Is the USA a nation of bigots and/or racists and/or idiots and hypocrites?

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  • BentleyspopBentleyspop Craft Beer Brewery, ColoradoPosts: 5,625
    Just more Trumpian normalization of racism. “Answer me when I speak to you, boy.” More fear of “the other.”
    Thank goodness Trump is president or you wouldn’t have anyone to blame in this world for things that are unrelated to him. Is it just fun to unload all your frustrations in the world on him? 

    Before being attacked, no, I do not like Trump and I did not vote for him. 
    Team Trump Treason is an enabler, he makes it okay to state your fear of the “other.” His immigration policies, campaign rhetoric and his “There are decent people on both sides,” illustrate that. Sorry you don’t have the ability to realize that.
    He is a jackass, sure. But the woman’s racist ways were probably well established before his presidency. It’s just funny how in AMT everything comes back to being Trumps fault 

    mace1229 said:

    mace1229 said:
    I don't know why this was surprising to anyone, and, honestly, don't know why it made big news.
    Don't get me wrong, I feel bad for the boys. But considering the following;

    We live in a society where mass shootings are not rare, this creates the "See something say something" movement.
    The boys apparently lacked social norms and appeared odd. They don;t even deny this, they defend it by saying they are "shy."
    The parent(s) was convinced they were not part of the tour because they arrived late and apparently did not cooperate with the parents when they became concerned.
    I didn't listen to the 911 tape, but nothing from the quotes I read sounded racist. She was convinced they were not part of the tour and was not sure why they were lingering around with such odd behavior.

    Now imagine this situation with a different outcome. Imagine they did come to hurt people. How many people would be casting blame on that parent for not saying something? What do you think the outrage would be if the public found out 2 people not part of the tour was following them around with "odd" behavior and something horrible did happen. How often has that been the case ad people cast the blame on witnesses for not speaking up? It happens with nearly every mass shooting. So you have this mother who is convinced these boys do not belong here and are not part of the group. She sees them behaving oddly, they refuse to cooperate with the people in the tour when asked questions. Are you really surprised someone came forward? Do you really blame her? Do you really think it was racially motivated? Ot maybe just paranoid with the violence that is on the news every day?

    It seems like the police handed it fine. Asked them just a few questions and let them go on their way. 
    If we call everyone racists when they report someone with odd behavior, how do we expect them to say something when they see something? We can;t expect them to be right 100% of the time, but everyone sure is willing to blame others when they miss a red flag.

    Odds are very very very low that the parent would have felt they “didn’t belong” if they were white. We also tell kids they don’t have to answer questions from adults they don’t know that don’t have any business questioning them. 

    This is straight up racist bullshit. 
    Do you have any reason to believe this? Plenty of cops get called for suspicious white people. Do you have any reason to believe this was racially motivated? Other than the fact they weren’t white there was nothing about this story that comes across as targeting minorities. People report white people all the time, shootings have been prevented because of it.

    There is nothing about the story that suggests it isn't racially motivated. Nothing about the teens' behaviour that's out of the ordinary for any teen in an unfamiliar situation. Except that they were on a college tour in Colorado, and weren't white, so they must not belong. 
    Not true.
    There are quite  a few on here and some who have been banned who blame everything  on.....

    Hillary
    Bill
    President Obama 
    The Jews
    Anyone not Caucasian 
    Etc etc
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,063
    The 911 caller told a dispatcher “They’re definitely not a part of the tour...they just really stand out."  

    Racism can be subtle or underlying something. Obvious racism wears a pointy white hood. 
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,008
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:

    mace1229 said:
    I don't know why this was surprising to anyone, and, honestly, don't know why it made big news.
    Don't get me wrong, I feel bad for the boys. But considering the following;

    We live in a society where mass shootings are not rare, this creates the "See something say something" movement.
    The boys apparently lacked social norms and appeared odd. They don;t even deny this, they defend it by saying they are "shy."
    The parent(s) was convinced they were not part of the tour because they arrived late and apparently did not cooperate with the parents when they became concerned.
    I didn't listen to the 911 tape, but nothing from the quotes I read sounded racist. She was convinced they were not part of the tour and was not sure why they were lingering around with such odd behavior.

    Now imagine this situation with a different outcome. Imagine they did come to hurt people. How many people would be casting blame on that parent for not saying something? What do you think the outrage would be if the public found out 2 people not part of the tour was following them around with "odd" behavior and something horrible did happen. How often has that been the case ad people cast the blame on witnesses for not speaking up? It happens with nearly every mass shooting. So you have this mother who is convinced these boys do not belong here and are not part of the group. She sees them behaving oddly, they refuse to cooperate with the people in the tour when asked questions. Are you really surprised someone came forward? Do you really blame her? Do you really think it was racially motivated? Ot maybe just paranoid with the violence that is on the news every day?

    It seems like the police handed it fine. Asked them just a few questions and let them go on their way. 
    If we call everyone racists when they report someone with odd behavior, how do we expect them to say something when they see something? We can;t expect them to be right 100% of the time, but everyone sure is willing to blame others when they miss a red flag.

