I guess a lot of Americans feel the same way as I do: why do we have to compromise our safety to let even more refugees in, especially one's with possibly terrorist ties (even though it's the vast minority)? Why can't Muslim countries or any other country take these people in? Why does the United states always have to get involved with international problems when we have a plethora of domestic issues to solve? I.e. Thousands of homeless american vets yet we are going to provide housing and education for those emigrating to the united states from the middle east. I guess everyone has their breaking point and this seems to be it.
The countries in the region are hosting millions of refugees, you are just echoing a right wing disinformation point. It is ironic too, considering it has clearly been the conservatives who block veterans bills every time they come up.
I m no conservative; I ve voted democrat every time since 1996. However I did live through 9/11 like many other people and have learned not to be so trusting of people. I agree no one is against law abiding Syrian refugees but you can not guarantee an Isis fighter won't slip in with them. See by not allowing any of them in you do guarantee that a terrorist won't slip through.
So let me get this straight... You aren't willing to gamble any American lives, but Syrian lives, they can be gambled with?
This makes no sense- its an unfair question.
Not that 'gambling' is the operative term for this situation... would you flip a coin to determine the well being of your child versus another, RG? Does your child hold a special place in your heart?
I'm assuming from this post that your child holds no more value than any other child. This is why I ask. If I am wrong... you should retract your rather arrogant statement where you challenged another for holding such a selfish position.
Of course it makes sense. Refusing to accept any refugees makes a virtual certainty that some Syrian lives (children?) that would have been saved will be lost, that refusal, on the chance that some strangers might be killed as a result in this country, is a gamble on Syrian lives. That is placing less value on Syrian lives than American lives any way you slice it.
The business of flipping a coin over my child is the unfair question that lacks sense. In an acute scenario where I have to choose my child over another, of course I won't flip the coin. That has nothing to do with flipping the coin to allow refugee children into this country with the infinitesimally small chance that another refugee will harm my son... I will flip that coin all day long. Yes, my own son takes precedence, but strangers sons are all of equal value to me, whatever color and origin they happen to have.
So you and McScruffy feel the same- instinctually protective of your own versus another: you in more 'acute' scenarios... him in more 'broader' scenarios.
That's a fair assessment, but I think the distinction you made makes all the difference. We are talking about lives hanging in the balance, denying all refugees entry will surely cause death and massive suffering of them, letting them in might cause death and suffering for us. The risk to us is a risk that many are willing to take, and many others are not willing to risk American lives but they don't seem to have a problem with the inevitabilcity of suffering among Syrians. I think it's fair to point out this is inherently placing less value on foreign lives, especially since most of the people I have seen expressing this sentiment don't seem to have thought it through to it's conclusion.
How exactly are Syrian refugees suffering or dying If they are settling in another country that is willing to take them in?
Lets see..2 million in Turkey , where the pool of people are we are begining the process of vetting for resettlement.
Est 3 million more on the move mostly to Europe. Another est 7 million more internally displaced within Syria.
So considering those in Turkey where they have been under armed guard for quite some time for settlement seems dangerous?
It's not just dangerous. There are food shortages. Children are becoming malnourished, and now Turkey has been forced to withdraw free medical services, while the refugees have no money at all and zero opportunity to work, so people are now literally dying because of simple lack of medical care. Meanwhile, more refugees arrive every day, with no space for them, now no medical care, not even for children who have been trekking on foot for god knows how long... plus it is now winter, and they are starting to freeze. Oh yeah, no biggie. No need to get them the fuck ot of there NOW to relieve their fear, stress, and suffering. They're just Syrians after all.
