Is the USA a nation of bigots and/or racists and/or idiots and hypocrites?
Comments
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I think everyone is missing a big point. It’s not that they showed up late, they had very odd behavior. They admit to having odd behavior. Yeah, you, me and a million other people could have shown up late, and I bet there’s a good chance at least 1 person would have casually asked “Did you register for a tour?” And we would have answered “yes.”Go Beavers said:
At age 48, I could’ve joined that college tour late, and I fully guarantee you no one would’ve called the cops.mace1229 said:
Are you being serious? You really don’t think white people get the police called on them? If you really believe that, this conversation isn’t worth continuing.Halifax2TheMax said:
Please post a link to a story where the cops were called on a white person for being someplace they had every right to be, bonus points if the caller was black, Hispanic or Asian.mace1229 said:
Do you have any reason to believe this? Plenty of cops get called for suspicious white people. Do you have any reason to believe this was racially motivated? Other than the fact they weren’t white there was nothing about this story that comes across as targeting minorities. People report white people all the time, shootings have been prevented because of it.oftenreading said:
Odds are very very very low that the parent would have felt they “didn’t belong” if they were white. We also tell kids they don’t have to answer questions from adults they don’t know that don’t have any business questioning them.mace1229 said:
I don't know why this was surprising to anyone, and, honestly, don't know why it made big news.Bentleyspop said:
Don't get me wrong, I feel bad for the boys. But considering the following;
We live in a society where mass shootings are not rare, this creates the "See something say something" movement.
The boys apparently lacked social norms and appeared odd. They don;t even deny this, they defend it by saying they are "shy."
The parent(s) was convinced they were not part of the tour because they arrived late and apparently did not cooperate with the parents when they became concerned.
I didn't listen to the 911 tape, but nothing from the quotes I read sounded racist. She was convinced they were not part of the tour and was not sure why they were lingering around with such odd behavior.
Now imagine this situation with a different outcome. Imagine they did come to hurt people. How many people would be casting blame on that parent for not saying something? What do you think the outrage would be if the public found out 2 people not part of the tour was following them around with "odd" behavior and something horrible did happen. How often has that been the case ad people cast the blame on witnesses for not speaking up? It happens with nearly every mass shooting. So you have this mother who is convinced these boys do not belong here and are not part of the group. She sees them behaving oddly, they refuse to cooperate with the people in the tour when asked questions. Are you really surprised someone came forward? Do you really blame her? Do you really think it was racially motivated? Ot maybe just paranoid with the violence that is on the news every day?
It seems like the police handed it fine. Asked them just a few questions and let them go on their way.
If we call everyone racists when they report someone with odd behavior, how do we expect them to say something when they see something? We can;t expect them to be right 100% of the time, but everyone sure is willing to blame others when they miss a red flag.
This is straight up racist bullshit.
they showed up late and then refused to answer that very simple question, that’s what was odd.
Again, I don’t think it warranted 911, but I don’t think this story is as big of a deal as people make it out to be. And this response was a good example. There’s more to the story than showing up late and having the cops called. 911 wasn’t called because they were late. I’m sure people are late every day to tour groups. But then I’m sure they respond to simple questions too
peope are asking like they’ve never been questioned for anything, and only minorities or blacks are. It’s part of everyday life, and responding is what is normal. It is completely odd to be asked a simple question and have the mentality to refuse to answer. Everyone who think questioning them was out of line, have you never been in first-class chekin lines and someone asks to see your ticket, have you never accidentally cut in line and somewhere asks how long you’ve been waiting, have you never seen a group of people and asked what the line was for to make sure you’re in the right place? It doesn’t matter what color you are, if you stand there and refuse to acknowledge someone asking that simple question they are going to think you’re odd.