    Odds are very very very low that the parent would have felt they “didn’t belong” if they were white. We also tell kids they don’t have to answer questions from adults they don’t know that don’t have any business questioning them. 

    This is straight up racist bullshit. 
    Do you have any reason to believe this? Plenty of cops get called for suspicious white people. Do you have any reason to believe this was racially motivated? Other than the fact they weren’t white there was nothing about this story that comes across as targeting minorities. People report white people all the time, shootings have been prevented because of it.
    Please post a link to a story where the cops were called on a white person for being someplace they had every right to be, bonus points if the caller was black, Hispanic or Asian.
    Are you being serious? You really don’t think white people get the police called on them? If you really believe that, this conversation isn’t worth continuing.
    At age 48, I could’ve joined that college tour late, and I fully guarantee you no one would’ve called the cops. 
    I think everyone is missing a big point. It’s not that they showed up late, they had very odd behavior. They admit to having odd behavior. Yeah, you, me and a million other people could have shown up late, and I bet there’s a good chance at least 1 person would have casually asked “Did you register for a tour?” And we would have answered “yes.”
    they showed up late and then refused to answer that very simple question, that’s what was odd. 
    Again, I don’t think it warranted 911, but I don’t think this story is as big of a deal as people make it out to be. And this response was a good example. There’s more to the story than showing up late and having the cops called. 911 wasn’t called because they were late. I’m sure people are late every day to tour groups. But then I’m sure they respond to simple questions too
    peope are asking like they’ve never been questioned for anything, and only minorities or blacks are. It’s part of everyday life, and responding is what is normal. It is completely odd to be asked a simple question and have the mentality to refuse to answer. Everyone who think questioning them was out of line, have you never been in  first-class chekin lines and someone asks to see your ticket, have you never accidentally cut in line and somewhere asks how long you’ve been waiting, have you never seen a group of people and asked what the line was for to make sure you’re in the right place? It doesn’t matter what color you are, if you stand there and refuse to acknowledge someone asking that simple question they are going to think you’re odd.
    Again, 911 not necessary, I just think this story is blown up.

    It simply isn't true that they refused to answer any questions. The woman is quoted as saying that when she asked the boys what the intended to study and one of them answered, the other laughed, which made her think that the first was lying. 

    Honestly, if I had a dollar for every time my brother laughed at what I said when I was younger......

    The point, which you are missing, is that she never even gave them the benefit of the doubt. It sounds to me like she questioned them in a way that made them feel uncomfortable and they didn't want to answer her, nor did they have to. If I don't like the way some busy body in a group is talking to me, I might also move away and not engage with her. I have that benefit, because I'm white, and no one is going to call the cops on me for it. 
    The article isnt very clear on that. It does state she asked their major and they laughed, but later in the article it also states “When asked why they didn't respond to questions by people in the group, the boys say Lloyd is shy.”
    Everything in that statement is plural. Multiple people and multiple questions. Like I said several times, don't think the Mom did the right think, but I don’t think it’s deserves all this attention either.  So yes,  it’s more reasonable to read that as someone casually asked why they were joining the group and that they refused to answer. That is weird. Not worth calling 911, but justified in calling it odd behavior.
    the thing that bugs me about this situation is there is no indication at all, zero, that this was racially motivated. But since it was 2 minorities it’s guilty until proven innocent on the Mom. That seems like the case more and more often.
    This story has been widely covered and I’ve read several articles and have also seen the video of the security guys questioning the boys. The woman is indeed quoted as saying that she asked them what they wanted to study but then thought the boy was lying when he answered. 

    She’s also quoted as saying that their presence made her feel “sick”. Like I said earlier, she needs to have a good look at how she interacts with the world 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    my2hands said:
    mace1229 said:
    my2hands said:
    In an era where fear, security, and suspicion rule the day,  i'm not so sure this can, or should, be dismissed as simple racism... 
    that has pretty much been my point. We live in an era of “if you see something, say something” and constant paranoia of the next shooting.
    i think she over reacted, but from the information I’ve seen it’s not a clear cut of racism.
    But I don't think we can say some level of racism or stereotyping absolutely did not play a factor here either...