seems like turkey has been a pretty good host according to this article: (i'm not finding any articles saying syrian refugees are freezing (aren't all people outside freezing when the weather drops?) due to the impeding weather. can you share a source?) source: http://www.thenation.com/article/why-syrian-refugees-in-turkey-are-leaving-for-europe/ Nasser is one of over 2 million Syrian refugees in Turkey, which has accepted more than any other state. According to a recent 72-page report issued by Turkey’s Republican People’s Party, only 270,000 refugees are living in camps near the border. The rest are scattered across Turkey’s 81 provinces. Istanbul is a popular destination for many of them, who like Nasser are trying to establish a new life. Some estimates peg the Syrian population in Turkey’s most populous city at nearly half a million. Turkey—currently the world’s largest refugee-hosting nation—has been widely praised for its welcoming attitude. On a visit marking World Refugee Day in June, the UN High Commissioner for Refugees, António Guterres, called Turkey “a great example for other countries in a world where borders are becoming unpassable for refugees.” The Turkish government says it has spent nearly $8 billion on humanitarian assistance for Syrian refugees alone. It also recently announced that Gaziantep University, less than a two-hour drive from Aleppo, would offer 28 majors in Arabic, including biology, mathematics, economics, literature, and engineering. However, the Turkish Parliament has yet to act on the issue of work permits for refugees, which it has punted until after the snap parliamentary elections to be held in November.
“More than half of school-age Syrian refugee children in Turkey whose native language is Arabic have been unable to go to school,” Chiharu Kondo, 43, said in a recent interview in Tokyo.
“To help Syrian refugees build a stable society with hope for their future, it is urgent to teach them the Turkish language to overcome the language barrier,” she said.
The number of Syrian refugees in Turkey stood at about 2 million last month, UNICEF says. While 708,000 of them are between 6 and 18 years old, around 400,000 do not attend school.
In 2014, the Turkish government gave all registered Syrian refugees the right to receive free education at its public schools. But Turkish and Syrian children are taught separately in morning and afternoon classes due to the language differences.
Such a situation “will not facilitate mutual understanding,” Kondo noted, adding that there also is a serious shortage of classrooms and teaching staff.
Kondo said there is risk that refugees may turn to terrorism or other dangerous activities if they fail to receive adequate education.
“Syrian refugees, who are unable to return home any time soon due to the prolonged civil war, must receive education and become integrated into society so that they can live with hope for the future. That will increase stability in host nations” she emphasized.
I guess a lot of Americans feel the same way as I do: why do we have to compromise our safety to let even more refugees in, especially one's with possibly terrorist ties (even though it's the vast minority)? Why can't Muslim countries or any other country take these people in? Why does the United states always have to get involved with international problems when we have a plethora of domestic issues to solve? I.e. Thousands of homeless american vets yet we are going to provide housing and education for those emigrating to the united states from the middle east. I guess everyone has their breaking point and this seems to be it.
The countries in the region are hosting millions of refugees, you are just echoing a right wing disinformation point. It is ironic too, considering it has clearly been the conservatives who block veterans bills every time they come up.
I m no conservative; I ve voted democrat every time since 1996. However I did live through 9/11 like many other people and have learned not to be so trusting of people. I agree no one is against law abiding Syrian refugees but you can not guarantee an Isis fighter won't slip in with them. See by not allowing any of them in you do guarantee that a terrorist won't slip through.
So let me get this straight... You aren't willing to gamble any American lives, but Syrian lives, they can be gambled with?
This makes no sense- its an unfair question.
Not that 'gambling' is the operative term for this situation... would you flip a coin to determine the well being of your child versus another, RG? Does your child hold a special place in your heart?
I'm assuming from this post that your child holds no more value than any other child. This is why I ask. If I am wrong... you should retract your rather arrogant statement where you challenged another for holding such a selfish position.
Of course it makes sense. Refusing to accept any refugees makes a virtual certainty that some Syrian lives (children?) that would have been saved will be lost, that refusal, on the chance that some strangers might be killed as a result in this country, is a gamble on Syrian lives. That is placing less value on Syrian lives than American lives any way you slice it.
The business of flipping a coin over my child is the unfair question that lacks sense. In an acute scenario where I have to choose my child over another, of course I won't flip the coin. That has nothing to do with flipping the coin to allow refugee children into this country with the infinitesimally small chance that another refugee will harm my son... I will flip that coin all day long. Yes, my own son takes precedence, but strangers sons are all of equal value to me, whatever color and origin they happen to have.
So you and McScruffy feel the same- instinctually protective of your own versus another: you in more 'acute' scenarios... him in more 'broader' scenarios.