Again, 911 not necessary, I just think this story is blown up.Post edited by mace1229 on0 -
I might call the cops on some white folks today just for fun0
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The tour leader has said she talked with them. She’s also said she didn’t see anything out of the ordinary with how they were behaving. It seems it’s only that one parent who did.mace1229 said:
I think everyone is missing a big point. It’s not that they showed up late, they had very odd behavior. They admit to having odd behavior. Yeah, you, me and a million other people could have shown up late, and I bet there’s a good chance at least 1 person would have casually asked “Did you register for a tour?” And we would have answered “yes.”Go Beavers said:
At age 48, I could’ve joined that college tour late, and I fully guarantee you no one would’ve called the cops.mace1229 said:
Are you being serious? You really don’t think white people get the police called on them? If you really believe that, this conversation isn’t worth continuing.Halifax2TheMax said:
Please post a link to a story where the cops were called on a white person for being someplace they had every right to be, bonus points if the caller was black, Hispanic or Asian.mace1229 said:
Do you have any reason to believe this? Plenty of cops get called for suspicious white people. Do you have any reason to believe this was racially motivated? Other than the fact they weren’t white there was nothing about this story that comes across as targeting minorities. People report white people all the time, shootings have been prevented because of it.oftenreading said:
Odds are very very very low that the parent would have felt they “didn’t belong” if they were white. We also tell kids they don’t have to answer questions from adults they don’t know that don’t have any business questioning them.mace1229 said:
I don't know why this was surprising to anyone, and, honestly, don't know why it made big news.Bentleyspop said:
Don't get me wrong, I feel bad for the boys. But considering the following;
We live in a society where mass shootings are not rare, this creates the "See something say something" movement.
The boys apparently lacked social norms and appeared odd. They don;t even deny this, they defend it by saying they are "shy."
The parent(s) was convinced they were not part of the tour because they arrived late and apparently did not cooperate with the parents when they became concerned.
I didn't listen to the 911 tape, but nothing from the quotes I read sounded racist. She was convinced they were not part of the tour and was not sure why they were lingering around with such odd behavior.
Now imagine this situation with a different outcome. Imagine they did come to hurt people. How many people would be casting blame on that parent for not saying something? What do you think the outrage would be if the public found out 2 people not part of the tour was following them around with "odd" behavior and something horrible did happen. How often has that been the case ad people cast the blame on witnesses for not speaking up? It happens with nearly every mass shooting. So you have this mother who is convinced these boys do not belong here and are not part of the group. She sees them behaving oddly, they refuse to cooperate with the people in the tour when asked questions. Are you really surprised someone came forward? Do you really blame her? Do you really think it was racially motivated? Ot maybe just paranoid with the violence that is on the news every day?
It seems like the police handed it fine. Asked them just a few questions and let them go on their way.
If we call everyone racists when they report someone with odd behavior, how do we expect them to say something when they see something? We can;t expect them to be right 100% of the time, but everyone sure is willing to blame others when they miss a red flag.
This is straight up racist bullshit.
they showed up late and then refused to answer that very simple question, that’s what was odd.
Again, I don’t think it warranted 911, but I don’t think this story is as big of a deal as people make it out to be. And this response was a good example. There’s more to the story than showing up late and having the cops called. 911 wasn’t called because they were late. I’m sure people are late every day to tour groups. But then I’m sure they respond to simple questions too
peope are asking like they’ve never been questioned for anything, and only minorities or blacks are. It’s part of everyday life, and responding is what is normal. It is completely odd to be asked a simple question and have the mentality to refuse to answer. Everyone who think questioning them was out of line, have you never been in first-class chekin lines and someone asks to see your ticket, have you never accidentally cut in line and somewhere asks how long you’ve been waiting, have you never seen a group of people and asked what the line was for to make sure you’re in the right place? It doesn’t matter what color you are, if you stand there and refuse to acknowledge someone asking that simple question they are going to think you’re odd.
Again, 911 not necessary, I just think this story is blown up.