    People are consumed with fear, and stereotypes 
    I would agree it’s definitely possible. I can’t say it did or didn’t.  
    I just think all the comments of “if they were white this wouldn’t have happened” are completely unfounded. There’s nothing at all the suggest that. White people get cops called on the all the time. They get kicked out of restaurants and told to leave places too.
    Now I’m not saying racism doesn’t exist and that every scenario where that has happened was justified. I’m just speaking against the mentality of everything is always racist. It was said on this thread flat out white property don’t get cops called on them and asked to leave places, and when it happens to a black person the only explanation is they are racist. That part just isn’t true.
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    Maybe a link to the story of the white members playing a round too slowly and having the cops called on them is in the offering?
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    Maybe a link to the story of the white members playing a round too slowly and having the cops called on them is in the offering?
    One, if that ever happened it wouldn’t make the news. And two, I never said there’s a white example for every extreme black one.
    just that it does happen, go on a ride along and you’ll see there’s lots of calls on white people too. The whole country isn’t racist, there’s actually a lot of good people here too.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    I don’t know the details of the golf story, but I know being asked to leave for player my too slow is not uncommon for white people. Courses have rules and regulations to keep the game moving, and if you’re new and taking 20 strokes per hole they’ll give you a warning or two before they ask you to leave. And if you refuse I would not be surprised at all if they called the cops.
    I don’t know where this idea that these things only happen to black comes from.
  • Thirty Bills UnpaidThirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 15,745
    Slow golfers have made me not play anymore.

    A few years back, my playing partners and I began playing at 6pm to get our rounds done in 2 hours. Hacks taking 5 practice swings to hit the ball 10 feet- finishing their rounds in 5 hours... and everybody else subjected to 5 hours- made me want to poke pins in my eyeballs.

    Pace of play has hurt the golf industry.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 7,063
    mace1229 said:
    my2hands said:
    mace1229 said:
    my2hands said:
    In an era where fear, security, and suspicion rule the day,  i'm not so sure this can, or should, be dismissed as simple racism... 
    that has pretty much been my point. We live in an era of “if you see something, say something” and constant paranoia of the next shooting.
    i think she over reacted, but from the information I’ve seen it’s not a clear cut of racism.
    But I don't think we can say some level of racism or stereotyping absolutely did not play a factor here either...

    People are consumed with fear, and stereotypes 
    I would agree it’s definitely possible. I can’t say it did or didn’t.  
    I just think all the comments of “if they were white this wouldn’t have happened” are completely unfounded. There’s nothing at all the suggest that. White people get cops called on the all the time. They get kicked out of restaurants and told to leave places too.
    Now I’m not saying racism doesn’t exist and that every scenario where that has happened was justified. I’m just speaking against the mentality of everything is always racist. It was said on this thread flat out white property don’t get cops called on them and asked to leave places, and when it happens to a black person the only explanation is they are racist. That part just isn’t true.
    Obviously white people have the cops called on them. That isn’t really the issue here. White privilege gives me implied permission to pretty much be wherever I want to be and that I belong there. Racism says minorites don’t have permission to go anywhere and be anywhere. 
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    Happens to white people all the time.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/07/us/airbnb-police-called-trnd/index.html

    No no big deal, right? I’m starting to think this is a new alt-right, white supremacist tactic, the same as swatting but without the weapon or serious crime claim. Just “acting suspicious.” Then hope things go south with law enforcement because, well, we know that never happens either.
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  • Merkin BallerMerkin Baller Posts: 3,010
    Happens to white people all the time.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/07/us/airbnb-police-called-trnd/index.html

    No no big deal, right? I’m starting to think this is a new alt-right, white supremacist tactic, the same as swatting but without the weapon or serious crime claim. Just “acting suspicious.” Then hope things go south with law enforcement because, well, we know that never happens either.
    The call was supposedly placed by an elderly neighbor. To be honest, if my neighbor knew I wasn’t around, and saw 4 strange (as in: unknown) people leaving my house with several bags, I think I would want them to do the same thing. 

    I also don’t think an elderly white woman is hip to ‘swatting’ or whatever the new alt-right trends are, but that’s just me. 

  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    Happens to white people all the time.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/07/us/airbnb-police-called-trnd/index.html

    No no big deal, right? I’m starting to think this is a new alt-right, white supremacist tactic, the same as swatting but without the weapon or serious crime claim. Just “acting suspicious.” Then hope things go south with law enforcement because, well, we know that never happens either.
    The call was supposedly placed by an elderly neighbor. To be honest, if my neighbor knew I wasn’t around, and saw 4 strange (as in: unknown) people leaving my house with several bags, I think I would want them to do the same thing. 

    I also don’t think an elderly white woman is hip to ‘swatting’ or whatever the new alt-right trends are, but that’s just me. 
    Were these the first Airbnb guests at this location or the first black guests? Or did the suitcases lead to visions of stockpiled assault rifles? You know, see something, say something?
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    Under Team Trump Treason, even more so.

    Trump rolling back Obama efforts on racial bias - POLITICO https://apple.news/A723EctXOSsyOifOneufKiQ
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    I blame the media and social media for some of this. It does happen to white people. I couldn't find much information because, guess what, when cops get called on a white person no one cares and it isn't reported.

    I would argue that in some neighborhoods a black person is more likely to get profiled or accused or get police called. I would not deny that. But it has been said several times that it just doesn't happen to white people, even as far as people don't call cops on white people. That just isn't true. But the way the media reports every black interaction with police they'd have you believe its true, and the only explanation for every once of these cases is racism.
    If you don't believe this, spend 1 day on a ride-along. I believe anyone can do a ride along, I've done it a couple times. I would encourage it, it gives you perspective what and how many calls cops get, how they deal with them, how people treat them, etc. Its a good experience. 
    The problem this has created is now anytime someone of color has the cops called on them it is considered racist.