That's a fair assessment, but I think the distinction you made makes all the difference. We are talking about lives hanging in the balance, denying all refugees entry will surely cause death and massive suffering of them, letting them in might cause death and suffering for us. The risk to us is a risk that many are willing to take, and many others are not willing to risk American lives but they don't seem to have a problem with the inevitabilcity of suffering among Syrians. I think it's fair to point out this is inherently placing less value on foreign lives, especially since most of the people I have seen expressing this sentiment don't seem to have thought it through to it's conclusion.
How exactly are Syrian refugees suffering or dying If they are settling in another country that is willing to take them in?
Lets see..2 million in Turkey , where the pool of people are we are begining the process of vetting for resettlement.
Est 3 million more on the move mostly to Europe. Another est 7 million more internally displaced within Syria.
So considering those in Turkey where they have been under armed guard for quite some time for settlement seems dangerous?
It's not just dangerous. There are food shortages. Children are becoming malnourished, and now Turkey has been forced to withdraw free medical services, while the refugees have no money at all and zero opportunity to work, so people are now literally dying because of simple lack of medical care. Meanwhile, more refugees arrive every day, with no space for them, now no medical care, not even for children who have been trekking on foot for god knows how long... plus it is now winter, and they are starting to freeze. Oh yeah, no biggie. No need to get them the fuck ot of there NOW to relieve their fear, stress, and suffering. They're just Syrians after all.
seems like turkey has been a pretty good host according to this article: (i'm not finding any articles saying syrian refugees are freezing (aren't all people outside freezing when the weather drops?) due to the impeding weather. can you share a source?) source: http://www.thenation.com/article/why-syrian-refugees-in-turkey-are-leaving-for-europe/ Nasser is one of over 2 million Syrian refugees in Turkey, which has accepted more than any other state. According to a recent 72-page report issued by Turkey’s Republican People’s Party, only 270,000 refugees are living in camps near the border. The rest are scattered across Turkey’s 81 provinces. Istanbul is a popular destination for many of them, who like Nasser are trying to establish a new life. Some estimates peg the Syrian population in Turkey’s most populous city at nearly half a million. Turkey—currently the world’s largest refugee-hosting nation—has been widely praised for its welcoming attitude. On a visit marking World Refugee Day in June, the UN High Commissioner for Refugees, António Guterres, called Turkey “a great example for other countries in a world where borders are becoming unpassable for refugees.” The Turkish government says it has spent nearly $8 billion on humanitarian assistance for Syrian refugees alone. It also recently announced that Gaziantep University, less than a two-hour drive from Aleppo, would offer 28 majors in Arabic, including biology, mathematics, economics, literature, and engineering. However, the Turkish Parliament has yet to act on the issue of work permits for refugees, which it has punted until after the snap parliamentary elections to be held in November.
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
and yeah winter is coming, but this the 3rd, 4th or even 5th winter these refugees have endured. I'm sure all of you have been vocal these past couple of years about how winter has impacted these people. please don't tell me this is the first time it has caught your attention since it is now national news.
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
What a waste of time.
yeah i read all the articles and the first thing that strikes me is: Vulnerable refugees face fifth winter without adequate food and clothing Danish Refugee Council (DRC) - Denmark - Fri, 20 Nov 2015 08:10 GMT denmark. harsh winters. holy cow it seems like the author is talking about refugees in denmark. but then we have a sleight of hand and he's talking about snow in the middle east?
Last winter snow blanketed refugee camps and urban areas, and freezing temperatures created concerns about the health of refugees, who lacked access to warm clothing and secure shelter. In early January, three Syrian refugee children froze to death in Lebanon and a snow storm in Syria killed two children caught in the elements. Temperatures throughout region drop below ten degrees from November – March, with snow common.
you could replace these cities names with any other cities across the globe. wait let me try: source http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/24/us/cold-weather-hits-midwest-and-east-coast-causing-several-deaths.html?_r=0 Since Saturday, the authorities have reported at least four deaths related to the cold in the Midwest, including a 70-year-old man found frozen in his unheated home in Des Plaines, Ill., on Sunday, according to The Associated Press.