And I think it’s you that’s missing the point. Calling 911 was this woman’s response because of her automatic belief that these native kids were a danger.Post edited by oftenreading onmy small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf0 -
mace1229 said:
I think everyone is missing a big point. It’s not that they showed up late, they had very odd behavior. They admit to having odd behavior. Yeah, you, me and a million other people could have shown up late, and I bet there’s a good chance at least 1 person would have casually asked “Did you register for a tour?” And we would have answered “yes.”Go Beavers said:
At age 48, I could’ve joined that college tour late, and I fully guarantee you no one would’ve called the cops.mace1229 said:
Are you being serious? You really don’t think white people get the police called on them? If you really believe that, this conversation isn’t worth continuing.Halifax2TheMax said:
Please post a link to a story where the cops were called on a white person for being someplace they had every right to be, bonus points if the caller was black, Hispanic or Asian.mace1229 said:
Do you have any reason to believe this? Plenty of cops get called for suspicious white people. Do you have any reason to believe this was racially motivated? Other than the fact they weren’t white there was nothing about this story that comes across as targeting minorities. People report white people all the time, shootings have been prevented because of it.oftenreading said:
Odds are very very very low that the parent would have felt they “didn’t belong” if they were white. We also tell kids they don’t have to answer questions from adults they don’t know that don’t have any business questioning them.mace1229 said:
I don't know why this was surprising to anyone, and, honestly, don't know why it made big news.Bentleyspop said:
Don't get me wrong, I feel bad for the boys. But considering the following;
We live in a society where mass shootings are not rare, this creates the "See something say something" movement.
The boys apparently lacked social norms and appeared odd. They don;t even deny this, they defend it by saying they are "shy."
The parent(s) was convinced they were not part of the tour because they arrived late and apparently did not cooperate with the parents when they became concerned.
I didn't listen to the 911 tape, but nothing from the quotes I read sounded racist. She was convinced they were not part of the tour and was not sure why they were lingering around with such odd behavior.
Now imagine this situation with a different outcome. Imagine they did come to hurt people. How many people would be casting blame on that parent for not saying something? What do you think the outrage would be if the public found out 2 people not part of the tour was following them around with "odd" behavior and something horrible did happen. How often has that been the case ad people cast the blame on witnesses for not speaking up? It happens with nearly every mass shooting. So you have this mother who is convinced these boys do not belong here and are not part of the group. She sees them behaving oddly, they refuse to cooperate with the people in the tour when asked questions. Are you really surprised someone came forward? Do you really blame her? Do you really think it was racially motivated? Ot maybe just paranoid with the violence that is on the news every day?
It seems like the police handed it fine. Asked them just a few questions and let them go on their way.
If we call everyone racists when they report someone with odd behavior, how do we expect them to say something when they see something? We can;t expect them to be right 100% of the time, but everyone sure is willing to blame others when they miss a red flag.
This is straight up racist bullshit.
they showed up late and then refused to answer that very simple question, that’s what was odd.
Again, I don’t think it warranted 911, but I don’t think this story is as big of a deal as people make it out to be. And this response was a good example. There’s more to the story than showing up late and having the cops called. 911 wasn’t called because they were late. I’m sure people are late every day to tour groups. But then I’m sure they respond to simple questions too
peope are asking like they’ve never been questioned for anything, and only minorities or blacks are. It’s part of everyday life, and responding is what is normal. It is completely odd to be asked a simple question and have the mentality to refuse to answer. Everyone who think questioning them was out of line, have you never been in first-class chekin lines and someone asks to see your ticket, have you never accidentally cut in line and somewhere asks how long you’ve been waiting, have you never seen a group of people and asked what the line was for to make sure you’re in the right place? It doesn’t matter what color you are, if you stand there and refuse to acknowledge someone asking that simple question they are going to think you’re odd.
Again, 911 not necessary, I just think this story is blown up.
It simply isn't true that they refused to answer any questions. The woman is quoted as saying that when she asked the boys what the intended to study and one of them answered, the other laughed, which made her think that the first was lying.