    I would consider my behavior better than the average teen and 20-something when I was that age. Never got into big trouble.  But guess what, I've had the cops called on me for breaking into my own home. I played Pokemon Go for a couple days, was in a park playing 4 houses down from where I live and had multiple people call the cops on me, came to my house and questioned me for about 5 minutes. I've had the cops pull me over for off-roading. We thought it was fine, but apparently only emergencies vehicles were permitted. Yes, we were doing something wrong, but we were treated like drug lords for about 30 minutes. The cop was a total dick to us, had us sit with our hands behind our back while he thoroughly searched our car, threatened to hall us into jail every time we spoke. Eventually let us go with a warning after he didn't find any drugs, and asked us to follow him out of the area. As we exited through the only dirt road, he stopped and locked the gate behind him, locking us in. I've been asked to leave restaurants before when we stayed longer than was needed. I've been asked to leave places when I wasn't a paying customer. I haven't been kicked off a golf course, but have seen white people being asked to leave for playing too slowly, it is part of the rules.
    Those things are a part of life. I doubt anyone can honestly say they've never been asked to leave someplace, or been rudely treated by a cop or something. 

    That stuff happens all the time. And the only issue I have is it seems like when it happens to a minority many people just automatically jump to the conclusion that the only explanation is racism. 
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    mace1229 said:
    I blame the media and social media for some of this. It does happen to white people. I couldn't find much information because, guess what, when cops get called on a white person no one cares and it isn't reported.

    I would argue that in some neighborhoods a black person is more likely to get profiled or accused or get police called. I would not deny that. But it has been said several times that it just doesn't happen to white people, even as far as people don't call cops on white people. That just isn't true. But the way the media reports every black interaction with police they'd have you believe its true, and the only explanation for every once of these cases is racism.
    If you don't believe this, spend 1 day on a ride-along. I believe anyone can do a ride along, I've done it a couple times. I would encourage it, it gives you perspective what and how many calls cops get, how they deal with them, how people treat them, etc. Its a good experience. 
    The problem this has created is now anytime someone of color has the cops called on them it is considered racist.

    I would consider my behavior better than the average teen and 20-something when I was that age. Never got into big trouble.  But guess what, I've had the cops called on me for breaking into my own home. I played Pokemon Go for a couple days, was in a park playing 4 houses down from where I live and had multiple people call the cops on me, came to my house and questioned me for about 5 minutes. I've had the cops pull me over for off-roading. We thought it was fine, but apparently only emergencies vehicles were permitted. Yes, we were doing something wrong, but we were treated like drug lords for about 30 minutes. The cop was a total dick to us, had us sit with our hands behind our back while he thoroughly searched our car, threatened to hall us into jail every time we spoke. Eventually let us go with a warning after he didn't find any drugs, and asked us to follow him out of the area. As we exited through the only dirt road, he stopped and locked the gate behind him, locking us in. I've been asked to leave restaurants before when we stayed longer than was needed. I've been asked to leave places when I wasn't a paying customer. I haven't been kicked off a golf course, but have seen white people being asked to leave for playing too slowly, it is part of the rules.
    Those things are a part of life. I doubt anyone can honestly say they've never been asked to leave someplace, or been rudely treated by a cop or something. 

    That stuff happens all the time. And the only issue I have is it seems like when it happens to a minority many people just automatically jump to the conclusion that the only explanation is racism. 
    Please, just stop. The black women weren’t asked to leave because of slow play, they had the cops called on them for slow golf play. Really? You can’t see the distinction? How many white people get asked to pre-pay for their meals? The black guys didn’t over stay their restaurant meal and linger over coffee. They were asked to pre-pay for their meals while no one else was. The lengths you go to dismiss these cases of racism by justifying it by saying it happens all the time to white people yet all you have to show is your personal experiences. Like that’s the barometer. “Well, it happened to me so it must happen to most white people.”  You can’t find instances of similar incidents because by and large, it doesn’t happen to white people based solely on their color. I challenge you to darken your skin and wear an Afro wig for two weeks and go about your regular business and see if you feel like you were treated differently.
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    edited May 11
    mace1229 said:
    I blame the media and social media for some of this. It does happen to white people. I couldn't find much information because, guess what, when cops get called on a white person no one cares and it isn't reported.

    I would argue that in some neighborhoods a black person is more likely to get profiled or accused or get police called. I would not deny that. But it has been said several times that it just doesn't happen to white people, even as far as people don't call cops on white people. That just isn't true. But the way the media reports every black interaction with police they'd have you believe its true, and the only explanation for every once of these cases is racism.
    If you don't believe this, spend 1 day on a ride-along. I believe anyone can do a ride along, I've done it a couple times. I would encourage it, it gives you perspective what and how many calls cops get, how they deal with them, how people treat them, etc. Its a good experience. 
    The problem this has created is now anytime someone of color has the cops called on them it is considered racist.

