing the mark on who Musky is probably referring to when he says "doers". The people that lost billions collectively are those in investment banking/financial industry etc. While I don't want to disparage those people I don't typically use the term "doers" towards them as they are not producers (other then possibly the concept of producing returns for someone's retirement) but traders on the products of others. They are the ones hit hardest. The "doers" are the small business owners, the trades people, the average person getting up everyday to work a job and/or provide a tangible service in any field. Those "doers" are having there wages suppressed through confiscatory taxes, burdensome regulations, and unchecked immigration. With this vote these "doers" now have a chance to start a re-set of policy on a local level. Certianly it will bring short term instability but with time and proper stewardship these "doers" will be able to improve there standard of living and that of the less well off. It will only be the crony capitalists who rely on cheap wages and protectionism and who could afford the immense compliance costs that will be hurt. These crony capitalists are not the "doers".

Hahhahahahaha that's a good laugh there.
"Flush"

BS44325

rgambs said:

BS44325 said:

rgambs said:

muskydan said:

Hope and Change...Hope and Change. Way to have some Balls England. As The freeloaders of the the world weep the doers of the world celebrate...

Ha, you have that backwards, it is the doers of the world who lost billions and trillions collectively in the blink of an eye.
You know, the folks who have capital invested...ahhh nevermind, if you don't get it you never will.

You're not wrong but I think you're just slightly missing the mark on who Musky is probably referring to when he says "doers". The people that lost billions collectively are those in investment banking/financial industry etc. While I don't want to disparage those people I don't typically use the term "doers" towards them as they are not producers (other then possibly the concept of producing returns for someone's retirement) but traders on the products of others. They are the ones hit hardest. The "doers" are the small business owners, the trades people, the average person getting up everyday to work a job and/or provide a tangible service in any field. Those "doers" are having there wages suppressed through confiscatory taxes, burdensome regulations, and unchecked immigration. With this vote these "doers" now have a chance to start a re-set of policy on a local level. Certianly it will bring short term instability but with time and proper stewardship these "doers" will be able to improve there standard of living and that of the less well off. It will only be the crony capitalists who rely on cheap wages and protectionism and who could afford the immense compliance costs that will be hurt. These crony capitalists are not the "doers".

Hahhahahahaha that's a good laugh there.
"Flush"

Oh? Which part did you find so funny?

BS44325

PJ_Soul said:

I am not sure what will happen with the EU free trade deal being negotiated. I am imagining that the one currently being brokered will go ahead without Britain, and then... ?? I am not sure if Canada and the UK would have something they'd want to work out individually or what. Is the UK now just out of the whole deal automatically? Will they get in on it as a separate nation now? I don't know.

CANZUK might be coming our way PJ Soul

http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/columnist/2016/06/24/brexit-boosts-canzuk-replacement-european-union-column/86347818/

Shawshank

Wait...so now some of you are concerned about big banks and corporations taking a hit because of this? Am I understanding that correctly? That's rich...especially for this board.

So they took a gamble on the people wanting/accepting globalization and they lost. Oh well. It's a stupid idea that was born out of a utopian mindset not based in reality. It's not how humans work. That's why you may care about your neighbors and will go out of your way to help them whenever the need arises...and even put other people before yourself...but you don't want them just walking into your house at night unannounced and plop down on your couch.

Individual families are a microcosm of the world as a whole. As a species we are naturally separated into smaller units and always have been. This idea that we will one day live in this giant, free roaming, borderless world is not even in the realm of possibility. The ones that really push for that are those wanting power and money...i.e. the same ones losing billions right now. Wait until other countries follow Britain's lead. It's only a matter of time.

rgambs

The funny part is where you made the assumption of what was meant by another poster, who (by his own admission) comes here for jollies when he's taking a shit lol

The post itself I largely agree with, except the drivel about government squashing small business. That's the biggest lie going around, government is the only thing standing between small businesses and the Wal-Mart's of the world who want to swallow them up.
I have been involved in quite a few small businesses, and none of the "government regulation is killing us" baloney has ever shown it's face. The fact that the largest corporations pay criminally low taxes and get unfair advantages doesn't mean small businesses should as well, it just means the ones at the top need to be forced to pay their share for a prosperous society.

rgambs

Shawshank said:

Wait...so now some of you are concerned about big banks and corporations taking a hit because of this? Am I understanding that correctly? That's rich...especially for this board.

So they took a gamble on the people wanting/accepting globalization and they lost. Oh well. It's a stupid idea that was born out of a utopian mindset not based in reality. It's not how humans work. That's why you may care about your neighbors and will go out of your way to help them whenever the need arises...and even put other people before yourself...but you don't want them just walking into your house at night unannounced and plop down on your couch.

Individual families are a microcosm of the world as a whole. As a species we are naturally separated into smaller units and always have been. This idea that we will one day live in this giant, free roaming, borderless world is not even in the realm of possibility. The ones that really push for that are those wanting power and money...i.e. the same ones losing billions right now. Wait until other countries follow Britain's lead. It's only a matter of time.

The one thing that's actually occured with supply side economics is that while the gains largely stay at the top, the losses trickle down to the rest of us when they wreck the economy.

dimitrispearljam

Spags said:

Division is never the right course.

Thats exactly what referendum always do!!
Put hate and blame eachother in the mind of people

dimitrispearljam

Jason P said:

The EU is now going to fuck over the UK if they want to, right? They don't want other countries to follow suit, so I'm guessing trade negotiations aren't going to go well.

Germany already celebrating and have like 10 plans how they will do it