Forecasters said the cold weather could be accompanied by several inches of snow in portions of Illinois, Iowa, Michigan and Wisconsin, and snowfall is expected to extend east to New York and as far south as Virginia on Friday.
As the frigid air moved east, local officials tried to prepare. The anticipated high on Thursday was 11 degrees in Buffalo, and around 20 degrees in Cleveland and Boston.
again, where's the turkish camps stories? of course people die because of the elements. that sucks. but don't accuse the right of the same thing you are doing which is sensationalizing a story.
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
And this is the pause where we wait for reinforcements to bolster against you mcgruff. You stated an opinion against the grain and the responses are crass and rude. As someone stated before good luck. Standby for rotten eggs and tomatoes thrown your way.
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
And this is the pause where we wait for reinforcements to bolster against you mcgruff. You stated an opinion against the grain and the responses are crass and rude. As someone stated before good luck. Standby for rotten eggs and tomatoes thrown your way.
I am a pilgrim in an holy land. Thank you for your support. I shall continue to post articles that support my opinion as reflected in public surveys and stories that reflect opinions of Americans that fought in the region. I shall also question people that say things without backing them up. (I m ignorant yet some people post four articles that have nothing to do with the question being asked. And when disproved they get all pissed and type "what a waste of time").
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
And this is the pause where we wait for reinforcements to bolster against you mcgruff. You stated an opinion against the grain and the responses are crass and rude. As someone stated before good luck. Standby for rotten eggs and tomatoes thrown your way.
I am a pilgrim in an holy land. Thank you for your support. I shall continue to post articles that support my opinion as reflected in public surveys and stories that reflect opinions of Americans that fought in the region. I shall also question people that say things without backing them up. (I m ignorant yet some people post four articles that have nothing to do with the question being asked. And when disproved they get all pissed and type "what a waste of time").
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey, your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold. your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four. your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
And this is the pause where we wait for reinforcements to bolster against you mcgruff. You stated an opinion against the grain and the responses are crass and rude. As someone stated before good luck. Standby for rotten eggs and tomatoes thrown your way.
I am a pilgrim in an holy land. Thank you for your support. I shall continue to post articles that support my opinion as reflected in public surveys and stories that reflect opinions of Americans that fought in the region. I shall also question people that say things without backing them up. (I m ignorant yet some people post four articles that have nothing to do with the question being asked. And when disproved they get all pissed and type "what a waste of time").
now you've done it Having a different opinion than la di da land.
Gruff, you don't like getting called out for commenting on a story you haven't read? Then don't try and BS your way through it. If you feel like you have been victimized by all us nasty liberals, you should go post about it on the "I'm a victim thread". Cause nobody cares.
Gruff, you don't like getting called out for commenting on a story you haven't read? Then don't try and BS your way through it. If you feel like you have been victimized by all us nasty liberals, you should go post about it on the "I'm a victim thread". Cause nobody cares.
Still none identified as refugees. And I'm still waiting to hear about their connection to the BDS movement.
I totally read all four of your non related stories trying to prove bad conditions in turkey contrary to the article I cited. I admit I messed up but I don't see how the article proves anything having to do with turkey.
Gruff, you don't like getting called out for commenting on a story you haven't read? Then don't try and BS your way through it. If you feel like you have been victimized by all us nasty liberals, you should go post about it on the "I'm a victim thread". Cause nobody cares.
Still none identified as refugees. And I'm still waiting to hear about their connection to the BDS movement.
I totally read all four of your non related stories trying to prove bad conditions in turkey contrary to the article I cited. I admit I messed up but I don't see how the article proves anything having to do with turkey.
The articles were about all Syrian refugees, when, if you go back and look at the initial comments made by PJSoul , Rgambs and Mickey....that's who they were referring to. You seemed to be the only one who wanted to make this all about refugees in Turkey camps.
But this is all besides the point and off topic in this thread. I am more than glad to continue this discussion with you over in the refugee thread if you want.
Does anyone need rescuing here? I've pounded a bunch of lasagna, am drinking a nice merlot, and have had my ass kicked by fan duel as well.