    I would consider my behavior better than the average teen and 20-something when I was that age. Never got into big trouble.  But guess what, I've had the cops called on me for breaking into my own home. I played Pokemon Go for a couple days, was in a park playing 4 houses down from where I live and had multiple people call the cops on me, came to my house and questioned me for about 5 minutes. I've had the cops pull me over for off-roading. We thought it was fine, but apparently only emergencies vehicles were permitted. Yes, we were doing something wrong, but we were treated like drug lords for about 30 minutes. The cop was a total dick to us, had us sit with our hands behind our back while he thoroughly searched our car, threatened to hall us into jail every time we spoke. Eventually let us go with a warning after he didn't find any drugs, and asked us to follow him out of the area. As we exited through the only dirt road, he stopped and locked the gate behind him, locking us in. I've been asked to leave restaurants before when we stayed longer than was needed. I've been asked to leave places when I wasn't a paying customer. I haven't been kicked off a golf course, but have seen white people being asked to leave for playing too slowly, it is part of the rules.
    Those things are a part of life. I doubt anyone can honestly say they've never been asked to leave someplace, or been rudely treated by a cop or something. 

    That stuff happens all the time. And the only issue I have is it seems like when it happens to a minority many people just automatically jump to the conclusion that the only explanation is racism. 
    Please, just stop. The black women weren’t asked to leave because of slow play, they had the cops called on them for slow golf play. Really? You can’t see the distinction? How many white people get asked to pre-pay for their meals? The black guys didn’t over stay their restaurant meal and linger over coffee. They were asked to pre-pay for their meals while no one else was. The lengths you go to dismiss these cases of racism by justifying it by saying it happens all the time to white people yet all you have to show is your personal experiences. Like that’s the barometer. “Well, it happened to me so it must happen to most white people.”  You can’t find instances of similar incidents because by and large, it doesn’t happen to white people based solely on their color. I challenge you to darken your skin and wear an Afro wig for two weeks and go about your regular business and see if you feel like you were treated differently.
    Because that wouldn't be racist.
    Talk about stereotyping. 
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • PJPOWERPJPOWER In Yo FacePosts: 4,405
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    I blame the media and social media for some of this. It does happen to white people. I couldn't find much information because, guess what, when cops get called on a white person no one cares and it isn't reported.

    I would argue that in some neighborhoods a black person is more likely to get profiled or accused or get police called. I would not deny that. But it has been said several times that it just doesn't happen to white people, even as far as people don't call cops on white people. That just isn't true. But the way the media reports every black interaction with police they'd have you believe its true, and the only explanation for every once of these cases is racism.
    If you don't believe this, spend 1 day on a ride-along. I believe anyone can do a ride along, I've done it a couple times. I would encourage it, it gives you perspective what and how many calls cops get, how they deal with them, how people treat them, etc. Its a good experience. 
    The problem this has created is now anytime someone of color has the cops called on them it is considered racist.

    I would consider my behavior better than the average teen and 20-something when I was that age. Never got into big trouble.  But guess what, I've had the cops called on me for breaking into my own home. I played Pokemon Go for a couple days, was in a park playing 4 houses down from where I live and had multiple people call the cops on me, came to my house and questioned me for about 5 minutes. I've had the cops pull me over for off-roading. We thought it was fine, but apparently only emergencies vehicles were permitted. Yes, we were doing something wrong, but we were treated like drug lords for about 30 minutes. The cop was a total dick to us, had us sit with our hands behind our back while he thoroughly searched our car, threatened to hall us into jail every time we spoke. Eventually let us go with a warning after he didn't find any drugs, and asked us to follow him out of the area. As we exited through the only dirt road, he stopped and locked the gate behind him, locking us in. I've been asked to leave restaurants before when we stayed longer than was needed. I've been asked to leave places when I wasn't a paying customer. I haven't been kicked off a golf course, but have seen white people being asked to leave for playing too slowly, it is part of the rules.
    Those things are a part of life. I doubt anyone can honestly say they've never been asked to leave someplace, or been rudely treated by a cop or something. 

    That stuff happens all the time. And the only issue I have is it seems like when it happens to a minority many people just automatically jump to the conclusion that the only explanation is racism. 
    Please, just stop. The black women weren’t asked to leave because of slow play, they had the cops called on them for slow golf play. Really? You can’t see the distinction? How many white people get asked to pre-pay for their meals? The black guys didn’t over stay their restaurant meal and linger over coffee. They were asked to pre-pay for their meals while no one else was. The lengths you go to dismiss these cases of racism by justifying it by saying it happens all the time to white people yet all you have to show is your personal experiences. Like that’s the barometer. “Well, it happened to me so it must happen to most white people.”  You can’t find instances of similar incidents because by and large, it doesn’t happen to white people based solely on their color. I challenge you to darken your skin and wear an Afro wig for two weeks and go about your regular business and see if you feel like you were treated differently.
    Because that wouldn't be racist.
    Talk about stereotyping. 
    “Trans-racial”, lol
    "At least I'm housebroken"
  • cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 10,634
    mace1229 said:
    I blame the media and social media for some of this. It does happen to white people. I couldn't find much information because, guess what, when cops get called on a white person no one cares and it isn't reported.