Honestly, if I had a dollar for every time my brother laughed at what I said when I was younger......
The point, which you are missing, is that she never even gave them the benefit of the doubt. It sounds to me like she questioned them in a way that made them feel uncomfortable and they didn't want to answer her, nor did they have to. If I don't like the way some busy body in a group is talking to me, I might also move away and not engage with her. I have that benefit, because I'm white, and no one is going to call the cops on me for it.my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf0 -
Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.Pittsburgh 2013
Cincinnati 2014
Greenville 2016
(Raleigh 2016)
Columbia 20160 -
Team Trump Treason is an enabler, he makes it okay to state your fear of the “other.” His immigration policies, campaign rhetoric and his “There are decent people on both sides,” illustrate that. Sorry you don’t have the ability to realize that.drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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He is a jackass, sure. But the woman’s racist ways were probably well established before his presidency. It’s just funny how in AMT everything comes back to being Trumps faultHalifax2TheMax said:
Team Trump Treason is an enabler, he makes it okay to state your fear of the “other.” His immigration policies, campaign rhetoric and his “There are decent people on both sides,” illustrate that. Sorry you don’t have the ability to realize that.drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.Pittsburgh 2013
Cincinnati 2014
Greenville 2016
(Raleigh 2016)
Columbia 20160 -
drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf0 -
For this incident, yes I am. Everyone has different scales of sensitivity to different events in their life and maybe for some reason this woman really thought something was off and needed to be addressed. It does seem racially motivated, but we don’t know that for sure. Her calling 911 wasn’t a crime, just extreme and unnecessary.oftenreading said:drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.
I believe the increase in hate crimes very well may be related to his presidency. But actual crimes, not thinking something wasn’t right on a tourPittsburgh 2013
Cincinnati 2014
Greenville 2016
(Raleigh 2016)
Columbia 20160 -
I’m not calling her actions a crime, either, but there is a spectrum of racist behaviour that ranges from day to day dismissal and denigration to outright hate crimes. Observationally, the whole spectrum seems to have increased in frequency in the last couple of years. Not just in the US, but internationally, in concert with the return to prominence of the far right in many European counties.drakeheuer14 said:
For this incident, yes I am. Everyone has different scales of sensitivity to different events in their life and maybe for some reason this woman really thought something was off and needed to be addressed. It does seem racially motivated, but we don’t know that for sure. Her calling 911 wasn’t a crime, just extreme and unnecessary.oftenreading said:drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.
I believe the increase in hate crimes very well may be related to his presidency. But actual crimes, not thinking something wasn’t right on a tourmy small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf0 -
If it were two white guys, we wouldn’t even be discussing it.drakeheuer14 said:
For this incident, yes I am. Everyone has different scales of sensitivity to different events in their life and maybe for some reason this woman really thought something was off and needed to be addressed. It does seem racially motivated, but we don’t know that for sure. Her calling 911 wasn’t a crime, just extreme and unnecessary.oftenreading said:drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.
I believe the increase in hate crimes very well may be related to his presidency. But actual crimes, not thinking something wasn’t right on a tour09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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Maybe. Maybe not.Halifax2TheMax said:
If it were two white guys, we wouldn’t even be discussing it.drakeheuer14 said:
For this incident, yes I am. Everyone has different scales of sensitivity to different events in their life and maybe for some reason this woman really thought something was off and needed to be addressed. It does seem racially motivated, but we don’t know that for sure. Her calling 911 wasn’t a crime, just extreme and unnecessary.oftenreading said:drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.