I'm ready to rescue someone lol!
I need rescuing! Bring lasagna!
I gotta say, much respect to Paris with the "to the bar" thing. That was dope.
Yah.
Picking up the pieces.
Brutal really though. Some people left their places that night never imagining they'd be bleeding out on some concert floor or sitting in some cafe. I was moved by reading how strangers embraced each other in their dying moments.
Killing random people has never say well with me. It makes me really f**king angry to be honest. I couldn't imagine reaching a point in my life where I thought it would be cool to massacre a bunch of people who truly did nothing to me.
"My brain's a good brain!"
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,677
Good luck in here Mcgruff... To many people riding around on their self righteous high horses acting like no one with any opinion other than theirs give a rats ass about humanitarianism. No one knows anything at all about what each other donates, votes, or even does for a living. But yet comment like you are a better person. Ridiculous. Later.
thanks bud. This thread reminds me of the "america's gun violence" thread. there's definitely some really cool people that I'd love to sit down with and actually discuss an issue in an intellectual way (brian, del, bad brains!, PP) and there's other's that are simply not worth replying to. They are the The kind that you present evidence too but they ignore it or it's their way or the high way or you are an obvious racist with no compassion. Actually my favorite is when people counter a question with a question.
And why does that please you, Mr. mcGruff?
But seriously, for the most part I think most people post here because each of us in our own way cares about world and current events. I don't necessarily care for the style or mind set of some here but looked at in a certain way, every post is an opportunity to learn something or at least sharpen one's own thoughts and statements. I've learned a lot here about being more thick skinned, more patient, more discerning and hopefully less biased...
...except for when we talk about global warming in which case if you don't agree with me you're full of shit.
Just kidding... sort of ...
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
McGruff, I read the article you posted. I always like to hear what SEALS have to say, (when they are allowed to speak), because I know they are on the front lines and often entrenched behind the enemy. One of my best friends served with them in the middle east. This soldier who wrote the piece focuses on one single event that I don't find very convincing for the point he is trying to make. A 14 year old boy slaps down a younger girl over candy in a war ravaged city is the best reason we shouldn't bring refugees over? I don't know. Obviously it's a nasty little event and one that seems to have affected him deeply but this is the main reason he gives for not wanting refugees? He talks about snipers laughing at shooting up American troops but I've seen videos of American snipers doing the same thing. That is war.
Good luck in here Mcgruff... To many people riding around on their self righteous high horses acting like no one with any opinion other than theirs give a rats ass about humanitarianism. No one knows anything at all about what each other donates, votes, or even does for a living. But yet comment like you are a better person. Ridiculous. Later.
thanks bud. This thread reminds me of the "america's gun violence" thread. there's definitely some really cool people that I'd love to sit down with and actually discuss an issue in an intellectual way (brian, del, bad brains!, PP) and there's other's that are simply not worth replying to. They are the The kind that you present evidence too but they ignore it or it's their way or the high way or you are an obvious racist with no compassion. Actually my favorite is when people counter a question with a question.
And why does that please you, Mr. mcGruff?
But seriously, for the most part I think most people post here because each of us in our own way cares about world and current events. I don't necessarily care for the style or mind set of some here but looked at in a certain way, every post is an opportunity to learn something or at least sharpen one's own thoughts and statements. I've learned a lot here about being more thick skinned, more patient, more discerning and hopefully less biased...
...except for when we talk about global warming in which case if you don't agree with me you're full of shit.
Just kidding... sort of ...
Bri, is global warming real or is it just an inconvenient truth?
McGruff, I read the article you posted. I always like to hear what SEALS have to say, (when they are allowed to speak), because I know they are on the front lines and often entrenched behind the enemy. One of my best friends served with them in the middle east. This soldier who wrote the piece focuses on one single event that I don't find very convincing for the point he is trying to make. A 14 year old boy slaps down a younger girl over candy in a war ravaged city is the best reason we shouldn't bring refugees over? I don't know. Obviously it's a nasty little event and one that seems to have affected him deeply but this is the main reason he gives for not wanting refugees? He talks about snipers laughing at shooting up American troops but I've seen videos of American snipers doing the same thing. That is war.