    I would argue that in some neighborhoods a black person is more likely to get profiled or accused or get police called. I would not deny that. But it has been said several times that it just doesn't happen to white people, even as far as people don't call cops on white people. That just isn't true. But the way the media reports every black interaction with police they'd have you believe its true, and the only explanation for every once of these cases is racism.
    If you don't believe this, spend 1 day on a ride-along. I believe anyone can do a ride along, I've done it a couple times. I would encourage it, it gives you perspective what and how many calls cops get, how they deal with them, how people treat them, etc. Its a good experience. 
    The problem this has created is now anytime someone of color has the cops called on them it is considered racist.

    I would consider my behavior better than the average teen and 20-something when I was that age. Never got into big trouble.  But guess what, I've had the cops called on me for breaking into my own home. I played Pokemon Go for a couple days, was in a park playing 4 houses down from where I live and had multiple people call the cops on me, came to my house and questioned me for about 5 minutes. I've had the cops pull me over for off-roading. We thought it was fine, but apparently only emergencies vehicles were permitted. Yes, we were doing something wrong, but we were treated like drug lords for about 30 minutes. The cop was a total dick to us, had us sit with our hands behind our back while he thoroughly searched our car, threatened to hall us into jail every time we spoke. Eventually let us go with a warning after he didn't find any drugs, and asked us to follow him out of the area. As we exited through the only dirt road, he stopped and locked the gate behind him, locking us in. I've been asked to leave restaurants before when we stayed longer than was needed. I've been asked to leave places when I wasn't a paying customer. I haven't been kicked off a golf course, but have seen white people being asked to leave for playing too slowly, it is part of the rules.
    Those things are a part of life. I doubt anyone can honestly say they've never been asked to leave someplace, or been rudely treated by a cop or something. 

    That stuff happens all the time. And the only issue I have is it seems like when it happens to a minority many people just automatically jump to the conclusion that the only explanation is racism. 
    It's true these things sometimes happen to white people.  And it's true you don't hear about it.  But you aren't hearing about the other 99.99999% of the incidents involving racism towards black people either.  They are no way equal in numbers.  So yes, some of these could have happened to white people....but the sheer number of times things like this happen to black people is crazy.  And the sole reason people are scared of them, think they won;t pay, etc is because of the color of their skin.
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    edited May 11
    mace1229 said:
    I blame the media and social media for some of this. It does happen to white people. I couldn't find much information because, guess what, when cops get called on a white person no one cares and it isn't reported.

    I would argue that in some neighborhoods a black person is more likely to get profiled or accused or get police called. I would not deny that. But it has been said several times that it just doesn't happen to white people, even as far as people don't call cops on white people. That just isn't true. But the way the media reports every black interaction with police they'd have you believe its true, and the only explanation for every once of these cases is racism.
    If you don't believe this, spend 1 day on a ride-along. I believe anyone can do a ride along, I've done it a couple times. I would encourage it, it gives you perspective what and how many calls cops get, how they deal with them, how people treat them, etc. Its a good experience. 
    The problem this has created is now anytime someone of color has the cops called on them it is considered racist.

    I would consider my behavior better than the average teen and 20-something when I was that age. Never got into big trouble.  But guess what, I've had the cops called on me for breaking into my own home. I played Pokemon Go for a couple days, was in a park playing 4 houses down from where I live and had multiple people call the cops on me, came to my house and questioned me for about 5 minutes. I've had the cops pull me over for off-roading. We thought it was fine, but apparently only emergencies vehicles were permitted. Yes, we were doing something wrong, but we were treated like drug lords for about 30 minutes. The cop was a total dick to us, had us sit with our hands behind our back while he thoroughly searched our car, threatened to hall us into jail every time we spoke. Eventually let us go with a warning after he didn't find any drugs, and asked us to follow him out of the area. As we exited through the only dirt road, he stopped and locked the gate behind him, locking us in. I've been asked to leave restaurants before when we stayed longer than was needed. I've been asked to leave places when I wasn't a paying customer. I haven't been kicked off a golf course, but have seen white people being asked to leave for playing too slowly, it is part of the rules.
    Those things are a part of life. I doubt anyone can honestly say they've never been asked to leave someplace, or been rudely treated by a cop or something. 

    That stuff happens all the time. And the only issue I have is it seems like when it happens to a minority many people just automatically jump to the conclusion that the only explanation is racism. 
    It's true these things sometimes happen to white people.  And it's true you don't hear about it.  But you aren't hearing about the other 99.99999% of the incidents involving racism towards black people either.  They are no way equal in numbers.  So yes, some of these could have happened to white people....but the sheer number of times things like this happen to black people is crazy.  And the sole reason people are scared of them, think they won;t pay, etc is because of the color of their skin.