I believe the increase in hate crimes very well may be related to his presidency. But actual crimes, not thinking something wasn’t right on a tour
I don’t think that statement of ‘if’ should indict her. But she shouldn’t be absolved of taking extreme measures either.Pittsburgh 2013
Cincinnati 2014
Greenville 2016
(Raleigh 2016)
Columbia 20160 -
True, because if it were 2 white guys it wouldn’t have even made the news.Halifax2TheMax said:
If it were two white guys, we wouldn’t even be discussing it.drakeheuer14 said:
For this incident, yes I am. Everyone has different scales of sensitivity to different events in their life and maybe for some reason this woman really thought something was off and needed to be addressed. It does seem racially motivated, but we don’t know that for sure. Her calling 911 wasn’t a crime, just extreme and unnecessary.oftenreading said:drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.
I believe the increase in hate crimes very well may be related to his presidency. But actual crimes, not thinking something wasn’t right on a tour0 -
Because it never would have happened. She would not have questioned their right to be there.mace1229 said:
True, because if it were 2 white guys it wouldn’t have even made the news.Halifax2TheMax said:
If it were two white guys, we wouldn’t even be discussing it.drakeheuer14 said:
For this incident, yes I am. Everyone has different scales of sensitivity to different events in their life and maybe for some reason this woman really thought something was off and needed to be addressed. It does seem racially motivated, but we don’t know that for sure. Her calling 911 wasn’t a crime, just extreme and unnecessary.oftenreading said:drakeheuer14 said:
Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him?Halifax2TheMax said:Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him.
Unrelated to Trump? Are you sure about that?
Even law enforcement is reporting a substantial increase in hate crimes since Trump was elected.
I believe the increase in hate crimes very well may be related to his presidency. But actual crimes, not thinking something wasn’t right on a tour09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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In an era where fear, security, and suspicion rule the day, i'm not so sure this can, or should, be dismissed as simple racism...0
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that has pretty much been my point. We live in an era of “if you see something, say something” and constant paranoia of the next shooting.my2hands said:In an era where fear, security, and suspicion rule the day, i'm not so sure this can, or should, be dismissed as simple racism...
i think she over reacted, but from the information I’ve seen it’s not a clear cut of racism.0 -
Exactly.mace1229 said:
that has pretty much been my point. We live in an era of “if you see something, say something” and constant paranoia of the next shooting.my2hands said:In an era where fear, security, and suspicion rule the day, i'm not so sure this can, or should, be dismissed as simple racism...
i think she over reacted, but from the information I’ve seen it’s not a clear cut of racism.Pittsburgh 2013
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The article isnt very clear on that. It does state she asked their major and they laughed, but later in the article it also states “When asked why they didn't respond to questions by people in the group, the boys say Lloyd is shy.”oftenreading said:mace1229 said:
I think everyone is missing a big point. It’s not that they showed up late, they had very odd behavior. They admit to having odd behavior. Yeah, you, me and a million other people could have shown up late, and I bet there’s a good chance at least 1 person would have casually asked “Did you register for a tour?” And we would have answered “yes.”Go Beavers said:
At age 48, I could’ve joined that college tour late, and I fully guarantee you no one would’ve called the cops.mace1229 said:
Are you being serious? You really don’t think white people get the police called on them? If you really believe that, this conversation isn’t worth continuing.Halifax2TheMax said:
Please post a link to a story where the cops were called on a white person for being someplace they had every right to be, bonus points if the caller was black, Hispanic or Asian.mace1229 said:
Do you have any reason to believe this? Plenty of cops get called for suspicious white people. Do you have any reason to believe this was racially motivated? Other than the fact they weren’t white there was nothing about this story that comes across as targeting minorities. People report white people all the time, shootings have been prevented because of it.oftenreading said:
Odds are very very very low that the parent would have felt they “didn’t belong” if they were white. We also tell kids they don’t have to answer questions from adults they don’t know that don’t have any business questioning them.mace1229 said:
I don't know why this was surprising to anyone, and, honestly, don't know why it made big news.Bentleyspop said:
Don't get me wrong, I feel bad for the boys. But considering the following;
We live in a society where mass shootings are not rare, this creates the "See something say something" movement.