Thanks for reading it. Like I said, I thought it was an interesting perspective from someone who was there. And I agree, it is war and war sucks.
McGruff, I read the article you posted. I always like to hear what SEALS have to say, (when they are allowed to speak), because I know they are on the front lines and often entrenched behind the enemy. One of my best friends served with them in the middle east. This soldier who wrote the piece focuses on one single event that I don't find very convincing for the point he is trying to make. A 14 year old boy slaps down a younger girl over candy in a war ravaged city is the best reason we shouldn't bring refugees over? I don't know. Obviously it's a nasty little event and one that seems to have affected him deeply but this is the main reason he gives for not wanting refugees? He talks about snipers laughing at shooting up American troops but I've seen videos of American snipers doing the same thing. That is war.
I thought it was pretty flimsy, you could find an example like this in any town in America.
Monkey Driven, Call this Living?
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,677
Good luck in here Mcgruff... To many people riding around on their self righteous high horses acting like no one with any opinion other than theirs give a rats ass about humanitarianism. No one knows anything at all about what each other donates, votes, or even does for a living. But yet comment like you are a better person. Ridiculous. Later.
thanks bud. This thread reminds me of the "america's gun violence" thread. there's definitely some really cool people that I'd love to sit down with and actually discuss an issue in an intellectual way (brian, del, bad brains!, PP) and there's other's that are simply not worth replying to. They are the The kind that you present evidence too but they ignore it or it's their way or the high way or you are an obvious racist with no compassion. Actually my favorite is when people counter a question with a question.
And why does that please you, Mr. mcGruff?
But seriously, for the most part I think most people post here because each of us in our own way cares about world and current events. I don't necessarily care for the style or mind set of some here but looked at in a certain way, every post is an opportunity to learn something or at least sharpen one's own thoughts and statements. I've learned a lot here about being more thick skinned, more patient, more discerning and hopefully less biased...
...except for when we talk about global warming in which case if you don't agree with me you're full of shit.
Just kidding... sort of ...
Bri, is global warming real or is it just an inconvenient truth?
Neither, it's Memorex!
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
Could have been put there by someone with security clearance. There isn't much anyone can do about a person who has security clearance and then decides to become a terrorist, or has a crystal clear record and references, etc, but decides to be a terrorist after being hired and developing trust. No matter what precautions are taken, there will ALWAYS be ways for terrorists to do their thing. That said, who knows how this specific bomb got there. It sounds like it was big, so it seem likely that it had to have been done pre-flight by someone who had access to the empty plane.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Could have been put there by someone with security clearance. There isn't much anyone can do about a person who has security clearance and then decides to become a terrorist, or has a crystal clear record and references, etc, but decides to be a terrorist after being hired and developing trust. No matter what precautions are taken, there will ALWAYS be ways for terrorists to do their thing. That said, who knows how this specific bomb got there. It sounds like it was big, so it seem likely that it had to have been done pre-flight by someone who had access to the empty plane.
Great, even more reasons for me to be wary of flying, think I should be fairly safe with Aer Lingus staff at least!
Comments
source: http://www.thenation.com/article/why-syrian-refugees-in-turkey-are-leaving-for-europe/
Nasser is one of over 2 million Syrian refugees in Turkey, which has accepted more than any other state. According to a recent 72-page report issued by Turkey’s Republican People’s Party, only 270,000 refugees are living in camps near the border. The rest are scattered across Turkey’s 81 provinces. Istanbul is a popular destination for many of them, who like Nasser are trying to establish a new life. Some estimates peg the Syrian population in Turkey’s most populous city at nearly half a million.
Turkey—currently the world’s largest refugee-hosting nation—has been widely praised for its welcoming attitude. On a visit marking World Refugee Day in June, the UN High Commissioner for Refugees, António Guterres, called Turkey “a great example for other countries in a world where borders are becoming unpassable for refugees.” The Turkish government says it has spent nearly $8 billion on humanitarian assistance for Syrian refugees alone. It also recently announced that Gaziantep University, less than a two-hour drive from Aleppo, would offer 28 majors in Arabic, including biology, mathematics, economics, literature, and engineering. However, the Turkish Parliament has yet to act on the issue of work permits for refugees, which it has punted until after the snap parliamentary elections to be held in November.