    My response was to those who flat out say this never happens to white people (and some have said that) and those that assume every case is racist. Some are, but every case can't be when it happens, to some extent, to all people. 

    I can guarantee you when parents called the cops on me because I was walking around a park adjacent to a school (playing Pokemon Go, I never even approached the school, was just walking through the public park adjacent to it) getting out where I lived just 4 houses down, if I was black this would have been seen as racial profiling. No question in my mind that would have been seen as racist if I was black.

    I never said it happens to everyone equally, in fact I said that it does not. I know it doesn't happen equally. But in today's world a black person can't have a negative experience without someone calling it racist. That was what I was trying to say, and I don't agree that it always is.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,366
    How do you know the parents called the cops?
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  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    How do you know the parents called the cops?
    The cops told me when they took my ID, ran my name and questioned me. They said they had multiple calls from the school and parents. I laughed about it, was a little embarassed to admit I was playing Pokemon.
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    edited May 11
    I had an outpatient surgery that morning. Had the day off work to recover and got bored. I wanted some fresh air and walk around. I just downloaded the game about a day or 2 earlier, so I decided to walk through the park that was only 4 houses down from where I lived. There is an elementary school adjacent to the park that was getting out during that time.
    Was there maybe 15-20 minutes before cops showed up and questioned me.
    There were 2 cops, 1 male and 1 female. The guy laughed with me, but the female was a little rude, almost as if she didn't believe me. 
    I am rarely ever home when school is getting out, but parents park along the street sometimes going beyond my house waiting for their kids. I can only assume it was some of those parents who called. 
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 16,088
    mace1229 said:
    I had an outpatient surgery that morning. Had the day off work to recover and got bored. I wanted some fresh air and walk around. I just downloaded the game about a day or 2 earlier, so I decided to walk through the park that was only 4 houses down from where I lived. There is an elementary school adjacent to the park that was getting out during that time.
    Was there maybe 15-20 minutes before cops showed up and questioned me.
    There were 2 cops, 1 male and 1 female. The guy laughed with me, but the female was a little rude, almost as if she didn't believe me. 
    I am rarely ever home when school is getting out, but parents park along the street sometimes going beyond my house waiting for their kids. I can only assume it was some of those parents who called. 
    that's fucking crazy. the world has gone bonkers. 
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 2,987
    edited May 11
    I gave the abbreviated version. They actually questioned me at my house. I went to the store or something and on the way home stopped at the park to walk around/go pokemon hunting. After 15-20 minutes I got back in my car and drove the 100 yards to my house.  I drive a bright yellow jeep (not the best choice if you want to kidnap kids with it), I was told at least one of the calls provided my car information and that is how they found me at my house. Knocked on my door and questioned me there. Clearly I was at my house, parked in my driveway, lived in the neighborhood and abandoned my attempt to kidnap children for the day, but they still came and questioned me.
    My wife was home and asked who was at the door. I was embarrassed to tell her I was playing Pokemon, so I just told her it was solicitors and that's why I went outside to talk to them. When she asked what was funny I came forward with the truth. You've never seen such a big eye-roll in your life. . 
    But you know, honestly I didn't mind. If 500 people get inconvenienced and questioned when they look out of place in order to prevent 1 kidnapping its worth it to me. As long as it doesn't go any farther than this did, not like they hauled me down to the station to talk to me.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 16,088
    mace1229 said:
    I gave the abbreviated version. They actually questioned me at my house. I went to the store or something and on the way home stopped at the park to walk around/go pokemon hunting. After 15-20 minutes I got back in my car and drove the 100 yards to my house.  I drive a bright yellow jeep (not the best choice if you want to kidnap kids with it), I was told at least one of the calls provided my car information and that is how they found me at my house. Knocked on my door and questioned me there. Clearly I was at my house, parked in my driveway, lived in the neighborhood and abandoned my attempt to kidnap children for the day, but they still came and questioned me.
    My wife was home and asked who was at the door. I was embarrassed to tell her I was playing Pokemon, so I just told her it was solicitors and that's why I went outside to talk to them. When she asked what was funny I came forward with the truth. You've never seen such a big eye-roll in your life. . 
    But you know, honestly I didn't mind. If 500 people get inconvenienced and questioned when they look out of place in order to prevent 1 kidnapping its worth it to me. 
    aren't they obligated to follow up on all calls though? even as assinine as it may seem? I don't fault the cops, really, more the paranoid "there's a pedophile on every corner" morons. 
  • pjhawkspjhawks Posts: 8,929
    mace1229 said:
    I gave the abbreviated version. They actually questioned me at my house. I went to the store or something and on the way home stopped at the park to walk around/go pokemon hunting. After 15-20 minutes I got back in my car and drove the 100 yards to my house.  I drive a bright yellow jeep (not the best choice if you want to kidnap kids with it), I was told at least one of the calls provided my car information and that is how they found me at my house. Knocked on my door and questioned me there. Clearly I was at my house, parked in my driveway, lived in the neighborhood and abandoned my attempt to kidnap children for the day, but they still came and questioned me.