The boys apparently lacked social norms and appeared odd. They don;t even deny this, they defend it by saying they are "shy."
The parent(s) was convinced they were not part of the tour because they arrived late and apparently did not cooperate with the parents when they became concerned.
I didn't listen to the 911 tape, but nothing from the quotes I read sounded racist. She was convinced they were not part of the tour and was not sure why they were lingering around with such odd behavior.
Now imagine this situation with a different outcome. Imagine they did come to hurt people. How many people would be casting blame on that parent for not saying something? What do you think the outrage would be if the public found out 2 people not part of the tour was following them around with "odd" behavior and something horrible did happen. How often has that been the case ad people cast the blame on witnesses for not speaking up? It happens with nearly every mass shooting. So you have this mother who is convinced these boys do not belong here and are not part of the group. She sees them behaving oddly, they refuse to cooperate with the people in the tour when asked questions. Are you really surprised someone came forward? Do you really blame her? Do you really think it was racially motivated? Ot maybe just paranoid with the violence that is on the news every day?
It seems like the police handed it fine. Asked them just a few questions and let them go on their way.
If we call everyone racists when they report someone with odd behavior, how do we expect them to say something when they see something? We can;t expect them to be right 100% of the time, but everyone sure is willing to blame others when they miss a red flag.
This is straight up racist bullshit.
they showed up late and then refused to answer that very simple question, that’s what was odd.
Again, I don’t think it warranted 911, but I don’t think this story is as big of a deal as people make it out to be. And this response was a good example. There’s more to the story than showing up late and having the cops called. 911 wasn’t called because they were late. I’m sure people are late every day to tour groups. But then I’m sure they respond to simple questions too
peope are asking like they’ve never been questioned for anything, and only minorities or blacks are. It’s part of everyday life, and responding is what is normal. It is completely odd to be asked a simple question and have the mentality to refuse to answer. Everyone who think questioning them was out of line, have you never been in first-class chekin lines and someone asks to see your ticket, have you never accidentally cut in line and somewhere asks how long you’ve been waiting, have you never seen a group of people and asked what the line was for to make sure you’re in the right place? It doesn’t matter what color you are, if you stand there and refuse to acknowledge someone asking that simple question they are going to think you’re odd.
Again, 911 not necessary, I just think this story is blown up.
It simply isn't true that they refused to answer any questions. The woman is quoted as saying that when she asked the boys what the intended to study and one of them answered, the other laughed, which made her think that the first was lying.
Honestly, if I had a dollar for every time my brother laughed at what I said when I was younger......
The point, which you are missing, is that she never even gave them the benefit of the doubt. It sounds to me like she questioned them in a way that made them feel uncomfortable and they didn't want to answer her, nor did they have to. If I don't like the way some busy body in a group is talking to me, I might also move away and not engage with her. I have that benefit, because I'm white, and no one is going to call the cops on me for it.
Everything in that statement is plural. Multiple people and multiple questions. Like I said several times, don't think the Mom did the right think, but I don’t think it’s deserves all this attention either. So yes, it’s more reasonable to read that as someone casually asked why they were joining the group and that they refused to answer. That is weird. Not worth calling 911, but justified in calling it odd behavior.
the thing that bugs me about this situation is there is no indication at all, zero, that this was racially motivated. But since it was 2 minorities it’s guilty until proven innocent on the Mom. That seems like the case more and more often.Post edited by mace1229 on0 -
But I don't think we can say some level of racism or stereotyping absolutely did not play a factor here either...mace1229 said:
that has pretty much been my point. We live in an era of “if you see something, say something” and constant paranoia of the next shooting.my2hands said:In an era where fear, security, and suspicion rule the day, i'm not so sure this can, or should, be dismissed as simple racism...
i think she over reacted, but from the information I’ve seen it’s not a clear cut of racism.
People are consumed with fear, and stereotypes0
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