Syrian refugees in Turkey in dire need of language teachers: UNICEF official
NOV 22, 2015
source: http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/11/22/national/syrian-refugees-turkey-dire-need-language-teachers-unicef-official/#.VlJeMKaTSZN
A Japanese working at UNICEF’s office in Turkey says there is an urgent need to teach Turkish to the young Arabic-speaking Syrian refugees there to help them integrate with society.
“More than half of school-age Syrian refugee children in Turkey whose native language is Arabic have been unable to go to school,” Chiharu Kondo, 43, said in a recent interview in Tokyo.
“To help Syrian refugees build a stable society with hope for their future, it is urgent to teach them the Turkish language to overcome the language barrier,” she said.
The number of Syrian refugees in Turkey stood at about 2 million last month, UNICEF says. While 708,000 of them are between 6 and 18 years old, around 400,000 do not attend school.
In 2014, the Turkish government gave all registered Syrian refugees the right to receive free education at its public schools. But Turkish and Syrian children are taught separately in morning and afternoon classes due to the language differences.
Such a situation “will not facilitate mutual understanding,” Kondo noted, adding that there also is a serious shortage of classrooms and teaching staff.
Kondo said there is risk that refugees may turn to terrorism or other dangerous activities if they fail to receive adequate education.
“Syrian refugees, who are unable to return home any time soon due to the prolonged civil war, must receive education and become integrated into society so that they can live with hope for the future. That will increase stability in host nations” she emphasized.
http://www.turkishweekly.net/2015/11/20/news/syrian-refugees-in-lebanons-beqaa-brace-for-cruel-winter/
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/02/winter-is-coming-the-new-crisis-for-refugees-in-europe
http://www.vice.com/read/talking-to-syrian-refugees-about-surviving-in-lebanon-916
http://www.trust.org/item/20151120081047-niq9m/
http://www.turkishweekly.net/2015/11/20/news/syrian-refugees-in-lebanons-beqaa-brace-for-cruel-winter/
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/02/winter-is-coming-the-new-crisis-for-refugees-in-europe
http://www.vice.com/read/talking-to-syrian-refugees-about-surviving-in-lebanon-916
your first article is from denmark. no shit it's cold there and it's not turkey,
your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold.
your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four.
your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
and yeah winter is coming, but this the 3rd, 4th or even 5th winter these refugees have endured. I'm sure all of you have been vocal these past couple of years about how winter has impacted these people. please don't tell me this is the first time it has caught your attention since it is now national news.
your second article is from lebanon. yeah its cold but no deaths and pretty standard suffering due to cold.
your third article is about refugees in europe and if exposed to the elements they'll get hypothermia. again, no shit when exposed to the elements. you could write that same article across the globe about homeless people. so far nothing about turkish camps and deaths and suffering. now onto article four.
your fourth article is about refugees in lebanon again. um yeah, neighbor next door. pretty much the same as your second article. and again no death and suffering on this huge scale that the left is talking about.
so where's the article about all this suffering in turkey?
The first article wasn't about refugees in Denmark. It was about the work the DRC is doing (Danish Refugee Council) in camps all across the middle east. No surprise you didn't read the content, based on all your other ignorant comments.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
What a waste of time.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
What a waste of time.
yeah i read all the articles and the first thing that strikes me is: Vulnerable refugees face fifth winter without adequate food and clothing
Danish Refugee Council (DRC) - Denmark - Fri, 20 Nov 2015 08:10 GMT
denmark. harsh winters. holy cow it seems like the author is talking about refugees in denmark. but then we have a sleight of hand and he's talking about snow in the middle east?