    My wife was home and asked who was at the door. I was embarrassed to tell her I was playing Pokemon, so I just told her it was solicitors and that's why I went outside to talk to them. When she asked what was funny I came forward with the truth. You've never seen such a big eye-roll in your life. . 
    But you know, honestly I didn't mind. If 500 people get inconvenienced and questioned when they look out of place in order to prevent 1 kidnapping its worth it to me. 
    inconvenient for you yes, but i'd rather live in a neighborhood where caution like that is taken.  There was recently a murder-suicide in a town a few miles from me. wife killed woman who was sleeping with her husband then herself. she stalked out the neighborhood for a few days prior. one neighbor said she saw this woman looking at the house with binoculars a few days prior to the murder and even though thought it was strange never called the police. police came out after murder-suicide and requested people call the cops when they see things that might be strange like that. they could have prevented a murder-suicide by calling. police were adamant afterwards to call when you see strange things like this.  i have zero problems with people calling in these types of cases.  2 minutes of inconvenience is better than what could happen.  
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 16,088
    pjhawks said:
    mace1229 said:
    I gave the abbreviated version. They actually questioned me at my house. I went to the store or something and on the way home stopped at the park to walk around/go pokemon hunting. After 15-20 minutes I got back in my car and drove the 100 yards to my house.  I drive a bright yellow jeep (not the best choice if you want to kidnap kids with it), I was told at least one of the calls provided my car information and that is how they found me at my house. Knocked on my door and questioned me there. Clearly I was at my house, parked in my driveway, lived in the neighborhood and abandoned my attempt to kidnap children for the day, but they still came and questioned me.
    My wife was home and asked who was at the door. I was embarrassed to tell her I was playing Pokemon, so I just told her it was solicitors and that's why I went outside to talk to them. When she asked what was funny I came forward with the truth. You've never seen such a big eye-roll in your life. . 
    But you know, honestly I didn't mind. If 500 people get inconvenienced and questioned when they look out of place in order to prevent 1 kidnapping its worth it to me. 
    inconvenient for you yes, but i'd rather live in a neighborhood where caution like that is taken.  There was recently a murder-suicide in a town a few miles from me. wife killed woman who was sleeping with her husband then herself. she stalked out the neighborhood for a few days prior. one neighbor said she saw this woman looking at the house with binoculars a few days prior to the murder and even though thought it was strange never called the police. police came out after murder-suicide and requested people call the cops when they see things that might be strange like that. they could have prevented a murder-suicide by calling. police were adamant afterwards to call when you see strange things like this.  i have zero problems with people calling in these types of cases.  2 minutes of inconvenience is better than what could happen.  
    looking at someone's house with binocs is a bit different than simply walking down the street looking at your phone, though, don't you think?
  • pjhawkspjhawks Posts: 8,929
    pjhawks said:
    mace1229 said:
    I gave the abbreviated version. They actually questioned me at my house. I went to the store or something and on the way home stopped at the park to walk around/go pokemon hunting. After 15-20 minutes I got back in my car and drove the 100 yards to my house.  I drive a bright yellow jeep (not the best choice if you want to kidnap kids with it), I was told at least one of the calls provided my car information and that is how they found me at my house. Knocked on my door and questioned me there. Clearly I was at my house, parked in my driveway, lived in the neighborhood and abandoned my attempt to kidnap children for the day, but they still came and questioned me.
    My wife was home and asked who was at the door. I was embarrassed to tell her I was playing Pokemon, so I just told her it was solicitors and that's why I went outside to talk to them. When she asked what was funny I came forward with the truth. You've never seen such a big eye-roll in your life. . 
    But you know, honestly I didn't mind. If 500 people get inconvenienced and questioned when they look out of place in order to prevent 1 kidnapping its worth it to me. 
    inconvenient for you yes, but i'd rather live in a neighborhood where caution like that is taken.  There was recently a murder-suicide in a town a few miles from me. wife killed woman who was sleeping with her husband then herself. she stalked out the neighborhood for a few days prior. one neighbor said she saw this woman looking at the house with binoculars a few days prior to the murder and even though thought it was strange never called the police. police came out after murder-suicide and requested people call the cops when they see things that might be strange like that. they could have prevented a murder-suicide by calling. police were adamant afterwards to call when you see strange things like this.  i have zero problems with people calling in these types of cases.  2 minutes of inconvenience is better than what could happen.  
    looking at someone's house with binocs is a bit different than simply walking down the street looking at your phone, though, don't you think?
    Yes but the point of my story was more if you think something/someone is acting peculiar nothing wrong with calling the police. it's why they are there.   Besides walking near a school, during the day and/or drop off/pick up-time i don't have a problem with being cautious in that situation if they see someone they deem might be acting strange or out of the ordinay.  
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