Last winter snow blanketed refugee camps and urban areas, and freezing temperatures created concerns about the health of refugees, who lacked access to warm clothing and secure shelter. In early January, three Syrian refugee children froze to death in Lebanon and a snow storm in Syria killed two children caught in the elements. Temperatures throughout region drop below ten degrees from November – March, with snow common.
you could replace these cities names with any other cities across the globe. wait let me try:
source http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/24/us/cold-weather-hits-midwest-and-east-coast-causing-several-deaths.html?_r=0
Since Saturday, the authorities have reported at least four deaths related to the cold in the Midwest, including a 70-year-old man found frozen in his unheated home in Des Plaines, Ill., on Sunday, according to The Associated Press.
Forecasters said the cold weather could be accompanied by several inches of snow in portions of Illinois, Iowa, Michigan and Wisconsin, and snowfall is expected to extend east to New York and as far south as Virginia on Friday.
As the frigid air moved east, local officials tried to prepare. The anticipated high on Thursday was 11 degrees in Buffalo, and around 20 degrees in Cleveland and Boston.
again, where's the turkish camps stories? of course people die because of the elements. that sucks. but don't accuse the right of the same thing you are doing which is sensationalizing a story.
You win, it's paradise in the Turkey camps....you make it sound so nice maybe you should move there. And the other refugees all across Europe and the middle east, well who gives a fuck eh....after all it's winter, what do you expect.
What a waste of time.
my ignorant self (just because i disagree with you? geez.) posted a story, did you read it? a friend of mine who's a navy seal recommended it to me. http://www.unprecedentedmediocrity.com/what-gwot-veterans-really-think-about-middle-eastern-refugees/
And this is the pause where we wait for reinforcements to bolster against you mcgruff.
You stated an opinion against the grain and the responses are crass and rude.
As someone stated before good luck.
Standby for rotten eggs and tomatoes thrown your way.
You stated an opinion against the grain and the responses are crass and rude.
As someone stated before good luck.
Standby for rotten eggs and tomatoes thrown your way.
I am a pilgrim in an holy land. Thank you for your support. I shall continue to post articles that support my opinion as reflected in public surveys and stories that reflect opinions of Americans that fought in the region. I shall also question people that say things without backing them up. (I m ignorant yet some people post four articles that have nothing to do with the question being asked. And when disproved they get all pissed and type "what a waste of time").
:.
now you've done it
Having a different opinion than la di da land.
I m screwed. Thirty will rescue me!
Anyways, lets get back on topic.
http://www.thestar.com/news/world/2015/11/21/who-were-the-paris-attackers-what-we-know-so-far.html
Who were the Paris attackers? What we know so far
Still none identified as refugees. And I'm still waiting to hear about their connection to the BDS movement.
Does anyone need rescuing here? I've pounded a bunch of lasagna, am drinking a nice merlot, and have had my ass kicked by fan duel as well.
I'm ready to rescue someone lol!
But this is all besides the point and off topic in this thread. I am more than glad to continue this discussion with you over in the refugee thread if you want.
http://www.skynews.com.au/news/top-stories/2015/11/23/brussels-lockdown-continues-over-attack-fears.html
I gotta say, much respect to Paris with the "to the bar" thing. That was dope.
LIVEFOOTSTEPS.ORG/USER/?USR=435
Picking up the pieces.
Brutal really though. Some people left their places that night never imagining they'd be bleeding out on some concert floor or sitting in some cafe. I was moved by reading how strangers embraced each other in their dying moments.
Killing random people has never say well with me. It makes me really f**king angry to be honest. I couldn't imagine reaching a point in my life where I thought it would be cool to massacre a bunch of people who truly did nothing to me.
But seriously, for the most part I think most people post here because each of us in our own way cares about world and current events. I don't necessarily care for the style or mind set of some here but looked at in a certain way, every post is an opportunity to learn something or at least sharpen one's own thoughts and statements. I've learned a lot here about being more thick skinned, more patient, more discerning and hopefully less biased...
...except for when we talk about global warming in which case if you don't agree with me you're full of shit.
Just kidding... sort of ...
http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/world-news/russian-plane-crash-picture-shows-6884828
That said, who knows how this specific bomb got there. It sounds like it was big, so it seem likely that it had to have been done pre-flight by someone who had access to the empty plane.